bigappleram wrote: ↑5 years ago
Gotta love reading PC fans gush over undersized PGs from A10 doormats...now comparing St Joe's Bynum to Tremont Waters simply because they are in the consideration set. I do give some of them credit when they say "i've never watched him play" bc as we all know the majority of PC fans aren't actual basketball fans, they watch PC and maybe some BE and that's where their frame of reference ends.
I like Bynum but he is only 5'8" and as for Pipkins, who is only 5'10", I would not have wanted him at URI, so going to PC does not phase me at all, in fact it's good from my vantage point.
I thought several years ago that the Big East would trend downwards once the teams bolted for the Big 10, ACC, AAC, etc and we saw that drop from #2 to #5 this year. They could drop even further it the AAC continues it's steady climb.
PC does not have a true PG and desperately need one. Pipkins was the right play for the team giving them a potential solid PG while they search for/develop the next one. Bynum would be a good pickup, who cares what team he played for?
As for the conference, the conference had a bad year by its standards. But most preseason rankings have 3 BIg East Top 15 teams plus two more right on the outside of the top 25. ESPN was probably the most aggressive predicting two Top 5 Big East teams. So it clearly was a blip unless you only judge things in one year cycles. Every Big East team should be better next year with the exception of St. John’s.
But you have Maliek White, who you told us was a better prospect than Jeff Dowtin. #fail
You have 4* David Duke who was supposed to be the 2nd coming of Kris Dunn. #fail
You raved about MAL and his recruiting rankings. #fail
And now your fans are enamored by undersized PGs from last place A10 teams. Comparing them to Tremont Waters LOL. Your fans love to quote rankings on kids they have never seen, and quick to shit on any mention of the A10 until it's someone you guys are interested in (Isiah Jackson, Pip, Bynum). You constantly make the point about how in grand scheme the rankings prove themselves out, but your own roster should show you the error in your ways. I would say every 1 of the guys above was grossly overrated, wouldn't you? AJ Reeves is a Top 50 talent, David Duke isn't. He's an athletic guard who can't shoot a lick and doesn't really have a position. Maybe that will change but his Top 50 ranking seems as erroneous as MALs was. Most coaches believe after the Top 20 there is a ton of margin for error and I would tend to agree. Would you rather have Kalief Young or Cyril Langevine? Downtin or White? I believe your quote about that URI class was that Cooley would be getting shit on if he brought in those guys.
between transfers and decommitments, you can only imagine how much cox and anyone else with scholarships available for next year head must be spinning right now. crazy
I like Bynum but he is only 5'8" and as for Pipkins, who is only 5'10", I would not have wanted him at URI, so going to PC does not phase me at all, in fact it's good from my vantage point.
I thought several years ago that the Big East would trend downwards once the teams bolted for the Big 10, ACC, AAC, etc and we saw that drop from #2 to #5 this year. They could drop even further it the AAC continues it's steady climb.
PC does not have a true PG and desperately need one. Pipkins was the right play for the team giving them a potential solid PG while they search for/develop the next one. Bynum would be a good pickup, who cares what team he played for?
As for the conference, the conference had a bad year by its standards. But most preseason rankings have 3 BIg East Top 15 teams plus two more right on the outside of the top 25. ESPN was probably the most aggressive predicting two Top 5 Big East teams. So it clearly was a blip unless you only judge things in one year cycles. Every Big East team should be better next year with the exception of St. John’s.
But you have Maliek White, who you told us was a better prospect than Jeff Dowtin. #fail
You have 4* David Duke who was supposed to be the 2nd coming of Kris Dunn. #fail
You raved about MAL and his recruiting rankings. #fail
And now your fans are enamored by undersized PGs from last place A10 teams. Comparing them to Tremont Waters LOL. Your fans love to quote rankings on kids they have never seen, and quick to shit on any mention of the A10 until it's someone you guys are interested in (Isiah Jackson, Pip, Bynum). You constantly make the point about how in grand scheme the rankings prove themselves out, but your own roster should show you the error in your ways. I would say every 1 of the guys above was grossly overrated, wouldn't you? AJ Reeves is a Top 50 talent, David Duke isn't. He's an athletic guard who can't shoot a lick and doesn't really have a position. Maybe that will change but his Top 50 ranking seems as erroneous as MALs was. Most coaches believe after the Top 20 there is a ton of margin for error and I would tend to agree. Would you rather have Kalief Young or Cyril Langevine? Downtin or White? I believe your quote about that URI class was that Cooley would be getting shit on if he brought in those guys.
My point has largely been proven out. Typically, the higher the recruiting ranking, the higher the ceiling and the higher the floor. I’ve always said that you can get good players in the Top 300. I just said I wouldn’t rely on that because you can get some real duds. I think Tertsea and Layssard are evidence on that. But that doesn’t mean every Top 100 player will be a star, but I do believe most Top 100 players even failing to meet their potential are still often serviceable rotation players, whereas most Top 300 players who don’t develop properly are barely low-major rotation players. Further, and I’ve pointed this out prior, arguably the 5 best players in the Hurley era were Top 150 recruits (counting the transfers in that) and most of them were Top 100. But that doesn’t mean someone can be a Too 250 player and turn into a good player who I’d want to fill a role on my team. Production and reality beats the HS projection at that point. But to Your point, it’s not just about talent, it’s about role as well. 13 players who can’t shoot and are defense first players might not make up a good roster, regardless of recruiting ranking. I think that more than anything has been the miss on Cooley’s part that he is trying to correct. And if fixing that means taking an A10 player who showed some potential and will have 3 years of eligibility, I’d take that shot.
I like Bynum but he is only 5'8" and as for Pipkins, who is only 5'10", I would not have wanted him at URI, so going to PC does not phase me at all, in fact it's good from my vantage point.
I thought several years ago that the Big East would trend downwards once the teams bolted for the Big 10, ACC, AAC, etc and we saw that drop from #2 to #5 this year. They could drop even further it the AAC continues it's steady climb.
PC does not have a true PG and desperately need one. Pipkins was the right play for the team giving them a potential solid PG while they search for/develop the next one. Bynum would be a good pickup, who cares what team he played for?
As for the conference, the conference had a bad year by its standards. But most preseason rankings have 3 BIg East Top 15 teams plus two more right on the outside of the top 25. ESPN was probably the most aggressive predicting two Top 5 Big East teams. So it clearly was a blip unless you only judge things in one year cycles. Every Big East team should be better next year with the exception of St. John’s.
But you have Maliek White, who you told us was a better prospect than Jeff Dowtin. #fail
You have 4* David Duke who was supposed to be the 2nd coming of Kris Dunn. #fail
You raved about MAL and his recruiting rankings. #fail
And now your fans are enamored by undersized PGs from last place A10 teams. Comparing them to Tremont Waters LOL. Your fans love to quote rankings on kids they have never seen, and quick to shit on any mention of the A10 until it's someone you guys are interested in (Isiah Jackson, Pip, Bynum). You constantly make the point about how in grand scheme the rankings prove themselves out, but your own roster should show you the error in your ways. I would say every 1 of the guys above was grossly overrated, wouldn't you? AJ Reeves is a Top 50 talent, David Duke isn't. He's an athletic guard who can't shoot a lick and doesn't really have a position. Maybe that will change but his Top 50 ranking seems as erroneous as MALs was. Most coaches believe after the Top 20 there is a ton of margin for error and I would tend to agree. Would you rather have Kalief Young or Cyril Langevine? Downtin or White? I believe your quote about that URI class was that Cooley would be getting shit on if he brought in those guys.
Drew Edwards also. But at least Edwards got Cooley his one and only NCAA win but never met expectations.
Pipkins scored lots of points against PC so they think he is really good. Or maybe had something to do with PCs defense. Cooley experimented with different Guards all year without much success. PC was known as a school that could develop great guards, had a long history of great guards but something is wrong now.
I just don’t know how after one season you can come up with the determination that PC can’t develop guards anymore. PC missed on MAL. He didn’t develop they way he should have and had he stayed, he would have had a role but as a reserve. And Duke was recruited as a PG but has developed to date as a combo guard. So now they are trying to be proactive and make sure they have a PG for next season and moving forward, I don’t think that’s the wrong play. You can’t keep jamming square pegs into round holes. If you go 3 or 4 or 5 years out from now, maybe that statement “something is wrong now” might be true. Not after one season.
Something is wrong but the more people like you can’t see it the better.
I wouldn’t want Pipkins at URI. So to me if Cooley thinks Pipkins is the answer I’d say that’s 2 years of PG challenges. But like you say let’s let it play out.
I actually don’t necessarily disagree with that, but I’d say Cooley watched Duke and White play from early last summer through the middle of March. He clearly felt both needed significant development to be a consistent starting PG, and found a grad transfer who could step in and give him minutes for next season and also buy time for 20-21, whether a transfer becoming eligible or the development of Duke. That doesn’t necessarily mean that he failed the position, but more that after last offseason, there was no reason to risk the position on “development” if he didn’t have to. At least now he knows he has a PG and anything else from Duke or White is an improvement versus hoping they both massively improve their PG skills.
And as for a combo guard, being a combo guard does not mean that a player can shoot, more than a player can play on and off-the-ball. There are plenty of slashers who are successful combo guards. I’d also like to point out that Kris Dunn was the #3 point guard on PC his freshman year, so I think Duke needs more PT before he’s written off as a PG. He’ll likely serve as the backup PG next season if he improves on some things during the summer. It’s TBD on what happens from that point.
PC saw Duke as a 1/2. He turned out to be a 2/3. But it's too early to write him off as a bust. (Unless we're also writing Harris off.)
"Every season, college basketball has one or two teams that rise from dormancy to relevancy, squads that make long-awaited charges at the NCAA Tournament and become really fun storylines along the way."
I don’t agree with RJ’s comment that Cooley has missed because he picked highly rated defense first players.
“it’s about role as well. 13 players who can’t shoot and are defense first players might not make up a good roster, regardless of recruiting ranking. I think that more than anything has been the miss on Cooley’s part that he is trying to correct.”
None of the Top 100 players are rated there because they are defense first players (particularly guards & SF). There isn’t much D even played on the AAU circuit where these players are truly evaluated. MAL, White, Duke & Reeves were rated high because of their offensive skills. I agree that it is too early to rate Duke.
Last edited by Rhody835 years ago, edited 1 time in total.
Rhody83 wrote: ↑5 years ago
I don’t agree with RJ’s comment that Cooley has missed because he picked highly rated defense first players.
“it’s about role as well. 13 players who can’t shoot and are defense first players might not make up a good roster, regardless of recruiting ranking. I think that more than anything has been the miss on Cooley’s part that he is trying to correct.”
None of the Top 100 players are rated there because they are defense first players (particularly guards & SF). There isn’t much D even played on the AAU circuit where these players are truly evaluated. MAL, White, Dunn & Reeves were rated high because of their offensive skills. I agree that it is too early to rate Dunn.
Rhody83 wrote: ↑5 years ago
I don’t agree with RJ’s comment that Cooley has missed because he picked highly rated defense first players.
“it’s about role as well. 13 players who can’t shoot and are defense first players might not make up a good roster, regardless of recruiting ranking. I think that more than anything has been the miss on Cooley’s part that he is trying to correct.”
None of the Top 100 players are rated there because they are defense first players (particularly guards & SF). There isn’t much D even played on the AAU circuit where these players are truly evaluated. MAL, White, Duke & Reeves were rated high because of their offensive skills. I agree that it is too early to rate Duke.
White was not a Top 100 player, but was relativelty high so point noted. I just don’t know how anyone could watch Duke or MAL and say they don’t need significant work on the offensive end to be solid contributors. Maybe defense-first was the wrong verbiage but both those guys specifically needed significant development to be solid offensive contributors. But Duke only played as much as he did down the stretch because he was capable of defending other elite offensive players for long stretches. He certainly wasn’t playing because of his offense or PG skills. So maybe instead of defense-first I should have said “raw” ability, I just think PC had too many raw offensive players and lacked two things 1 - solid PG play and 2 - shooting. I think some of that tied into recruiting philosophy and am glad to see some tweaks this offseason.
That’s fair. Duke was a good offensive player in AAU but isn’t a good shooter. Both he and MAL were slashers at the prep/AAU level.
I think I remember PC fans being concerned that Duke might be a one and done.
Would like to understand the details. Played for Duquesne left and was a walkon at Nevada. Now transfers back to A10 SLU. Did he reduce the 2 yr window?
Rhody83 wrote: ↑5 years ago
Would like to understand the details. Played for Duquesne left and was a walkon at Nevada. Now transfers back to A10 SLU. Did he reduce the 2 yr window?
He was never officially on the Nevada roster this past season. He had no scholarship paying his tuition on his own for the second semester he was there.
It will be interesting to see what happens with regard to A-10 transfer rules. This is an unusual case given his situation at Nevada. He never played and was never on the roster. Will intra-league transfer rules apply given these circumstances. His last game played would have been at Duquesne and his next at St Louis. Adding even more complexity to his situation is that he transferred in the middle of an academic year. NCAA rules typically require sitting out a full year. A-10 intra transfer rules require sitting out two years.
Last edited by RF15 years ago, edited 2 times in total.
On the Marquette Message Board board some say some say that there have been issues between Howard and both of the Hausers. Some say the Hausers were not happy that Howard would ignore plays and play selfishly.
Marquette struggled in February and March
The timing of Howard saying he was returning and Hausers leaving says a lot. Huge losses for Marquette.
ramster wrote: ↑5 years ago
On the Marquette Message Board board some say some say that there have been issues between Howard and both of the Hausers. Some say the Hausers were not happy that Howard would ignore plays and play selfishly.
Marquette struggled in February and March
The timing of Howard saying he was returning and Hausers leaving says a lot. Huge losses for Marquette.
That has to be it.
They said they were transferring a day or two after Howard said he was coming back.
F*ck Alacki, DarthFriar, DirtyBeanFriar94, xCoachK, Boxworth, Friar Faithful, bicycleicycle, Matt_Keough, Patrick Norton, the Rosato brothers, and especially Benjamin Lord !
With the new rules you can go through the workouts, go through the process, see where you stack up and what you need work on. Many kids are using that option and will most certainly withdraw before the June deadline. I’d guess that to be true with both Toppin and Grady and Gudmonnson.
phipsiGD'11 wrote: ↑5 years ago
I can see a team taking a chance on Toppin, not on Grady.
And Toppin had academic issues coming out of prep so he might want to bolt to the pros.
"Every season, college basketball has one or two teams that rise from dormancy to relevancy, squads that make long-awaited charges at the NCAA Tournament and become really fun storylines along the way."
Some NCAA transfer rule updates from last week’s meeting:
1) a proposed penalty on Grad Transfers (scholarship counting for 2 years if they left without completing grad degree) was defeated.
2) players that enroll in summer school can transfer and be eligible immediately if the HC leaves before the first day of Fall Semester.
Are these transfers from mid majors (like A10) going to P6 schools going to have a significant impact or will they be in the back end of the rotation for their new school? It just seems like the interest level from top schools is a little high based on their mid major performance.
Jared Bynum, Freshman transferring from St Joseph’s, has narrowed to 7 teams with 3 being from the NBE:
Providence
Butler
Seton Hall
Clemson
Notre Dame
Virginia Tech
Stanford
Rothstein posted that Marco Anthony of Virginia has put his name in the transfer portal. A bit player who I believe didn’t see the court in the Final Four. Seems curious, given that four of their starters are entering the draft. You would think he would have a big opening for playing time next year. Kyle Guy just stated he is not going to remove his name and I don’t think Ty Jerome intends to, either. Hunter should be a top 15 pick, so he won’t return to UVA. This is leading to speculation in one on line UVA publication that the Hauser brothers may transfer there, since they now have the available scholarships.
In another day, UVA would be the heavy preseason favorite to repeat, given that they had no senior starters this season. Alas, it’s the 21st century, where it’s just about impossible to keep elite teams together.
JimSidd wrote: ↑5 years ago
Rothstein posted that Marco Anthony of Virginia has put his name in the transfer portal. A bit player who I believe didn’t see the court in the Final Four. Seems curious, given that four of their starters are entering the draft. You would think he would have a big opening for playing time next year. Kyle Guy just stated he is not going to remove his name and I don’t think Ty Jerome intends to, either. Hunter should be a top 15 pick, so he won’t return to UVA. This is leading to speculation in one on line UVA publication that the Hauser brothers may transfer there, since they now have the available scholarships.
In another day, UVA would be the heavy preseason favorite to repeat, given that they had no senior starters this season. Alas, it’s the 21st century, where it’s just about impossible to keep elite teams together.
ramster wrote: ↑5 years ago
Jared Bynum, Freshman transferring from St Joseph’s, has narrowed to 7 teams with 3 being from the NBE:
Providence
Butler
Seton Hall
Clemson
Notre Dame
Virginia Tech
Stanford
Bynum currently visiting PC, will visit Butler Wednesday
