URI Men's Basketball Program

[section(105)]

From a URI standpoint: Should we be rooting for no college football this year? Would 1 year of no college football revenue bring us back closer to the field when it comes to athletic department revenues?

........mmmmmm no, and this from someone that barely follows football, but know many that attend games......we should be rooting for getting all aspects of our lives back on track ASAP, cause this/that new normal is not normal at all.....looking forward to a Fall Saturday afternoon in Kingston......Go Rhody......

[BlackDogRants]

Ok so I have been a follower of KB for years. I hardly ever post as you see. However, I have come to appreciate who are rational posters. IMO they are BlueRam, 83, Big apple ram, DC, Iggy, Sec 205, Bos, Rod (rip), I may have missed one but so many of you are just full of shit!! Call it pent up Covid19 frustration
Sorry.

Oh I didn't make the list?! Fine... I will be entering my name into the message board transfer portal.


Kidding... I love this board!

[spookydog]

From a URI standpoint: Should we be rooting for no college football this year? Would 1 year of no college football revenue bring us back closer to the field when it comes to athletic department revenues?

They also played 2 FBS teams last year (Ohio & VT) & they get paid quite handsomely to do so. Each year they play at least one of those games, if not 2 like this year. That helps fund a big chunk of their season.

[EasyEdBrown]

Again...that money goes to the university. Not directly to the Athletic program.

So where does all the money we piss away on football come from?

Donors.

Why do you think a $4million project got done over the summer, while we're waiting on funding for 2 years on a $5million project? When you consider the football donor base, the narrative that football is this money suck pool compared to other sports just isn't really true.

Another question to consider...do you think more ex-football players are involved with supporting the program, or more ex-basketball players? I'm talking about material support, not just showing up to practice with the team once a year.

[RIFan]

So, the primary improvement that we have been waiting for is the practice facility. So the Toppin family is upset that there hasn't been a "ground breaking" for that, or are there other improvements they we sold that have also not materialized? I agree that it seems like ages ago that the practice facility was promised and it's been crickets since. I assume the well has run dry with the typical donors?

[Rhode_Island_Red]

Again...that money goes to the university. Not directly to the Athletic program.

So where does all the money we piss away on football come from?

Donors.

Why do you think a $4million project got done over the summer, while we're waiting on funding for 2 years on a $5million project? When you consider the football donor base, the narrative that football is this money suck pool compared to other sports just isn't really true.

Another question to consider...do you think more ex-football players are involved with supporting the program, or more ex-basketball players? I'm talking about material support, not just showing up to practice with the team once a year.

So donors fund the ongoing operating expenses of a football program in addition to the capital expenditures? Please show your work.

And given that there are 65 to 80 players on a football roster and 12 to 14 on a basketball roster, the answer is obvious.

[BlackDogRants]

So, the primary improvement that we have been waiting for is the practice facility. So are the Toppin's family is upset that there hasn't been a "ground breaking" for that, or are there other improvements they we sold that have also not materialized? I agree that it seems like ages ago that the practice facility was promised and it's been crickets since. I assume the well has run dry with the typical donors?

The word "ground breaking" got my attention here. Only because I believe if we were to actually create a practice facility it wouldn't (shouldn't) involve the ground at all.

I am pretty sure this was brought up before but....Isn't the best most efficient route to renovate Keaney gym? The infrastructure is all there. Sewer/Water/Gas/Power. The bones are set. Steel/Roof/Concrete/Court. Majority of the work would be demo of the seats and pure cosmetic updates to the look. I am sure it still has the old locker rooms and training rooms. To be honest I would use the upper tier of seats as where the new staff office would go and have all glass windows to overlook the court.

The only thing I can rationalize as to why they wouldn't use it is the proximity to the Ryan Center.

They could still have volleyball play in there - they can roll in a handful of fold up chais for the 6 spectators that come watch those games.

[RamStock]

So, the primary improvement that we have been waiting for is the practice facility. So are the Toppin's family is upset that there hasn't been a "ground breaking" for that, or are there other improvements they we sold that have also not materialized? I agree that it seems like ages ago that the practice facility was promised and it's been crickets since. I assume the well has run dry with the typical donors?

The word "ground breaking" got my attention here. Only because I believe if we were to actually create a practice facility it wouldn't (shouldn't) involve the ground at all.

I am pretty sure this was brought up before but....Isn't the best most efficient route to renovate Keaney gym? The infrastructure is all there. Sewer/Water/Gas/Power. The bones are set. Steel/Roof/Concrete/Court. Majority of the work would be demo of the seats and pure cosmetic updates to the look. I am sure it still has the old locker rooms and training rooms. To be honest I would use the upper tier of seats as where the new staff office would go and have all glass windows to overlook the court.

The only thing I can rationalize as to why they wouldn't use it is the proximity to the Ryan Center.

They could still have volleyball play in there - they can roll in a handful of fold up chais for the 6 spectators that come watch those games.

I agree on using Keaney gym. This is the most practical from an economical standpoint. They could definitely use the money to make top of the line improvements to the facility and really tailor it to the players. I know there is probably more behind this and maybe not being a stand alone facility is a big deal, but if we are strapped from a financial standpoint we need to look at every possibility. They could probably make some money by selling off old seats or other items from Keaney during the renovation-I know I would buy stuff-lol

[phipsiGD'11]

As usual, I don't know much of anything. BUT it wouldn't surprise me if building new is cheaper or comparable to renovating Keaney. A lot of building codes that would have to be met, etc.
I would say that I am sure they have looked into several options to weight what would be best, BUT I know this school too well at this point...

[CHICO 78]

when did Keaney become the most likely. Wasn't Tootell the identified site for
the Practice facility?

[steviep123]

I doubt the Toppin family cares about a physical new practice facility. it's probably more that they felt he wasn't being developed they way he should be. That's my guess with no inside knowledge.

[NJRhodyFan]

I doubt the Toppin family cares about a physical new practice facility. it's probably more that they felt he wasn't being developed they way he should be. That's my guess with no inside knowledge.

I think your assumption is correct. Or at least I think that's the reason provided by Toppin's family as to why URI wasn't the best place for him. But I still believe the TRUE reason why he left is that he wanted a bigger name on the front of his jersey. Playing for Kentucky or Oregon would satisfy that desire.

[Rhodyram]

I doubt the Toppin family cares about a physical new practice facility. it's probably more that they felt he wasn't being developed they way he should be. That's my guess with no inside knowledge.

That’s my guess with very very very little knowledge.

[EasyEdBrown]

Please show your work.

A $4 million project was done over a summer.

The practice facility for basketball is now 2 years in trying to get $5m.

Now you show yours. We have seatbacks in Meade that has ex football players on it. The plaques in the Ryan Center have a bunch of football players on it.

When we almost dropped down to the NEC in football, there was so much donor pushback that we reversed course (including getting scholarships re-funded).

I'll put the cut off at when Skinner came on. What basketball alumni from Skinner, Harrick, DeGregorio, Baron, Hurley, or Cox's teams are sending the Athletic Dept money to get projects done?

[theblueram]

Please show your work.

A $4 million project was done over a summer.

The practice facility for basketball is now 2 years in trying to get $5m.

Now you show yours. We have seatbacks in Meade that has ex football players on it. The plaques in the Ryan Center have a bunch of football players on it.

When we almost dropped down to the NEC in football, there was so much donor pushback that we reversed course (including getting scholarships re-funded).

I'll put the cut off at when Skinner came on. What basketball alumni from Skinner, Harrick, DeGregorio, Baron, Hurley, or Cox's teams are sending the Athletic Dept money to get projects done?

You make an excellent point EasyEd. I have not publicly heard of any player mentioned with any projects, let alone the practice facility. Were any involved with the Ryan Center? I would be curious to hear the answer on this.

[EasyEdBrown]

I don't have any answers myself, but I think that a lot of people are asking the wrong questions when it comes to funding, the football and basketball programs, and how much Thorr's hands are tied (or not!) to affect positive financial change in the department.

[spookydog]

So where does all the money we piss away on football come from?

Donors.

Why do you think a $4million project got done over the summer, while we're waiting on funding for 2 years on a $5million project? When you consider the football donor base, the narrative that football is this money suck pool compared to other sports just isn't really true.

Another question to consider...do you think more ex-football players are involved with supporting the program, or more ex-basketball players? I'm talking about material support, not just showing up to practice with the team once a year.

So donors fund the ongoing operating expenses of a football program in addition to the capital expenditures? Please show your work.

And given that there are 65 to 80 players on a football roster and 12 to 14 on a basketball roster, the answer is obvious.

FYI - It is 63 in FCS (FBS gets 85)

[hrstrat57]

Putting this here cause folks might see it and I’m too lazy to start a thread.

Carry on.

[Blue Man]

Just to remind everyone of the facts:

Thorr doesn't set the budget for athletics. He is given what he is given and has to make due.

For football: I can't believe we are still having this argument on the board. Football costs next to nothing for the athletic department. It has a larger donor pool than basketball. It provides title IX protection for the athletic department. The football sponsorship dollars are more than basketball sponsorship dollars.

Even when losing - football's average attendance was 6585 per game in conference. Significantly more than basketball.

An FBS buy game for football brings in 2x more money each year than the NCAA credits do.

Football money has NOTHING to do with basketball money. If the football team did not exist, football donors would not magically send their money to basketball. They would probably give enough to push out any AD stupid enough to make a decision like cutting football, and then get football back.

Also, if football didn't exist the entire athletic department would collapse because you'd lose 63 female scholarships as well. With 126 less student athletes, I'm sure that's an easy excuse to cut the athletic budget more - not shift funding over to basketball.

So once again...football's money has NOTHING to do with basketball.

URI as a whole (state, RIBGHE, donors) do not support basketball enough relative to our NCAA expectations.

The donors didn't ever "pony up the cash" for Hurley. They "committed" at the 11th hour with "promises" of things to do. As we can see from the current state of things - the promises were about as good as you would expect.

Even with Dan's "cult of personality" - Ryan, Fascitelli, etc donated large sums of money and built other buildings on campus - but not a practice facility. Thorr can't strong-arm the big donors to doing anything because we have no fall-back support. There's no state funding. No other generous donors. Thorr and co have to just hope that the donors open their wallets up and be grateful for what they get.

[TruePoint]

And yet their not building the practice facility really didn’t hinder Dan’s teams on the floor. He found a way to keep everyone in the boat and win at a very high level in a way that felt very sustainable. Ultimately not having the practice facility and other niceties was a problem for his pride and ego, but it wasn’t costing him anything in terms of basketball product. If he was a little more the way that he likes to think that he is, he’d still be here, so would a lot of these players, the team would have won more games over the last two years and, ironically, construction on the practice facility would probably be nearing completion.

At the end of the day, I’m not going to blame Dan for being like all the other coaches. It’s water under the bridge anyways. And you can’t blame Cox for not being Dan. Thorr has a really tough job - he has to figure out who and where the next Dan is, because it is going to take that type of guy to win here the way everyone wants. Maybe that guy is already here developing on the job, maybe he’s not. We can bang the drum over and over again about regular fans showing up every night and donating what they can, we can pray the school’s few benefactors step up, we can pressure the state house - but we are unlikely to suddenly become the type of well-funded and professional operation that a moderately competent coach can step into and win. That is a fantasy. We have to have a coach who is special - it’s the one consistent thing over generations of URI basketball that has always been and will always be true.

[rjsuperfly66]

TP, I think there is some truth and some fiction in what you say.

Hurley obviously did a great job in lieu of not having all the lights bigger programs may have had.

But as the transfer thread correctly points out, the modern college basketball player appears to be more and more spoiled.

My belief is that they only continue to trend in that direction.

Does that mean all players care exclusively about the name on the jersey or the resources of the program?

No, but as time goes on, I think it'll only be harder and harder for programs to compete without the consistent investment into luxury items like practice facilities, charter flights, etc.

[RamStock]

Just to remind everyone of the facts:

Thorr doesn't set the budget for athletics. He is given what he is given and has to make due.

For football: I can't believe we are still having this argument on the board. Football costs next to nothing for the athletic department. It has a larger donor pool than basketball. It provides title IX protection for the athletic department. The football sponsorship dollars are more than basketball sponsorship dollars.

Even when losing - football's average attendance was 6585 per game in conference. Significantly more than basketball.

An FBS buy game for football brings in 2x more money each year than the NCAA credits do.

Football money has NOTHING to do with basketball money. If the football team did not exist, football donors would not magically send their money to basketball. They would probably give enough to push out any AD stupid enough to make a decision like cutting football, and then get football back.

Also, if football didn't exist the entire athletic department would collapse because you'd lose 63 female scholarships as well. With 126 less student athletes, I'm sure that's an easy excuse to cut the athletic budget more - not shift funding over to basketball.

So once again...football's money has NOTHING to do with basketball.

URI as a whole (state, RIBGHE, donors) do not support basketball enough relative to our NCAA expectations.

The donors didn't ever "pony up the cash" for Hurley. They "committed" at the 11th hour with "promises" of things to do. As we can see from the current state of things - the promises were about as good as you would expect.

Even with Dan's "cult of personality" - Ryan, Fascitelli, etc donated large sums of money and built other buildings on campus - but not a practice facility. Thorr can't strong-arm the big donors to doing anything because we have no fall-back support. There's no state funding. No other generous donors. Thorr and co have to just hope that the donors open their wallets up and be grateful for what they get.

Do we have a football team at URI?? I have never heard anyone talk about them. All good points you brought up on the subject at hand, but one thing I know is no one gives a rats ass about a three decade losing 1-AA football team. Even if they win it is like playing in the NIT. I agree with your points though on the distribution of money having no impact on basketball just venting on how little interest there is on football at URI. You made valid points on the subject at hand though. Sorry to get off track

[rambone 78]

Think about what our investment in the program would be, if we had a 4 million dollar a year TV contract that PC has.

What's ours? Around 400K. Only one zero difference, but boy what a big one.

That's 3.6 million reasons a year why PC has their practice facility, and other amenities that we don't.

It's true RJ, we are falling behind, and fast.

[Rhode_Island_Red]

Just to remind everyone of the facts:

Thorr doesn't set the budget for athletics. He is given what he is given and has to make due.

For football: I can't believe we are still having this argument on the board. Football costs next to nothing for the athletic department. It has a larger donor pool than basketball. It provides title IX protection for the athletic department. The football sponsorship dollars are more than basketball sponsorship dollars.

Even when losing - football's average attendance was 6585 per game in conference. Significantly more than basketball.

An FBS buy game for football brings in 2x more money each year than the NCAA credits do.

Football money has NOTHING to do with basketball money. If the football team did not exist, football donors would not magically send their money to basketball. They would probably give enough to push out any AD stupid enough to make a decision like cutting football, and then get football back.

Also, if football didn't exist the entire athletic department would collapse because you'd lose 63 female scholarships as well. With 126 less student athletes, I'm sure that's an easy excuse to cut the athletic budget more - not shift funding over to basketball.

So once again...football's money has NOTHING to do with basketball.

URI as a whole (state, RIBGHE, donors) do not support basketball enough relative to our NCAA expectations.

The donors didn't ever "pony up the cash" for Hurley. They "committed" at the 11th hour with "promises" of things to do. As we can see from the current state of things - the promises were about as good as you would expect.

Even with Dan's "cult of personality" - Ryan, Fascitelli, etc donated large sums of money and built other buildings on campus - but not a practice facility. Thorr can't strong-arm the big donors to doing anything because we have no fall-back support. There's no state funding. No other generous donors. Thorr and co have to just hope that the donors open their wallets up and be grateful(( for what they get.

So the gate revenue (how many of those 6500 are on student tickets?), donations and a buy game cover all the costs — coaches, equipment, travel and lodging, dorms and dining halls (every scholarship player keeps a paying student out of the dorms)? I find that hard to believe.

[rhodyfan3000]

Jacob Toppin ain't walking through that door...



20 years ago

[reef]

One of the best rants ever

[NC_Ram]

Maybe we should add a new category to Obadiah's contest ...... WHO exactly is left on our team.

[Rhodyram]

Maybe we should add a new category to Obadiah's contest ...... WHO exactly is left on our team.

I’d say 50/50 chance that Walker is the only player returning that saw the floor last year.

[rambone 78]

If that happens, Cox truly would have to be a miracle worker to get the team to the NCAA tourney.

This team needs leadership....who would be "that guy?"

[raminwarwick]

Blue man mentions how the football team keeps the money from their buy in games. My question would be why doesn't the Basketball team get to keep the NCAA money they earned?

[RamStock]

Maybe we should add a new category to Obadiah's contest ...... WHO exactly is left on our team.

I’d say 50/50 chance that Walker is the only player returning that saw the floor last year.

Agree. Either Fatts and Harris both leave or at least one of them. Fatts sees all his teammates moving on to bigger and better things. Find it really hard to believe he will be back. Only thing would be is he does what no one else does these days and shows loyalty to David Cox who has always had his back even when things were going very poorly

[Rhody15]

If that happens, Cox truly would have to be a miracle worker to get the team to the NCAA tourney.

This team needs leadership....who would be "that guy?"

I get more shocked every time someone mentions the tournament with the team for this upcoming year.

We would need nothing short of a miracle.

[steviep123]

Maybe we should add a new category to Obadiah's contest ...... WHO exactly is left on our team.

I’d say 50/50 chance that Walker is the only player returning that saw the floor last year.

Agree. Either Fatts and Harris both leave or at least one of them. Fatts sees all his teammates moving on to bigger and better things. Find it really hard to believe he will be back. Only thing would be is he does what no one else does these days and shows loyalty to David Cox who has always had his back even when things were going very poorly

Cox having a player's back didn't stop Toppin from leaving (see end of UMass game at the Ryan Center).

[Seawrightspostgame]

I felt like Cox forced Toppin on the court the last month of the season. I really thought/think his potential is that of a star but he hurt the team this year. I think walking out of the SLU game my dad was asking me what does Toppin give the team in terms of impact? In theory he would be an elite defender, rebounder, finisher above the rim and a deadly guy to stretch the floor, but it just didn't go that way this year.

I do think he just needs to grow into his body and play a little tougher and then sky is the limit.

[Rhody15]

I felt like Cox forced Toppin on the court the last month of the season. I really thought/think his potential is that of a star but he hurt the team this year. I think walking out of the SLU game my dad was asking me what does Toppin give the team in terms of impact? In theory he would be an elite defender, rebounder, finisher above the rim and a deadly guy to stretch the floor, but it just didn't go that way this year.

I do think he just needs to grow into his body and play a little tougher and then sky is the limit.

He was only a raw skinny freshman, couldn’t expect the world from him this year.

He was obviously going to develop and become a major factor here the next few years.

[Rhody72]

Toppin will benefit from a red-shirt year at Kentucky if it works out that way.

[CamsRams]

Would be great to see Chris DiSano or Bill Koch start a weekly podcast. With all the offseason activity, transfers, scheduling and program reviews - there would be no lack of topics to analyze.

[CamsRams]

http://turnto10.com/sports/content/cox- ... -uri-hoops

Cox weighs in on future of the URI hoops

It's safe to say it's been a tough stretch for the University of Rhode Island Men's Basketball team.

With Fatts Russell declaring for the NBA draft, combined with Tyrese Martin transferring to UConn and Jacob Toppin heading to Kentucky, URI Head Coach David Cox is just trying to adjust to the changing landscape of college basketball.


"It's definitely something that we have to address being at mid-major and low-major level. We are always re-recruiting around this time of year anyway. To be honest with you, just trying to maintain the relationships and keep away the poachers," said Cox.

But Cox did reload in the last couple of days with commits and transfers and he has a message for the fans.

"We are super excited about what we are putting together and bringing to the table for next season. We've got a bevy of talent still left in this program and we brought in some very talented young men," said Cox.

Then, there are the issue with trying to compete with the big times schools with facilities and charter flights.

"I've had some very candid conversations with out athletic director and our president, as well as some of the donors. I do know that they are very much interested in helping this program reach the next level," said Cox.

NBC 10 also spoke with URI Athletic Director Thorr Bjorn who said that his top priority is to complete the $6.5 million fundraising initiative to renovate the West Gym into a practice facility.

[Rhody15]

Correct me if I’m wrong, but wasn’t the cost of the facility 4 million at first, then 5 million, now Thorr is saying 6.5?

[Rhodymob05]

Construction costs always go up. But it’s encouraging to hear that Cox is pushing everyone to invest and take the program to a higher level. And he’s right, next season will have a talented roster.

[bigappleram]

We are not at "low major level" -- we are textbook mid major. Top 6 in a Top 10 conference. Upper third of an upper third league. Low major is the MAAC, Patriot, NEC, etc.

[rhodyfan3000]

The NCAA is actively trying to downsize us.

[bigappleram]

The ncaa can do whatever they want, I am referring to our own coach calling us low major. That isn’t true and the only reason to say that is to lower expectations and create a more grim picture than is accurate. We have been a Top 50-60ish program for 3 of the last 4 years and 4 of the last 6. We play in an 8,000 seat arena. We aren’t low major.

[Rhodymob05]

Reading Kentucky boards, they consider Uri a high level mid major. Pretty accurate.

[ramster]

The ncaa can do whatever they want, I am referring to our own coach calling us low major. That isn’t true and the only reason to say that is to lower expectations and create a more grim picture than is accurate. We have been a Top 50-60ish program for 3 of the last 4 years and 4 of the last 6. We play in an 8,000 seat arena. We aren’t low major.

I found it odd that Cox said “being at mid-major and low-major level. Not sure why we wouldn’t be one of the other. It does sound like downplaying the expectations. Not exactly “Gonzaga of the East” aspirational commentary.


"It's definitely something that we have to address being at mid-major and low-major level. We are always re-recruiting around this time of year anyway. To be honest with you, just trying to maintain the relationships and keep away the poachers," said Cox.

[PeteRI]

Reading Kentucky boards, they consider Uri a high level mid major. Pretty accurate.

So I guess we should be even more proud that they took Jacob.

[Rhodymob05]

Low majors are the East Wyoming Techs of the college world. No idea why Cox said that lol.

[giovanni]

The ncaa can do whatever they want, I am referring to our own coach calling us low major. That isn’t true and the only reason to say that is to lower expectations and create a more grim picture than is accurate. We have been a Top 50-60ish program for 3 of the last 4 years and 4 of the last 6. We play in an 8,000 seat arena. We aren’t low major.

Agree 100%. When I was watching I caught the low major comment too and was very surprised to hear him say that. We are a classic mid major is correct. He is the first coach I have ever heard say that. Initially I thought it was an dig at the administration for not investing like a mid major and often treating the program like a low major. But good point he may have said that to lower the expectations or maybe have a dual purpose. For the problems he and this program has had, at least he is not recruiting at a low major level thus far anyway.

[giovanni]

David Cox is normally a very soft spoken and very positive guy, but in that interview I did sense some irritation in his voice. Perhaps in his meetings with AD, president and donors he did not hear exactly what he had hoped and believed he was getting the same run around Hurley got, even though he says that he knows that they are all very much interested in helping this program reach the next level

[reef]

Using low Major definitely a poor choice of words