2023 CBB Post Season All Things NCAA/NIT

[Blue Man]

It's tough thinking about 'what could have been' if we had been proactive and were able to keep him here. Brings back memories of both Penders and Harrick as we were becoming nationally relevant then right back to irrelevancy.

I mean it's pretty easy to play that out at least in the short term.

For all the people (DC and his burners and a few others) who said "Cox had a bare cupboard" - Dan Hurley probably immediately wins another A10 title and goes to the NCAA that year. He probably goes and does the same the year after too.

Dan would've had a roster in year 1 of Cox with Jeff, Fatts, and Cyril - along with Tyrese Martin. Jeff never leaves the point. Fatts is probably reigned in.

I'd imagine Jacob Toppin comes and stays too.

Maybe Dan leaves then for UConn - or maybe we've continued to invest. What I do know is that Dan was going to leave anywhere that his own ambitions are outpacing the investments of where he is. And he'll stay anywhere the investments of where he is are prepared to meet him wherever he goes.

The "brand" was important - but he also talked about the weight of it. He could've built a brand here too.

What mattered to Dan was the tangible things EVERYWHERE in the program - from the arena to the promotions to the pep band.

He also needed the infrastructure to win - film rooms, athletic training rooms, charter flights, assistant coaches budget, practice facility. He got some of those things here - but not everything. Worse, he couldn't even get a commitment on those things.

Everything that he had to scratch and claw to get at URI - UConn already had in place on day 1. So he was comparing all of that - even with the rebuild - against what we had at URI. We didn't come close - but worse, we lacked the ambition to. That's why he left.

My personal opinion - and it is not a shot at President Dooley at all because I have a great deal of respect for him and I believe his urgent priorities were not Athletic Dept related at the time Dan left - is it took a change in Presidents to realign the priorities after the excellent job President Dooley performed addressing his urgent priorities.

Therefore, President Dooley placed new President, President Parlange, into a position to have the luxury of shifting gears a bit - which is what led to finally giving Thorr, I believe, what he needed to secure a coach of Archie’s stature.

I do not know this for a fact but, being in related meetings with university leadership and being on the periphery of what President Dooley was focusing on at the time, that is the sense I have.

Since I had to retire, I have stepped away to the point of being completely out of that loop. But, I do believe, if at all possible that President Parlange will continue to build on what he started, given the broad support needed.

I have opinions I won't share on the board - but Dooley was too involved in athletics for someone who's priorities weren't in athletics. And that's my problem.

Either give Thorr all the resources he needs to do the job or don't - but when you're not giving him all the resources he needs, keep out of it.

Parlange showed how simple it was to give those resources to athletics.

[reef]

Yeah I’m glad we got Parlange in here now , he seems to know the importance of having a good hoop team

[Jdrums#3]

I mean it's pretty easy to play that out at least in the short term.

For all the people (DC and his burners and a few others) who said "Cox had a bare cupboard" - Dan Hurley probably immediately wins another A10 title and goes to the NCAA that year. He probably goes and does the same the year after too.

Dan would've had a roster in year 1 of Cox with Jeff, Fatts, and Cyril - along with Tyrese Martin. Jeff never leaves the point. Fatts is probably reigned in.

I'd imagine Jacob Toppin comes and stays too.

Maybe Dan leaves then for UConn - or maybe we've continued to invest. What I do know is that Dan was going to leave anywhere that his own ambitions are outpacing the investments of where he is. And he'll stay anywhere the investments of where he is are prepared to meet him wherever he goes.

The "brand" was important - but he also talked about the weight of it. He could've built a brand here too.

What mattered to Dan was the tangible things EVERYWHERE in the program - from the arena to the promotions to the pep band.

He also needed the infrastructure to win - film rooms, athletic training rooms, charter flights, assistant coaches budget, practice facility. He got some of those things here - but not everything. Worse, he couldn't even get a commitment on those things.

Everything that he had to scratch and claw to get at URI - UConn already had in place on day 1. So he was comparing all of that - even with the rebuild - against what we had at URI. We didn't come close - but worse, we lacked the ambition to. That's why he left.

My personal opinion - and it is not a shot at President Dooley at all because I have a great deal of respect for him and I believe his urgent priorities were not Athletic Dept related at the time Dan left - is it took a change in Presidents to realign the priorities after the excellent job President Dooley performed addressing his urgent priorities.

Therefore, President Dooley placed new President, President Parlange, into a position to have the luxury of shifting gears a bit - which is what led to finally giving Thorr, I believe, what he needed to secure a coach of Archie’s stature.

I do not know this for a fact but, being in related meetings with university leadership and being on the periphery of what President Dooley was focusing on at the time, that is the sense I have.

Since I had to retire, I have stepped away to the point of being completely out of that loop. But, I do believe, if at all possible that President Parlange will continue to build on what he started, given the broad support needed.

I have opinions I won't share on the board - but Dooley was too involved in athletics for someone who's priorities weren't in athletics. And that's my problem.

Either give Thorr all the resources he needs to do the job or don't - but when you're not giving him all the resources he needs, keep out of it.

Parlange showed how simple it was to give those resources to athletics.

I understand, BlueMan.

Due to my periphery involvement, my perspective was limited to non-athletic related initiatives. Though I had met Thorr and been in his company 3-4 times, I never had the same access with the athletic dept because my skill set and networks were of little value there so was not aware of any roadblocks Thorr had to encounter, although, I can speculate.

That said, I am not a proponent of meddling while not providing the needed resources.

[bigappleram]

Don't really see why he would lie on the most popular sports podcast in America and say he wanted to come back to Rhody the day after his UConn press conference.

He wasn't staying.

Not after Slickee-boy Moore whispered sweet nothings in his ear for a whole year, not with Arrogant Haystack Calhoun at his practices -- you can only imagine what those two said to him about URI.

What they said? Or what he saw?

Because saying things like "imagine what you could do with a practice facility, charter flights, and not losing your assistant coaches every year" isn't really slander if it's true.

In fact. That's literally exactly what Dan asked for that we didn't provide.

I really don't understand some in this fanbase. URI needed to invest to keep someone like Dan. For some reason you think people who didn't go here/didn't grow up here should love URI like we do. Dan did exactly what we asked of him - got us to national prominence and winning without scandal. We were a national conversation piece by him doing things the right way. We did literally nothing in return that Dan asked of us as a fanbase or university:

Invest: assistant coaches, charter flights, practice facility.

Show up: We didn't come close to selling out every game down the stretch those 2 years we were good. We had "historically good" attendance for URI - but we as a fanbase fell short of our commitment as well. We got good and couldn't fill up our 7700 seat arena. UConn had more people in the building than us when they were bad, then they got good and routinely sell out a 10k and 15k arena.

I'm sure it wasn't hard for Calhoun to "sell" UConn against URI when you look at everything that Dan saw and then asked us to provide.

URI also needed to invest to get someone like Archie. We finally started investing. Too late for Dan, but at least we got Arch.

Further to that second point, after the Fordham game and some losses that year many people gave up. I was amongst only a handful of fans in Pittsburgh for what ended up being a glorious run through the finals. It’s too bad bc 16-17 team was the better team. And they were peaking into that Oregon game. Stan Robinson played 1 of the best March madness games by any Ram ever. The next season got more fanfare but the previous team was better.

[reef]

He wasn't staying.

Not after Slickee-boy Moore whispered sweet nothings in his ear for a whole year, not with Arrogant Haystack Calhoun at his practices -- you can only imagine what those two said to him about URI.

What they said? Or what he saw?

Because saying things like "imagine what you could do with a practice facility, charter flights, and not losing your assistant coaches every year" isn't really slander if it's true.

In fact. That's literally exactly what Dan asked for that we didn't provide.

I really don't understand some in this fanbase. URI needed to invest to keep someone like Dan. For some reason you think people who didn't go here/didn't grow up here should love URI like we do. Dan did exactly what we asked of him - got us to national prominence and winning without scandal. We were a national conversation piece by him doing things the right way. We did literally nothing in return that Dan asked of us as a fanbase or university:

Invest: assistant coaches, charter flights, practice facility.

Show up: We didn't come close to selling out every game down the stretch those 2 years we were good. We had "historically good" attendance for URI - but we as a fanbase fell short of our commitment as well. We got good and couldn't fill up our 7700 seat arena. UConn had more people in the building than us when they were bad, then they got good and routinely sell out a 10k and 15k arena.

I'm sure it wasn't hard for Calhoun to "sell" UConn against URI when you look at everything that Dan saw and then asked us to provide.

URI also needed to invest to get someone like Archie. We finally started investing. Too late for Dan, but at least we got Arch.

Further to that second point, after the Fordham game and some losses that year many people gave up. I was amongst only a handful of fans in Pittsburgh for what ended up being a glorious run through the finals. It’s too bad bc 16-17 team was the better team. And they were peaking into that Oregon game. Stan Robinson played 1 of the best March madness games by any Ram ever. The next season got more fanfare but the previous team was better.

That was Stan best game as a Ram , would have loved to see if we got to the final 4 had we beaten Ducks

[NYGFan_Section208]

That Dan left sucked for sure, but that didn't crater the program. Hire a proven winner after that and the cratering wouldn't have been so deep

[SGreenwell]

Some neat stats from another board I'm on - This year will be the seventh in the last nine that the tournament winner will have spent zero time ranked #1 during the season. Of this year's Final Four teams, only San Diego State was in the preseason poll. The #1 preseason team - UNC - didn't make the tournament.

[NYGFan_Section208]

Some neat stats from another board I'm on - This year will be the seventh in the last nine that the tournament winner will have spent zero time ranked #1 during the season. Of this year's Final Four teams, only San Diego State was in the preseason poll. The #1 preseason team - UNC - didn't make the tournament.

good

[reef]

Some neat stats from another board I'm on - This year will be the seventh in the last nine that the tournament winner will have spent zero time ranked #1 during the season. Of this year's Final Four teams, only San Diego State was in the preseason poll. The #1 preseason team - UNC - didn't make the tournament.

Incredible stat Greenie

[ramster]

That Dan left sucked for sure, but that didn't crater the program. Hire a proven winner after that and the cratering wouldn't have been so deep

Absolutely
You knew who David Cox was (or should have known) after having been an Assistant at URI
You took the recommendation of the outgoing HC headed to UCONN
You made a contract promising Assistant David Cox money if he didn't get the HC job
Took the safe route, hired the current assistant coach
Players said they wanted the Assistant Coach to stay (but most didn't stay in the short/medium run)
Could hire the Assistant Coach for far less money than an experienced Head Coach from the marketplace

5 years later we are at the bottom of the crater and water is leaking into it

[reef]

Funny how things work out say Thorr hired Shrewsbery and then players leave cuz Cox didn’t get the head coaching job

Does Micah parlay that into 5 M per year @ ND ??

[steviep123]

Funny how things work out say Thorr hired Shrewsbery and then players leave cuz Cox didn’t get the head coaching job

Does Micah parlay that into 5 M per year @ ND ??

I don't recall Shrewsberry on the list (maybe ours, but no official list/list of finalists). If I recall correctly the lists of finalists were underwhelming at the time. Joe Dooley (who was fired from East Carolina before Cox I think). I don't remember who else if anyone does.

[ATPTourFan]

[reef]

Wow , does Baron live down there ??

[PeterRamTime]

Wow , does Baron live down there ??

He's down there emBARONsing himself

[reef]

Wow , does Baron live down there ??

He's down there emBARONsing himself

Hey is this the closest he’s been to a final 4 ??

[PeterRamTime]

Wow , does Baron live down there ??

He's down there emBARONsing himself

Hey is this the closest he’s been to a final 4 ??

I think I remember he used to go every year

He lost a lot of that pot belly! Must be doing keto!

[bigappleram]

Funny how things work out say Thorr hired Shrewsbery and then players leave cuz Cox didn’t get the head coaching job

Does Micah parlay that into 5 M per year @ ND ??

I don't recall Shrewsberry on the list (maybe ours, but no official list/list of finalists). If I recall correctly the lists of finalists were underwhelming at the time. Joe Dooley (who was fired from East Carolina before Cox I think). I don't remember who else if anyone does.

Shrewsberry was in the mix for sure. Along with Dooley. And 1 more person I forget.

[NYGFan_Section208]

Funny how things work out say Thorr hired Shrewsbery and then players leave cuz Cox didn’t get the head coaching job

Does Micah parlay that into 5 M per year @ ND ??

I don't recall Shrewsberry on the list (maybe ours, but no official list/list of finalists). If I recall correctly the lists of finalists were underwhelming at the time. Joe Dooley (who was fired from East Carolina before Cox I think). I don't remember who else if anyone does.

Rick

[steviep123]

Funny how things work out say Thorr hired Shrewsbery and then players leave cuz Cox didn’t get the head coaching job

Does Micah parlay that into 5 M per year @ ND ??

I don't recall Shrewsberry on the list (maybe ours, but no official list/list of finalists). If I recall correctly the lists of finalists were underwhelming at the time. Joe Dooley (who was fired from East Carolina before Cox I think). I don't remember who else if anyone does.

Shrewsberry was in the mix for sure. Along with Dooley. And 1 more person I forget.

If Shrewsbury was a serious candidate and we chose Cox over home that was a huge mistake. But I don’t recall it.

[bigappleram]

I don't recall Shrewsberry on the list (maybe ours, but no official list/list of finalists). If I recall correctly the lists of finalists were underwhelming at the time. Joe Dooley (who was fired from East Carolina before Cox I think). I don't remember who else if anyone does.

Shrewsberry was in the mix for sure. Along with Dooley. And 1 more person I forget.

If Shrewsbury was a serious candidate and we chose Cox over home that was a huge mistake. But I don’t recall it.

He was and we did.

[steviep123]

Shrewsberry was in the mix for sure. Along with Dooley. And 1 more person I forget.

If Shrewsbury was a serious candidate and we chose Cox over home that was a huge mistake. But I don’t recall it.

He was and we did.

Horrible

[TexRam]

Funny how things work out say Thorr hired Shrewsbery and then players leave cuz Cox didn’t get the head coaching job

Does Micah parlay that into 5 M per year @ ND ??

I don't recall Shrewsberry on the list (maybe ours, but no official list/list of finalists). If I recall correctly the lists of finalists were underwhelming at the time. Joe Dooley (who was fired from East Carolina before Cox I think). I don't remember who else if anyone does.

Shrewsberry was in the mix for sure. Along with Dooley. And 1 more person I forget.

John Becker

[reef]

If Shrewsbury was a serious candidate and we chose Cox over home that was a huge mistake. But I don’t recall it.

He was and we did.

Horrible

Yeah that was really bad , @ least Thorr nailed 2 of his 3 hires in DH and Arch

[Rhody15]

If Shrewsbury was a serious candidate and we chose Cox over home that was a huge mistake. But I don’t recall it.

He was and we did.

Horrible

Come on, not one person said they wanted Shrewsberry over Cox.

The overwhelming majority wanted and thought Cox was the right hire, with a few people wanting Pitino.

Hindsight always 20/20.

[Rhode_Island_Red]

"I told dese guys dey gotta step up and make plays ..."

[jcru]

gotta put da ball in da basket

[jcru]

He was and we did.

Horrible

Come on, not one person said they wanted Shrewsberry over Cox.

The overwhelming majority wanted and thought Cox was the right hire, with a few people wanting Pitino.

Hindsight always 20/20.

I don't remember Shrewsberry in particular, over anyone else who was mentioned, there were a few names floated, but I just wanted someone from the outside who could try to establish their own thing and not live in the shadow of their predecessor. Preferably someone with head coaching experience and a decent resume.

Look at VCU, are they going to hire Rhoades' top assistant? No

Look at PC, are they going to hire Cooley's top assistant? No

I even quoted Rod who had just passed, who was notorious for preaching "get the next hire right" when someone like Dan leaves for greener pastures. Of all the things he preached on here, that should have been branded on his forehead. That was his number one point, all day, every day.
Basically, to paraphrase "we all know it's going to happen, [Dan] (or someone like him) leaving, isn't as big of a problem, as getting the Next hire wrong."

We were told if we didn't hire Cox, all the players both here already and coming in would leave. Two years later, mass exodus anyway. Which was to be expected. Hiring Cox only delayed the inevitable.

Fast forward to today. Players, especially in this new NCAA free agency era, are like employees. Never let them dictate to you who the next coach is going to be. You think the Patriots are going to let the players decide who their next coach is going to be when Belichick retires? They'll be told, we'll get whoever we want, and you'll be lucky to be retained, IF HE LIKES YOU. IF YOU FIT HIS STYLE OF PLAY. IF YOU HAVE VALUE TO THIS TEAM.

That's how all coaching jobs should be.

Some people hate the new shift in the NCAA, particularly those who enjoy growing up with a player for four years, and getting to know them, having them over for dinner, or even having a conversation with them, and they spoke with them, and that made their day, making memories, etc, etc.

Me? I embrace the new changes. Level the playing field. Limited free agency (now only able to make one transfer without sitting out), show me the money NIL, and balancing a roster of traditional high school recruits who will leave at some point vs one year rental grad students vs a couple year rental transfers or JUCOs. The rosters are always going to be in flux.

A truly ruthless and scrupulous coach (GM) ought to be able to take advantage of this.

[jcru]

Jim Baron looks the same way he did all those years ago, when the booster club introduced us at the Coast Guard House for the website. Just his hair is all white now, is about the only difference. That looks like the same exact track suit he was wearing that day too.

[jcru]

look at Rick Pitino, get's hired at St. Johns, same day announces, I'm getting rid of the entire roster. Everyone is going into the dumpster except the center.

slick is going to do just fine in the new free agency era. ruthless and scrupulous, and $$$ up the wazoo

[rambone 78]

With the new reality (constant turnover) it's even more important to have a coach who can get a team of strangers to play at a high level in a short time.

[SGreenwell]

We did have a poll about who people wanted as the next head coach in 2018, and Cox was the overwhelming pick, with Pitino in second place. Everyone else got minimal votes. Scuttlebutt on the board was that for the 2018 hiring, the people interviewed were Cox, Shrewsbury, John Becker (Vermont) and Joe Dooley (fired after four years at East Carolina, but was coming off 5+ seasons of 20+ wins, two NCAA appearances in three years, and two regular season titles at Florida Gulf Coast).

[Obadiah]

Back to the NCAA Final Four:

Student Enrollment at FF schools per Wikipedia

UConn - 32,669 (public)
Florida Atlantic - 30,808 (public)
Miami - 19,096 (private)
San Diego State - 35,578 (public)

Do we have a pattern here?

[jcru]

We did have a poll about who people wanted as the next head coach in 2018, and Cox was the overwhelming pick, with Pitino in second place. Everyone else got minimal votes. Scuttlebutt on the board was that for the 2018 hiring, the people interviewed were Cox, Shrewsbury, John Becker (Vermont) and Joe Dooley (fired after four years at East Carolina, but was coming off 5+ seasons of 20+ wins, two NCAA appearances in three years, and two regular season titles at Florida Gulf Coast).

Yeah, well, attempts to be heard against the mountain of people who wanted Cox were basically futile. I would write an argument for exploring the open market and all of a sudden 8 people would respond in unison, all agreeing with each other and high fiving each other.

After about 4-5 attempts, I gave up.

[ramster]

Back to the NCAA Final Four:

Student Enrollment at FF schools per Wikipedia

UConn - 32,669 (public)
Florida Atlantic - 30,808 (public)
Miami - 19,096 (private)
San Diego State - 35,578 (public)

Do we have a pattern here?

All good size schools
All with FBS Football programs
All with aggressive growth plans
3 of 4 in warm weather climates and in growing population areas
3 of 4 public institutions

San Diego State rumored to be joining PAC 12. Could be soon
FAU moving from Conf USA to AAC July 1st
Miami in strong ACC but could be open to move conferences

As P5's grow their conferences the move towards 2 levels like Football with FBS and FCS seems more and more likely.
UCONN will ultimately want to land in a P5 Conference for all sports including FBS Football, as Boston College did.

P5's are adding teams, growing their conferences with more expansion in discussions.



https://www.deseret.com/2023/3/27/23658 ... ue-expands

[section(105)]

If it wasn’t already, the A-10 and others like it are the AAA/AA minor leagues to the P5’s. The gap is just getting wider. No?

[rambone 78]

105, sadly it's all true. Smallish public's like URI are at a major disadvantage.
Only saving grace is if we have big donors who donate big...

[SGreenwell]

Back to the NCAA Final Four:

Student Enrollment at FF schools per Wikipedia

UConn - 32,669 (public)
Florida Atlantic - 30,808 (public)
Miami - 19,096 (private)
San Diego State - 35,578 (public)

Do we have a pattern here?

Sure, but I don't think its dissimilar from any year. Bigger schools in nicer areas historically do better in almost all sports. Like in 2008, the four teams were Memphis, UCLA, Kansas and UNC. In 1997, it was UNC, Kentucky, Arizona and Minnesota. 1986 featured Louisville, Duke, Kansas and LSU. (Just cherry picking years at random.) URI's enrollment is 18,000, according to Google, so I don't think we're in the "so small it can't possibly happen" size of school.

[ramster]

If it wasn’t already, the A-10 and others like it are the AAA/AA minor leagues to the P5’s. The gap is just getting wider. No?

Gap is definitely widening

[rambone 78]

It's always been tough for us, just getting tougher.

Many changes happening, many more to come.

[ramster]

Back to the NCAA Final Four:

Student Enrollment at FF schools per Wikipedia

UConn - 32,669 (public)
Florida Atlantic - 30,808 (public)
Miami - 19,096 (private)
San Diego State - 35,578 (public)

Do we have a pattern here?

Another factor is these schools are hitting the portal. Because of their size they have more money, more alumni, more local businesses, more opportunities for NIL.
Because of their size they have lots of academic offerings, majors. The 5th year Covid players can be attracted to Grad School options that smaller schools are more limited with.
3 of 4 great climates to spend a Grad year at.
Well coached too - players in 5th year want to chase the ring, they want the NCAA Tournament. No rebuilds for them.

Ivy League does not allow 5th year. Recent Brown to UNC Grad Transfer.


The rosters of Pac-12 basketball teams in the 2023-2024 season are going to be dramatically different compared to this past season. This is less a product of graduations and used-up eligibility, more a product of a lot of transfers in and out of the conference.

We know that the transfer portal — especially within the context of COVID-year eligibility — has democratized college basketball. This is how Florida Atlantic, San Diego State, and Miami have all gained key transfer pieces which helped fuel a first run to the Final Four at those three schools.

Yet, even though we know the portal is a whirlwind of activity, it might still be startling to grasp just how busy and volatile the portal already is, with many more movements (and player decisions) left to come. Players are flying out the door at several Pac-12 programs, and in some cases, they’re transferring from one Pac-12 team to another. Consider the example of Colorado’s Lawson Lovering transferring to rival Utah.

https://trojanswire.usatoday.com/2023/0 ... asketball/

[Rhody15]

If it wasn’t already, the A-10 and others like it are the AAA/AA minor leagues to the P5’s. The gap is just getting wider. No?

Gap is definitely widening

And yet we had a 16 seed beat a 1 seed with the National POY.

Two mid majors in the Final Four.

[bigappleram]

We have never been the Yankees.
We have always had to strive to be the Devil Rays.
I’m a Yankee fan and the Rays have been better than us for numerous years despite competitive disadvantages. This is our paradigm. It hasn’t changed due to NIL, Portal, etc.

We have to punch above our weight. Be creative. Excel at talent identification and development. Maintain or increase parity with peer schools in the arms race- Facilities, NIL, Marketing, etc.

[Obadiah]

Great points, ramster.

For over 50 years, it's a given for large public universities to dominate the composition of the Final Four and the national championship. What is unique this year"s FF is the appearance of two schools from mid major conferences. The only other time this happened was in 2011 when VCU of the Colonial and Butler of the Horizon made it. Also, UNLV as a member of the Big West is the only school outside the major basketball conferences to win a national championship.

Here is list of mid major participants in previous FF:

Gonzaga 2021, 2017
Loyola Chicago 2018
Wichita State 2013
VCU 2011
Butler 2011
George Mason 2006
UMass 1996
UNLV 1990
Penn 1979
UNC Charlotte 1977
PC 1973

[reef]

We did have a poll about who people wanted as the next head coach in 2018, and Cox was the overwhelming pick, with Pitino in second place. Everyone else got minimal votes. Scuttlebutt on the board was that for the 2018 hiring, the people interviewed were Cox, Shrewsbury, John Becker (Vermont) and Joe Dooley (fired after four years at East Carolina, but was coming off 5+ seasons of 20+ wins, two NCAA appearances in three years, and two regular season titles at Florida Gulf Coast).

Can anyone confirm that Micah S was interviewed or was he just rumored to be a candidate??

[ramster]

Back to the NCAA Final Four:

Student Enrollment at FF schools per Wikipedia

UConn - 32,669 (public)
Florida Atlantic - 30,808 (public)
Miami - 19,096 (private)
San Diego State - 35,578 (public)

Do we have a pattern here?

An Interesting note Obadiah:

Charlotte Conf USA won the CBI - 16 teams
North Texas Conf USA and Alabama Birmingham Conf USA are in the NIT Championship - 32 teams - Game Thursday Night
Florida Atlantic Conf USA is in the NCAA Final 4 - 68 teams

If Florida Atlantic wins the National Championship then Conference USA will have won all 3 Post Season Tournaments!!!! They already have CBI and NIT Championships

And oddly enough all are leaving Conf USA for the AAC American Athletic Conference - July 1!!!!

Leaving Conf USA for AAC
Florida Atlantic
Alabama Birmingham
North Texas
Charlotte
Rice
Texas San Antonio

Leaving AAC for Big 12
Houston
Cincinnati
Central Florida

[rambone 78]

BAR, I agree with everything you said in your last post.

Success here is not impossible..
It's just going to be difficult.

Archie needs to find another Scoochie Smith. Or in our case, another Tyson Wheeler. And some big guys who can shoot.

[Jdrums#3]

Back to the NCAA Final Four:

Student Enrollment at FF schools per Wikipedia

UConn - 32,669 (public)
Florida Atlantic - 30,808 (public)
Miami - 19,096 (private)
San Diego State - 35,578 (public)

Do we have a pattern here?

Another factor is these schools are hitting the portal. Because of their size they have more money, more alumni, more local businesses, more opportunities for NIL.
Because of their size they have lots of academic offerings, majors. The 5th year Covid players can be attracted to Grad School options that smaller schools are more limited with.
3 of 4 great climates to spend a Grad year at.
Well coached too - players in 5th year want to chase the ring, they want the NCAA Tournament. No rebuilds for them.

Ivy League does not allow 5th year. Recent Brown to UNC Grad Transfer.


The rosters of Pac-12 basketball teams in the 2023-2024 season are going to be dramatically different compared to this past season. This is less a product of graduations and used-up eligibility, more a product of a lot of transfers in and out of the conference.

We know that the transfer portal — especially within the context of COVID-year eligibility — has democratized college basketball. This is how Florida Atlantic, San Diego State, and Miami have all gained key transfer pieces which helped fuel a first run to the Final Four at those three schools.

Yet, even though we know the portal is a whirlwind of activity, it might still be startling to grasp just how busy and volatile the portal already is, with many more movements (and player decisions) left to come. Players are flying out the door at several Pac-12 programs, and in some cases, they’re transferring from one Pac-12 team to another. Consider the example of Colorado’s Lawson Lovering transferring to rival Utah.

https://trojanswire.usatoday.com/2023/0 ... asketball/

The BE, a smaller basketball centric conference, made up of mostly smaller catholic schools, did okay this year and, I expect, will continue to thrive for the foreseeable future unless, the P5 decide to maximize their basketball revenue stream (which is an undervalued asset per the Big 12 Commissioner) and cannibalize the BE by tempting members away with much more money to compete in their conference for basketball only.

In the meantime, and I am not a BE fan ( but will give it its due ), learn from the Big East and copy what you can on a conference level because I am not a doom and gloomer. Far from it, though I may get frustrated at times. I believe with change comes opportunity so, you (meaning Rhody and the A10 ) figure out the best ways to adapt to and overcome the changes - IF you are committed to competing for NCAAT bids.

IF Rhody is committed ( I am confident it is ) and IF the conference isn’t, then Rhody needs to immediately seek out, convince, cajole, beg, prove to like minded programs to join together in a smaller, tightly knit basketball committed conference, or figure out a way to raise its bb profile enough to be attractive to a conference wanting to only maximize its revenue on the basketball side of the ledger (and compete for NCAAT bids) and not for all sports, imho.

Yes, that last option is a stretch but, if you want to compete seriously for NCAAT bids in the future, you do what you have to do to be in that position. Otherwise, drop down to a conference like the America East and hope you win your conference to get the single bid until the NCAA - in collusion with the P5 - relegate you to an NIT subdivision and be happy with that.

There is nothing wrong with that, if that is all you strive for and are content. I am not, however. And, I hope it doesn’t happen before I leave this earthly realm for good.

[Jdrums#3]

We have never been the Yankees.
We have always had to strive to be the Devil Rays.
I’m a Yankee fan and the Rays have been better than us for numerous years despite competitive disadvantages. This is our paradigm. It hasn’t changed due to NIL, Portal, etc.

We have to punch above our weight. Be creative. Excel at talent identification and development. Maintain or increase parity with peer schools in the arms race- Facilities, NIL, Marketing, etc.

This! ^^^^

Prop’s, Bar.

[NYGFan_Section208]

I don't recall Shrewsberry on the list (maybe ours, but no official list/list of finalists). If I recall correctly the lists of finalists were underwhelming at the time. Joe Dooley (who was fired from East Carolina before Cox I think). I don't remember who else if anyone does.

Shrewsberry was in the mix for sure. Along with Dooley. And 1 more person I forget.

John Becker

Ella Grasso?