'23 PG Cam Estevez (URI)

[ace]

Great, like this commitment.
Good job Archie and the staff.

Assuming Carey doesn't return that means we over-signed 2 players.
I guess the portal will take care of that.

It's funny that several on KB (not me) thought Archie would leave a spot or 2 open.
Archie did just the opposite and over-signed currently thru 24-25.

I recall a posting or two that seemed really sure that Miller was leaving a spot open but that was for the 2022-23 season. I was so sure it seemed to have been heard from Miller himself. I do not think anyone was ever referring to the level of Recruiting for the Class of 2023.

I think the Rule changed are significantly changing the College Basketball recruiting process.

• 1800 in transfer portal last two years is an average of 5.1 transfers out per D1 Team - that's AVERAGE!!

• NIL with even low mid majors creating NIL plans

• Transfers allowed every year with no sit-out

So now we have Coaches recruiting OVER their allotment because they are anticipating the 5.1 Transfers per year. As Miller brings in Class of 2023 players well before the 1st November Commitment Date we know that current roster underclassmen are looking back over their shoulders and wondering about their future playing time. Still only 200 Total Minutes to spread per team per game.

Class of 2023 Players are committing faster than I have ever seen.

Looking at the Class of 2023 Top 100 ESPN:

• 46 of the Top 100 are already committed and we are still in August. I don't ever remember that many players already committed this early

• Early commitments are happening with the Top 100 to 250 as well. Players can transfer without the sit out penalty so it's easier to transfer - players know that AND Head Coaches know that. So it makes perfect sense to over-recruit your roster positions

• Of the 46 Committments 42 are P5 Programs, only 4 Non P5:

• Georgetown - #22 Marvel Allen

• Gonzaga - #45 Dusty Stromer

• UCONN - #53 Stephon Castle (actually committed as a Junior)

• St John's - #90 Brandon Garner

Even the Big East is getting squeezed out by the P5's. Still 54 to go.

I agree that it seems like ‘23s are committing earlier than before. There’s a mix of guys going the pro route, but it is certainly not ruining the college game like some feared.

ESPN is terrible, though. 247 just updated, and that seems a much more valid source for player evaluation.

https://247sports.com/Season/2023-Baske ... HighSchool

[ace]

Awesome! Have we lost a recruiting battle yet?

Hard to say, really. They’ve certainly offered guys and had visits with guys who then kind of went out of their current reach. They were some guys’ best offers, which is fine if you trust your ability to evaluate talent. With the number of guys they’re bringing in, I think I’ll just root for the uniform, then give it a season or two to shake out before I get overly attached to any one player.

Here's a Q&A on his commitment.

https://www.prospectiveinsight.com/post/cam-estevez

He already knows how to give a good quote!

[Jdrums#3]

Here's a Q&A on his commitment.

https://www.prospectiveinsight.com/post/cam-estevez

Great find, 78. Thanks!

Heck, the kid got me all hyped with that interview. Throw up the ball. Let’s go!

[4Diffs]

Billyboy78 wrote: ↑1 hour ago
Awesome! Have we lost a recruiting battle yet?
Hard to say, really. They’ve certainly offered guys and had visits with guys who then kind of went out of their current reach. They were some guys’ best offers, which is fine if you trust your ability to evaluate talent. With the number of guys they’re bringing in, I think I’ll just root for the uniform, then give it a season or two to shake out before I get overly attached to any one player.

Agree with this. Al Skinner made a living identifying his type of player and recruiting his type irrespective of how many stars a player has. This is the best overall coaching staff the school has had in a long time (the total staff including the assistants). Based on that, and how early they are taking these guys, I think they are finding their type of guy and guys that they want. How it all shakes out we will have to wait and see. But it does look like they have made a conscious decision to maybe from the high school ranks at least to be swimming in a little smaller pond. For one who does not like over recruiting in general I am coming to grips that this is probably the new reality for a school in the A10. Here today gone tomorrow. I mean the staff has now brought in 12 players in the last four months.

He does say all the right things in that interview.

The top part of this did not come over correctly. The first sentence is from Billyboy 78 but the next paragraph is from Ace. Wanted to clarify this as it is not clear. I did not want to quote the entire post and thought I could copy and paste the part I wanted but that did not work.

[ramster]

His Final 6 were strong. Nice to have landed Estevez from among that group.

MAC - Miami (OH) - Travis Steele moved over from Xavier
A10 - VCU
A10 - St. Bonaventure
Big 12 in 2024 - UCF
SEC - Mississippi State

[ace]

Agree with this. Al Skinner made a living identifying his type of player and recruiting his type irrespective of how many stars a player has. This is the best overall coaching staff the school has had in a long time (the total staff including the assistants). Based on that, and how early they are taking these guys, I think they are finding their type of guy and guys that they want. How it all shakes out we will have to wait and see. But it does look like they have made a conscious decision to maybe from the high school ranks at least to be swimming in a little smaller pond. For one who does not like over recruiting in general I am coming to grips that this is probably the new reality for a school in the A10. Here today gone tomorrow. I mean the staff has now brought in 12 players in the last four months.

I agree with a lot of this. I do think, though, that once he gets his mojo back, Archie and company will start bringing in guys who are a little more nationally relevant/known.

[ace]

His Final 6 were strong. Nice to have landed Estevez from among that group.

MAC - Miami (OH) - Travis Steele moved over from Xavier
A10 - VCU
A10 - St. Bonaventure
Big 12 in 2024 - UCF
SEC - Mississippi State

That’s debatable, as are many final lists, but it’s probably not worth the discussion. They got a guy they wanted, which is the important part.

[theblueram]

Agree with this. Al Skinner made a living identifying his type of player and recruiting his type irrespective of how many stars a player has. This is the best overall coaching staff the school has had in a long time (the total staff including the assistants). Based on that, and how early they are taking these guys, I think they are finding their type of guy and guys that they want. How it all shakes out we will have to wait and see. But it does look like they have made a conscious decision to maybe from the high school ranks at least to be swimming in a little smaller pond. For one who does not like over recruiting in general I am coming to grips that this is probably the new reality for a school in the A10. Here today gone tomorrow. I mean the staff has now brought in 12 players in the last four months.

I agree with a lot of this. I do think, though, that once he gets his mojo back, Archie and company will start bringing in guys who are a little more nationally relevant/known.

I don't agree with the best overall coaching staff in a long time part of it. Dan was doing just fine 5 years ago here.

[ramster]

His Final 6 were strong. Nice to have landed Estevez from among that group.

MAC - Miami (OH) - Travis Steele moved over from Xavier
A10 - VCU
A10 - St. Bonaventure
Big 12 in 2024 - UCF
SEC - Mississippi State

That’s debatable, as are many final lists, but it’s probably not worth the discussion. They got a guy they wanted, which is the important part.

I should have said strong as compared to the other 5 freshmen committed (2 for 2023 and 3 for 2022).
None of the 6 recruits are listed in the 243 Players Class of 2023 or in the 333 Players Class of 2022 from 247.

I’d agree that as time goes on Miller and Staff will recruit higher ranked players. This is starting off. The thinking would be that these players have upside potential.

[Billyboy78]

Awesome! Have we lost a recruiting battle yet?

Hard to say, really. They’ve certainly offered guys and had visits with guys who then kind of went out of their current reach. They were some guys’ best offers, which is fine if you trust your ability to evaluate talent. With the number of guys they’re bringing in, I think I’ll just root for the uniform, then give it a season or two to shake out before I get overly attached to any one player.

Here's a Q&A on his commitment.

https://www.prospectiveinsight.com/post/cam-estevez

He already knows how to give a good quote!

Glad you're still following us, Ace.

[Jdrums#3]

Same here. Really appreciate Ace’s perspective.

Also, as theblueram posted, I don’t agree with 4diffs statement as to best staff in awhile. It’s too early for me. Potentially, perhaps but time will tell.

4diffs, I sure hope that turns out to be the case and the staff does turn out to be the best in awhile (your definition of awhile may be different than mine) because that means we have had some deep tourney runs. In the meantime, I’ll give the edge to Dan and his staff but will admit, I love this staffs potential.

Thanks for the excellent KB discussion.

[Rhody15]

Agree with this. Al Skinner made a living identifying his type of player and recruiting his type irrespective of how many stars a player has. This is the best overall coaching staff the school has had in a long time (the total staff including the assistants). Based on that, and how early they are taking these guys, I think they are finding their type of guy and guys that they want. How it all shakes out we will have to wait and see. But it does look like they have made a conscious decision to maybe from the high school ranks at least to be swimming in a little smaller pond. For one who does not like over recruiting in general I am coming to grips that this is probably the new reality for a school in the A10. Here today gone tomorrow. I mean the staff has now brought in 12 players in the last four months.

I agree with a lot of this. I do think, though, that once he gets his mojo back, Archie and company will start bringing in guys who are a little more nationally relevant/known.

I don't agree with the best overall coaching staff in a long time part of it. Dan was doing just fine 5 years ago here.

Yea, I mean, there’s no logical way someone can say this staff is better than Dan’s.

Wasn’t Hurley’s first recruiting class EC and Hassan?

Top 100ish type players who will eventually be in the HOF here.

[PeteRI]

Cam Estevez - PG
From: Teaneck, NJ
School: Canterbury School (CT)
Travel/AAU: Riverside Hawks

Ht: 6'3"
Wt: ???

RANKINGS:
Verbal Commits: 2 star (composite)



OFFERS:
Duquesne
Fairfield
Fordham
Miami (OH)
Rhode Island
Robert Morris
St. Bonaventure
Towson
VCU
Vermont
Wagner
Wichita State

INTEREST:
Boston College
Mississippi State


https://www.verbalcommits.com/players/cam-estevez

Holy shit. He's a dead ringer for my man Fatts!

[jcru]

This is the way.

Archie targets recruit. Archie get's recruit.

Lather, rinse, repeat.

When was the last time we had that? Pretty much, never. I'll take it.

[reef]

Heck of a signing it sounds

Watch out for the Rhody Rams in a couple of years we are going places !!

[jcru]

Some coaches, they can get their players to walk through walls, by convincing them they won't get hurt.

I think Archie is one of those kind of coaches. This entire program is going to have a new look when they take the floor.

[jcru]

Remember that line by Pepper Johnson about Bill Parcells?

"If Coach Parcells tells you there's cheese at the top of the mountain, someone better bring the crackers"

I think we have a coach like that in Archie.

[rhodylaw]

I agree with a lot of this. I do think, though, that once he gets his mojo back, Archie and company will start bringing in guys who are a little more nationally relevant/known.

I don't agree with the best overall coaching staff in a long time part of it. Dan was doing just fine 5 years ago here.

Yea, I mean, there’s no logical way someone can say this staff is better than Dan’s.

Wasn’t Hurley’s first recruiting class EC and Hassan?

Top 100ish type players who will eventually be in the HOF here.

It is very tough to compare - Dan’s first season team was not strong but the transfer rules were not the same. Outside of Munford there wasn’t much there. Archie knocked it out of the park on the first season roster with 4 top 100 transfers and some very strong freshmen pieces. The fact that the first “recruiting” season is not as strong as DH’s first “recruiting” season is a reflection of the cupboard not being empty and having a lot of really high ranked talent already in Kingston.

[jcru]

I know Dan was the best, but it wasn't the same. The pressure is higher, the stakes are higher now. You have to identify people who may not stay, there is a lot more to it now. That's not to say that Dan isn't doing that at Connecticut. But, we haven't seen anyone have to do that here, until now.

Archie identifies a half dozen players, and there is all sorts of competition for them, some of them have a final list of 10 schools, because they are all desperate for players these days... and he wins every single one.

Will that continue forever? No, probably not, but it sure is impressive right now, for a first year coach to boot.

[Jdrums#3]

Remember that line by Pepper Johnson about Bill Parcells?

"If Coach Parcells tells you there's cheese at the top of the mountain, someone better bring the crackers"

I think we have a coach like that in Archie.

Great quote. The Big Tuna and food…who da thunk it.

[Rhody_NYCT]

I know Dan was the best, but it wasn't the same. The pressure is higher, the stakes are higher now. You have to identify people who may not stay, there is a lot more to it now. That's not to say that Dan isn't doing that at Connecticut. But, we haven't seen anyone have to do that here, until now.

Archie identifies a half dozen players, and there is all sorts of competition for them, some of them have a final list of 10 schools, because they are all desperate for players these days... and he wins every single one.

Will that continue forever? No, probably not, but it sure is impressive right now, for a first year coach to boot.

I don't recall Hurley (or any past coaches) signing players this early. It's a good sign!

[reef]

Some coaches, they can get their players to walk through walls, by convincing them they won't get hurt.

I think Archie is one of those kind of coaches. This entire program is going to have a new look when they take the floor.

Great call and I agree it will be noticeable

[Seawrightspostgame]

Agree with this. Al Skinner made a living identifying his type of player and recruiting his type irrespective of how many stars a player has. This is the best overall coaching staff the school has had in a long time (the total staff including the assistants). Based on that, and how early they are taking these guys, I think they are finding their type of guy and guys that they want. How it all shakes out we will have to wait and see. But it does look like they have made a conscious decision to maybe from the high school ranks at least to be swimming in a little smaller pond. For one who does not like over recruiting in general I am coming to grips that this is probably the new reality for a school in the A10. Here today gone tomorrow. I mean the staff has now brought in 12 players in the last four months.

I agree with a lot of this. I do think, though, that once he gets his mojo back, Archie and company will start bringing in guys who are a little more nationally relevant/known.

I don't agree with the best overall coaching staff in a long time part of it. Dan was doing just fine 5 years ago here.

Yes DH is a super success, at least for us. Seems Archie and Co. will be too.

[CamsRams]

[ramster]

I don't see where this is true. I do not see him ranked in the 247 Rankings for Class of 2023. Maybe there is a different version from what I am viewing.

Estevez announced his decision on his personal social media accounts Monday evening — he’s a top-250 player nationally in his class according to 247Sports.


https://www.providencejournal.com/story ... 870249001/

[steveystuds06]

Let’s go!!!

[Bill Koch]

I don't see where this is true. I do not see him ranked in the 247 Rankings for Class of 2023. Maybe there is a different version from what I am viewing.

Estevez announced his decision on his personal social media accounts Monday evening — he’s a top-250 player nationally in his class according to 247Sports.


https://www.providencejournal.com/story ... 870249001/

Estevez 230, Dubsky 244 according to 247Sports.

That's the site-specific list. They more widely circulate a composite that includes an average from other services.

https://247sports.com/Season/2023-Baske ... F&State=CT

[PlayMikeMotenMore]

His Final 6 were strong. Nice to have landed Estevez from among that group.

MAC - Miami (OH) - Travis Steele moved over from Xavier
A10 - VCU
A10 - St. Bonaventure
Big 12 in 2024 - UCF
SEC - Mississippi State

That’s debatable, as are many final lists, but it’s probably not worth the discussion. They got a guy they wanted, which is the important part.

I should have said strong as compared to the other 5 freshmen committed (2 for 2023 and 3 for 2022).
None of the 6 recruits are listed in the 243 Players Class of 2023 or in the 333 Players Class of 2022 from 247.

I’d agree that as time goes on Miller and Staff will recruit higher ranked players. This is starting off. The thinking would be that these players have upside potential.

"Upside potential." Classic! You've watched one too many NBA drafts if you're using that lingo. Can we throw in he has a "tremendous length", can "score the ball," is a "spread the floor guy," and has a "high motor." Any others from the floor that I'm missing?

[4Diffs]

I agree with a lot of this. I do think, though, that once he gets his mojo back, Archie and company will start bringing in guys who are a little more nationally relevant/known.

I don't agree with the best overall coaching staff in a long time part of it. Dan was doing just fine 5 years ago here.

Yea, I mean, there’s no logical way someone can say this staff is better than Dan’s.

Wasn’t Hurley’s first recruiting class EC and Hassan?

Top 100ish type players who will eventually be in the HOF here.

"No logical way." I am all for people having their own opinions but the snark with this obnoxious comment is a little much from my Friar fan cloaked as Rhody 15.

Let's compare the two staffs and see if anybody with a brain can figure this out. It is not that hard.

Dan Hurley's last staff:

1. David Cox - solid assistant, not a great head coach but that does not factor in here. But was fired at Rutgers before coming here.
2. Tom Moore - rode Jim Calhoun's coattails to a long career as an assistant coach. I thought he was terrible when he was here and was shocked that Hurley took him to UConn, but there may have been other reasons for that which we will not discuss.
3. Ty Boswell - did he doing anything here. If he did I missed it. An AAU coach who was hired to recruit. I must have missed who he signed. Who replaced a nice man in Jim Carr but Jim was not a great assistant in my book.

Now this is not Hurley's fault, he had a bunch of good assistants that were poached during his time at Rhode Island. That would include his brother Bobby who was awesome here in his one year, Preston Murphy (oh what has happened to Preston very sad), Antonio Reynolds Dean (one of my all time favorite players who was a very good assistant), and Luke Murray who is now at UConn with Hurley.

Now let's compare the current staff.

1. Kenny Johnson who was the highest paid assistant at one time in the country when he was poached by Louisville from Indiana. That is two big time programs that he was an assistant at. He has deep connections in the DC area which has already paid off in recruiting and he is a very articulate guy who comes across great.
2. Duane Woodward - Was an assistant at Monmouth with King Rice before becoming an assistant with Seton Hall of the Big East. Long professional career playing overseas which has helped already with the international recruiting. Strong in NYC and was the lead on several players out of that area. A very solid assistant already who will get better with more experience.
3. Austin Carroll - gets a lot of flak on this board for being the son of John Carroll who had some health issues that led to some difficulties during his time at Rhody. But well thought of by his peers. Clearly young but now being surrounded by more experienced and better coaches should help him to continue to hone his craft. Not bad for a third assistant.

Take a look at that list again and tell me it is not logical to say that this is the best Rhody staff in quite a while. Out of the six names above, the current guys would rank 1, 3 and 4. Yes I would give Cox the number two spot after Johnson. Hopefully Archie does not have the same problem losing guys like Hurley did, but I think he might unfortunately.

This is the best staff including the head coach and assistants that Rhode Island has had in twenty years or so. There may have been a year or two when Hurley had a staff as good but if he did it was short lived. His first year he had Bobby Hurley, Preston Murphy and Jim Carr. That was pretty good, but this was Preston's first assistant job after being DOBO at BC, Bobby was new to coaching but took to it like fish to water and Jim Carr who was OK. If you want to say that one was as good or better fine, but no comparison with his last staff here compared to this. And this does not even get into two player development coaches that they have now versus one (or was it zero in the past).

Let's wait to see how it all shakes out before we start comparing players that each staff recruits. Hurley's staff has six years of recruits to look at versus zero who have actually played a second currently Only time will tell there but recruiting, and the A10, is vastly different than it was ten years ago. I like the approach the current staff is taking in the current environment.

[ace]

That was a lot of wrong words, all together.

Anyway, Archie has money for assistants that the previous coach could only have dreamed of. That should help with retention.

[CamsRams]

[ramster]

That’s debatable, as are many final lists, but it’s probably not worth the discussion. They got a guy they wanted, which is the important part.

I should have said strong as compared to the other 5 freshmen committed (2 for 2023 and 3 for 2022).
None of the 6 recruits are listed in the 243 Players Class of 2023 or in the 333 Players Class of 2022 from 247.

I’d agree that as time goes on Miller and Staff will recruit higher ranked players. This is starting off. The thinking would be that these players have upside potential.

"Upside potential." Classic! You've watched one too many NBA drafts if you're using that lingo. Can we throw in he has a "tremendous length", can "score the ball," is a "spread the floor guy," and has a "high motor." Any others from the floor that I'm missing?

I’m using the lingo “upside potential” for Archie and Staff.
Note that I’m the poster saying none of these 6 freshmen are ranked in 247sports.

[ramster]

I don't see where this is true. I do not see him ranked in the 247 Rankings for Class of 2023. Maybe there is a different version from what I am viewing.

Estevez announced his decision on his personal social media accounts Monday evening — he’s a top-250 player nationally in his class according to 247Sports.


https://www.providencejournal.com/story ... 870249001/

Estevez 230, Dubsky 244 according to 247Sports.

That's the site-specific list. They more widely circulate a composite that includes an average from other services.

https://247sports.com/Season/2023-Baske ... F&State=CT

Thanks.
I see in the Composite 247Sports Composite now lists 247 players in which neither Estevez or Dubsky are listed.
Going to 247 list there are 150 players listed.
Going to the State list for Connecticut then I see where you got Estevez 240 and Dubsky 244.

If 247 had listed all of their ranked players instead of shutting off at 150 I would have seen them and not have had to go to the jndividusl state, right? Wonder why they cut the list at 150, but I understand now where you got the rankings.

[steveystuds06]

I should have said strong as compared to the other 5 freshmen committed (2 for 2023 and 3 for 2022).
None of the 6 recruits are listed in the 243 Players Class of 2023 or in the 333 Players Class of 2022 from 247.

I’d agree that as time goes on Miller and Staff will recruit higher ranked players. This is starting off. The thinking would be that these players have upside potential.

"Upside potential." Classic! You've watched one too many NBA drafts if you're using that lingo. Can we throw in he has a "tremendous length", can "score the ball," is a "spread the floor guy," and has a "high motor." Any others from the floor that I'm missing?

I’m using the lingo “upside potential” for Archie and Staff.
Note that I’m the poster saying none of these 6 freshmen are ranked in 247sports.

Connor, Adrian, and Cam are all 3-star players on 247
Hutch is a 3 star on Rivals

[steveystuds06]

I don't see where this is true. I do not see him ranked in the 247 Rankings for Class of 2023. Maybe there is a different version from what I am viewing.

Estevez announced his decision on his personal social media accounts Monday evening — he’s a top-250 player nationally in his class according to 247Sports.


https://www.providencejournal.com/story ... 870249001/

Estevez 230, Dubsky 244 according to 247Sports.

That's the site-specific list. They more widely circulate a composite that includes an average from other services.

https://247sports.com/Season/2023-Baske ... F&State=CT

Thanks.
I see in the Composite 247Sports Composite now lists 247 players in which neither Estevez or Dubsky are listed.
Going to 247 list there are 150 players listed.
Going to the State list for Connecticut then I see where you got Estevez 240 and Dubsky 244.

If 247 had listed all of their ranked players instead of shutting off at 150 I would have seen them and not have had to go to the jndividusl state, right? Wonder why they cut the list at 150, but I understand now where you got the rankings.


4EE25674-F62B-473E-8B46-3605C1865F54.jpeg

Much easier to go to their player page and you'll see the ranking.

[ramster]

Estevez 230, Dubsky 244 according to 247Sports.

That's the site-specific list. They more widely circulate a composite that includes an average from other services.

https://247sports.com/Season/2023-Baske ... F&State=CT

Thanks.
I see in the Composite 247Sports Composite now lists 247 players in which neither Estevez or Dubsky are listed.
Going to 247 list there are 150 players listed.
Going to the State list for Connecticut then I see where you got Estevez 240 and Dubsky 244.

If 247 had listed all of their ranked players instead of shutting off at 150 I would have seen them and not have had to go to the jndividusl state, right? Wonder why they cut the list at 150, but I understand now where you got the rankings.


4EE25674-F62B-473E-8B46-3605C1865F54.jpeg

Much easier to go to their player page and you'll see the ranking.

It’s not a matter of being easier.

247 Sports lists a Composite that now includes 247 players (last 2 players are tied at 246)
In that listing Estevez and Dubsky are not among the 247 players.

The other 247 (Not Composite) lists only up to 150 and stops, however, if you go to State of Connecticut as Bill Koch shows how he got the Estevez Ranking) you can see Estevez at 240. IF 247 Sports listed all players instead of stopping at 150 (for whatever reason) I would have seen it.

247 has 2 listings. One Composite and one their own.

Estevez and Dubsky are unranked on the 247 Sports Composite of 247 players. They are ranked 230 and 244 respectively on the 247 Sports list.

[Rhody15]

I don't agree with the best overall coaching staff in a long time part of it. Dan was doing just fine 5 years ago here.

Yea, I mean, there’s no logical way someone can say this staff is better than Dan’s.

Wasn’t Hurley’s first recruiting class EC and Hassan?

Top 100ish type players who will eventually be in the HOF here.

"No logical way." I am all for people having their own opinions but the snark with this obnoxious comment is a little much from my Friar fan cloaked as Rhody 15.

Let's compare the two staffs and see if anybody with a brain can figure this out. It is not that hard.

Dan Hurley's last staff:

1. David Cox - solid assistant, not a great head coach but that does not factor in here. But was fired at Rutgers before coming here.
2. Tom Moore - rode Jim Calhoun's coattails to a long career as an assistant coach. I thought he was terrible when he was here and was shocked that Hurley took him to UConn, but there may have been other reasons for that which we will not discuss.
3. Ty Boswell - did he doing anything here. If he did I missed it. An AAU coach who was hired to recruit. I must have missed who he signed. Who replaced a nice man in Jim Carr but Jim was not a great assistant in my book.

Now this is not Hurley's fault, he had a bunch of good assistants that were poached during his time at Rhode Island. That would include his brother Bobby who was awesome here in his one year, Preston Murphy (oh what has happened to Preston very sad), Antonio Reynolds Dean (one of my all time favorite players who was a very good assistant), and Luke Murray who is now at UConn with Hurley.

Now let's compare the current staff.

1. Kenny Johnson who was the highest paid assistant at one time in the country when he was poached by Louisville from Indiana. That is two big time programs that he was an assistant at. He has deep connections in the DC area which has already paid off in recruiting and he is a very articulate guy who comes across great.
2. Duane Woodward - Was an assistant at Monmouth with King Rice before becoming an assistant with Seton Hall of the Big East. Long professional career playing overseas which has helped already with the international recruiting. Strong in NYC and was the lead on several players out of that area. A very solid assistant already who will get better with more experience.
3. Austin Carroll - gets a lot of flak on this board for being the son of John Carroll who had some health issues that led to some difficulties during his time at Rhody. But well thought of by his peers. Clearly young but now being surrounded by more experienced and better coaches should help him to continue to hone his craft. Not bad for a third assistant.

Take a look at that list again and tell me it is not logical to say that this is the best Rhody staff in quite a while. Out of the six names above, the current guys would rank 1, 3 and 4. Yes I would give Cox the number two spot after Johnson. Hopefully Archie does not have the same problem losing guys like Hurley did, but I think he might unfortunately.

This is the best staff including the head coach and assistants that Rhode Island has had in twenty years or so. There may have been a year or two when Hurley had a staff as good but if he did it was short lived. His first year he had Bobby Hurley, Preston Murphy and Jim Carr. That was pretty good, but this was Preston's first assistant job after being DOBO at BC, Bobby was new to coaching but took to it like fish to water and Jim Carr who was OK. If you want to say that one was as good or better fine, but no comparison with his last staff here compared to this. And this does not even get into two player development coaches that they have now versus one (or was it zero in the past).

Let's wait to see how it all shakes out before we start comparing players that each staff recruits. Hurley's staff has six years of recruits to look at versus zero who have actually played a second currently Only time will tell there but recruiting, and the A10, is vastly different than it was ten years ago. I like the approach the current staff is taking in the current environment.

Yea Boswell did nothing, only had a major hand in recruiting the best player in the Hurley era.

Cox was an incredible recruiter while he was here.

I just don’t know how you can say this staff is better than Hurley’s when there hasn’t even been a game played yet under Archie.

Hurley had multiple top assistants leave, along with his last two staffs having two A10 titles and two NCAA tournament wins.

[steveystuds06]

Thanks.
I see in the Composite 247Sports Composite now lists 247 players in which neither Estevez or Dubsky are listed.
Going to 247 list there are 150 players listed.
Going to the State list for Connecticut then I see where you got Estevez 240 and Dubsky 244.

If 247 had listed all of their ranked players instead of shutting off at 150 I would have seen them and not have had to go to the jndividusl state, right? Wonder why they cut the list at 150, but I understand now where you got the rankings.


4EE25674-F62B-473E-8B46-3605C1865F54.jpeg

Much easier to go to their player page and you'll see the ranking.

It’s not a matter of being easier.

247 Sports lists a Composite that now includes 247 players (last 2 players are tied at 246)
In that listing Estevez and Dubsky are not among the 247 players.

The other 247 (Not Composite) lists only up to 150 and stops, however, if you go to State of Connecticut as Bill Koch shows how he got the Estevez Ranking) you can see Estevez at 240. IF 247 Sports listed all players instead of stopping at 150 (for whatever reason) I would have seen it.

247 has 2 listings. One Composite and one their own.

Estevez and Dubsky are unranked on the 247 Sports Composite of 247 players. They are ranked 230 and 244 respectively on the 247 Sports list.


989B7523-3FF6-4289-B4C8-465D0AE13E5A.png

I personally feel it's much easier to go to their player page. It takes two seconds. If you do a quick search of their name and go to their player page, it will tell you their ranking for 247 and 247 composite. If you want to know their overall ranking you click their state ranking or position ranking and it will take you to that page that Koch posted.

This is Connor's page.

Connor Rating.png (16.23 KiB) Viewed 2714 times

[steveystuds06]

Yea, I mean, there’s no logical way someone can say this staff is better than Dan’s.

Wasn’t Hurley’s first recruiting class EC and Hassan?

Top 100ish type players who will eventually be in the HOF here.

"No logical way." I am all for people having their own opinions but the snark with this obnoxious comment is a little much from my Friar fan cloaked as Rhody 15.

Let's compare the two staffs and see if anybody with a brain can figure this out. It is not that hard.

Dan Hurley's last staff:

1. David Cox - solid assistant, not a great head coach but that does not factor in here. But was fired at Rutgers before coming here.
2. Tom Moore - rode Jim Calhoun's coattails to a long career as an assistant coach. I thought he was terrible when he was here and was shocked that Hurley took him to UConn, but there may have been other reasons for that which we will not discuss.
3. Ty Boswell - did he doing anything here. If he did I missed it. An AAU coach who was hired to recruit. I must have missed who he signed. Who replaced a nice man in Jim Carr but Jim was not a great assistant in my book.

Now this is not Hurley's fault, he had a bunch of good assistants that were poached during his time at Rhode Island. That would include his brother Bobby who was awesome here in his one year, Preston Murphy (oh what has happened to Preston very sad), Antonio Reynolds Dean (one of my all time favorite players who was a very good assistant), and Luke Murray who is now at UConn with Hurley.

Now let's compare the current staff.

1. Kenny Johnson who was the highest paid assistant at one time in the country when he was poached by Louisville from Indiana. That is two big time programs that he was an assistant at. He has deep connections in the DC area which has already paid off in recruiting and he is a very articulate guy who comes across great.
2. Duane Woodward - Was an assistant at Monmouth with King Rice before becoming an assistant with Seton Hall of the Big East. Long professional career playing overseas which has helped already with the international recruiting. Strong in NYC and was the lead on several players out of that area. A very solid assistant already who will get better with more experience.
3. Austin Carroll - gets a lot of flak on this board for being the son of John Carroll who had some health issues that led to some difficulties during his time at Rhody. But well thought of by his peers. Clearly young but now being surrounded by more experienced and better coaches should help him to continue to hone his craft. Not bad for a third assistant.

Take a look at that list again and tell me it is not logical to say that this is the best Rhody staff in quite a while. Out of the six names above, the current guys would rank 1, 3 and 4. Yes I would give Cox the number two spot after Johnson. Hopefully Archie does not have the same problem losing guys like Hurley did, but I think he might unfortunately.

This is the best staff including the head coach and assistants that Rhode Island has had in twenty years or so. There may have been a year or two when Hurley had a staff as good but if he did it was short lived. His first year he had Bobby Hurley, Preston Murphy and Jim Carr. That was pretty good, but this was Preston's first assistant job after being DOBO at BC, Bobby was new to coaching but took to it like fish to water and Jim Carr who was OK. If you want to say that one was as good or better fine, but no comparison with his last staff here compared to this. And this does not even get into two player development coaches that they have now versus one (or was it zero in the past).

Let's wait to see how it all shakes out before we start comparing players that each staff recruits. Hurley's staff has six years of recruits to look at versus zero who have actually played a second currently Only time will tell there but recruiting, and the A10, is vastly different than it was ten years ago. I like the approach the current staff is taking in the current environment.

Yea Boswell did nothing, only had a major hand in recruiting the best player in the Hurley era.

Cox was an incredible recruiter while he was here.

I just don’t know how you can say this staff is better than Hurley’s when there hasn’t even been a game played yet under Archie.

Hurley had multiple top assistants leave, along with his last two staffs having two A10 titles and two NCAA tournament wins.

On paper. This staff is just as good as any of Dans. Dan didn't have the budget that Archie has so it makes plenty of sense for Archie to land some big-time assistants like KJ and Woodward. The pressure is on for them to get results. I think they will.

[eli#10]

Anyone find out who the talent evaluators are and what their backgrounds are for these rating agencies?

As has been discussed before on this board the 5 star players are probably seen the most and their ratings are probably justified. The rest of the players (especially the twos and threes) are probably not seen that often and if they have a poor game their rating obviously will be downgraded accordingly and it will be quite difficult to rise in the rankings.

In any event I would trust the evaluations of our coaching staff over the guys who do the ratings.

[ramster]

Anyone find out who the talent evaluators are and what their backgrounds are for these rating agencies?

As has been discussed before on this board the 5 star players are probably seen the most and their ratings are probably justified. The rest of the players (especially the twos and threes) are probably not seen that often and if they have a poor game their rating obviously will be downgraded accordingly and it will be quite difficult to rise in the rankings.

In any event I would trust the evaluations of our coaching staff over the guys who do the ratings.

So it shouldn’t bother you that neither Estevez nor Dubsky were ranked in the Top 247 players listed on the 247Sports Composite Ranking.

[PeterRamTime]

Anyone find out who the talent evaluators are and what their backgrounds are for these rating agencies?

As has been discussed before on this board the 5 star players are probably seen the most and their ratings are probably justified. The rest of the players (especially the twos and threes) are probably not seen that often and if they have a poor game their rating obviously will be downgraded accordingly and it will be quite difficult to rise in the rankings.

In any event I would trust the evaluations of our coaching staff over the guys who do the ratings.

I'd lean on trusting our coaches talent evaluations over these recruiting services.

I dont think they put near as many resources into scouting for basketball as they do football as football recruiting is a much bigger deal to fans than basketball.

Like how could someone like Jacob Toppin be so under the radar in NY? He clearly had a ton of raw ability. The football version of him gets noticed and has tons of p5 offers.

Now that may speak to basketball coaches not being aware of all the talent out there, but we were a high mid major coming off some significant success and we still found a guy like Toppin.

[bigappleram]

247 is generally considered the most credible. ESPN the least (they do almost zero scouting on players outside the top tier).

But agree with you Eli, our coaches eyes plus what other programs are after someone are much better indicators IMO.

[PeterRamTime]

247 is generally considered the most credible. ESPN the least (they do almost zero scouting on players outside the top tier).

But agree with you Eli, our coaches eyes plus what other programs are after someone are much better indicators IMO.

ESPN isn't credible at all anymore and rivals is on its way out because of on3

[SGreenwell]

Anyone find out who the talent evaluators are and what their backgrounds are for these rating agencies?

As has been discussed before on this board the 5 star players are probably seen the most and their ratings are probably justified. The rest of the players (especially the twos and threes) are probably not seen that often and if they have a poor game their rating obviously will be downgraded accordingly and it will be quite difficult to rise in the rankings.

In any event I would trust the evaluations of our coaching staff over the guys who do the ratings.

I generally trust the more local services a bit more than the national ones, provided they've had decent exposure to college level basketball as well. Meaning - If Bill Koch came out with a Top 5 or Top 10 list of R.I. high and prep school basketball prospects, I imagine it's way more accurate than whatever a national service is peddling.

However, when it comes to comparing region to region, or even covering larger states, it's kind of a matter of "good fucking luck." It would be helpful if schools could adopt one national reporting service for statistics - they all collect stats on their own, they just don't share them - but stats at the high school level are probably less valuable than a scout with a good eye. Even in one given year, I think it would be really hard to watch, say, games in Texas, California, Florida and Maryland / DC, and make a good list from 1 to 100, especially as you get further down the list.

That's not to say that recruiting rankings are worthless. If you gave me the option right now to trade all of our 2023-24 commits for four players in the Top 50, well, I'm taking that deal in a heartbeat. But I think they work best as projections, not statements of fact. It's more likely that a 5-star will be better than a 4 and a 3 and a 2... but there will absolutely be some 2 stars more valuable than a 3, a 4 or even a 5.

Final thing - Archie has signed guys way, way earlier than we're used to, before these guys have even played their senior high school and AAU seasons. It wouldn't surprise me if one or more of them shot up the rankings as a result, whether that means they end up as a 3 or a 4 star recruit. A reverse of the Elijah Wood situation.

[reef]

Put me in the camp of just trusting what Arch Kenny and Duane see they will take us places

[ElmCityRhody]

Amen

NO DOUBT !

[RhodyKyle]

Anyone find out who the talent evaluators are and what their backgrounds are for these rating agencies?

As has been discussed before on this board the 5 star players are probably seen the most and their ratings are probably justified. The rest of the players (especially the twos and threes) are probably not seen that often and if they have a poor game their rating obviously will be downgraded accordingly and it will be quite difficult to rise in the rankings.

In any event I would trust the evaluations of our coaching staff over the guys who do the ratings.

I know 247 poached Adam Finklestein from ESPN and made him a top evaluator, or maybe even their top evaluator.

[Rhodymob05]

Finklestein (Always think of Ray Finkle from Ace Ventura) has always had a good beat on recruits and often gives URI a mention.

[SandorClegane]

Finklestein (Always think of Ray Finkle from Ace Ventura) has always had a good beat on recruits and often gives URI a mention.

Bro…. I was thinking the same thing. Finkle is einhorn and einhorn is finkle..