Loyola-Chicago to the A10

[ramster]

I believe Loyolas arena would be the 3rd or 4th smallest in the conference?

A-10 Arenas with current capacity

Fordham Rose Hill Gym 3,200
LaSalle Gola Arena 3,200
Duquesne Cooper Fieldhouse 3,500
St Joe's Hagan Arena 4,200
Loyola Gentile Center 4,486
GW Smith Center 5,000
Davidson Belk arena 5,295
SBU Reilly Center 5,480
Richmond Robins Center 7,201
VCU Seigel Center 7,637
URI Ryan Center 7,657
GMU EagleBank Arena 7,860
UMass Mullins Center 9,493
St Louis Chaifetz Center 10,600
Dayton UD Arena 13,409

A photo montage of the arenas from a few years ago prior to Duquesne renovation and addition of Loyola

A-10 Arenas Nov-2015.jpg

Would have been nice to add a school with at least 7000 capacity.
Adding at the bottom capacity range is not thinking big.

My guess is the A10 looks very different in 5-10 years anyway so it won’t matter

[RF1]

You know it’s a bad season for Rhody when it’s game day, we are playing Dayton (one of the top teams in the conf again) at home and KB is temporarily obsessed with a thread like this.

Ooph. Bad season.

Anything that distracts us from the hot mess that is this year's team is ok by me. The 2022-23 season can't end soon enough.

[section(105)]

You know it’s a bad season for Rhody when it’s game day, we are playing Dayton (one of the top teams in the conf again) at home and KB is temporarily obsessed with a thread like this.

Ooph. Bad season.

Anything that distracts us from the hot mess that is this year's team is ok by me. The 2022-23 season can't end soon enough.

Agree, JETS, just end the season, side note, the Alumni Association bus trip to the Bronx for Fordham was cancelled, it was my wife and I and maybe 4 others…..

[RF1]

I guess that by virtue of GMU having the EagleBank Arena that presently has a capacity of 7,860 makes it a far more valuable member to the A-10 than Loyola.

The fact that GMU is averaging just 3,310 for a team that is today 12-8 means nothing. The fact that its addition to the A-10 did not add a new market as it shares the DMV with GW doesn't matter. The fact that its market population is smaller than that of Chicago does not matter. The fact that its team has done little on the court to distinguish itself (no NCAA or even NIT) in its TEN years as an A-10 member means nothing. It is apparently per some automatically a better league member just by having a bigger arena.

[PeterRamTime]

Another that has not aged well

Well you have to admit nobody could have guessed they would be this atrocious.

Yeah you could've. Just like the A-10 has had a handful of teams that could compete a conference or two above, there are also (way more) teams at the bottom that belong in lower conferences and would probably still be middle of the pack.

The MVC (and other 1 bid leagues) don't really have that, especially since the few years they weren't 1 bid - they had Creighton and Wichita State. Just like no one would argue that the A-10 was a significantly better conference with Xavier, Temple, and Butler and we are a shell of ourselves on the national stage - the same would be said about the MVC.

Loyola isn't a powerhouse program, they were a bigger fish in a small pond and they still weren't the best team in that conference running away. They were in the "upper echelon" of the MVC the Porter Moser years along with blueblood programs Drake, Northern Iowa, and Bradley.

The best hope for Loyola is a consistent middle of the pack team.

As a conference - they I assume they were thinking "this gives us Chicago, an added recruiting spot/sell for other teams to get their recruits some games in Chicago, and another easy travel game to keep the likes of Dayton/St Louis as less of a flight risk."

Literally no one predicted they would be anywhere near this bad. Not even you. You just think they can't be great in this conference.

Absolutely nothing suggested they would suddenly be this bad.

Especially after being as good as they've been since their final four run.

Drew Valentine had them playing essentially the same style of basketball as Porter Moser and they were attracting more talent.

Since 17/18 they had been operating at a higher level than pretty much everyone in the Atlantic 10. They had good enough teams to compete at the top of the league, good enough coaching and appeared to be acquiring the necessary talent.

Like last years Loyola team easily wins the A-10 regular season championship.

Everything pointed to them continuing to play the smart winning basketball they had been playing and use the A-10 to improve their talent enough to compete at a high level in this conference.

But I guess Drew Valentine is their Dave Cox because they look as hopeless as we do. Didn't look like they lost enough players to completely fall off the map.

[theblueram]

I guess that by virtue of GMU having the EagleBank Arena that presently has a capacity of 7,860 makes it a far more valuable member to the A-10 than Loyola.

The fact that GMU is averaging just 3,310 for a team that is today 12-8 means nothing. The fact that its addition to the A-10 did not add a new market as it shares the DMV with GW doesn't matter. The fact that its market population is smaller than that of Chicago does matter. The fact that its team has done little on the court to distinguish itself (no NCAA or even NIT) in its TEN years as an A-10 member means nothing. It is apparently per some automatically a better league member just by having a bigger arena.

Now you piqued my interest and I'm going to find the GMU add thread and see what my thoughts were. Good thing we didn't add St Peter's , they are 11th in the Metro.

[ramster]

I guess that by virtue of GMU having the EagleBank Arena that presently has a capacity of 7,860 makes it a far more valuable member to the A-10 than Loyola.

The fact that GMU is averaging just 3,310 for a team that is today 12-8 means nothing. The fact that its addition to the A-10 did not add a new market as it shares the DMV with GW doesn't matter. The fact that its market population is smaller than that of Chicago does matter. The fact that its team has done little on the court to distinguish itself (no NCAA or even NIT) in its TEN years as an A-10 member means nothing. It is apparently per some automatically a better league member just by having a bigger arena.

Now you piqued my interest and I'm going to find the GMU add thread and see what my thoughts were. Good thing we didn't add St Peter's , they are 11th in the Metro.

Here you go Theblueram……..

viewtopic.php?t=1021&hilit=George+Mason&start=450

[theblueram]

I guess that by virtue of GMU having the EagleBank Arena that presently has a capacity of 7,860 makes it a far more valuable member to the A-10 than Loyola.

The fact that GMU is averaging just 3,310 for a team that is today 12-8 means nothing. The fact that its addition to the A-10 did not add a new market as it shares the DMV with GW doesn't matter. The fact that its market population is smaller than that of Chicago does matter. The fact that its team has done little on the court to distinguish itself (no NCAA or even NIT) in its TEN years as an A-10 member means nothing. It is apparently per some automatically a better league member just by having a bigger arena.

Now you piqued my interest and I'm going to find the GMU add thread and see what my thoughts were. Good thing we didn't add St Peter's , they are 11th in the Metro.

Here you go Theblueram……..

viewtopic.php?t=1021&hilit=George+Mason&start=450

Interesting that I did not have one post for or against this add. Sometimes back in the day when I disagreed with Rod, I just didn't post.

[reef]

Loyola blows 11 point lead loses by 14 @ Duquesne

[RhodyKyle]

Loyola blows 11 point lead loses by 14 @ Duquesne

I blame the Uber Eats guy! He cursed Loyola last night.

[RF1]

Loyola blows 11 point lead loses by 14 @ Duquesne

I blame the Uber Eats guy! He cursed Loyola last night.

Most people will probably not understand your reference so I will help them out. During play in Pittsburgh at Duquesne, an UberEats delivery guy (in yellow jacket carrying food bag in corner of court in tweet photo below) walked onto the court to deliver a takeout meal to a customer along the sideline. He wasn't all that far from some of the players as they were transitioning to the other end of the court. It didn't really interfere with play but was certainly not something ever seen before.

[reef]

Who orders doordash , Uber eats or grubhub @ a sporting event ?? Poor delivery guy

[RhowdyRam02]

Who orders doordash , Uber eats or grubhub @ a sporting event ?? Poor delivery guy

Sounds like a hell of an idea with the kind of concession lines we deal with....

[Rhody15]

Who orders doordash , Uber eats or grubhub @ a sporting event ?? Poor delivery guy

Sounds like a hell of an idea with the kind of concession lines we deal with....

Unfortunately it wasn't real.

Was only a staged TikTok video to go viral.

[damram]

I think chair service would be a great idea. Instead of walking around selling 50/50 tickets to people that already bought them for the most part, the fundraisers can deliver for a pre determined fee. I hate standing in line while the game is being played.

[theblueram]

I think chair service would be a great idea. Instead of walking around selling 50/50 tickets to people that already bought them for the most part, the fundraisers can deliver for a pre determined fee. I hate standing in line while the game is being played.

You mean like a baseball game where people coming around with beers and hot dogs to your seat? Brilliant!!!

[bigappleram]

When we are having a conversation about programs that should be dropped to make the league stronger and someone brings up that we currently are in 12th place.

[Jersey77]

When we are having a conversation about programs that should be dropped to make the league stronger and someone brings up that we currently are in 12th place.

Actually, the entire conversation about purposely dropping teams from the A10 is a total waste because that will not happen.

There was also discussion here about forming a new conference, but again good luck with that.

[Blue Man]

When we are having a conversation about programs that should be dropped to make the league stronger and someone brings up that we currently are in 12th place.

The key to remember is that Duquesne, Fordham, and George Mason made the dance before they were in the A10. So they have NEVER contributed a single credit to the A-10 pool.

They've made significantly more money off of everyone else. Even La Salle's 3 units was at least SOMETHING to give back.

Cutting those bums SHOULD happen, but it unfortunately never will.

[SmartyBarrett]

The key to remember is that Duquesne, Fordham, and George Mason made the dance before they were in the A10. So they have NEVER contributed a single credit to the A-10 pool.

Same goes for Loyola-Chicago. Hoping they don't go 12+ years without a bid like the other schools. Not off to a great start!

[RhowdyRam02]

When we are having a conversation about programs that should be dropped to make the league stronger and someone brings up that we currently are in 12th place.

Duquesne - 46 years ago
Fordham - never in the A10
La Salle - once 10 years ago, have made no investments in their program, university is going bankrupt

[PeterRamTime]

Here's a fun hypothetical

If we were to run the table in the A-10's do we get one of the 16 seed play in games? Would they ever put an A-10 team in one of those games?

Would be a sweet deal though! Go grab us an easy win in Dayton and procure two NCAA credits.

[RhowdyRam02]

When we are having a conversation about programs that should be dropped to make the league stronger and someone brings up that we currently are in 12th place.

The key to remember is that Duquesne, Fordham, and George Mason made the dance before they were in the A10. So they have NEVER contributed a single credit to the A-10 pool.

They've made significantly more money off of everyone else. Even La Salle's 3 units was at least SOMETHING to give back.

Cutting those bums SHOULD happen, but it unfortunately never will.

Duquesne happened in the forerunner of the A10, so technically 46 years ago they did contribute. I give George Mason a pass for now because they at least have an arena and a location that indicate they could eventually bring something to the table, but it's about time for them to do it

[PeterRamTime]

When we are having a conversation about programs that should be dropped to make the league stronger and someone brings up that we currently are in 12th place.

The key to remember is that Duquesne, Fordham, and George Mason made the dance before they were in the A10. So they have NEVER contributed a single credit to the A-10 pool.

They've made significantly more money off of everyone else. Even La Salle's 3 units was at least SOMETHING to give back.

Cutting those bums SHOULD happen, but it unfortunately never will.

Duquesne happened in the forerunner of the A10, so technically 46 years ago they did contribute. I give George Mason a pass for now because they at least have an arena and a location that indicate they could eventually bring something to the table, but it's about time for them to do it

I think Mason has a pretty good chance under Kim English. They look better coached now than they have in a while. The potential is there, but Paul Hewitt really dropped the ball when they moved to the A-10.

From the final four on they went to a CIT, CBI, NIT, and two more NCAA's with one more tournament win in 11. Then they move to the A-10 and died.

It's weird how Paul Hewitt took GT to the national championship game and pretty much just completely fell off after that.

[reef]

Here's a fun hypothetical

If we were to run the table in the A-10's do we get one of the 16 seed play in games? Would they ever put an A-10 team in one of those games?

Would be a sweet deal though! Go grab us an easy win in Dayton and procure two NCAA credits.

No I don’t think so those are usually the bottom feeder conferences in the 25-30 range

[RhowdyRam02]

The key to remember is that Duquesne, Fordham, and George Mason made the dance before they were in the A10. So they have NEVER contributed a single credit to the A-10 pool.

They've made significantly more money off of everyone else. Even La Salle's 3 units was at least SOMETHING to give back.

Cutting those bums SHOULD happen, but it unfortunately never will.

Duquesne happened in the forerunner of the A10, so technically 46 years ago they did contribute. I give George Mason a pass for now because they at least have an arena and a location that indicate they could eventually bring something to the table, but it's about time for them to do it

I think Mason has a pretty good chance under Kim English. They look better coached now than they have in a while. The potential is there, but Paul Hewitt really dropped the ball when they moved to the A-10.

From the final four on they went to a CIT, CBI, NIT, and two more NCAA's with one more tournament win in 11. Then they move to the A-10 and died.

It's weird how Paul Hewitt took GT to the national championship game and pretty much just completely fell off after that.

Right. George Mason so far in the A10 feels more to me like their Baron era years than a team that doesn't have the facilities/will to compete, where Fordham doesn't have the facilities and will to compete

[Blue Man]

When we are having a conversation about programs that should be dropped to make the league stronger and someone brings up that we currently are in 12th place.

The key to remember is that Duquesne, Fordham, and George Mason made the dance before they were in the A10. So they have NEVER contributed a single credit to the A-10 pool.

They've made significantly more money off of everyone else. Even La Salle's 3 units was at least SOMETHING to give back.

Cutting those bums SHOULD happen, but it unfortunately never will.

Duquesne happened in the forerunner of the A10, so technically 46 years ago they did contribute. I give George Mason a pass for now because they at least have an arena and a location that indicate they could eventually bring something to the table, but it's about time for them to do it

I agree with your overall sentiment about GM and agree about arena and geography. Solid comparison point about the Baron era here. The other thing to consider is the recruiting "sale" of being able to "play in front of friends and family" once or twice a year. DMV is a hotbed for talent - and while I detest what GM and GW have brought to the table in the past decade - it does help guys like Ish/Bray/Abdou/Lou to know they'll be in front of their people at least 2 games a year - plus Richmond and VCU a bit to the south.

Pitt isn't that much of a hotbed (Miller family not withstanding). Philly is a hotbed - but with the DMV schools and St Joes you really don't need La Salle.

NY obviously is rich with talent - but is close enough to URI/St Joes/UMass/Bonnies where you'd think shedding their weight and trying to get OOC games in the region might be more worthwhile.

Apologies about not realizing the ECBL was the A-10 before a rebrand. While it's the same conference - technically they still haven't given anything to the A-10 lol. Regardless - can't imagine (I couldn't actually find) what NCAA credits paid in 1977. Currently it's $2.03M over 6 years per game played in. Can't imagine it was anywhere close to that even with inflation adjustment.

[RhowdyRam02]

The key to remember is that Duquesne, Fordham, and George Mason made the dance before they were in the A10. So they have NEVER contributed a single credit to the A-10 pool.

They've made significantly more money off of everyone else. Even La Salle's 3 units was at least SOMETHING to give back.

Cutting those bums SHOULD happen, but it unfortunately never will.

Duquesne happened in the forerunner of the A10, so technically 46 years ago they did contribute. I give George Mason a pass for now because they at least have an arena and a location that indicate they could eventually bring something to the table, but it's about time for them to do it

I agree with your overall sentiment about GM and agree about arena and geography. Solid comparison point about the Baron era here. The other thing to consider is the recruiting "sale" of being able to "play in front of friends and family" once or twice a year. DMV is a hotbed for talent - and while I detest what GM and GW have brought to the table in the past decade - it does help guys like Ish/Bray/Abdou/Lou to know they'll be in front of their people at least 2 games a year - plus Richmond and VCU a bit to the south.

Pitt isn't that much of a hotbed (Miller family not withstanding). Philly is a hotbed - but with the DMV schools and St Joes you really don't need La Salle.

NY obviously is rich with talent - but is close enough to URI/St Joes/UMass/Bonnies where you'd think shedding their weight and trying to get OOC games in the region might be more worthwhile.

Apologies about not realizing the ECBL was the A-10 before a rebrand. While it's the same conference - technically they still haven't given anything to the A-10 lol. Regardless - can't imagine (I couldn't actually find) what NCAA credits paid in 1977. Currently it's $2.03M over 6 years per game played in. Can't imagine it was anywhere close to that even with inflation adjustment.

Honestly I only know because I've started putting something together that I'll probably put out there after this season because I was so done with people comparing us in the basement a few years to programs constantly in the basement. So far I've pretty much confirmed what I suspected going in. We're a solid middle-tier A10 program. Even if you want to say we're toward the bottom of the middle-tier there is clear separation between us and the lowest tier

[PeterRamTime]

Duquesne happened in the forerunner of the A10, so technically 46 years ago they did contribute. I give George Mason a pass for now because they at least have an arena and a location that indicate they could eventually bring something to the table, but it's about time for them to do it

I think Mason has a pretty good chance under Kim English. They look better coached now than they have in a while. The potential is there, but Paul Hewitt really dropped the ball when they moved to the A-10.

From the final four on they went to a CIT, CBI, NIT, and two more NCAA's with one more tournament win in 11. Then they move to the A-10 and died.

It's weird how Paul Hewitt took GT to the national championship game and pretty much just completely fell off after that.

Right. George Mason so far in the A10 feels more to me like their Baron era years than a team that doesn't have the facilities/will to compete, where Fordham doesn't have the facilities and will to compete

Baron era minus a coach as good as Baron...

[ramster]

Now you piqued my interest and I'm going to find the GMU add thread and see what my thoughts were. Good thing we didn't add St Peter's , they are 11th in the Metro.

Here you go Theblueram……..

viewtopic.php?t=1021&hilit=George+Mason&start=450

Interesting that I did not have one post for or against this add. Sometimes back in the day when I disagreed with Rod, I just didn't post.

It was interesting to read through about page 10 to the end of this thread 10 years ago.
The A10 had a lot of changes as Temple, Xavier, Charlotte and Butler left (Butler just 1 year)
VCU added in 2012, followed by George Mason and Davidson.

GMU was pretty well received by the KB board at the time 10 years ago but I was surprised to see quite a few not wanting Davidson as some said it was too far away and A10 shouldn’t go further south. Davidson was viewed as recapturing the Charlotte market when Charlotte opted to leave. Davidson has done very well with NCAA appearances before AND after joining the A10. Sienna was mentioned by some as preferred over Davidson because closer to Barclay Center.

GMU has 39,000 students, Practice Facility opened a few years ago. Public university. Could be just waiting for the right Head Coach.

Davidson NCAA tournament appearances
1966, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1986, 1998, 2002, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2012, 2013, 2015, 2018, 2022

At the time 10 years ago departures of Xavier, Charlotte, Temple and Butler tended to drive new additions to backfill open slots.

Adding Loyola of Chicago was not necessary to fill an opening. Added to 15 schools. Also necessitated making 6 play in teams instead of 4.

[steviep123]

Here's a fun hypothetical

If we were to run the table in the A-10's do we get one of the 16 seed play in games? Would they ever put an A-10 team in one of those games?

Would be a sweet deal though! Go grab us an easy win in Dayton and procure two NCAA credits.

I’m pretty sure the winner of the A10 tournament championship can’t be in the first four. I think it’s a rule for all the Sunday finals- can’t remember where I saw that.

[Blue Man]

Here's a fun hypothetical

If we were to run the table in the A-10's do we get one of the 16 seed play in games? Would they ever put an A-10 team in one of those games?

Would be a sweet deal though! Go grab us an easy win in Dayton and procure two NCAA credits.

I’m pretty sure the winner of the A10 tournament championship can’t be in the first four. I think it’s a rule for all the Sunday finals- can’t remember where I saw that.

It is a rule. It’s why in 2017 we wanted the W - if we were a bubble team we’d have potentially been first four.

AQ’s are all sorted with everyone else in the field - so doubtful we’d be all the way down as a 16 - but who knows.

[reef]

We are 7-13 now if say we go 3-7 rest of way to finish 10-20 then won 4 games In Brooklyn that’s 14-20 and would guess the worst seed we would get is a 14 seed

[McRam]

Duquesne happened in the forerunner of the A10, so technically 46 years ago they did contribute. I give George Mason a pass for now because they at least have an arena and a location that indicate they could eventually bring something to the table, but it's about time for them to do it

I think Mason has a pretty good chance under Kim English. They look better coached now than they have in a while. The potential is there, but Paul Hewitt really dropped the ball when they moved to the A-10.

From the final four on they went to a CIT, CBI, NIT, and two more NCAA's with one more tournament win in 11. Then they move to the A-10 and died.

It's weird how Paul Hewitt took GT to the national championship game and pretty much just completely fell off after that.

Right. George Mason so far in the A10 feels more to me like their Baron era years than a team that doesn't have the facilities/will to compete, where Fordham doesn't have the facilities and will to compete

Fordham. Yes, bad facilities, will to compete. Yes. Have

[PeterRamTime]

Here's a fun hypothetical

If we were to run the table in the A-10's do we get one of the 16 seed play in games? Would they ever put an A-10 team in one of those games?

Would be a sweet deal though! Go grab us an easy win in Dayton and procure two NCAA credits.

I’m pretty sure the winner of the A10 tournament championship can’t be in the first four. I think it’s a rule for all the Sunday finals- can’t remember where I saw that.

No I'm saying as a 16 seed!

[Jersey77]

Here's a fun hypothetical

If we were to run the table in the A-10's do we get one of the 16 seed play in games? Would they ever put an A-10 team in one of those games?

Would be a sweet deal though! Go grab us an easy win in Dayton and procure two NCAA credits.

I’m pretty sure the winner of the A10 tournament championship can’t be in the first four. I think it’s a rule for all the Sunday finals- can’t remember where I saw that.

No I'm saying as a 16 seed!

Of course it is possible for a bottom tier A10 school to get a 16 seed if they somehow miraculously can win the tournament. That would just show how weak our conference is.

[PeterRamTime]

Fordham is 17-4 ya'll....

So weird

Hey we beat the best Fordham team this century! Lol

[jcru]

The obi toppin Dayton team didn’t go to the NCAAs?

[jcru]

I’m sorry but that sounds like a technicality. It’s not that the 2020 Dayton team didn’t easily qualify for the NCAA tournament, it’s that the NCAA Tournament was cancelled because of Covid

[steviep123]

The obi toppin Dayton team didn’t go to the NCAAs?

They would have but COVID cancelled the tournament that year.

[NYGFan_Section208]

You know it’s a bad season for Rhody when it’s game day, we are playing Dayton (one of the top teams in the conf again) at home and KB is temporarily obsessed with a thread like this.

Ooph. Bad season.

Anything that distracts us from the hot mess that is this year's team is ok by me. The 2022-23 season can't end soon enough.

Agree, JETS, just end the season, side note, the Alumni Association bus trip to the Bronx for Fordham was cancelled, it was my wife and I and maybe 4 others…..

Hold on to those tix. If the plan falls into place (plan = 5-1 thru GW), this trip will be back on.

[theblueram]

When we are having a conversation about programs that should be dropped to make the league stronger and someone brings up that we currently are in 12th place.

I'm gonna go out on a limb and predict in 10 years, Loyola, Fordham, Duquesne and George Mason still won't have an appearance.

[section(105)]

Wanna add LaSalle?

[theblueram]

Wanna add LaSalle?

Not with Fran Dunphy. But I thought about it.

[NYGFan_Section208]

When we are having a conversation about programs that should be dropped to make the league stronger and someone brings up that we currently are in 12th place.

I'm gonna go out on a limb and predict in 10 years, Loyola, Fordham, Duquesne and George Mason still won't have an appearance.

Would the odds there be better or worse than rolling zero 7s?