Why Do We Shoot So Many Threes? A thread.

[Blue Man]

Since this has become the penultimate theme of the 2018-2019 Rams, I figured that I would give this theme it's own place to be discussed.

Currently, URI ranks 349/351 in 3 point shooting percentage. 26.3%. Trailing perennial NCAA juggernaut Chicago State's 26.6%, and safely ahead of yearly contender Jackson State's 25.7% ranking at the bottom. The national average is 34.5%

URI attempts 19.4 per game, placing them at 288th in the country, and below the average of 26.2 per game. We've attempted 426 total.

We've made 112 of those shots, good for 344th in the country. National average is 174.

Fatts Russell has attempted 115 3 point shots, or 5.5 per game. 27% of our total attempts. He's connected on 21 of them, good for an 18% mark. Alarmingly it's down over 11% from last years 29% clip.

Christion Thompson has attempted 86 3 point shots, or 3.9 per game. 20% of our total attempts. He's connected on 23 of them, good for a 26% mark. He's only down 2% from his career, but nearly on brand from 2017.

Now as bad as that is, if you take Fatts' and CT's shots out of the equation, URI only jumps to 29.3% - which would only jump us to 339th in the country.

Tate is a 31.3% 3 point shooter, or 10 of 32. Martin is a 32.4% 3 point shooter, 23 of 71. Jeff Dowtin has dropped 10% in a year to 29.2% from his near 39% clip last season, 26 of 89 this year.

What does all this mean? I don't know. I'm not a coach.

What I do know is that we are not a good 3 point shooting team. It's not just a Fatts or CT thing. Our "good" shooters are still significantly below average, and our returning shooters have dropped SUBSTANTIALLY from their previous season averages.

With the changing of fitness coaches and assistant coaches - has anything changed? We saw this happen with Akeem Richmond from his Freshman to Sophomore year. It's certainly possible.

What I do know is that 22 games into the year we certainly are what we are. Not good from behind the arc.

Certainly not saying that you have to be deadly from 3 to be a good team - there are only 3 in the top 10 who will be in the NCAA at large mix this year. When you expand that to the top 25? 6. Top 50? 10.

What I am saying is that for URI this season - 3 pointers ain't it boss.

I did look at these stats, and came up with this number; 18. 18 attempts is the magic number between things going good, mezza/mezz, or bad.

We have never lost a game this season in which we took less than 18 attempts. 4-0.

We are 4-3 in games that we've taken exactly 18 attempts.

We are 4-7 in games that we've taken more than 18 attempts.

Every single one of our 10 losses has had 18 or more attempts.

We are 3-7 in games over 20 attempts, the 3 wins were Bryant, Brown, and MTSU.

I certainly don't know the answers as to why we are so bad at three pointers, why our returning shooters have gotten significantly worse, or why we miss so many wide open shots.

What I do know is that the 4 times we've taken less than 18 3's we've won.

Dear team, please stop taking so many threes.

[rjsuperfly66]

We have never lost a game this season in which we took less than 18 attempts. 4-0.

We are 4-3 in games that we've taken exactly 18 attempts.

We are 4-7 in games that we've taken more than 18 attempts.

Every single one of our 10 losses has had 18 or more attempts.

We are 3-7 in games over 20 attempts, the 3 wins were Bryant, Brown, and MTSU.

I'm not going to sit here and pretend I watch every URI game, I don't.
But one thing I will say from experience, sometimes increased three point attempts are not necessarily a fault of the offense.
If the defense is any good, they are going to take away your strength and force you to play to your weakness.
Being a weaker 3 point shooting team is a significant weakness because to defend it is simplistic.
You can legitimately have your entire defense stand in the paint and just crowd driving lanes and entry passes and just dare that opponent to beat you from the outside.
Pick and roll offense is also negated as everyone is going to play under the screen versus aggressively attacking the ballhandler.
Trust me, as a PC fan we are also seeing this, not enough competent shooting so defenses crowd the paint and play more aggressive on the players they feel can hurt them.
And now it's to the point where players get semi-open looks but rather than looking for a confident green light, they are so nervous that they end up passing the ball around like a hot potato, which usually leads to a highly contested shot near the end of the shot clock.
Frankly, I'd rather an open 3 point attempt from a struggling 3 point shooter, than a contested two with no time on the shot clock.
Basketball is a game about confidence, if you don't have it, you are toast.

[DC_Rams]

RJ, once again, Bravo bro, Bravo.

[Billyboy78]

We need to get out and run and force the action. Even when we often have what looks like a fast break opportunity, we almost always pull it back and set up the half court. Our half court sucks. We actually did see one against St. Louis last week that ended up with an alley oop to Tyrese. A team that can't shoot needs a bunch of easy baskets during the game. We don't have shooters but we do have athletes. Use them. RUN!

[section(105)]

.....the Coach must feel and decided that the three point shot is part of the offensive schemes, therefore the players are given a green lite hoist them up......the players see an urgency to take them as the alternative of a two man game of getting the ball in the post and a kick out pass......which does’t happen, therefore they burp up what they see as a good percentage shot trey that really is not.......so adjustments to teach where on the floor and when in the shot clock to take them needs work.......it also seems they are caught in the ‘we will shout our way out of the slump’.......almost like they have never met three point shot they don’t like.....

[hrstrat57]

We need to get out and run and force the action. Even when we often have what looks like a fast break opportunity, we almost always pull it back and set up the half court. Our half court sucks. We actually did see one against St. Louis last week that ended up with an alley oop to Tyrese. A team that can't shoot needs a bunch of easy baskets during the game. We don't have shooters but we do have athletes. Use them. RUN!

Push the ball, fill the lanes.

100% word with this group. Crystal clear. Should have been our do or die strategy from the start of this season.

But, like shooting it requires work in practice. Like the recruiting dilemma ( recruit BAA vs a system) easy is not part of basketball and long term and short term change is difficult. It’s hard to practice a running/ push the ball / fill the lanes attack plan when you’re shooting “hundreds” of 3’s and free throws to improve your awful shooting. There just isn’t enough time in practice mid season.

We all think as fans fixing things is easy.

It’s not.

It is probably too late in the season to change how we do things. Anyone on the forum that actually has seen URI practice on a regular basis should comment. I’d sure like eyes on reporting of what we have been doing in practice. To my eyes the on court product looked like a hot mess in multiple games this season.

It’s far from hopeless tho in my opinion and we should see a more complete product / style of play next season?

Hopefully including recruitment of a juco or Euro shooter or 2.

Go Rhody!

[section(105)]

We need to get out and run and force the action. Even when we often have what looks like a fast break opportunity, we almost always pull it back and set up the half court. Our half court sucks. We actually did see one against St. Louis last week that ended up with an alley oop to Tyrese. A team that can't shoot needs a bunch of easy baskets during the game. We don't have shooters but we do have athletes. Use them. RUN!

.......good point, which goes back to my question in another thread on “what is our system(offensive).......if a force the action and dictate tempo, speed the opponent into turnovers was the style of system Coach wanted to play, then somewhere along the way he perhaps thought he didn’t have the horses to execute that style, which results in no secondary break and pull the ball out.....

[Billyboy78]

We need to get out and run and force the action. Even when we often have what looks like a fast break opportunity, we almost always pull it back and set up the half court. Our half court sucks. We actually did see one against St. Louis last week that ended up with an alley oop to Tyrese. A team that can't shoot needs a bunch of easy baskets during the game. We don't have shooters but we do have athletes. Use them. RUN!

Push the ball, fill the lanes.

100% word with this group. Crystal clear. Should have been our do or die strategy from the start of this season.

But, like shooting it requires work in practice. Like the recruiting dilemma ( recruit BAA vs a system) easy is not part of basketball and long term and short term change is difficult. It’s hard to practice a running/ push the ball / fill the lanes attack plan when you’re shooting “hundreds” of 3’s and free throws to improve your awful shooting. There just isn’t enough time in practice mid season.

We all think as fans fixing things is easy.

It’s not.

It is probably too late in the season to change how we do things. Anyone on the forum that actually has seen URI practice on a regular basis should comment. I’d sure like eyes on reporting of what we have been doing in practice. To my eyes the on court product looked like a hot mess in multiple games this season.

It’s far from hopeless tho in my opinion and we should see a more complete product / style of play next season?

Hopefully including recruitment of a juco or Euro shooter or 2.

Go Rhody!

I agree that it would be hard to change. But I think fast break basketball comes much more naturally than half court offense does to kids. It's what they've been doing all their lives on the playgrounds and what they love to do. Yes, it wold have to be more disciplined than playground basketball and there are things to teach....getting the ball to the middle, how to handle a 3 on 2, a 2 on 1, looking for a trailer, etc. But I think that's easier to teach than half court sets, and like I said, more natural for the kids. We need a lot more layups and a lot less 3 point shots with the type of team we have right now.

[Obadiah]

No question that Fatts Russell is the worst three point shooter on the Rams. He is also the worst three point shooter in the country and probably the worst three point shooter in the last 5-7 years of college ball!!

But these dreadful 3-point stats mask the fact that Fatts is an inefficient offensive player and considering that his usage rate at 27% is the highest on the team that is troubling. Through the Davidson game. Fatts' offensive rating is 91.7, the lowest of all the the starters and bench ex Siverio's 86.3 and Omar gets much less PT. An offensive rating of 91.7, is considered well below average and if that isn't bad enough ponder the fact his offensive percentage drops below 80% when the opposition is of higher quslity that Bryant or Brown.

[section(105)]

.......earlier this season, an analyst on some game referred to our use of the quick three like the hockey dump the puck and chase, with Cyril cleaning up the offensive rebound put back as the strength of our offense......

[hrstrat57]

We need to get out and run and force the action. Even when we often have what looks like a fast break opportunity, we almost always pull it back and set up the half court. Our half court sucks. We actually did see one against St. Louis last week that ended up with an alley oop to Tyrese. A team that can't shoot needs a bunch of easy baskets during the game. We don't have shooters but we do have athletes. Use them. RUN!

Push the ball, fill the lanes.

100% word with this group. Crystal clear. Should have been our do or die strategy from the start of this season.

But, like shooting it requires work in practice. Like the recruiting dilemma ( recruit BAA vs a system) easy is not part of basketball and long term and short term change is difficult. It’s hard to practice a running/ push the ball / fill the lanes attack plan when you’re shooting “hundreds” of 3’s and free throws to improve your awful shooting. There just isn’t enough time in practice mid season.

We all think as fans fixing things is easy.

It’s not.

It is probably too late in the season to change how we do things. Anyone on the forum that actually has seen URI practice on a regular basis should comment. I’d sure like eyes on reporting of what we have been doing in practice. To my eyes the on court product looked like a hot mess in multiple games this season.

It’s far from hopeless tho in my opinion and we should see a more complete product / style of play next season?

Hopefully including recruitment of a juco or Euro shooter or 2.

Go Rhody!

I agree that it would be hard to change. But I think fast break basketball comes much more naturally than half court offense does to kids. It's what they've been doing all their lives on the playgrounds and what they love to do. Yes, it wold have to be more disciplined than playground basketball and there are things to teach....getting the ball to the middle, how to handle a 3 on 2, a 2 on 1, looking for a trailer, etc. But I think that's easier to teach than half court sets, and like I said, more natural for the kids. We need a lot more layups and a lot less 3 point shots with the type of team we have right now.

At this point I would be shifting practice time to rehearsing exactly what you describe BillyBoy78. We don’t have the shooters to run the stand around offense we are running now. As others have pointed out correctly opposing D will be packed in making it very difficult to get the ball into the post or attack the glass back door or via dribble drive. Our defense is elite that is not an easy task to accomplish so time to rework the offensive approach based on the skill set we have. There are few players in the country that Russell can’t beat down the floor. Offensively that is our most potent weapon and our forwards and Dowtin can certainly fill the lanes. I honestly expected to see a attacking offense all season based on our team speed. This half court set offensive approach surprised me. It does create a lot of open looks, so it is effective but sadly our players don’t make enough shots.

It will keep the rest of the season interesting to see how we approach the remaining schedule.

I don’t see any quit in this group so they deserve our continued support.

Finish strong. This is the home of the fast break. Go Rhody!

[RhowdyRam02]

.......earlier this season, an analyst on some game referred to our use of the quick three like the hockey dump the puck and chase, with Cyril cleaning up the offensive rebound put back as the strength of our offense......

I'm not sure how much sense that makes. Is Cyril even in position for the rebound on quick threes?

[RhowdyRam02]

Push the ball, fill the lanes.

100% word with this group. Crystal clear. Should have been our do or die strategy from the start of this season.

But, like shooting it requires work in practice. Like the recruiting dilemma ( recruit BAA vs a system) easy is not part of basketball and long term and short term change is difficult. It’s hard to practice a running/ push the ball / fill the lanes attack plan when you’re shooting “hundreds” of 3’s and free throws to improve your awful shooting. There just isn’t enough time in practice mid season.

We all think as fans fixing things is easy.

It’s not.

It is probably too late in the season to change how we do things. Anyone on the forum that actually has seen URI practice on a regular basis should comment. I’d sure like eyes on reporting of what we have been doing in practice. To my eyes the on court product looked like a hot mess in multiple games this season.

It’s far from hopeless tho in my opinion and we should see a more complete product / style of play next season?

Hopefully including recruitment of a juco or Euro shooter or 2.

Go Rhody!

I agree that it would be hard to change. But I think fast break basketball comes much more naturally than half court offense does to kids. It's what they've been doing all their lives on the playgrounds and what they love to do. Yes, it wold have to be more disciplined than playground basketball and there are things to teach....getting the ball to the middle, how to handle a 3 on 2, a 2 on 1, looking for a trailer, etc. But I think that's easier to teach than half court sets, and like I said, more natural for the kids. We need a lot more layups and a lot less 3 point shots with the type of team we have right now.

At this point I would be shifting practice time to rehearsing exactly what you describe BillyBoy78. We don’t have the shooters to run the stand around offense we are running now. As others have pointed out correctly opposing D will be packed in making it very difficult to get the ball into the post or attack the glass back door or via dribble drive. Our defense is elite that is not an easy task to accomplish so time to rework the offensive approach based on the skill set we have. There are few players in the country that Russell can’t beat down the floor. Offensively that is our most potent weapon and our forwards and Dowtin can certainly fill the lanes. I honestly expected to see a attacking offense all season based on our team speed. This half court set offensive approach surprised me. It does create a lot of open looks, so it is effective but sadly our players don’t make enough shots.

It will keep the rest of the season interesting to see how we approach the remaining schedule.

I don’t see any quit in this group so they deserve our continued support.

Finish strong. This is the home of the fast break. Go Rhody!

Does this offensive approach create open looks or are we given open looks from deep because the other team knows we can't make the shot? I believe it's the latter

[hrstrat57]

I agree that it would be hard to change. But I think fast break basketball comes much more naturally than half court offense does to kids. It's what they've been doing all their lives on the playgrounds and what they love to do. Yes, it wold have to be more disciplined than playground basketball and there are things to teach....getting the ball to the middle, how to handle a 3 on 2, a 2 on 1, looking for a trailer, etc. But I think that's easier to teach than half court sets, and like I said, more natural for the kids. We need a lot more layups and a lot less 3 point shots with the type of team we have right now.

At this point I would be shifting practice time to rehearsing exactly what you describe BillyBoy78. We don’t have the shooters to run the stand around offense we are running now. As others have pointed out correctly opposing D will be packed in making it very difficult to get the ball into the post or attack the glass back door or via dribble drive. Our defense is elite that is not an easy task to accomplish so time to rework the offensive approach based on the skill set we have. There are few players in the country that Russell can’t beat down the floor. Offensively that is our most potent weapon and our forwards and Dowtin can certainly fill the lanes. I honestly expected to see a attacking offense all season based on our team speed. This half court set offensive approach surprised me. It does create a lot of open looks, so it is effective but sadly our players don’t make enough shots.

It will keep the rest of the season interesting to see how we approach the remaining schedule.

I don’t see any quit in this group so they deserve our continued support.

Finish strong. This is the home of the fast break. Go Rhody!

Does this offensive approach create open looks or are we given open looks from deep because the other team knows we can't make the shot? I believe it's the latter

Davidson was daring us to shoot no question. Keep missing and the entry pass to Langevine disappears the dribble drive get squashed and the cutters run into a wall of packed in defense.

The result is 53 points and a hot mess and a bunch of very happy Wildcats.

[section(105)]

I agree that it would be hard to change. But I think fast break basketball comes much more naturally than half court offense does to kids. It's what they've been doing all their lives on the playgrounds and what they love to do. Yes, it wold have to be more disciplined than playground basketball and there are things to teach....getting the ball to the middle, how to handle a 3 on 2, a 2 on 1, looking for a trailer, etc. But I think that's easier to teach than half court sets, and like I said, more natural for the kids. We need a lot more layups and a lot less 3 point shots with the type of team we have right now.

At this point I would be shifting practice time to rehearsing exactly what you describe BillyBoy78. We don’t have the shooters to run the stand around offense we are running now. As others have pointed out correctly opposing D will be packed in making it very difficult to get the ball into the post or attack the glass back door or via dribble drive. Our defense is elite that is not an easy task to accomplish so time to rework the offensive approach based on the skill set we have. There are few players in the country that Russell can’t beat down the floor. Offensively that is our most potent weapon and our forwards and Dowtin can certainly fill the lanes. I honestly expected to see a attacking offense all season based on our team speed. This half court set offensive approach surprised me. It does create a lot of open looks, so it is effective but sadly our players don’t make enough shots.

It will keep the rest of the season interesting to see how we approach the remaining schedule.

I don’t see any quit in this group so they deserve our continued support.

Finish strong. This is the home of the fast break. Go Rhody!

Does this offensive approach create open looks or are we given open looks from deep because the other team knows we can't make the shot? I believe it's the latter

.......makes us easy to scout......

[hrstrat57]

Wish we could get more intel on the whole practice and what’s going on today....

[section(105)]

......not sure what the purpose of the still shot from Koch was.....

[Billyboy78]

......not sure what the purpose of the still shot from Koch was.....

He thinks that we think that the team doesn’t practice free throws.

[Blue Man]

We have never lost a game this season in which we took less than 18 attempts. 4-0.

We are 4-3 in games that we've taken exactly 18 attempts.

We are 4-7 in games that we've taken more than 18 attempts.

Every single one of our 10 losses has had 18 or more attempts.

We are 3-7 in games over 20 attempts, the 3 wins were Bryant, Brown, and MTSU.

I'm not going to sit here and pretend I watch every URI game, I don't.
But one thing I will say from experience, sometimes increased three point attempts are not necessarily a fault of the offense.
If the defense is any good, they are going to take away your strength and force you to play to your weakness.
Being a weaker 3 point shooting team is a significant weakness because to defend it is simplistic.
You can legitimately have your entire defense stand in the paint and just crowd driving lanes and entry passes and just dare that opponent to beat you from the outside.
Pick and roll offense is also negated as everyone is going to play under the screen versus aggressively attacking the ballhandler.
Trust me, as a PC fan we are also seeing this, not enough competent shooting so defenses crowd the paint and play more aggressive on the players they feel can hurt them.
And now it's to the point where players get semi-open looks but rather than looking for a confident green light, they are so nervous that they end up passing the ball around like a hot potato, which usually leads to a highly contested shot near the end of the shot clock.
Frankly, I'd rather an open 3 point attempt from a struggling 3 point shooter, than a contested two with no time on the shot clock.
Basketball is a game about confidence, if you don't have it, you are toast.

Completely fair and reasonable take, and I agree for the most part.

The problem I see is that there's not a direct correlation like "later in the season teams schemed against us and we kept shooting more." You'd think if there's tape on us and teams know we can't shoot that they'd pack in a zone and dare us to hoist em up.

Actually, our 3 lowest attempts came in January during our win streak. 1-9 vs VCU, 3-8 @ La Salle, 5-13 vs SBU. In fact, the first time we attempted under 18 was against WVU earlier in the season.

My one point of contention is why does it have to be a zero sum game between open 3 or contested 2?

I think the frustration a lot of us have is it feels like the offense is stagnant with no motion, a 2 or 3 player weave at the top of the key, and then we're into desperation time low in the clock.

Why aren't there more high post ball screens?

Why isn't there any hi-lo motion?

Why does the ball go down into the paint as the only option while 4 players stand around and wait to see if it comes back out?

Why isn't there more motion in the offense to give us mid-range options?

Of course you can't remove a 3 point shot from your offense altogether, but you can run an offense where you provide mid-range options. You can design plays that revolve around P&R's.

I thought it was an interesting stat to dig into, and I'd love to see us do ANYTHING different on offense than we're currently doing.

My argument is that if you know you're going to miss 3/4 of the 3's you take in a game, maybe limit those empty possessions to 10 or less. Just a thought.

[section(105)]

.....Blueman, cause the players don’t know or have not be taught to move without the ball to make a move to get themselves into open position and/or move in such a way has to help the player with the ball......coaching......?......”watch the player that gave you the ball.....”

[Rhodymob05]

Think "Frank Keaney, father of the fast break", and the "Running rams of Rhode Island". Let's get back to our roots.

[Bill Koch]

......not sure what the purpose of the still shot from Koch was.....

I post a photo from just about any given place I travel. Scroll back a few tweets and you'll see similar photos from prior to the Davidson game on Wednesday.

Practices have generally been closed to the media outside of the free throw periods, which are open for viewing/video purposes. The end of any given day before a game usually involves at least a couple of live opponent scouting periods.

[RhowdyRam02]

Is that a change with this coaching staff?

[rjsuperfly66]

Statistically if you shoot 26% from three and 40% from two, you are better off taking the two point shot. URI shoots 26.3% from three and 50.9% from two. I know it isn’t that simplistic but it does shed some light. They should take an open two before an open three and they should take less than 18 threes per game.

I think the challenge with comparing twos and threes is that there is a wide range of twos one can take ... Layups and dunks all count as made two point baskets, but are not always easily accessible in the half-court offense. Then you still have close range shots, played around the block and the restricted area. So just saying "We shoot 51% from two" is not always indicative of a half-court set with the clock running down. Of course we'd all take dunks and layups, but the average team shoots pretty much the same percentage from 8' that they do from 21'. Teams shoot higher percentages from three than they do from 12'-15'. It's the sad reality about the death of the mid-range game. So if your team is an average shooting mid-range team (let's say they are shooting 36% from midrange), they are scoring 7.2 points per 10 possessions. A team shooting 26% from 3 would score 7.8 points per 10 possessions. You are better off taking the three than the two in those situations.

Regardless, this was the article on got some of that data from, which is far from precise but consistent with what I would think is fair ... http://toddwschneider.com/posts/nba-vs- ... rformance/

[ramster]

Statistically if you shoot 26% from three and 40% from two, you are better off taking the two point shot. URI shoots 26.3% from three and 50.9% from two. I know it isn’t that simplistic but it does shed some light. They should take an open two before an open three and they should take less than 18 threes per game.

I think the challenge with comparing twos and threes is that there is a wide range of twos one can take ... Layups and dunks all count as made two point baskets, but are not always easily accessible in the half-court offense. Then you still have close range shots, played around the block and the restricted area. So just saying "We shoot 51% from two" is not always indicative of a half-court set with the clock running down. Of course we'd all take dunks and layups, but the average team shoots pretty much the same percentage from 8' that they do from 21'. Teams shoot higher percentages from three than they do from 12'-15'. It's the sad reality about the death of the mid-range game. So if your team is an average shooting mid-range team (let's say they are shooting 36% from midrange), they are scoring 7.2 points per 10 possessions. A team shooting 26% from 3 would score 7.8 points per 10 possessions. You are better off taking the three than the two in those situations.

Regardless, this was the article on got some of that data from, which is far from precise but consistent with what I would think is fair ... http://toddwschneider.com/posts/nba-vs- ... rformance/

Lots of data RJ, which is fine, but what would you recommend to fix things? How does URI improve from being 3rd from the bottom? You are the Head Coach - or you are hired by the HC (Cox) to improve shooting percentages, what would you recommend to him? Top 5 recommendations you would have for Cox? DC_rams same question. And it has to be for this season, not next.

[rjsuperfly66]

Statistically if you shoot 26% from three and 40% from two, you are better off taking the two point shot. URI shoots 26.3% from three and 50.9% from two. I know it isn’t that simplistic but it does shed some light. They should take an open two before an open three and they should take less than 18 threes per game.

I think the challenge with comparing twos and threes is that there is a wide range of twos one can take ... Layups and dunks all count as made two point baskets, but are not always easily accessible in the half-court offense. Then you still have close range shots, played around the block and the restricted area. So just saying "We shoot 51% from two" is not always indicative of a half-court set with the clock running down. Of course we'd all take dunks and layups, but the average team shoots pretty much the same percentage from 8' that they do from 21'. Teams shoot higher percentages from three than they do from 12'-15'. It's the sad reality about the death of the mid-range game. So if your team is an average shooting mid-range team (let's say they are shooting 36% from midrange), they are scoring 7.2 points per 10 possessions. A team shooting 26% from 3 would score 7.8 points per 10 possessions. You are better off taking the three than the two in those situations.

Regardless, this was the article on got some of that data from, which is far from precise but consistent with what I would think is fair ... http://toddwschneider.com/posts/nba-vs- ... rformance/

Lots of data RJ, which is fine, but what would you recommend to fix things? How does URI improve from being 3rd from the bottom? You are the Head Coach - or you are hired by the HC (Cox) to improve shooting percentages, what would you recommend to him? Top 5 recommendations you would have for Cox? DC_rams same question. And it has to be for this season, not next.

The problem is that most fixes take an offseason and cant be changed on the fly. Even if I told you I had this great offense they could run to great success, how many teams can implement and successfully run a new offensive structure with 8 games left in the season? Any new sets now, the offense is going to look robotic and forced. Players are going to think too much, which is going to bog the offense down even more.

The biggest thing I would offer is look for those practice with confidence and translate it to game day. If someone is practicing well, they should confidently feel that green light during a game situation. Doesn't mean it's a make, but the worst thing you can see if someone who gets a high-percentage look but starts hesitating, double-clutching, etc.

I saw it the other night during the PC-Georgetown game -- Maliek White has been complete dog crap for the last month. He gets the ball on the wing, wide open to step into a 3. He hesitates and double-clutches so the defender can recover, they play hot potato around the wing for 10 seconds, and someone ends up taking a fallaway midrange jumper that misses horrible with a few seconds on the shot clock. That guy cannot be seeing the court for you.

Same for a guy who does that double-clutch tentative thing, and then next time they get the ball semi-open, they chuck up an ill-timed three (say with 20 seconds on the shot clock) without running any offense because they feel like they have to make up for it.

You need to find guys who can confidently play for you during the scope of a regular offensive set and ride them.

Now, the other thing I'm a big advocate for is tempo -- If your team cannot operate within the halfcourt offense, what can you do to make things easier for them? I believe big-time in those situations you should be looking to press and run. If you can flash different pressure defenses that force some open-court turnovers, perhaps you get your athletes moving to the basket. And I mean real pressure, not the "We're going to man up from 3/4 court." I mean flashing traps, actually trapping on occasion, denying the entry, etc. Also trap from different areas of the court, some in the backcourt, some near the front-court, just smartly speed up your opponent without sacrificing defense too much. Just keep mixing it up so the offense can't get comfortable.

[NYGFan_Section208]

as far as 3 volume goes, did someone already say, "the behinder you get, the threezer you shoot?"

[Billyboy78]

as far as 3 volume goes, did someone already say, "the behinder you get, the threezer you shoot?"

Is that a Meatloaf song?

[ramster]

Statistically if you shoot 26% from three and 40% from two, you are better off taking the two point shot. URI shoots 26.3% from three and 50.9% from two. I know it isn’t that simplistic but it does shed some light. They should take an open two before an open three and they should take less than 18 threes per game.

I think the challenge with comparing twos and threes is that there is a wide range of twos one can take ... Layups and dunks all count as made two point baskets, but are not always easily accessible in the half-court offense. Then you still have close range shots, played around the block and the restricted area. So just saying "We shoot 51% from two" is not always indicative of a half-court set with the clock running down. Of course we'd all take dunks and layups, but the average team shoots pretty much the same percentage from 8' that they do from 21'. Teams shoot higher percentages from three than they do from 12'-15'. It's the sad reality about the death of the mid-range game. So if your team is an average shooting mid-range team (let's say they are shooting 36% from midrange), they are scoring 7.2 points per 10 possessions. A team shooting 26% from 3 would score 7.8 points per 10 possessions. You are better off taking the three than the two in those situations.

Regardless, this was the article on got some of that data from, which is far from precise but consistent with what I would think is fair ... http://toddwschneider.com/posts/nba-vs- ... rformance/

Lots of data RJ, which is fine, but what would you recommend to fix things? How does URI improve from being 3rd from the bottom? You are the Head Coach - or you are hired by the HC (Cox) to improve shooting percentages, what would you recommend to him? Top 5 recommendations you would have for Cox? DC_rams same question. And it has to be for this season, not next.

And same question goes to anyone....
So here are mine - I said 5 but here are 6

1) Pass the ball crisply, no soft lazy passes, and everyone moving to try to get open. Applaud and congratulate the assist people more than the player who takes or hits the 3 pointer. Even if the 3 is missed applaud the pass. Passes need to be chest high and enable “catch and shoot” in rhythm. Most of our 3’s are being taken off the dribble
2) No 3 pointers from 30 feet away. Need to be close to the 3 point line and open to take any 3
3) All 3 pointers need to be taken squared up to the basket - nothing off balance or fall-a-way or man in face
4) Work with Cyril and Jermaine to pass the ball out to an open 3 point shooter. Applaud the pass.
5) Constructive criticism and for those who don’t pass well or who look to take 3’s not in the rhythm of the offense - no hero ball
6) Best 3 point shooters need to be taking the most 3 point shots. Sounds obvious, I know, but has not happened. Martin and Dowtin are our best 3 point shooters. Thompson and Russell our worst. If Thompson and Russell want to take more attempts then they need to show improvement in the reduced number they are destined to take. They must earn back the privilege to shoot 3’s

To say that defenses are packing it on on URI and daring us to shoot means we should have more open shots than last year, not less.
Jeff Dowtin was 36% Freshman, 39% Sophomore and now only 29%. He has established himself in his 1st 2 years as a good shooter - so what has changed? He came out of his position as the main ball handler. A number of his 3’s are coming with the shot clock winding down. We don’t pass the ball crisply and we dribble too much enabling us to get in trouble with the shot clock. Fatts is not distributing the ball as well as a PG needs to. Not getting enough assists. Last game Langevine was wide open following a steal but Fatts took it all the way. He made the hoop but the obvious play was to dish it too Langevine, plays like this I hope are being replayed on tape and suggested alternatives discussed. Seems Fatts is more concerned with scoring than with distributing.

[reef]

We will never be any good if we continue to rank near the bottom of that 3 point list. Are there any teams ranked 300th or below in the top 30 in the country ??

Teams that are smart like Davidson will pack it in and force us to shoot 3s

That being said if we are open and it comes in the flow we have to shoot them

[section(105)]

......maybe I will work on my five fixers, before that many of these stats and expected recommendations, do this not that kind of stuff is difficult to implement at this point in the season and more importantly would lead to too much thinking while on the court where offense is a feel for the hot zone and sweet spot in shouting, going with the flow and not overthinking the flow in game.....can’t be second guessing every time you touch the ball.....

[rambone 78]

We waste our athletic talents standing around watching someone dribble.

These guys are better on the move....so the defense can't set up every time and dare us to shoot low percentage [especially for us] shots.

Cox before the season told anybody who would listen, that we would run an uptempo motion style offense.

So where is it? And why not? Teams who can't shoot can't stand around like a bunch of fire hydrants.

Would like to get an explanation from this staff as to why this isn't happening. And if anyone blames it on inexperience, that's load of crap.

Teams like Davidson, who are much less athletic than we are, manage to do a far better job with their half court offense.

We need to take advantage of our strengths...clearly we do not. Just the opposite in fact.

It's a coaching issue, imo. Even though Cox is new as a head coach, his staff should know how to teach this stuff. Or are they clueless?

[hrstrat57]

We waste our athletic talents standing around watching someone dribble.

These guys are better on the move....so the defense can't set up every time and dare us to shoot low percentage [especially for us] shots.

Cox before the season told anybody who would listen, that we would run an uptempo motion style offense.

So where is it? And why not? Teams who can't shoot can't stand around like a bunch of fire hydrants.

Would like to get an explanation from this staff as to why this isn't happening. And if anyone blames it on inexperience, that's load of crap.

Fair to ask. Modified four corner offense with 3/4 stuck in corners with no crossing - vertical movement only for the 5 with 1 and 2 playing catch and nearly no fast break.

Saturday’s opponent put on a multi pronged attack clinic straight out of Dean Smith’s book. If Grady had shown up we would have lost by 25.

[hrstrat57]

We waste our athletic talents standing around watching someone dribble.

These guys are better on the move....so the defense can't set up every time and dare us to shoot low percentage [especially for us] shots.

Cox before the season told anybody who would listen, that we would run an uptempo motion style offense.

So where is it? And why not? Teams who can't shoot can't stand around like a bunch of fire hydrants.

Would like to get an explanation from this staff as to why this isn't happening. And if anyone blames it on inexperience, that's load of crap.

Fair to ask. Modified four corner offense with 3/4 stuck in corners with no crossing - vertical movement only for the 5 with 1 and 2 playing catch and nearly no fast break.

Saturday’s opponent put on a multi pronged attack clinic straight out of Dean Smith’s book. If Grady had shown up we would have lost by 25.

[hrstrat57]

Double post...........

[rambone 78]

A lot of us on this board were excited to hear Cox talk about shitcanning the stand around offense that Dan used to employ especially late in games.

That DC would turn out to be a better x's and o's coach than his predecessor....

So far we are seeing nothing to indicate he's better.....and his staff isn't helping to solve the problem either.

I hope to heck we will see a much better offensive scheme next season....or some serious doubts will start to creep in.

[KevanBoyles]

A sports psychologist would probably help.

[rambone 78]

We need to be and stay aggressive and both offense and defense...keep defenses off balance.....I know that requires maybe a little more quality depth than we have right now....maybe that's the reason Cox doesn't play it uptempo yet?

But it needs to happen by next season, when we will have more depth.

In any event, that shouldn't stop the staff from at least kicking the tires on a more motion style offense now. Continuing to do what we're doing now, and we can forget seeing much improvement the rest of this season.

[section(105)]

Five fixes; take the team bowling, take the team to the movies, take the team to historic tour of Newort Mansions, take the team for pedi/mani, start a no shave until we........??

[rambone 78]

Watch tapes of their FT shooting in practice...and then tapes of them shooting them in games....see where they are screwing up.

Either that, or take them to see the horror classic "The Thing".....considering that approximates what we're seeing with their shooting this season.

Not suitable for children.


Please...no beards....I've seen enough of James Harden, Julian Edelman, and the entire Red Sox roster.....gross

[Blue Man]

Lost in the disgust of Saturday was the fact that we attempted 19 3's. A scorching 3-19 for 15%. We have now fallen to DEAD LAST, 353 of 353 in 3 point shooting percentage in the country. A super-awesome 25.8%.

Fatts has continued to defy logic and now sits at a sub-18% 3-point clip. 17.9%, 21 of 117. I couldn't find a site that would bother to show every player in the country, but of guards who play 10 mins or more a game, I'd argue he has to be dead last in the entire NCAA.

Obviously there are a lot of well thought out reasons listed above for why this could or could not matter, and obviously the effort on Saturday was abysmal and our shooting was probably not on the top of the list of why we lost.

However, the stats are the stats and all of our losses continue to have the common theme of 18 or more 3's attempted.

8-3 in games with 18 or less attempts.

4-8 in games with 19 or more.

[josephski]

Lost in the disgust of Saturday was the fact that we attempted 19 3's. A scorching 3-19 for 15%. We have now fallen to DEAD LAST, 353 of 353 in 3 point shooting percentage in the country. A super-awesome 25.8%.

Fatts has continued to defy logic and now sits at a sub-18% 3-point clip. 17.9%, 21 of 117. I couldn't find a site that would bother to show every player in the country, but of guards who play 10 mins or more a game, I'd argue he has to be dead last in the entire NCAA.

Obviously there are a lot of well thought out reasons listed above for why this could or could not matter, and obviously the effort on Saturday was abysmal and our shooting was probably not on the top of the list of why we lost.

However, the stats are the stats and all of our losses continue to have the common theme of 18 or more 3's attempted.

8-3 in games with 18 or less attempts.

4-8 in games with 19 or more.

6 of those 19 threes came with 5 minutes left in the game when we were down 20+ points.

[Blue Man]

Lost in the disgust of Saturday was the fact that we attempted 19 3's. A scorching 3-19 for 15%. We have now fallen to DEAD LAST, 353 of 353 in 3 point shooting percentage in the country. A super-awesome 25.8%.

Fatts has continued to defy logic and now sits at a sub-18% 3-point clip. 17.9%, 21 of 117. I couldn't find a site that would bother to show every player in the country, but of guards who play 10 mins or more a game, I'd argue he has to be dead last in the entire NCAA.

Obviously there are a lot of well thought out reasons listed above for why this could or could not matter, and obviously the effort on Saturday was abysmal and our shooting was probably not on the top of the list of why we lost.

However, the stats are the stats and all of our losses continue to have the common theme of 18 or more 3's attempted.

8-3 in games with 18 or less attempts.

4-8 in games with 19 or more.

6 of those 19 threes came with 5 minutes left in the game when we were down 20+ points.

Absolutely correct. Just pointing out a statistical observation that continues to correlate. Certainly wasn't the reason we lost at all.

[theblueram]

Remember the grief Akeem Richmond got because his shot % went down his sophomore year? He went from 38.8 to 32.5% from 3PT.

[reef]

353 of 353 is just pathetic

Embarrassing

[ATPTourFan]

Takes effort to achieve.

[ElmCityRhody]

353 of 353 is just pathetic

Embarrassing

enBARONsing !

[Obadiah]

That we lose more games when we take more than 18 treys reminds me of the old stat principle that simple correlation does not imply causation. Our opponents in those losses exploited our weaknesses better than others as they played excellent defense. We beat West Virginia, not because we shot under 18 treys, but because Higgins' man/pressure defense played to our strengths.

[theblueram]

That we lose more games when we take more than 18 treys reminds me of the old stat principle that simple correlation does not imply causation. Our opponents in those losses exploited our weaknesses better than others as they played excellent defense. We beat West Virginia, not because we shot under 18 treys, but because Higgins' man/pressure defense played to our strengths.

I say it was because Jeff Dowtin played the point.

[15 Year Lurker]

At this point, I'd like to see what happens if we focus on the "worst shot" in basketball and just take a step in from the 3 point line.

Maybe that helps change the percentage and still open things up for the big guys.

I think Fatts should certainly try that as his best percentage shot seems to be that mid range jump shot. No real stats to back that up but he seems to make way more shots from a few steps in and miss a lot of threes and drives. Still want to see him drive...just no threes.