[OFFICIAL] Hurley Signs Extension With URI

RF1 · Unread post by **RF1** » 11 years ago

steviep123 wrote:Can someone post Donaldson's article? I can't seem to find it on line.

I posted a link in an above post.

steviep123 · Unread post by **steviep123** » 11 years ago

RF1 wrote:
BFC wrote:http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/college/ ... Basketball

Lenn Robbins couldn't even get URI's record from the last season right.

He went 6-21 in his first season at Rhode Island

This is the same guy that had Dayton imminently joining the Big East a few weeks ago so I would give it ZERO creedence. Another sad indictment of today's journalism. Many writers just write crap to put it out there with little regard to fact and accuracy.

Who has time for fact checking anyway?

steviep123 · Unread post by **steviep123** » 11 years ago

RF1 wrote:
steviep123 wrote:Can someone post Donaldson's article? I can't seem to find it on line.

I posted a link in an above post.

Thanks!

scine20 · Unread post by **scine20** » 11 years ago

If I was a potential recruit it would scare me that he is even showing interest in the Rutgers job. It's also concerning as a fan that he's already looking at other jobs after one year. You'd like to see him 100% committed to this job for the length of the contract, or, if not the length of the contract, at least long enough to show some positive results and leave it in a good place for the next guy to take over.

If Hurley does leave now you could almost argue that the program will be in worse shape than it was in March of 2012 before Baron was fired.

Rhody74 · Unread post by **Rhody74** » 11 years ago

steviep123 wrote:Can someone post Donaldson's article? I can't seem to find it on line.

http://digital.olivesoftware.com/Olive/ ... w=ZW50aXR5

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 11 years ago

BFC wrote:http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/college/ ... Basketball

I don't know, maybe this is baseless on my part, but I feel like that could be a lot worse.

steviep123 · Unread post by **steviep123** » 11 years ago

Captainron@ wrote:Mmmmm, weiners

That's what she said!!

Rhody74 · Unread post by **Rhody74** » 11 years ago

I dunno, but the Post story reads like a story about a man who's thinking of leaving his wife for a beautiful woman but is confilicted by two facts:

1. He's happily married;
2. The other woman has syphilis

Unread post by **ATPTourFan** » 11 years ago

RF1 wrote:
BFC wrote:http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/college/ ... Basketball

Lenn Robbins couldn't even get URI's record from the last season right.

He went 6-21 in his first season at Rhode Island

This is the same guy that had Dayton imminently joining the Big East a few weeks ago so I would give it ZERO creedence. Another sad indictment of today's journalism. Many writers just write crap to put it out there with little regard to fact and accuracy.

Exactly, Lenn Robins hasn't gotten anything right in the past 6 months. He has no good contacts.

Unread post by **ATPTourFan** » 11 years ago

scine20 wrote:If I was a potential recruit it would scare me that he is even showing interest in the Rutgers job. It's also concerning as a fan that he's already looking at other jobs after one year. You'd like to see him 100% committed to this job for the length of the contract, or, if not the length of the contract, at least long enough to show some positive results and leave it in a good place for the next guy to take over.

If Hurley does leave now you could almost argue that the program will be in worse shape than it was in March of 2012 before Baron was fired.

Who says Hurley's showing interest in the specific opening at Rutgers at the moment. If they got him to say, "I'd be interested in coaching in Jersey again some day", does that imply that he's "interested" in Rutgers right NOW? NO, it doesn't. He's a young head coach who will have tons of options in his long career.

Lenn Robins should be avoided if you prefer quality, factual coverage of any topic.

gorhody89 · Unread post by **gorhody89** » 11 years ago

Rhody74 wrote:I dunno, but the Post story reads like a story about a man who's thinking of leaving his wife for a beautiful woman but is confilicted by two facts:

1. He's happily married;
2. The other woman has syphilis

hahaha perfect comparison

scine20 · Unread post by **scine20** » 11 years ago

ATPTourFan wrote:
scine20 wrote:If I was a potential recruit it would scare me that he is even showing interest in the Rutgers job. It's also concerning as a fan that he's already looking at other jobs after one year. You'd like to see him 100% committed to this job for the length of the contract, or, if not the length of the contract, at least long enough to show some positive results and leave it in a good place for the next guy to take over.

If Hurley does leave now you could almost argue that the program will be in worse shape than it was in March of 2012 before Baron was fired.
Who says Hurley's showing interest in the specific opening at Rutgers at the moment. If they got him to say, "I'd be interested in coaching in Jersey again some day", does that imply that he's "interested" in Rutgers right NOW? NO, it doesn't. He's a young head coach who will have tons of options in his long career.

Lenn Robins should be avoided if you prefer quality, factual coverage of any topic.

Whether it's true or not, the fact that it's the NY Post is concerning.

URI_05 · Unread post by **URI_05** » 11 years ago

scine20 wrote:
ATPTourFan wrote:
scine20 wrote:If I was a potential recruit it would scare me that he is even showing interest in the Rutgers job. It's also concerning as a fan that he's already looking at other jobs after one year. You'd like to see him 100% committed to this job for the length of the contract, or, if not the length of the contract, at least long enough to show some positive results and leave it in a good place for the next guy to take over.

If Hurley does leave now you could almost argue that the program will be in worse shape than it was in March of 2012 before Baron was fired.
Who says Hurley's showing interest in the specific opening at Rutgers at the moment. If they got him to say, "I'd be interested in coaching in Jersey again some day", does that imply that he's "interested" in Rutgers right NOW? NO, it doesn't. He's a young head coach who will have tons of options in his long career.

Lenn Robins should be avoided if you prefer quality, factual coverage of any topic.
Whether it's true or not, the fact that it's the NY Post is concerning.

No it's not. If you followed NY sports at all, you would know that.

Unread post by **ATPTourFan** » 11 years ago

Exactly, Robins was just incredibly OFF on the New Big East thing RF1 alluded to earlier in this thread. He has no idea.

Remember, in his garbage story, he was speaking to a "source" close to Rutgers who is relaying, without full context, a conversation (supposedly) with Dan. Robins is not even saying "a source close to Hurley says...".

Avoid Robins.

Blue Man · Unread post by **Blue Man** » 11 years ago

Rhody74 wrote:I dunno, but the Post story reads like a story about a man who's thinking of leaving his wife for a beautiful woman but is confilicted by two facts:

1. He's happily married;
2. The other woman has syphilis

Hahaha perfect.

Also, this article says that Lawrence Frank is interested in the RU job. Didn't Frank come out yesterday and say he wasn't?

I want to get paid to write for the Post. A source of mine says Wes Welker is interested in the Broncos receiver slot. Also, another close source says Pedro is interested in toeing the rubber for the sox later this season. And when I say "interested," i of course mean this is a fact.

Billyboy78 · Unread post by **Billyboy78** » 11 years ago

The PC Journal will be thrilled if Hurley is gone. Heaven forbid the state school threaten the supremecy of their precious little Friars.....that newspaper, that school, Rooke, Cordischi, the idiot TV guys...they all make me want to puke!!!

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 11 years ago

Ditto, Billy! I'm so tired of this.
Just think, as long as Dan Hurley is at URI, these same cast of
rejects, will be promoting every story that has to do with his leaving.
Pathetic!

scine20 · Unread post by **scine20** » 11 years ago

Blue Man wrote:
Rhody74 wrote:I dunno, but the Post story reads like a story about a man who's thinking of leaving his wife for a beautiful woman but is confilicted by two facts:

1. He's happily married;
2. The other woman has syphilis
Hahaha perfect.

Also, this article says that Lawrence Frank is interested in the RU job. Didn't Frank come out yesterday and say he wasn't?

I want to get paid to write for the Post. A source of mine says Wes Welker is interested in the Broncos receiver slot. Also, another close source says Pedro is interested in toeing the rubber for the sox later this season. And when I say "interested," i of course mean this is a fact.

The point is that Hurley should be interested in the URI job and only the URI job.

Unread post by **ATPTourFan** » 11 years ago

Scine, that may be exactly the case right now.

3wisemen · Unread post by **3wisemen** » 11 years ago

Scine, that's not real life. It's good to be happy where you are, but human nature is to always look for bigger and better. The grass is always greener.
URI has potential to be a good job. It's not the dead end it appeared to be at the end of Baron's tenure. It's also not up to the standard of a Big Ten program. Those two facts invite speculation. Dan Hurley's sole motive here for URI faans should be to turn this program into a destination for young, talented coaches looking to advance their careers. That's what VCU is. That should be the model.

RAM67 · Unread post by **RAM67** » 11 years ago

I think Dan is doing his due dilligence by not commenting. I am sure he will not reaffirm his committment to us without at least hearing from RU officially. But who will contact him if the 2 kingpins are gone? This could drag out for a long time, and I know I am going to be impatient. My heart says he stays, but only my heart.

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 11 years ago

"It's also not up to the standard of a Big Ten program" You mean like Northwestern and Penn State in basketball?
VCU paid Shaka Smart a boatload of money and concessions to keep him there. He's not going anywhere.
If he was, he'd have been gone by now. That's also real life. Not to be a stepping stone job for anyone who
thinks he can use the job like toilet paper. Shit and run.

Iggy1979 · Unread post by **Iggy1979** » 11 years ago

EricRueb wrote:What was wrong with Donaldson's piece exactly? That it explored a possible option for something you hope doesn't happen? It was a column; not a news story, and it went perfect with the PK/KMac piece. The comparison of Hurley to Rutgers and Cooley and PC was fitting.
Just because the topic wasn't something you didn't like doesn't make it a hatchet job.

1. No one from Rutgers has even talked to Hurley but Donaldson writes like it's a done deal.
2. If Hurley does leave, the two "top" candidates that Donaldson mentions won't even get a phone call from Thorr.
Other than that, great column.

3wisemen · Unread post by **3wisemen** » 11 years ago

Facilities. Cash. The surroundings that come with a big-time program.
URI took four bus trips to Philly in a three-day span last season (Temple and St. Joe's). Big Ten programs don't do that. Major conference programs don't do that. Coaches notice those sorts of things. It's what they fight for in their contracts. When Baron droned on and on about the process and infrastructure, that's what he meant. Charter to every game. Basketball-specific weight rooms, practice center, dining hall, etc. The ability to schedule anyone and travel anywhere. It's the sort of thing coaches ask for when they extend their contracts at mid-majors and smaller schools.

scine20 · Unread post by **scine20** » 11 years ago

3wisemen wrote:Facilities. Cash. The surroundings that come with a big-time program.
URI took four bus trips to Philly in a three-day span last season (Temple and St. Joe's). Big Ten programs don't do that. Major conference programs don't do that. Coaches notice those sorts of things. It's what they fight for in their contracts. When Baron droned on and on about the process and infrastructure, that's what he meant. It's the sort of thing coach ask for when they extend their contracts at mid-majors and smaller schools.

Hurley knew all that coming in. He also knew that he could probably get a job at a BCS level school.

He shouldn't have come to URI if taking bus trips would be an issue.

Rhody74 · Unread post by **Rhody74** » 11 years ago

Here's another tweet to get the sky-is-falling crowd in a tither:

Xavier Munford ‏@InMyLifetimexx 7m
Headed to Jersey

3wisemen · Unread post by **3wisemen** » 11 years ago

scine20 wrote:
3wisemen wrote:Facilities. Cash. The surroundings that come with a big-time program.
URI took four bus trips to Philly in a three-day span last season (Temple and St. Joe's). Big Ten programs don't do that. Major conference programs don't do that. Coaches notice those sorts of things. It's what they fight for in their contracts. When Baron droned on and on about the process and infrastructure, that's what he meant. It's the sort of thing coach ask for when they extend their contracts at mid-majors and smaller schools.
Hurley knew all that coming in. He also knew that he could probably get a job at a BCS level school.

He shouldn't have come to URI if taking bus trips would be an issue.

Scine, follow along. I was pointing out the differences between a major program and what URI is right now. I'm sure Hurley was aware of that. He came here to build something and I certainly think he's started to do that already. But in order to continue, he needs more. He's going to ask for more. If URI doesn't provide it, Hurley's decision to leave gets easier.

scine20 · Unread post by **scine20** » 11 years ago

3wisemen wrote:
scine20 wrote:
3wisemen wrote:Facilities. Cash. The surroundings that come with a big-time program.
URI took four bus trips to Philly in a three-day span last season (Temple and St. Joe's). Big Ten programs don't do that. Major conference programs don't do that. Coaches notice those sorts of things. It's what they fight for in their contracts. When Baron droned on and on about the process and infrastructure, that's what he meant. It's the sort of thing coach ask for when they extend their contracts at mid-majors and smaller schools.
Hurley knew all that coming in. He also knew that he could probably get a job at a BCS level school.

He shouldn't have come to URI if taking bus trips would be an issue.
Scine, follow along. I was pointing out the differences between a major program and what URI is right now. I'm sure Hurley was aware of that. He came here to build something and I certainly think he's started to do that already. But in order to continue, he needs more. He's going to ask for more. If URI doesn't provide it, Hurley's decision to leave gets easier.

I understand. But Hurley shouldn't have come to URI if there was even a remote chance that he'd leave after 1 year. IMO he's a fraud if he leaves now and I'd have zero respect for him.

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 11 years ago

"Keep the faith with Dan - he likes it here, a lot and knows that there is so much more to accomplish and do but is so critical that we continue to supply him and the program with the tools they need to remain competitive - both on and off the court. I believe that we are and have a great plan going forward. "
This from someone who should know what's going on in Kingston.
In case you've been sleeping, there are many things in motion to accomplish getting us the program
to compete on a level playing field.
Rhody74, Munford, Biggie and Aaman are always going home for weekends. BFD!

Rhody74 · Unread post by **Rhody74** » 11 years ago

rodfromcranston wrote: Rhody74, Munford, Biggie and Aaman are always going home for weekends. BFD!

I know .... I was kidding ....

ramfan85 · Unread post by **ramfan85** » 11 years ago

I didn't mind Dan's silence before. But, now that all these articles are coming out indicating his "possible" interest in RU, I think it's important for him to respond that he's not interested, if that's how he feels. He doesn't have to wait for a formal offer. Not responding gives some credence to the articles.
We still have open scholarships. recruits read and hear these stories, too.
Don't think that because he's at the FF that he can't be recruited. Most schools are represented there. Didn't Tom talk to Texas people at the FF?

3wisemen · Unread post by **3wisemen** » 11 years ago

Scine, would you leave your job after one year if a rival company offered to triple your salary and guarantee your job security for a longer time? If you say no, you're the real fraud. That's incredibly hypocritical.

Gonebarongone · Unread post by **Gonebarongone** » 11 years ago

Here are some of what I think the issues are:

1. I don't necessarily think that a good year (short of a S16 type run) gets DH on the national radar for a BCS type job that might come open. The types of jobs that will come open in the next year. Wake Forest type jobs. BCS jobs outside of the Northeast/Mid-Atlantic.

2. He is unique in that his name would carry weight above his stature in a pretty small area. Let's face it, a guy in the middle of the country is going to be pretty non-plussed by a DH hire. So, we are really looking at a few jobs where his name would place him above his resume. St. John's. Seton Hall. Nova. Rutgers.

3. Steve Lavin isn't going anywhere. Willard just got extended to 2020. Jay Wright? Probably not. Whoever the new Rutgers coach is will get presumably 3-4 years.

4. So, that's the real context in which I think DH considers (if offered). If I don't take one of the BCS or Big East jobs now in an area I know I can crush recruiting, it could be 3-4 more years.

Honestly, I bet he really wants to stay at URI. Doesn't strike me as a one year and bolt guy. But, the situation is pretty unique, too. It might be tough to pass up $1.5MM to coach in the Big 10.

3wisemen · Unread post by **3wisemen** » 11 years ago

The Final Four also doubles as the NABC convention. Coaches and athletic staff from all over the country are in Atlanta right now.

scine20 · Unread post by **scine20** » 11 years ago

3wisemen wrote:Would you leave your job after one year if a rival company offered to triple your salary and guarantee your job security for a longer time? If you say no, you're the real fraud. That's incredibly hypocritical.

Not if I made a commitment to a bunch of kids and a fan base to do a job.

There's more to life than money. How about integrity?

I'm not saying that Hurley has to stay for the duration, although it would be nice if he did. But leaving now would put URI in a worse position than they were in before he was hired.

3wisemen · Unread post by **3wisemen** » 11 years ago

You'd be making the same commitment to your co-workers and your boss. And then you would leave. Stop thinking like a fan and get serious.

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 11 years ago

Again, for the deaf, Rice made 20K more than Hurley is.
If Rutgers is going to break the bank, why not go after a Ben Howland?
Why would Rutgers pass on one time top cadidate Eddie Jordan, who wants the job?
Who the hell is going to recruit Hurley at the Final Four?
There's an assumption that he's just looking, for any big job after an 8 win season, like some drunken hooker looking for a john
at a convention. Give me a break!
Penders admitted he was looking to parlay his success at URI for bigger money.
Different people, different circumstances.
Also, does anyone get it that Dan's silence is in conjuction with Biruta and Carr's situation with Rutgers?
THE SKY IS FALLING! THE SKY IS FALLING!

3wisemen · Unread post by **3wisemen** » 11 years ago

Penders went from $50K at URI to $500K at Texas.
As for Rutgers, Rice was making about 20 percent of that $650K at Robert Morris. It's a business. They didn't have to pay him more. With Hurley it would be a different scenario. They would have to do much better than $650K and would be able to with the Big Ten cash they have coming in. Again, Rod, don't fall in with Scine. Think realistically and not like some ignorant fan. You're better than that.

Gonebarongone · Unread post by **Gonebarongone** » 11 years ago

rodfromcranston wrote:Agains for the deaf, Rice made 20K more than Hurley is.
If Rutgers is going to break the bank, why not go after a Ben Howland?
Why would Rutgers pass on one time top cadidate Eddie Jordan, who wants the job?
Who the hell is going to recruit Hurley at the Final Four?
There's an assumption that he's just looking, for any big job after an 8 win season, like some drunken hooker looking for a john
at a convention. Give me a break!
Penders admitted he was looking to parlay his success at URI for bigger money.
Different people, different circumstances.
Also, does anyone get it that Dan's silence is in conjuction with Biruta and Carr's situation with Rutgers?
THE SKY IS FALLING! THE SKY IS FALLING!

Rod-Rice was hired three years before they knew they were getting the Big Ten windfall. The next RU coach will get well north of $1MM.

The reality is that many things have to fall into place for DH to go to Rutgers. I honestly think that there is less than a one in four chance he goes. At the same time, you can see the context in which the job would interest him. Any coach worth his salt thinks he can fix a place. Like any pitching coach thinking he can tweak the guy with the great stuff with poor results. DH will not get another shot at a big D-1 job within a few hours of NYC and a very fertile recruiting area AND a massive pay bump AND games in Bloomington, Ann Arbor, East Lansing against Izzo, Crean, etc probably for at least 3-4 years if he passes this up. I'm not saying he is going. Like I said, I really do think it is significantly less than 50/50. But, it would not surprise me in the least.

Also, for the nth time, if you get all riled up about speculation about him leaving, why the hell do you click on a topic titled "Renewed speculation of Dan Hurley to Rutgers"? It's like someone allergic to peanut butter diving into a jar of Skippy.

RIFan · Unread post by **RIFan** » 11 years ago

Dan is going to be a wealthy man whether he stays at URI, or goes somwhere else. We are not talking about a guy who is making $50k/year jumping to $150k. Dan is now a 1%'er as they like to say. Did the apple not fall far from the tree (his father), or is Dan chasing the money?

scine20 · Unread post by **scine20** » 11 years ago

3wisemen wrote:Penders went from $50K at URI to $500K at Texas.
As for Rutgers, Rice was making about 20 percent of that $650K at Robert Morris. It's a business. They didn't have to pay him more. With Hurley it would be a different scenario. They would have to do much better than $650K and would be able to with the Big Ten cash they have coming in. Again, Rod, don't fall in with Scine. Think realistically and not like some ignorant fan. You're better than that.

Not sure where I'm being ignorant.

I am saying that if Hurley leaves that it is ethically wrong. This isn't a Penders situation where he had built up URI to where the next guy could come in and do a decent job. Rice took Robert Morris to the tournament. Hurley hasn't done a thing as far as improving the win/loss (not that I would have expected him to) but if he leaves now he'd be leaving URI in a huge hole that would be bigger than the one that they were in before Hurley even got there after all these recruits and transfer follow him to Rutgers. He should think about that before cashing his check. $650,000 a year is more than any public employee is making in Rhode Island. I don't think that Hurley is exactly on the streets beginning for money.

He's not breaking a law if he leaves. But if he does it he'd be a greedy prick who I would have zero respect for as a person.

Roz · Unread post by **Roz** » 11 years ago

Not sure if anyone heard the interview, but Bobby was on Colin Cowherd earlier and said he was not interested in the Rutgers position, acknowledged Danny has been mentioned a lot, but then said he has not spoken to him about it and that he is doing good things in RI.

3wisemen · Unread post by **3wisemen** » 11 years ago

Ah yes, the highest paid state employee argument. If you want to make a case against being ignorant, that's probably not the best place to start.
Hurley didn't take Wagner to the tournament. No NIT. No NCAA. Not even the CIT. Was he a greedy prick for leaving there? No, he was smart. He left for a better job. And you feel that way because he came to the team that you happen to like.

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 11 years ago

I've tried to give my view on things, coupled with some feedback
from my sources.
I have provided information on players only meeting, the realignment of coaching staff,
a quote from a prominent insider, information about why Hurley's son may not have
enrolled in whatever school he didn't.
So now, you tell me who has contributed the most to this thread, minus the chicken little hysteria?
Let's vote on if I should have passed on a thread THAT I BEGAN!

ramfan85 · Unread post by **ramfan85** » 11 years ago

I could go for a drunken hooker right about now. But, only if she's a quality person (and not named Donaldson).

steviep123 · Unread post by **steviep123** » 11 years ago

ramfan85 wrote:I could go for a drunken hooker right about now. But, only if she's a quality person (and not named Donaldson).

I hear Cordischi knows someone....

Gonebarongone · Unread post by **Gonebarongone** » 11 years ago

rodfromcranston wrote:I've tried to give my view on things, coupled with some feedback
from my sources.
I have provided information on players only meeting, the realignment of coaching staff,
a quote from a prominent insider, information about why Hurley's son may not have
enrolled in whatever school he didn't.
So now, you tell me who has contributed the most to this thread, minus the chicken little hysteria?
Let's vote on if I should have passed on a thread THAT I BEGAN!

Ha! Even better. Let me start a thread about something that makes me go insane. Also, I have a gold sticker for you because you have contributed the most to this thread. I don't think I am a chicken little because I think it is doubtful he goes but let's interject some realism into this thread. 99% of coaches would at least consider this step up. Maybe he is the 1%. But, nothing coaches do surprise me anymore. There should be nothing stopping his from saying via the media something to the effect of "I have seen my name in several articles about the Rutgers job. I am flattered but I am happy at URI". Pretty simple. Until I see that, the door is open.

ramfan85 · Unread post by **ramfan85** » 11 years ago

steviep123 wrote:
ramfan85 wrote:I could go for a drunken hooker right about now. But, only if she's a quality person (and not named Donaldson).
I hear Cordischi knows someone....

LOL

hrstrat57 · Unread post by **hrstrat57** » 11 years ago

Billyboy78 wrote:The PC Journal will be thrilled if Hurley is gone. Heaven forbid the state school threaten the supremecy of their precious little Friars.....that newspaper, that school, Rooke, Cordischi, the idiot TV guys...they all make me want to puke!!!

The downcity providence ultimate nightmare =
Ryan Center sold out every game....top 25 Ram team playing at the top of their game.
All the RI buzz is Ram buzz.
This is likely just a few months away if the current situation holds and is exactly why the pc crowd wants to run D Hurley out of town.

Pretty easy to figure out IMHO!

Billyboy78 · Unread post by **Billyboy78** » 11 years ago

hrstrat57 wrote:
Billyboy78 wrote:The PC Journal will be thrilled if Hurley is gone. Heaven forbid the state school threaten the supremecy of their precious little Friars.....that newspaper, that school, Rooke, Cordischi, the idiot TV guys...they all make me want to puke!!!
The downcity providence ultimate nightmare =
Ryan Center sold out every game....top 25 Ram team playing at the top of their game.
All the RI buzz is Ram buzz.
This is likely just a few months away if the current situation holds and is exactly why the pc crowd wants to run D Hurley out of town.

Pretty easy to figure out IMHO!

We will never have the "buzz". We could be the #1 team in the country and still be #2 in the state....always have, always will.....see 1978.