KeaneyBlue - The URI Basketball Forum

Isn't about time the Hall of Fame kick's Pitino's ass out?

The fact that Pitino/Louisville can’t figure out why the championship needs to be vacated is hysterical to me.

I just hate the vacating of championships.

There’s no men in black memory eraser thing. It happened. They won.

Fine schools money. Taking away wins and saying things didn’t happen is dumb. You can’t legislate people’s memories.

Nobody says you can’t remember it, but the offending party simply gets no credit for the memory.

Yea the sad part is , those players worked their asses off and legitimately won the national title. No ones going to think someone else won in 2013. Hell I forgot about Michigan.

ATPTourFan wrote:Nobody says you can’t remember it, but the offending party simply gets no credit for the memory.

Tell that to Kevin Ware.

This is another short sighted punishment that hits the players instead of the offending party.

Fine the schools money. Fine the coaches money. That’s the only thing you can do to ensure the actual offending and guilty parties get punished.

The victory is the only thing “student” athletes are allowed to keep thanks to NCAA regulations...and now they’re taking that away.

Coaches can just leave a school and go somewhere new. Schools still got to cash all that money from the NCAA run. Kids don’t get any of that...they just get the wins. Let them keep those for Christ’s sake.

Regardless of how I feel about Pitino I’m with Blueman on this one.

Didn’t agree w uMass decision either.....

Pulling down banners punishes the coaches, the players at the time, and the fans. The coaches and athletes who were part of the program when the transgression occurred and the fans who looked the other way in the name of a championship season. The athletes are not innocent in this particular case. They know they can't bring recruits to parties, particularly with strippers when the recruits are underage. Just vacating wins hurts those that were there, instead of post season bans which do often hurt those that came after the problem.

How would this board reacted if they pulled down the 1998 elite 8 banner? sure we have the memories, but without the banner in the rafters it would be an empty feeling.

urirx wrote:Pulling down banners punishes the coaches, the players at the time, and the fans. The coaches and athletes who were part of the program when the transgression occurred and the fans who looked the other way in the name of a championship season. The athletes are not innocent in this particular case. They know they can't bring recruits to parties, particularly with strippers when the recruits are underage. Just vacating wins hurts those that were there, instead of post season bans which do often hurt those that came after the problem.

How would this board reacted if they pulled down the 1998 elite 8 banner? sure we have the memories, but without the banner in the rafters it would be an empty feeling.

The “athletes” are 17-18 year old kids who don’t know any better. They come from situations no one on this board could possibly comprehend. The adults in their lives may not have any idea what is going on either. There’s no guidance and the coaches and teams “helping” them are preying on those kids and families for their own monetary gain. The kids are victims. The “95% of them who graduate with a degree in something other than sports” are used up like consumables and thrown away.

The fans are not “looking away” and ignoring problems...how the hell are they supposed to know what’s going on under the hood? Why do the fans need to be punished????

This isn’t some Penn State pedophelia ring that is damaging people that we’re talking about. All of these crimes are centered around money.

The adults who know better should be held accountable and punished via their ill gotten gains. I’m sure Rick Pitino feels really awful about his “vacated” title. I’m sure he’s drying his eyes with hundreds in one of his 16 room mansions.

Meanwhile a kid who didn’t go pro in basketball is sitting at home being told that the title he worked for doesn’t mean shit, so now he has nothing from all he gave to the game.

All at the same time the cash keeps pouring in at Louisville and all the other schools.

If a crime is money based, punish the offenders with money. The wins are more important to every other person that didn’t benefit financially.

ATPTourFan wrote:Nobody says you can’t remember it, but the offending party simply gets no credit for the memory.

still doesnt make any sense to me though.

Vacating wins and titles implies that you were the only dirty team and everyone else was playing by the rules. We know that is a truckload of BS.

It's like steroids in baseball, Bonds/Clemens/McGwire should be in the HOF. Yeah, they juiced, but so did the guys they were playing against.

Point is every pro athlete, or team, will always push the envelope to get an edge. It's the very nature of competition.

Yeah I don't get the vacating titles thing either. Everyone knows they won it

Why should anyone care what Rick Pitino thinks? The man is a complete fraud.

Fine LVille 5 mil. No NCAA for 5 years. Allow their kids immediate transfers to any school. Just maybe they’ll think about it next time. Vacating past titles is ridiculous. Nobody cares

UCH21377 wrote:Fine LVille 5 mil. No NCAA for 5 years. Allow their kids immediate transfers to any school. Just maybe they’ll think about it next time. Vacating past titles is ridiculous. Nobody cares

This is more like it.

Throw in a hefty fine for pretty ricky and I’m there.

I never believed that penalizing an entire program for something that a few individuals may have been guilty of is right. I think schools should be fined and any offending party fired or if it's a player banned from participating again. But don't completely ruin it for the thousands of fans and those who had nothing to do with whatever it was that the school is being penalized for.

I wish he'd go away

scine20 wrote:I never believed that penalizing an entire program for something that a few individuals may have been guilty of is right. I think schools should be fined and any offending party fired or if it's a player banned from participating again. But don't completely ruin it for the thousands of fans and those who had nothing to do with whatever it was that the school is being penalized for.

This wasn't just "a few individuals" -- this was systemic. You penalize the program to make sure everyone in it gets the message -- the university administration that looked the other way, the boosters who put up the money for the hookers and the fans to get them to insist things be done the right way. You vacate the wins and the championship as a way of banning the players retroactively.

Rhode_Island_Red wrote:

scine20 wrote:I never believed that penalizing an entire program for something that a few individuals may have been guilty of is right. I think schools should be fined and any offending party fired or if it's a player banned from participating again. But don't completely ruin it for the thousands of fans and those who had nothing to do with whatever it was that the school is being penalized for.

This wasn't just "a few individuals" -- this was systemic. You penalize the program to make sure everyone in it gets the message -- the university administration that looked the other way, the boosters who put up the money for the hookers and the fans to get them to insist things be done the right way. You vacate the wins and the championship as a way of banning the players retroactively.

I understand the logic. I just don't agree. Louisville is on probation now for how long (as far as scholarship reduction)? How would you feel if you came to URI and boom they went on probation? Imagine being a freshman as Louisville right now. You basically have no hope of ever seeing a winning team.

I'd rather everyone involved get penalized than those not involved. No you can't fine the students but you can certainly fine the staff and the school as a whole.

That's why the students should be allowed to transfer and be eligible immediately. But part of the penalty to the institution is the effect on recruiting as more competing coaches remind/warn recruits that Louisville may be sanctioned/banned, etc. This SHOULD be used against the school, especially a school with tons of money because often the only way to really hurt them is to keep the best players from signing there.

Rhode_Island_Red wrote:

scine20 wrote:I never believed that penalizing an entire program for something that a few individuals may have been guilty of is right. I think schools should be fined and any offending party fired or if it's a player banned from participating again. But don't completely ruin it for the thousands of fans and those who had nothing to do with whatever it was that the school is being penalized for.

This wasn't just "a few individuals" -- this was systemic. You penalize the program to make sure everyone in it gets the message -- the university administration that looked the other way, the boosters who put up the money for the hookers and the fans to get them to insist things be done the right way. You vacate the wins and the championship as a way of banning the players retroactively.

Oh ok this take totally makes sense. I know when I give my donation to athletics they ask me if I want the money used for hookers or not (they actually don’t do that, they just ask if it’s general or basketball only)....are you serious?

Even if one jackwagon booster goes on his own to throw a hooker party, and it wasn’t a shoe company or grassroots guy...you are punishing the people who only care about seeing their program win, instead of the people who care about money.

The players played. The coaches coaches. The better team one. “Ineligibility” by NCAA standards is a JOKE. Taking a “stand” and punishing someone 5 years later by saying it doesn’t count is frivolous and ineffective.

It did count. Everyone saw it.

Punishments don’t exist for punishments sake. They exist to serve as a deterrent for other programs. They’ve been vacating things for a long time. It hasn’t stopped anything.

The coaches and execs who made money still get to keep it. The fans and players who were innocent or victims made memories and now they’re being told they don’t count. How does that make sense?

Start fining programs and coaches and I’d bet you start seeing actual change.

Blue Man wrote:

Rhode_Island_Red wrote:

scine20 wrote:I never believed that penalizing an entire program for something that a few individuals may have been guilty of is right. I think schools should be fined and any offending party fired or if it's a player banned from participating again. But don't completely ruin it for the thousands of fans and those who had nothing to do with whatever it was that the school is being penalized for.

This wasn't just "a few individuals" -- this was systemic. You penalize the program to make sure everyone in it gets the message -- the university administration that looked the other way, the boosters who put up the money for the hookers and the fans to get them to insist things be done the right way. You vacate the wins and the championship as a way of banning the players retroactively.

Oh ok this take totally makes sense. I know when I give my donation to athletics they ask me if I want the money used for hookers or not (they actually don’t do that, they just ask if it’s general or basketball only)....are you serious?

Even if one jackwagon booster goes on his own to throw a hooker party, and it wasn’t a shoe company or grassroots guy...you are punishing the people who only care about seeing their program win, instead of the people who care about money.

The players played. The coaches coaches. The better team one. “Ineligibility” by NCAA standards is a JOKE. Taking a “stand” and punishing someone 5 years later by saying it doesn’t count is frivolous and ineffective.

It did count. Everyone saw it.

Punishments don’t exist for punishments sake. They exist to serve as a deterrent for other programs. They’ve been vacating things for a long time. It hasn’t stopped anything.

The coaches and execs who made money still get to keep it. The fans and players who were innocent or victims made memories and now they’re being told they don’t count. How does that make sense?

Start fining programs and coaches and I’d bet you start seeing actual change.

you're getting some of that here at least with the NCAA taking back all money from tourney credits over that timeframe, but they still did the garbage move of vacating wins.

the problem is even hammering the program itself doesnt touch the coach (see Calipari). Like you said they need to directly go after coaches too.

They also need to be consistent. example:

Notre Dame just had to vacate 2 years of wins due to academic infractions.....UNC had a decade of fake classes and fake grades for athletes and got a "now dont you do it again" from the NCAA

SMU got the death penalty for paying recruits....Penn State got a relative slap on the wrist for the biggest scandal in NCAA history (Sandusky)

At the time biggest scandal. Michigan State now would have to be the biggest

RhowdyRam02 wrote:At the time biggest scandal. Michigan State now would have to be the biggest

not that these are hairs I really want to split, but other than murder for hire, you cant get worse than 3 decades of known and ignored child rape

Da_Process_Survivor wrote:

RhowdyRam02 wrote:At the time biggest scandal. Michigan State now would have to be the biggest

not that these are hairs I really want to split, but other than murder for hire, you cant get worse than 3 decades of known and ignored child rape

Murder for hire? What thing do you think I'm thinking of? I'm talking about the MSU doctor, Larry Nassar, who was involved with the sex abuse of all the gymnasts. He's accused of abusing at least 250 as far back as 1992, claiming the abuse was part of what he needed to do for their care

RhowdyRam02 wrote:

Da_Process_Survivor wrote:

RhowdyRam02 wrote:At the time biggest scandal. Michigan State now would have to be the biggest

not that these are hairs I really want to split, but other than murder for hire, you cant get worse than 3 decades of known and ignored child rape

Murder for hire? What thing do you think I'm thinking of? I'm talking about the MSU doctor, Larry Nassar, who was involved with the sex abuse of all the gymnasts. He's accused of abusing at least 250 as far back as 1992, claiming the abuse was part of what he needed to do for their care

yeah, i know what youre talking about. What I said was "short of murder for hire" aka, unless a school was organizing murder for hire you cant get worse than raping kids.

Penn St turned a blind eye to known child rape for 30 years. They let Sandusky have contact with kids and be a part of the kids camps knowing he was a pedophile. That is so far beyond what Nassar did. Trust me, Nassar deserves to be buried under the prison, but there's nothing more despicable than abusing children.

Da_Process_Survivor wrote:

RhowdyRam02 wrote:

Da_Process_Survivor wrote:
not that these are hairs I really want to split, but other than murder for hire, you cant get worse than 3 decades of known and ignored child rape

Murder for hire? What thing do you think I'm thinking of? I'm talking about the MSU doctor, Larry Nassar, who was involved with the sex abuse of all the gymnasts. He's accused of abusing at least 250 as far back as 1992, claiming the abuse was part of what he needed to do for their care

yeah, i know what youre talking about. What I said was "short of murder for hire" aka, unless a school was organizing murder for hire you cant get worse than raping kids.

Penn St turned a blind eye to known child rape for 30 years. They let Sandusky have contact with kids and be a part of the kids camps knowing he was a pedophile. That is so far beyond what Nassar did. Trust me, Nassar deserves to be buried under the prison, but there's nothing more despicable than abusing children.

Am I missing something? Nassar was abusing children as well.

And BTW, Louisville's been crooked since Denny Crum began buying players in the 1970s.