The refs! - 2014-2015

RoadyJay · Unread post by **RoadyJay** » 9 years ago

I remember that jump-ball call... man that was quick. I do believe that was Corbett.

Iggy1979 · Unread post by **Iggy1979** » 9 years ago

I thought Kelly was the weak link in this crew but I actually didn't have a problem overall. URI got whistled for 20 fouls. I'll take that every night. I can think of three or four calls that went URI's way when they probably shouldn't have, including EC pushing off during the press at a key part of the game.

RhowdyRam02 · Unread post by **RhowdyRam02** » 9 years ago

There was a stretch in the mid to late first half that was just brutal. One of the dark haired refs started calling everything in favor of UMass and it became so egregious that it seemed like the oldest ref started calling everything in favor of us to even things out. While it was nice to have the ref trying to even things out it definitely hurt pace of play and call consistency. Honestly, at that point those two refs could have gone back to the locker room for a snack and drink, they could have pulled one UMass and one URI fan from the stands to take their place and there wouldn't have been a whole lot of difference.

sf2010 · Unread post by **sf2010** » 9 years ago

After the horrific push-off call on Jarvis in the first half, I saw Hurley yell over at the ref closest to him who was not the one who made the call, and that ref just shrugged and pointed over to the ref who made the call, implying that he had no idea what the hell the call was either.

RoadyJay · Unread post by **RoadyJay** » 9 years ago

I know many of us have less than fond memories of Corbett (no call against UNC at the Garden in 2010), but he is a good ref overall.

I think you hit it spot on RR2. Tim Kelly was calling everything in favor of UMass that one stretch in the first half and Corbett was helping to even things out.

At one point I asked Corbett why Kelly was so bad. Corbett replied "Why are you asking me?!".. I said "I just thought you might know why he is so bad." Smiles ensued..

If you recall at the Fordham game Hurley and Kelly got into it pretty good... I don't think those two will be sending each other Christmas cards.

RAM67 · Unread post by **RAM67** » 9 years ago

RoadyJay wrote:I remember that jump-ball call... man that was quick. I do believe that was Corbett.

That call was pathetic.

Ramulous · Unread post by **Ramulous** » 9 years ago

Which ref was the one running down the court with his arms up in the touchdown call and why was he doing this?

RoadyJay · Unread post by **RoadyJay** » 9 years ago

Ramulous wrote:Which ref was the one running down the court with his arms up in the touchdown call and why was he doing this?

Hahaha. If it's the play I'm thinking of then it was a no foul call on UMass that Hurley was complaining about. Corbett threw both hands up in the air in touchdown fashion to indicate that the defender had has arms/hands straight up in the air, which is not a foul.

Ramulous · Unread post by **Ramulous** » 9 years ago

He did it a couple of times......why didn't he do it when Lalanne bumped into Watson with his hands up and got the foul anyway?

adam914 · Unread post by **adam914** » 9 years ago

I was wondering about this to, never seen it before. He did it quite a few times actually, and it always seemed to be when someone was bringing the ball up court.

Ramulous · Unread post by **Ramulous** » 9 years ago

Maybe he was telling the crowd he wasn't with those two other guys.....

The Dude · Unread post by **The Dude** » 9 years ago

Tim Kelly...uhhhggg!
The guy was dreadful in the first half. I can't stand watching that clown officiate a game. Just glad Rhody powered through it all and got the win.

Rhode_Island_Red · Unread post by **Rhode_Island_Red** » 9 years ago

I gave up bad-mouthing people for Lent. About seven minutes into the first half, I realized I'll have to go to Confession because of Kelly.

Billyboy78 · Unread post by **Billyboy78** » 9 years ago

Rhode_Island_Red wrote:I gave up bad-mouthing people for Lent. About seven minutes into the first half, I realized I'll have to go to Confession because of Kelly.

Hey Red, I'm surprised you didn't respond to our dear PC friend Wooden Nickel, who called both of us morons in another thread.

Rhode_Island_Red · Unread post by **Rhode_Island_Red** » 9 years ago

Billyboy78 wrote:
Rhode_Island_Red wrote:I gave up bad-mouthing people for Lent. About seven minutes into the first half, I realized I'll have to go to Confession because of Kelly.
Hey Red, I'm surprised you didn't respond to our dear PC friend Wooden Nickel, who called both of us morons in another thread.

What would be the point? They have to come here and exercise their superiority complexes, because where else can they feel superior? (It ain't bad-mouthing if it's a fact.)

RoadyJay · Unread post by **RoadyJay** » 9 years ago

For George Mason we had:

Andrew Marotta http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/andrew-marotta
Patrick Evans http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/patrick-evans
Edwin Young http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/edwin-young

Even with 45 fouls called I hardly realized these guys were there. Maybe it's because I was at the Coast Guard House having a few soda pops.

Marotta called a couple of our games last year but the other two we haven't seen before. In fact, this was Edwin Young's 21st game reffed ever at the D1 level.

Nice job men!

Ramulous · Unread post by **Ramulous** » 9 years ago

I've heard Marotta's son is a good QB who may go in the first round of the upcoming NFL draft....oh. wait....lebbemind....

RoadyJay · Unread post by **RoadyJay** » 9 years ago

For Davidson we had:

Bernard Clinton http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/bernard-clinton
Wally Rutecki http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/wally-rutecki
DJ Carstensen http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/d-j-carstensen/

I certainly don't lay any blame at the feet of the refs. We just got beat! But this was a less than stellar crew.

Another bench warning for Coach

. I asked Carstensen why... He said you cannot motion to a ref across the court... ok?

DJ Carstensen - also reffed the games at Fordham and against Santa Clara
Wally Rutecki - has not reffed any of our other games this year. In fact, it's been a couple of years since we've seen him
Bernard Clinton - also called Brown game for us

Rhode_Island_Red · Unread post by **Rhode_Island_Red** » 9 years ago

We've had Clinton a few times this season.

As for Carstensen, I notice he's shaved his head. He should finish the job and cut it off.

RoadyJay · Unread post by **RoadyJay** » 9 years ago

For Dayton we had:

Bryan Kersey http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/bryan-kersey
Michael Stephens http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/michael-stephens
James Breeding http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/james-breeding

Kersey also reffed the Richmond and VCU games... Dan and Kersey really got into it during the VCU game.
Michael Stephens... one of my favorites.. and is a local guy from Providence. Didn't get to see him at the Ryan Center this year

Breeding... one of the worst I've seen this year. Also reffed our game against Georgia Tech and gave Hurley a warning during that game.

Not sure who gave TJ the technical foul but obviously they should be fired.

RoadyJay · Unread post by **RoadyJay** » 9 years ago

For St. Joe's we had:

Bill McCarthy http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/bill-mccarthy
Chuck Jones http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/chuck-jones
Steve Ruppenthal http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/steve-ruppenthal

Overall this crew was poor...

McCarthy reffed our games at Fordham, UMass, and Duquense... His first visit to the Ryan Center and it was not a very good showing on his part.. Gave Dan a warning.
This was Jones' first time calling a URI game this year
This was also Ruppenthal's first time calling a URI game this year. He was the worst of the bunch in my opinion.

eli#10 · Unread post by **eli#10** » 9 years ago

FWIW Kersey called the T on TJ. Dan and Kersey will not be exchanging Christmas cards anytime soon.
Stephens did one of our home games last year and did not make an obvious call on a foul on X at the end of one game that was very critical. The play was right in front on the TV announcers and in watching the game on my DVR the announcers were also shocked that Stephens did not call a foul. My recollection is that we were down 1 or 2 points and that X should have gone to the line for at least a 1 and 1 or possibly 2 shots. I said at the time that Stephens should not do any more of our games since he is from Providence and that it puts him in a dicey situation as to not show any bias toward us. Stephens is a highly rated ref (I am pretty sure he did NCAA games last year along with Kersey) but he should not do any of our games.

The Dude · Unread post by **The Dude** » 9 years ago

The Dude wrote:Tim Kelly...uhhhggg!
The guy was dreadful in the first half. I can't stand watching that clown officiate a game. Just glad Rhody powered through it all and got the win.

The above quote was after Tim Kelley officiated the UMass game.

If there was any doubt about how dreadful this guy is as an official, he sure removed it right away in this game against GW.
OMG...Tim Kelley! WTF! Dude, needs to find a new profession. I thought Hurley was going to have a massive coronary after the 3rd could call on Hassan. Shit, I thought I was going to have one.
Just glad Rhody someway, somehow, found a way to win the game.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 9 years ago

You would think in tourney games, refs would go a little lighter on the whistles.

Not this bunch. I think we have to be resigned to the fact that they are going to knee jerk us around, due to our physical style of defense.

We're going to have to find a way to overcome this tomorrow and hopefully Sunday.

If we do Dance, I hope that we will see a better quality of ref than what we're seeing in the A10.

Maybe Dan needs to have a sit down with relevant parties after the season, and hash some things out.

rhodyrudder · Unread post by **rhodyrudder** » 9 years ago

woulda won by 20 except for the 2 freakin HORRENDOUS calls...
a 5-pt play and then a 4-pt play, 2nd one was a freakin push-off...
btw how do they call 2 TECHNICALS ON HURLEY and NOT THROW HIM OUT?!?!?

adam914 · Unread post by **adam914** » 9 years ago

Straight garbage...every one of them.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 9 years ago

Can't happen tomorrow night...no techs please....

Dayton plays tough defense too, yet they almost never get in foul trouble...

We need them to get into foul trouble.

And keep ourselves out of foul trouble....

We do that, this is a win.

twisted3829 · Unread post by **twisted3829** » 9 years ago

rhodyrudder wrote:woulda won by 20 except for the 2 freakin HORRENDOUS calls...
a 5-pt play and then a 4-pt play, 2nd one was a freakin push-off...
btw how do they call 2 TECHNICALS ON HURLEY and NOT THROW HIM OUT?!?!?

Second tech was on EC

Running Ram · Unread post by **Running Ram** » 9 years ago

Someone said this in the G dub game thread, but these lousy ref's can't handle calling a game when real defense is played. It's a joke, just look at that last foul call on JT, they guy contorts himself to not make contact with the shooter and succeeds but some idiot ref with his head two yards up his ass farts in his whistle and JT hits the showers. What a joke!

Blue Man · Unread post by **Blue Man** » 9 years ago

I wish Tim Kelly had the balls to show his face at pacos tacos.

How many teams win games when 2 techs are called against them?

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 9 years ago

I honestly think Giannini is right.
These A-10 refs are protecting the higher seeds (except us)
Davidson should be back in NC, but for the refs and a phantom
jump ball call.
That was like a WWE deal. The replay showed nobody had even touched the ball,
let alone tying it up.
Dayton benefited from some odd calls against the Bonnies, too.

URI_IEP · Unread post by **URI_IEP** » 9 years ago

Just out of curiosity I checked out the GW forum. Guess what they were complaining about. The awful refs who were (in their opinion) screwing them, and (in their opinion) the fact that Hurley had them in his back pocket (especially in the second half). I know they're frustrating, but let's not become a fan base that blames the refs. They're always there and they're usually not to our liking (or the other team's fans liking). URI needs to do exactly what they did last night, take them out of the game. No excuses!

Billyboy78 · Unread post by **Billyboy78** » 9 years ago

URI_IEP wrote:Just out of curiosity I checked out the GW forum. Guess what they were complaining about. The awful refs who were (in their opinion) screwing them, and (in their opinion) the fact that Hurley had them in his back pocket (especially in the second half). I know they're frustrating, but let's not become a fan base that blames the refs. They're always there and they're usually not to our liking (or the other team's fans liking). URI needs to do exactly what they did last night, take them out of the game. No excuses!

Refs make bad calls because they are human, and well, not good refs. But when it looks to me that it's more than just incompetence, that's when I have a problem.

URI_IEP · Unread post by **URI_IEP** » 9 years ago

Billyboy78 wrote:
URI_IEP wrote:Just out of curiosity I checked out the GW forum. Guess what they were complaining about. The awful refs who were (in their opinion) screwing them, and (in their opinion) the fact that Hurley had them in his back pocket (especially in the second half). I know they're frustrating, but let's not become a fan base that blames the refs. They're always there and they're usually not to our liking (or the other team's fans liking). URI needs to do exactly what they did last night, take them out of the game. No excuses!
Refs make bad calls because they are human, and well, not good refs. But when it looks to me that it's more than just incompetence, that's when I have a problem.

I get that, but my point is (as a general rule) EVERY team/fan base thinks they're getting screwed by the refs, either purposefully (GW: "they're giving into Hurely too much!") or due to incompetence (more likely). Seriously, go read any other fan base's forum. They're ALL getting unfair treatment from the refs (according to them).

Iggy1979 · Unread post by **Iggy1979** » 9 years ago

I agree with IEP, but it's embarrassing for the A10 to have such awful officiating

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 9 years ago

When you see the things that happened in the Davidson-Lasalle game,
you begin to wonder.

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 9 years ago

I can tell you that our frustration with the officiating is shared by the coaches. As far as what GW fans think, I don't care. All I know is that the game was terribly officiated and GW was given 4 free points for no reason, and still couldn't make it a game.

McRam · Unread post by **McRam** » 9 years ago

The bottom line is that the A10 does not pay as much as the Big Confences, so we do not get the best refs. Not any more complicated than that- there is a real good ref stat sheet site that gives all kinds of ref stats. see the link below. One of the most interesting is one ref has 44 techs called for this season, others 11.

http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/stats

rhodyrudder · Unread post by **rhodyrudder** » 9 years ago

Usually at this level a tech is called only because someone has pointed out, correctly, that an official sucks, and they're too hard-headed to admit that they blew a call.

adam914 · Unread post by **adam914** » 9 years ago

I don't blame the GW fans for complaining about the refs either. They should. They were absolutely incompetent on both ends of the floor, towards both teams. That's why all fans complain, because they are that bad.

josephski · Unread post by **josephski** » 9 years ago

Refs we're bad for both teams and we shot 13 more FT's so I understand the overall hate but everyone's being a little cynical if you think the refs were out to screw us only. EC's tech will be called a tech in college basketball almost everytime if you run up the court and yell that's bullshit after a foul call. The worst call by far was EC's traveling call when he only took two steps. If you can't count a player's steps correctly on a layup you really should not be Reffing any games at the college level.

adam914 · Unread post by **adam914** » 9 years ago

So I think I saw Tim Kelly doing the VCU game, hopefully that means we avoid him today.

Unread post by **SGreenwell** » 9 years ago

McRam wrote:The bottom line is that the A10 does not pay as much as the Big Confences, so we do not get the best refs.

I think this is one of three factors that contributes to bad officiating. When you combine the mindset you need to be a ref, along with the athletic shape you need to be in (ideally!), along with the pay, it doesn't really strike me as a great job. I think it's a big issue for football and basketball, since they're more physically demanding than, say, baseball. (I'm not familiar enough with hockey to know whether it's a big deal in that sport as well.)

McRam · Unread post by **McRam** » 9 years ago

SGreenwell wrote:
McRam wrote:The bottom line is that the A10 does not pay as much as the Big Confences, so we do not get the best refs.
I think this is one of three factors that contributes to bad officiating. When you combine the mindset you need to be a ref, along with the athletic shape you need to be in (ideally!), along with the pay, it doesn't really strike me as a great job. I think it's a big issue for football and basketball, since they're more physically demanding than, say, baseball. (I'm not familiar enough with hockey to know whether it's a big deal in that sport as well.)

If you are Big Conference ref, you get $1200-1500 per game. Not bad for a couple of hours of work!
(Think that the A10 is more like $800, maybe $1000)

eli#10 · Unread post by **eli#10** » 9 years ago

I think I just saw Danny's buddy Brian Kersey doing the ACC final between UNC and Notre Dame.

RoadyJay · Unread post by **RoadyJay** » 9 years ago

Finally back from the Big Apple! Let's see... The refs.... Wow, the A10 really needs to resolve their glaring problem with their officials.

For GW we had:

Wally Rutecki http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/wally-rutecki
Earl Walton http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/earl-walton
Tim Kelly http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/tim-kelly

Rutecki also reffed our home game against Davidson. Tim Kelly stole the show in this one with his horrendous officiating, but Rutecki was not far behind.

This was the first one of our games that Walton has called.

And finally, Tim Kelly. He, without a doubt, wins the Worst Official of the Year award. He also called our games at home versus UMass and Delaware State and our away game at Fordham. Despite how awful he is we are were 4-0 in games he called. Maybe he's not so bad

Two techs on our guys and we win by 13... Go figure

RoadyJay · Unread post by **RoadyJay** » 9 years ago

For Dayton we had:

Paul Faia http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/paul-faia
Lamar Simpson http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/lamar-simpson
Kenneth Clark http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/kenneth-clark

Faia called our game at St. Louis and our home game vs. St. Bonaventure. He was horrendous against Dayton as was the rest of the crew.

The fouls were 18 for us and 11 for Dayton. I understand we had a few "intentional" fouls at the very end of the game, but that's too big of a discrepancy.

Lamar Simpson also reffed our home game against LaSalle.

Kenneth Clark also reffed our away game against LaSalle. I believe he received most of Dan Hurley's ire, especially towards the end of the game.

PlayMikeMotenMore · Unread post by **PlayMikeMotenMore** » 9 years ago

"That's too big of a discrepancy." What kind of statement is that? IF a team commits more fouls, then it is what it is. What, every game, there should be no difference in the fouls between two teams?

We talk about URI's "physical" style of defense but yet complain that they are whistled for more fouls. Can't have it both ways, in my opinion.

RoadyJay · Unread post by **RoadyJay** » 9 years ago

PlayMikeMotenMore wrote:"That's too big of a discrepancy." What kind of statement is that? IF a team commits more fouls, then it is what it is. What, every agame, there should be no difference in the fouls between two teams?

We talk about URI's "physical" style of defense but yet complain that they are whistled for more fouls. Can't have it both ways, in my opinion.

It's a legit statement.

One stat refs are measured on is Home Foul Margin... For many years, stats show that usually the home team is called for ~2 less fouls per game. In this case we were on a neutral court and the fact that we were called for 60+% more fouls is an outlier.

There were only 29 fouls called in the game.. Normally we see 8-10 more fouls per game... So I wouldn't say it was about any team's physical style of defense.

Most of the fouls called on us were just poor calls... Combine that with several Dayton no-calls and you get the 18-11 discrepancy in fouls.

Dr. Giannini summed it up best when he said to the refs.... "You're protecting the #1 seed!"

bressler3south · Unread post by **bressler3south** » 9 years ago

PlayMikeMotenMore wrote:"That's too big of a discrepancy." What kind of statement is that? IF a team commits more fouls, then it is what it is. What, every game, there should be no difference in the fouls between two teams?

We talk about URI's "physical" style of defense but yet complain that they are whistled for more fouls. Can't have it both ways, in my opinion.

You can play a physical-style, and not commit fouls. It's the less-than-ticky-tacky fouls called -- usually from inappropriate ref-court-placement/bad angles, etc., that pisses-off the Board.
What I believe riles up everyone about officiating/umpiring are two things: INCONSISTENCY AND THE REFS/UMPIRES WHO GET PRICKLY BECAUSE THEY CAN'T TAKE THE CRITICISM IN-GAME AND TAKE OVER THE GAME FOR THE WORSE, MAGNIFYING EVERYONE'S SHORT-COMINGS.
BOTTOM LINE: THE REFS WILL PREVAIL BECAUSE THE WHISTLE IS THEIRS, THEY'LL TECH-UP ANYONE, AND COACHES KNOW THAT ANARCHY WILL PREVAIL IF THEY SHOW NO SELF-CONTROL.
COACH HURLEY MAY BE CORRECT 85% OF THE TIME, BUT HIS DELIVERY/ BEHAVIOR JUST CREATES NEGATIVE OUTCOMES.
Nothing wrong with intensity, but everyone on the Battlefield isn't your enemy.
As the old saying goes: Better with honey than vinegar…..
Interestingly, I can't stand watching Coach K work a ref, because he always looks like he's sniping and whining.