Conference Realignment

[Obadiah]

superfly, I do not have any strong understanding of why the BE would expand. Maybe ESPN and Fox may have some solid reasons for it. My sole interest here is that any BE expansion does offer URI an opportunity to move beyond the A-10. I understand that this is a low probability and is only possible if the BE decides on a major expansion. If the BE adds one or two schools, URI is out. If the BE adds three or four schools, URI is out. If the BE adds 5 or more schools, URI has a shot. Please do not misunderstand this. I am speculating on the only circumstance under which I see URI having a chance at BE membership and that circumstance is very unlikely to occur..

[Jdrums#3]

Following the immediate prior discussion regarding NBE expansion, I just had an epiphany…

The NBE should expand west with only Catholic schools, then, if UConn doesn’t convert to Catholicism in mass (no pun intended), jettison (excommunicate?) those heathens from the conference!

Then, and this is the key to success: negotiate a TV contract for games during Masses on Saturday’s at 5pm and for Sunday mornings; place big screen TV’s in all the churches convents, etc, (every Catholic institution and property) and indulge every Catholic to watch the games.

The NBE might be able to pull in $30-40 mil per team from a network with the strategy including a cut of parishioner donations.

I josh, of course, but then…

Anyway, just some spiritual related college basketball realignment humor on a college football Saturday. No offense intended.

P.S. credit to RJ Superfly for the only Catholic schools expansion idea.



Back to serious talk. Carry on.

ETA: Another NBE revenue idea…update the Bingo game cards to include game matchups - NBE Basketball Bingo…it’s a natural.

Apologies again…it is just how my mind works sometimes; the ideas come in bunches like unstoppable tsunami’s.

Back to serious talk for good this time.

[rjsuperfly66]

superfly, I do not have any strong understanding of why the BE would expand. Maybe ESPN and Fox may have some solid reasons for it. My sole interest here is that any BE expansion does offer URI an opportunity to move beyond the A-10. I understand that this is a low probability and is only possible if the BE decides on a major expansion. If the BE adds one or two schools, URI is out. If the BE adds three or four schools, URI is out. If the BE adds 5 or more schools, URI has a shot. Please do not misunderstand this. I am speculating on the only circumstance under which I see URI having a chance at BE membership and that circumstance is very unlikely to occur..

It's driven by the media/Fox - more quality teams = more quality games = more quality content. Fox has started to build up a nice college basketball rotation between the BE, Big Ten, Big 12, MWC, etc. But that doesn't mean they don't want to see continually improved matchups. Ratings matter to advertisers. And this is personally where I would aggressively attack a Gonzaga focused western wing of the conference. While someone like Zaga can add viewers in any time slot, getting more quality programming in the late window (10:30 and later) may be a draw to Fox. They'll already have access to USC/UCLA home games not airing on B10 network, they might get some west coast games out of the B12 inventory, but that would help ensure 6 nights a week, quality basketball until midnight. And if they do it right, perhaps they can turn FS2 into something more than a footnote and turn it into something similar to ESPN2.

[RhodyKyle]

40-50 years ago, it was natural for conferences to form with schools closer for geographic purposes. Now it's about what you bring to the table - media markets, quality of team, etc. And I know you pointed out USC/UCLA moving together, but that is two teams splitting a 6 million person media market. Both bring different things to the table. URI will never have an invite to the BE unless they turn into a perennial Top 25 team, and even then that is probably not enough.

That's a different argument altogether. No one here disagrees with that. We were saying that using geographic proximity as a reason to block someone is petty and shortsighted.

Why is it petty and shortsighted?

I would agree if a team was a slam dunk, have to have them, and they were blocked.

All things being equal though, expansion at this level is driven almost entirely by what drives TV contract revenue.

A second team in a small media market is pretty much a non-starter because it does nothing to elevate the bar. Nothing about that is petty or short-sighted. It's long-term strategic thinking on what sells.

BAR summed it up nicely.

Geography is meaningless. If Rhody was a consistent top 40 program where we are located wouldn’t matter. Butler got a BE invite of 2 magical years they will likely never come close replicating again. Creighton is in freakin Omaha.

Media market is meaningless in 2023. Linear TV is about to become the dvd of television.

[bigappleram]

Talking about “long term and strategic” and terrestrial TV in the same sentence is kinda funny. Try to find someone under say 25-30 that even watches TV.

[RIFan]

So true, my kids only watch YouTube and Netflix 90+% of the time…that is when they are not on TikTok.

[DuneClub]

For the record:
Two teams declined the BE's invitation, Holy Cross and Rutgers (circa 1979).

One team accepted an invitation (1982) but did not receive the yes vote, losing by one (5/8).
So apparently Villanova got Gtn,SJ to go along with them and block Joe paterno.

[Obadiah]

It's driven by the media/Fox - more quality teams = more quality games = more quality content

Sorry, superfly, we are now in Catch-22 land. The above is a playback of my earlier comment on brands, pairings, and time slots as opposed to your emphasis on market size. Funny.

It does not answer my question to you, knowledgeable about the BE. Since its new inception, the 10 member BE has not expanded except to bring back UConn. Media pressure existed before, so why didn't the BE expand further, then or now and ex the media what guides them currently. Maybe I am wrong, but I thought you once said you talk to BE officials

[Jersey77]

NM

[rjsuperfly66]

It's driven by the media/Fox - more quality teams = more quality games = more quality content

Sorry, superfly, we are now in Catch-22 land. The above is a playback of my earlier comment on brands, pairings, and time slots as opposed to your emphasis on market size. Funny.

It does not answer my question to you, knowledgeable about the BE. Since its new inception, the 10 member BE has not expanded except to bring back UConn. Media pressure existed before, so why didn't the BE expand further, then or now and ex the media what guides them currently. Maybe I am wrong, but I thought you once said you talk to BE officials

I've never claimed that expansion is solely about opening up foreign media markets. Brand absolutely matters as well, but if you have two teams, completely almost identical pedigrees, but one is in a new media territory, and was is in a duplicate media market, I do believe from everything I've heard the BE, like most conferences, would opt for the new market over the duplicate market.

The BE has been very selective in expansion because they've had the luxury of a lucrative (at the time) Fox contract. As nice as UCONN was to bring in as a brand, the timing was based on other conferences expanding to 20 conference games and the BE not wanting to be trapped at 18.

The BE is now trying to continue to position itself for the next TV contract. They've had conversations with Gonzaga over the last several years but Gonzaga has not had any interest in a full move due to travel costs for Olympic sports. There has not been another team that moves the needle, which is why further expansion talks haven't really happened other than compiling a list of potential targets. Most conferences believe 22 conference games may soon be on the table, so BE adding a 12th (or more), is based as much on that as TV considerations.

[Jersey77]

It's driven by the media/Fox - more quality teams = more quality games = more quality content

Sorry, superfly, we are now in Catch-22 land. The above is a playback of my earlier comment on brands, pairings, and time slots as opposed to your emphasis on market size. Funny.

It does not answer my question to you, knowledgeable about the BE. Since its new inception, the 10 member BE has not expanded except to bring back UConn. Media pressure existed before, so why didn't the BE expand further, then or now and ex the media what guides them currently. Maybe I am wrong, but I thought you once said you talk to BE officials

I've never claimed that expansion is solely about opening up foreign media markets. Brand absolutely matters as well, but if you have two teams, completely almost identical pedigrees, but one is in a new media territory, and was is in a duplicate media market, I do believe from everything I've heard the BE, like most conferences, would opt for the new market over the duplicate market.

The BE has been very selective in expansion because they've had the luxury of a lucrative (at the time) Fox contract. As nice as UCONN was to bring in as a brand, the timing was based on other conferences expanding to 20 conference games and the BE not wanting to be trapped at 18.

The BE is now trying to continue to position itself for the next TV contract. They've had conversations with Gonzaga over the last several years but Gonzaga has not had any interest in a full move due to travel costs for Olympic sports. There has not been another team that moves the needle, which is why further expansion talks haven't really happened other than compiling a list of potential targets. Most conferences believe 22 conference games may soon be on the table, so BE adding a 12th (or more), may be based as much on that as TV considerations.

I think I heard that Fox Sports was willing to up the ante in the new contract negotiations if the BE expands.
Not sure though if that includes any stipulations on programs or markets.

I know that the Zags have pushed back before, and they currently don't really need the BE.
Maybe a packaged deal with St. Mary's would help, who knows but also drawbacks there.

Again my fear is the A10 losing Dayton, VCU, or SLU to an eventual BE invite.

[Steve81]

Have to think UMass will be gone as A10 revenue is declining. MAC 35.7M and A10 just shy of 26M but don't understand that in light of the detailed page showing 20.5M Revenue.


https://projects.propublica.org/nonprof ... Conference

https://projects.propublica.org/nonprof ... Conference

[Obadiah]

It's driven by the media/Fox - more quality teams = more quality games = more quality content

Sorry, superfly, we are now in Catch-22 land. The above is a playback of my earlier comment on brands, pairings, and time slots as opposed to your emphasis on market size. Funny.

It does not answer my question to you, knowledgeable about the BE. Since its new inception, the 10 member BE has not expanded except to bring back UConn. Media pressure existed before, so why didn't the BE expand further, then or now and ex the media what guides them currently. Maybe I am wrong, but I thought you once said you talk to BE officials

I've never claimed that expansion is solely about opening up foreign media markets. Brand absolutely matters as well, but if you have two teams, completely almost identical pedigrees, but one is in a new media territory, and was is in a duplicate media market, I do believe from everything I've heard the BE, like most conferences, would opt for the new market over the duplicate market.

The BE has been very selective in expansion because they've had the luxury of a lucrative (at the time) Fox contract. As nice as UCONN was to bring in as a brand, the timing was based on other conferences expanding to 20 conference games and the BE not wanting to be trapped at 18.

The BE is now trying to continue to position itself for the next TV contract. They've had conversations with Gonzaga over the last several years but Gonzaga has not had any interest in a full move due to travel costs for Olympic sports. There has not been another team that moves the needle, which is why further expansion talks haven't really happened other than compiling a list of potential targets. Most conferences believe 22 conference games may soon be on the table, so BE adding a 12th (or more), is based as much on that as TV considerations.

Thanks, superfly for the clarification, but you did use market size to exclude URI from the BE despite the value of the pairing opportunities. Listen let's be honest here, you as well as all PC fans do not want URI in the BE because it neutralizes your advantage. I understand and accept that position, so let's not kid ourselves because you otherwise box yourself into silly lines of reasoning like since the #1 media market is NYC, let's take in Fordham.

Point #2. In the case of the Big Ten, the addition of UCLA/USC added stature to the league as did Texas and Oklahoma for the SEC. There are no apparent additions that impact similarly for BE basketball and in fact, eventually UConn will leave given the lure of football and the P4/5 and none of possible prospects fill that gap on brand recognition or pairings attractiveness.. So why would the BE expand at all. Your thoughts.

[Rhodymob05]

Have to think UMass will be gone as A10 revenue is declining. MAC 35.7M and A10 just shy of 26M but don't understand that in light of the detailed page showing 20.5M Revenue.


https://projects.propublica.org/nonprof ... Conference

https://projects.propublica.org/nonprof ... Conference

So UMASS basketball would go down to the MAC and play the Eastern Michigans and Kent states? Yikes.

[Jersey77]

I am okay if UMass leaves the A10 for the MAC, which of course would be football driven.

In that case, very possible the council members are asking the commissioner to gauge the interest of outside programs that may be a good fit.

Also, the A10 taking Charleston as a replacement isn't a bad option.

[section(105)]

I recently have bought into the notion that the Capital District New York would be a good A-10 market, no? We have kicked this around before, now being different?

[Jersey77]

I recently have bought into the notion that the Capital District New York would be a good A-10 market, no? We have kicked this around before, now being different?

105, I guess you are thinking Siena.
The MVP arena is a nice/big venue.

Drawback to some here would be no NCAAT appearances since 2010.
Although in 2020 they finished 1st in the MAAC, but post-season cancelled.

Many think highly of HC Carmen Maciariello who is 45 and Siena has been his only head coaching gig.

[bigappleram]

I recently have bought into the notion that the Capital District New York would be a good A-10 market, no? We have kicked this around before, now being different?

105, I guess you are thinking Siena.
The MVP arena is a nice/big venue.

Drawback to some here would be no NCAAT appearances since 2010.
Although in 2020 they finished 1st in the MAAC, but post-season cancelled.

Many think highly of HC Carmen Maciariello who is 45 and Siena has been his only head coaching gig.

Siena has always been my pick bc their ceiling is higher than others considered...even if their recent past results aren't great.
Have had a long list of accomplished coaches roll through there.
Upstate NY is talent rich.
Play in a large metro with an 8k+ arena.
Way more compelling (to me) than some small liberal arts school in the south.

[Jersey77]

I recently have bought into the notion that the Capital District New York would be a good A-10 market, no? We have kicked this around before, now being different?

105, I guess you are thinking Siena.
The MVP arena is a nice/big venue.

Drawback to some here would be no NCAAT appearances since 2010.
Although in 2020 they finished 1st in the MAAC, but post-season cancelled.

Many think highly of HC Carmen Maciariello who is 45 and Siena has been his only head coaching gig.

Siena has always been my pick bc their ceiling is higher than others considered...even if their recent past results aren't great.
Have had a long list of accomplished coaches roll through there.
Upstate NY is talent rich.
Play in a large metro with an 8k+ arena.
Way more compelling (to me) than some small liberal arts school in the south.

Yeah, don't disagree BAR.

Fran McCaffery had a nice run there (3 straight NCCAT) before leaving for Iowa.

[theblueram]

The way things are going, and being a juan bid league last year, I would rather be in an 8 team conference if juan bid is how it's going to be. You play quarters, semis and finals. No need to be in a bloated juan bid league and have to play 4+ games to get a bid. NCAA is destroying college basketball.

[Obadiah]

Siena has one of the better fan bases, averaging close to 6000 per game over the last 8 years.

[section(105)]

With the tinkering of incremental changes expected in A-10(if the BE comes calling for others) Siena would be good replacement. I just don’t see large changes(new conferences)nor dismissal of current A-10 current whom don’t measure up. No?

[rjsuperfly66]

It's driven by the media/Fox - more quality teams = more quality games = more quality content

Sorry, superfly, we are now in Catch-22 land. The above is a playback of my earlier comment on brands, pairings, and time slots as opposed to your emphasis on market size. Funny.

It does not answer my question to you, knowledgeable about the BE. Since its new inception, the 10 member BE has not expanded except to bring back UConn. Media pressure existed before, so why didn't the BE expand further, then or now and ex the media what guides them currently. Maybe I am wrong, but I thought you once said you talk to BE officials

I've never claimed that expansion is solely about opening up foreign media markets. Brand absolutely matters as well, but if you have two teams, completely almost identical pedigrees, but one is in a new media territory, and was is in a duplicate media market, I do believe from everything I've heard the BE, like most conferences, would opt for the new market over the duplicate market.

The BE has been very selective in expansion because they've had the luxury of a lucrative (at the time) Fox contract. As nice as UCONN was to bring in as a brand, the timing was based on other conferences expanding to 20 conference games and the BE not wanting to be trapped at 18.

The BE is now trying to continue to position itself for the next TV contract. They've had conversations with Gonzaga over the last several years but Gonzaga has not had any interest in a full move due to travel costs for Olympic sports. There has not been another team that moves the needle, which is why further expansion talks haven't really happened other than compiling a list of potential targets. Most conferences believe 22 conference games may soon be on the table, so BE adding a 12th (or more), is based as much on that as TV considerations.

Thanks, superfly for the clarification, but you did use market size to exclude URI from the BE despite the value of the pairing opportunities. Listen let's be honest here, you as well as all PC fans do not want URI in the BE because it neutralizes your advantage. I understand and accept that position, so let's not kid ourselves because you otherwise box yourself into silly lines of reasoning like since the #1 media market is NYC, let's take in Fordham.

Point #2. In the case of the Big Ten, the addition of UCLA/USC added stature to the league as did Texas and Oklahoma for the SEC. There are no apparent additions that impact similarly for BE basketball and in fact, eventually UConn will leave given the lure of football and the P4/5 and none of possible prospects fill that gap on brand recognition or pairings attractiveness.. So why would the BE expand at all. Your thoughts.

I used market size in the current landscape because there is nothing to differentiate URI from many of the other potential candidates who bring more to the table and offer the benefit of a new potential market. Sure if URI becomes a perennial tourney team over the next 10 years perhaps they make a more compelling case, even with PC/UCONN trying to block a move.

The BE will need to expand, at the very least, to keep a double round-robin schedule in line to match the potential 22+ game conference schedules the Big Ten, SEC, and Big 12 will likely be in favor of in the future. It's hard enough to land good OOC games, once those conferences eventually go to 9 OOC games, it'll be nearly impossible, so better off with a conference H/H against a Top 75ish team than 2 OOC games with limited/unpredictable upside. Moving to the BE will immediately upgrade any program, so picking someone who is already consistently flirting with the dance would be a nice addition for a 12th team. Not many options, but still probably 5 years for things to sort out.

[RF1]

I am okay if UMass leaves the A10 for the MAC, which of course would be football driven.

In that case, very possible the council members are asking the commissioner to gauge the interest of outside programs that may be a good fit.

Also, the A10 taking Charleston as a replacement isn't a bad option.

Losing the UMass men's basketball program would not be a big blow to the A-10. Losing VCU or Dayton would be catastrophic. UMass has only had real men's hoops success in the conference under Calipari. He is their only head coach that has ever won an NCAA game. They draw sparse crowds and have little support from most residents in the state, especially in the heavily populated Boston metro area.

Most conference members would not be all that upset if they were leave. The lone exception would probably be URI. It would not be good to lose the league member it has the most history with. Furthermore UMass is the closest member. If they were to go, URI would be further isolated as the only team from New England. Losing a fellow public school in a conference already with a small religious school majority membership would also be bad for URI.

[Rhodymob05]

As a fan, I would cry if we went to the MAC just for football. You think The Ryan is dead now..

[jcru]

The way things are going, and being a juan bid league last year, I would rather be in an 8 team conference if juan bid is how it's going to be. You play quarters, semis and finals. No need to be in a bloated juan bid league and have to play 4+ games to get a bid. NCAA is destroying college basketball.

I vote for this. Get into a league similar to the Ivy League, with say, Siena, Hofstra, Delaware, and 4 bottom feeders.

Then you have a 25-33% chance of winning the autobid every year. If you dominate your conference, you become like Vermont and Princeton and go every single year, or most years.

[section(105)]

I do not think the URI football program will dictate which conference Rhody hoops is in. No?

[Jersey77]

I am okay if UMass leaves the A10 for the MAC, which of course would be football driven.

In that case, very possible the council members are asking the commissioner to gauge the interest of outside programs that may be a good fit.

Also, the A10 taking Charleston as a replacement isn't a bad option.

Losing the UMass men's basketball program would not be a big blow to the A-10. Losing VCU or Dayton would be catastrophic. UMass has only had real men's hoops success under Calipari. He is their only head coach that has ever won an NCAA game. They draw sparse crowds and have little support from most residents in the state, especially in the heavily populated Boston metro area.

Most conference members would not be all that upset if they were leave. The lone exception would probably be URI. It would not be good to lose the league member it has the most history with. Furthermore UMass is the closest member. If they were to go, URI would be further isolated as the only team from New England. Losing a fellow public school in a conference already with a small religious school majority membership would also be bad for URI.

In that case RF1, if UMass does leave, we should entertain the idea of playing them yearly rotating home/away OOC.

[Jersey77]

The way things are going, and being a juan bid league last year, I would rather be in an 8 team conference if juan bid is how it's going to be. You play quarters, semis and finals. No need to be in a bloated juan bid league and have to play 4+ games to get a bid. NCAA is destroying college basketball.

I vote for this. Get into a league similar to the Ivy League, with say, Siena, Hofstra, Delaware, and 4 bottom feeders.

Then you have a 25-33% chance of winning the autobid every year. If you dominate your conference, you become like Vermont and Princeton and go every single year, or most years.

Yep that would justify Archie's over $2M salary and am sure that scenario is what he was looking for in coming to Rhody.

[theblueram]

The way things are going, and being a juan bid league last year, I would rather be in an 8 team conference if juan bid is how it's going to be. You play quarters, semis and finals. No need to be in a bloated juan bid league and have to play 4+ games to get a bid. NCAA is destroying college basketball.

I vote for this. Get into a league similar to the Ivy League, with say, Siena, Hofstra, Delaware, and 4 bottom feeders.

Then you have a 25-33% chance of winning the autobid every year. If you dominate your conference, you become like Vermont and Princeton and go every single year, or most years.

Yep that would justify Archie's over $2M salary and am sure that scenario is what he was looking for in coming to Rhody.

Better than your idea of adding Siena. NET 206 last year. Hmmmm, that will help the conference.

[Jersey77]

I vote for this. Get into a league similar to the Ivy League, with say, Siena, Hofstra, Delaware, and 4 bottom feeders.

Then you have a 25-33% chance of winning the autobid every year. If you dominate your conference, you become like Vermont and Princeton and go every single year, or most years.

Yep that would justify Archie's over $2M salary and am sure that scenario is what he was looking for in coming to Rhody.

Better than your idea of adding Siena. NET 206 last year. Hmmmm, that will help the conference.

No it isn't, not even close.

Besides adding Siena wasn't my idea, I was responding to 105 and BAR.
But yeah if several teams bail, they may not be the worst option as several here pointed out.

[jcru]

Yep that would justify Archie's over $2M salary and am sure that scenario is what he was looking for in coming to Rhody.

I'm guessing a Conference in it's death throws that produces one bid to the only show in town and looking to add team #16, and bleeding money, wasn't what he was looking for coming to Rhody either.

[jcru]

But yeah if several teams bail, they may not be the worst option as several here pointed out.

Nooooo. That wouldn't be the worst option at all.

The worst option would be staying.

[jcru]

Some people choose a conference for money (UMass)

Some people choose a conference for NCAA bids (Vermont)

Some people choose a conference so they can have 500-700 asses parked next to them at the Ryan Center for home games (Mob05)

And some people don't have the sense to realize when the NCAA has stacked the deck against your conference, specifically, and there will be no long term recovery, just a slow implosion like the submarine Titan, where other teams in the conference are looking for the first chance to bolt for greener pastures.

Like the joke goes: two men are running from the Lion, one guy says "we can't outrun him" and the other guys says "I don't have to outrun HIM, I just have to outrun YOU!"

The teams currently calculating their next cushy landing spot are that second guy.

[Jersey77]

Yep that would justify Archie's over $2M salary and am sure that scenario is what he was looking for in coming to Rhody.

I'm guessing a Conference in it's death throws that produces one bid to the only show in town and looking to add team #16, and bleeding money, wasn't what he was looking for coming to Rhody either.

Not sure exactly sure what the A10 intends to do.
We had 1 year with only 1 bid and now you are predicting doom and gloom.

We obviously aren't paying him that kind of salary to be a bottom feeder here either.
We expect him to eventually lead us to conference championships.

[Jersey77]

But yeah if several teams bail, they may not be the worst option as several here pointed out.

Nooooo. That wouldn't be the worst option at all.

The worst option would be staying.

Of course.
You suggested we should leave for conferences such as the CAA, MAAC, or the AEC.

[jcru]

The NCAA, has done everything, but grab you by the throat and scream at you, that conferences like the A-10 are done for... by design.

They want FBS football conferences, and conferences like the Ivy League that get one bid apiece. No in between. Everything that they do from here on out, NIL, "free agency", everything, will be geared towards producing that result. Gone will be mid major conferences, to be replaced by "lesser" FBS football conferences, who will at least be rewarded for contributing to the FBS picture.

You seem like a very smart guy, I can't understand why you seem to be blinded to that fact?

[NYGFan_Section208]

I do not think the URI football program will dictate which conference Rhody hoops is in. No?

Yes, probably no.

[Jersey77]

The NCAA, has done everything, but grab you by the throat and scream at you, that conferences like the A-10 are done for... by design.

They want FBC football conferences, and conferences like the Ivy League that get one bid apiece. No in between. Everything that they do from here on out, NIL, everything, will be geared towards producing that result. Gone will be mid major conferences, to be replaced by "lesser" FBC football conference, who will at least be rewarded for contributing to the FBC.

You seem like a very smart guy, I can't understand why you seem to be blinded to that fact?

Actually I do agree that the NCAA and P5 has stacked the deck against conferences like ours.

There has been talk about possibly restructuring the NCAAT.

We will see and can only hope eventually there will be some changes for the better.

[jcru]

I do not think the URI football program will dictate which conference Rhody hoops is in. No?

Yes, probably no.

It can't. It's not in a position to do so.

They need to get that Stadium upgrade settled. Because they are not even going to be playing at home for at least one season. They need to string together a few playoff seasons. They're not currently in a position to entertain something like that, so the answer would be no. JMU recently was, so they did.

[jcru]

I mean, the CAA is as good as launch pad as any, to make that leap. But they need to worry about continuing on the trajectory they are on, for the time being, and not letting it lapse.

[section(105)]

Maybe some of us are trying to revive the isolated past times where the good times and lightning in a bottle were the function of gifted players recruited and near magic coaching chemistry. That ship. Does not come by Kingston often. Archie, or someone else build a program that demonstrates sustained dominance of the current conference. No?

[RhowdyRam02]

I vote for this. Get into a league similar to the Ivy League, with say, Siena, Hofstra, Delaware, and 4 bottom feeders.

Then you have a 25-33% chance of winning the autobid every year. If you dominate your conference, you become like Vermont and Princeton and go every single year, or most years.

Yep that would justify Archie's over $2M salary and am sure that scenario is what he was looking for in coming to Rhody.

Better than your idea of adding Siena. NET 206 last year. Hmmmm, that will help the conference.

Seriously. Fucking Siena now? We'd be better off in the America East with the shit teams people want to add

[RF1]

I am okay if UMass leaves the A10 for the MAC, which of course would be football driven.

In that case, very possible the council members are asking the commissioner to gauge the interest of outside programs that may be a good fit.

Also, the A10 taking Charleston as a replacement isn't a bad option.

Losing the UMass men's basketball program would not be a big blow to the A-10. Losing VCU or Dayton would be catastrophic. UMass has only had real men's hoops success under Calipari. He is their only head coach that has ever won an NCAA game. They draw sparse crowds and have little support from most residents in the state, especially in the heavily populated Boston metro area.

Most conference members would not be all that upset if they were leave. The lone exception would probably be URI. It would not be good to lose the league member it has the most history with. Furthermore UMass is the closest member. If they were to go, URI would be further isolated as the only team from New England. Losing a fellow public school in a conference already with a small religious school majority membership would also be bad for URI.

In that case RF1, if UMass does leave, we should entertain the idea of playing them yearly rotating home/away OOC.

I would be for playing them home and home on a fairly regular basis given the long history and relatively short distance. I however do not think it would need to be every year like PC and Brown.

[Steve81]

Losing the UMass men's basketball program would not be a big blow to the A-10. Losing VCU or Dayton would be catastrophic. UMass has only had real men's hoops success under Calipari. He is their only head coach that has ever won an NCAA game. They draw sparse crowds and have little support from most residents in the state, especially in the heavily populated Boston metro area.

Most conference members would not be all that upset if they were leave. The lone exception would probably be URI. It would not be good to lose the league member it has the most history with. Furthermore UMass is the closest member. If they were to go, URI would be further isolated as the only team from New England. Losing a fellow public school in a conference already with a small religious school majority membership would also be bad for URI.

In that case RF1, if UMass does leave, we should entertain the idea of playing them yearly rotating home/away OOC.

I would be for playing them home and home on a fairly regular basis given the long history and relatively short distance. I however do not think it would need to be every year like PC and Brown.

Home and home with a FCS is not happening. In fact if we move, we need to shed games not add new ones.

[Jersey77]

In that case RF1, if UMass does leave, we should entertain the idea of playing them yearly rotating home/away OOC.

I would be for playing them home and home on a fairly regular basis given the long history and relatively short distance. I however do not think it would need to be every year like PC and Brown.

Home and home with a FCS is not happening. In fact if we move, we need to shed games not add new ones.

I think we are discussing basketball games not football.

[Steve81]

So UMASS basketball would go down to the MAC and play the Eastern Michigans and Kent states? Yikes.

You realize that Kent State was in the Elite 8 in 2002 and in the tournament last year.

Yes, the finances will push us to the MAC and once you do not have multiple teams in the top 40-50, it's a 1 bid conference. Then you have VCU and St.Louis looking at the AAC as a pairing with Army.
VCU forum.
https://www.vcuramnation.com/forums/thr ... 1/page-241

Will post the top half has good basketball and will post the top half in each, 6 for the MAC and 7 for the A10.

https://www.ncaa.com/rankings/basketbal ... t-rankings
MAC
68 Kent State
82 Toledo
105 Akron
133 Ohio
156 Ball State
194 Buffalo

A10
54 VCU
77 Dayton
97 St. Louis
132 Fordham
137 Duquesne
139 George Mason
145 Davidson


The A10 is better but still good basketball in the MAC, especially the east wing. The A10 is at risk if being raided whether it's the American or/and Big East.

[Jersey77]

Home and home with a FCS is not happening. In fact if we move, we need to shed games not add new ones.

I think we are discussing basketball games not football.

Yes, the finances will push us to the MAC and once you do not have multiple teams in the top 40-50, it's a 1 bid conference. Then you have VCU and St.Louis looking at the AAC as a pairing with Army.
VCU forum.
https://www.vcuramnation.com/forums/thr ... 1/page-241

So, yes the Michigan schools suck big time, but the top half has good basketball and will post the top half in each, 6 for the MAC and 8 for the A10.

https://www.ncaa.com/rankings/basketbal ... t-rankings
MAC
68 Kent State
82 Toledo
105 Akron
133 Ohio
156 Ball State
194 Buffalo

A10
54 VCU
77 Dayton
97 St. Louis
132 Fordham
137 Duquesne
139 George Mason
145 Davidson
160 Richmond


The A10 is better but still good basketball. However the A10 can be raided whether it's the American or/and the Big East.

Looking back now, do you think it was a mistake for UMass to not accept the full-time invitation from the MAC?
Rather than be forced out and go independent, while staying with the A10 in basketball.

[Steve81]

I think we are discussing basketball games not football.

Yes, the finances will push us to the MAC and once you do not have multiple teams in the top 40-50, it's a 1 bid conference. Then you have VCU and St.Louis looking at the AAC as a pairing with Army.
VCU forum.
https://www.vcuramnation.com/forums/thr ... 1/page-241

So, yes the Michigan schools suck big time, but the top half has good basketball and will post the top half in each, 6 for the MAC and 8 for the A10.

https://www.ncaa.com/rankings/basketbal ... t-rankings
MAC
68 Kent State
82 Toledo
105 Akron
133 Ohio
156 Ball State
194 Buffalo

A10
54 VCU
77 Dayton
97 St. Louis
132 Fordham
137 Duquesne
139 George Mason
145 Davidson
160 Richmond


The A10 is better but still good basketball. However the A10 can be raided whether it's the American or/and the Big East.

Looking back now, do you think it was a mistake for UMass to not accept the full-time invitation from the MAC?
Rather than be forced out and go independent, while staying with the A10 in basketball.

Understand why we stayed in the A10. As long as it was earning 4 bids or more. In fact that year, 2014 the A10 got 6 bids with us taking that last bid. Think it's a mistake now, but do like the idea of waiting on an East Coast partner, maintaining east coast exposure and history. I've advocated for UMass to see if UConn would pair with us all sports and them FB in MAC and call URI and see if they could get ready when UConn eventually leaves, wait list so to speak. Delaware is worthy and on the east cost, 40 miles outside of Philly.

[RF1]

Steve81 is on the UMass, A-10, VCU, and various other forums openly advocating for UMass to leave the A-10 and join the MAC. He has been doing so on some of them for years, well before the decline the A-10 is presently facing. He states that the move to the MAC is a certain eventuality. It seems however that many UMass fans and their school administration do not necessarily share his view. He is also very much a football over basketball UMass fan based on all the posts of his I have read over the years. Rhody fans should keep in mind that he is but ONE fan that has a very obvious agenda. His opinions should not be taken as representing all UMass fans or the school's administration.