Game #6: Georgia Tech Yellowjackets - ESPNU - GameDay!!

[Seawrightspostgame]

Oh your saying Hare's roster spot kept guys away that could be here now? I guess. Really a periphery problem.

I like what we got down there.

No Rod, Jordan Hare's ship sailed and sunk. I'm with you.

[The Dude]

Do we enter conference play at 9-2?

stuff looks awful cause guys are scared, TJ looks great because hes not scared, unselfish and benefits from 4 years of working on his body. Its the experience vs talent thing. Experience gets it done.

I think our best lineup is EC, TJ, JT,Gil, Martin/Watson. Anybody?

I like Jarvis but at the end of this game he got a rebound not 4 feet from the goal with nobody on him and he didn't even look at the rim. He will take time.

Despite any of the headaches, have to point out the miraculous turn around in Gil's game. He couldn't cover a bed and now he is pretty good at defending and rebounding.

Totally agree with the best line up. Gil has improved as well. I would like to see Jarvis and TJ get the lion's share of the minutes each game.

[bressler3south]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nsETySf ... freload=10

AND TOLD US, AND TOLD US, AND TOLD US……..

A BRESSLER PRODUCTION

IN ASSOCIATION WITH EMOTICON ENTERPRISES

[Rhody Guy]

As usual I would bet that it is the outspoken minority that thinks the GT game was the big indicator that we suck. Most people most likely feel like we played like crap but we are bound to from time to time. We should do a poll to find out.

[RIFan]

I beg your forgiveness Rod...but in my defense, I brought him up as screwing us for next year, since he would have been the heir apparent at center. Now we are going to have to get a Juco or first year player who can contribute right away...that will be difficult.

[Gonebarongone]

As usual I would bet that it is the outspoken minority that thinks the GT game was the big indicator that we suck. Most people most likely feel like we played like crap but we are bound to from time to time. We should do a poll to find out.

I don't think it's the GT game. It's the lack of any evolution in the offense. Going back to the first season it was pass, weave, dribble around the perimeter then hope X bailed us out. We chalked it up to personnel. But, the personnel is changing and now we are blaming it on a young PG. Even the Nebraska win was a gross offensive display. This team plays great defense. They rebound well. But, the upside is capped when there is no attempt to get easy buckets inside and they devolve into a jump shooting team which isn't very good at making jumpers. Over the next few dozen games, if nothing changes, we will win some on defense and we will win some when the jumpers are falling. That's a testament to the upgrade in talent by the staff. But, against decent or better teams, it's going to be a struggle. So, sure, a message board overreacts, but I think the frustration is a little deeper.

[rodfromcranston]

OK, RIFan. You get to skate this time as a first offense.
Rambone is getting my ex wife to nag him until he goes deaf,
as the penalty for mentioning he who shall go nameless.
In all seriousness, I'm praying for a mid term transfer. Less down time than
for a transfer at the end of the year. He'd only miss a few games and be
able to play in December 2015.
A good juco could be the answer.
Getting a big out of high school/prep, as we know, will take a long
time to develop.
Do we have time? Next year will be EC and Hassan's junior year.
The window is closing on us being an NCAA team during their time here.

Agree 100% GBG.

[TruePoint]

I actually agree with GBG's analysis of the team at this point - we will win games with athleticism and maybe some others if we have a great shooting night, but overall we lack the ability to score enough points to consistently threaten good teams. I've been saying that since the Nebraska game. What I disagree with is acting like the GT game was some kind of revelation when it really should fit into exactly what we have known about this team the whole time. So it is the meltdown after that particular game I don't get.

Before the season most people would say they thought the team would win 17-19 games and threaten late for a NIT appearance. That represents another step forward in building this program up from nothing to where we want it to be, and it seems like exactly where we are headed. But I guess people just don't like to see what that actually looks like? I can't figure out what the anxiety is about for a team that is right on course as far as I can tell.

[rodfromcranston]

I think what is is this:
During Dan's first season, he had X and some lower D-1 players.
With that team, with no depth and little talent, they played hard and
were in games that they had no reason to be in. Gritty.
They bought into Dan's program 100%. Well, maybe not one of those guys.....
With that terrible team, there were many close losses, and the team
played with great discipline, all season.
So, with all the transfers last year, plus EC and Martin, we all expected the
added talent to play with the discipline and grit of Dan's first team.
Instead, they reverted to what we saw for much of the season.
So, now, everyone is a year older, two fine freshmen are added to the mix,
and we don't see what we thought we were getting when we saw Hurley's first team.
How many of us said,"Wow! Imagine how good we're going to be when he gets some talent!"
Well the grit, the discipline, and the fire only appears sporadically.
I think that's where some of us are getting our disappointment.

[adam914]

If you are happy with shit play, then good for you. Enjoy it.

Can you show me where I said I was happy with shit play? Do I have to make 100 posts a day in every thread saying the same thing over and over again like you to prove that I don't like when we play bad?

[Obadiah]

I think what happened in Hurley's second year is the newcomers Iffy, Minnis, and Reischel were not good as expected. And there is no evidence that a year of seasoning has helped these guys with a possible pass for Reischel. Also Butler has proven to have less value. That means with the walk-on and excluding Reischel, we have 5 men who contribute little. Add to the mix a transfer plus two freshman and your core of experience comes down to 5 guys.

[Sweep The Leg]

I think what is is this:
During Dan's first season, he had X and some lower D-1 players.
With that team, with no depth and little talent, they played hard and
were in games that they had no reason to be in. Gritty.
They bought into Dan's program 100%. Well, maybe not one of those guys.....
With that terrible team, there were many close losses, and the team
played with great discipline, all season.
So, with all the transfers last year, plus EC and Martin, we all expected the
added talent to play with the discipline and grit of Dan's first team.
Instead, they reverted to what we saw for much of the season.
So, now, everyone is a year older, two fine freshmen are added to the mix,
and we don't see what we thought we were getting when we saw Hurley's first team.
How many of us said,"Wow! Imagine how good we're going to be when he gets some talent!"
Well the grit, the discipline, and the fire only appears sporadically.
I think that's where some of us are getting our disappointment.

I was going to type pretty much that exact sentiment, but you beat me to it. Dan's best work at Rhody was that 1st season where we had very limited talent and depth and the players we did have were holdovers from the prior coach who will never be mentioned by name. Dan had to get those 3 seniors to buy in for one more year even to field a team. It was doomed from the start. But, Dan had a good strategy and slowed the game down and played tough D and it worked as we were competitive for many games, the most impressive, OSU.

The second season was touted with transfers and 2 All-Rookie freshman. We played very well toward the end with everyone finding their game and there looked to be hope for this season as everyone except X was coming back. During mid-season, it seemed like X passed the torch to EC and let him be the alpha dog which could not have been easy for X. There was a few games in a row, he was really off and I that shift affected him. He was basically a bridge to bigger and better things for our program, but not a part of ultimate anticipated success. That has to be frustrating and he handled it very well.

Now, it seems like we regressed offensively mightly and a bit defensively. We run that horrible 3 man weave for 25 seconds and then panic to get any look the last 9 seconds. Our 2nd best player, Hassan, doesn't shoot anymore. Why? He had a good mid-range baseline shot at the end of last year and could use that threat to his advantage driving the baseline. Seems the coaching style is all about the guards and the low post guys are window dressing. If you run low post plays, you make teams play complete defense. Make them work hard with effective ball movement, not this handing off shit back and forth.

Against more athletic teams, we struggle defensively. Kansas had wide open looks from 3 all night and had at least 5 and 1s. The 1st year Hurley led Rams would have played better defensively.

I never understood the concept of having to sacrifice having a good defense in able to improve the offense. These should not be mutually exclusive. You should be to do both well.

I think there is hope for this year's team. We have talent. But, they need to be put in the best possible position to win. Play to your player's strengths. Become more dyanmic offensively, high-low and lateral ball movement. Have players slash to the basket without the ball and good things will happen. The other A-10 teams for a lack of a better word, suck. An NCAA birth can still be a reality this year if we can hammer the overall weak teams in the A-10. They are some scary losses for the league.

[Captainron@]

Sometimes I wonder if Hurley is so high energy/volume all the time, that eventually the kids get use to it and when he needs to improve the energy/effort, they've already heard that level so much, that it doesn't create a response anymore... I think a lot of the refs may feel the same way too.

[Iggy1979]

STL: Disagree on one point: I think this is Hurley's best defensive team.
Captain: When they were behind against Kansas and Ga Tech the team noticeably turned up the energy, so I think the team is still reacting to Hurley's lead.

[Ram1019]

Part of being a good team is having the ability to make adjustments to your mistakes. Lets see how they react after Sundays performance. This applies to players and coaching. It's too early for me to worry.

[bigappleram]

We are so much better defensively than either of the two previous seasons its not even close. Yes the first year we had a ton of grit, but when you stink that is what people call it. It wasnt so much great D as it was a very methodical approach on offense that kept games low scoring. Baron's early teams had the same style, but it wasnt because he was a great defensive coach....we saw that b/c when we actually had gifted athletes (Keith, Ulmer, Delroy) our defense actually got worse. Not the same thing here, we are playing very very good defense for the most part.

[Gonebarongone]

We are so much better defensively than either of the two previous seasons its not even close. Yes the first year we had a ton of grit, but when you stink that is what people call it. It wasnt so much great D as it was a very methodical approach on offense that kept games low scoring. Baron's early teams had the same style, but it wasnt because he was a great defensive coach....we saw that b/c when we actually had gifted athletes (Keith, Ulmer, Delroy) our defense actually got worse. Not the same thing here, we are playing very very good defense for the most part.

I agree. I will add that when you are talking about defense, you are essentially talking about ending possessions by the offense by any means. I do think the defense a few years ago was very good at the shell concepts of man to man defense. But, the reality is they got killed on the other team's offensive glass and they didn't turn the other team over. So, even though the team a few years ago did play pretty good defense, they just didn't end enough possessions. This year's team kills it on the boards and does a decent job turning teams over. That makes this squad a ton better even if they do break down a bit and tend to reach a lot (they foul way too often).

[Seawrightspostgame]

I also think this is the best defense. They have even gotten better over the 6 games. At first they were doing everything except denying in the passing lanes, so when the on-ball defense would succeed, the guy could just pass it to somebody else. They now are taking that away too.

Hassan I think is still learning to be the force that he is from his less than ideal size. He gets fouls because he's not long enough to be an absolute rim protector in the sense of a long guy that can block without fouling. He gets in positions where he is just not situated to block a shot and gets fouls called. As soon as he adjusts to the idea that he can't block EVERY shot, he will be even better. If that is not committing the foul or taking a better angle IDK but I am sure he will figure it out soon. He seems to be a very fast learner.

[Sweep The Leg]

We are so much better defensively than either of the two previous seasons its not even close. Yes the first year we had a ton of grit, but when you stink that is what people call it. It wasnt so much great D as it was a very methodical approach on offense that kept games low scoring. Baron's early teams had the same style, but it wasnt because he was a great defensive coach....we saw that b/c when we actually had gifted athletes (Keith, Ulmer, Delroy) our defense actually got worse. Not the same thing here, we are playing very very good defense for the most part.

I agree. I will add that when you are talking about defense, you are essentially talking about ending possessions by the offense by any means. I do think the defense a few years ago was very good at the shell concepts of man to man defense. But, the reality is they got killed on the other team's offensive glass and they didn't turn the other team over. So, even though the team a few years ago did play pretty good defense, they just didn't end enough possessions. This year's team kills it on the boards and does a decent job turning teams over. That makes this squad a ton better even if they do break down a bit and tend to reach a lot (they foul way too often).

Well, when Nik is your main 4 and Ryan Brooks is your 5, you're going to get beat on the glass on both sides of the court.

Kansas had their way with us offensively. Apparently GT did as well as they shot 56% from 3 when they were horrible in their previous games, as was Kansas, and shot 31 foul shots. That doesn't scream good defense. Nebraska is the only non-cupcake we played well defensively against and the big knock on them last year was offensive efficiency.

I think Jared is a great defender as is TJ. Hassan is great considering he is playing out of position. And everyone else is pretty average.

[rambone 78]

Sweep, I think you are right about our defense. I would add Gil to the list of guys that are playing pretty good defense, especially compared to the matador defense he played last year.

Besides those four, the rest are average at best. I think Jarvis will improve quite a bit, the rest I doubt.

[TruePoint]

Defense is an area where the result can be greater than the sum of its parts. Great individual defenders are good to have but you don't need them to be a good defensive team. Effort, discipline and basketball IQ can be enough (assuming you have capable athletes, and we do).

[Sweep The Leg]

Sweep, I think you are right about our defense. I would add Gil to the list of guys that are playing pretty good defense, especially compared to the matador defense he played last year.

Besides those four, the rest are average at best. I think Jarvis will improve quite a bit, the rest I doubt.

Gil isn't fouling which is nice and is rebounding. Don't except much more from him, not a real rim protector.

Jarvis is learning. Still getting caught in screens leading to open looks. It's tough when your young and the smallest person out there. He needs to learn to take better angles and anticipate screens sooner.

[Sweep The Leg]

Defense is an area where the result can be greater than the sum of its parts. Great individual defenders are good to have but you don't need them to be a good defensive team. Effort, discipline and basketball IQ can be enough (assuming you have capable athletes, and we do).

Have to disagree there. If you have great defensive guards, it protects the bigs from recovery fouls when players drive the lane. Last year, Powell and Biggie were beat off the dribble causing Gil to foul more and easy interior buckets. As a team that plays strictly man, the success of individual defenders means even more. There is still help defense and some rotation happening, but maybe only 1/3 of that teamwork type defense that is used and needed in various zones.

[rambone 78]

TP, I'll admit that you made some good points in that post about where this team is, concerning our expectations at this point.

The reason I flew off the handle about the GT game was:

Leading up to that game, we had some obvious issues. Nothing earth shattering, just normal growing pains imo.

But what went down in that game was SO bad, it was like they never played the game before. Like I said, I expect some struggles, we all do. I just never imagined we'd be so bad, especially a Hurley coached team. It was shocking, leading to anger.

Hopefully we'll never see such a performance again.

[TruePoint]

Thanks Bone. I think there are fair critiques to make about the team I just haven't seem anything to from them yet that would change my season-long expectations. That's all I was trying to say.

STL - I don't think we necessarily disagree. I wasn't trying to say that good defenders aren't helpful, just that you don't need to have a team full of them to play good team defense. I think you'd be better off with five pretty talented guys playing their assignments correctly and giving full effort than having two or three great individual defenders and two or three guys that could care less and are complete dogs on that end of the floor. Obviously the best case would be to have five guys giving max effort with some of them also being great individual defenders (and the more the better).

[Billyboy78]

Thanks Bone. I think there are fair critiques to make about the team I just haven't seem anything to from them yet that would change my season-long expectations. That's all I was trying to say.

STL - I don't think we necessarily disagree. I wasn't trying to say that good defenders aren't helpful, just that you don't need to have a team full of them to play good team defense. I think you'd be better off with five pretty talented guys playing their assignments correctly and giving full effort than having two or three great individual defenders and two or three guys that could care less and are complete dogs on that end of the floor. Obviously the best case would be to have five guys giving max effort with some of them also being great individual defenders (and the more the better).

Larry Bird is a great example of this. He was not a good one on one defender, but was great in team defense.

[rambone 78]

Larry Bird, along with Magic, were the smartest BB players I ever saw.

Not anywhere near the most athletic or talented, but his BB IQ was off the charts.

[Seawrightspostgame]

Since we are talking D. Reischel seems to lose his guy after every pick and roll. It's insane.

[Sweep The Leg]

Thanks Bone. I think there are fair critiques to make about the team I just haven't seem anything to from them yet that would change my season-long expectations. That's all I was trying to say.

STL - I don't think we necessarily disagree. I wasn't trying to say that good defenders aren't helpful, just that you don't need to have a team full of them to play good team defense. I think you'd be better off with five pretty talented guys playing their assignments correctly and giving full effort than having two or three great individual defenders and two or three guys that could care less and are complete dogs on that end of the floor. Obviously the best case would be to have five guys giving max effort with some of them also being great individual defenders (and the more the better).

Larry Bird is a great example of this. He was not a good one on one defender, but was great in team defense.

As a deplorable man once said, 'Larry Bird isn't walking through that door.'

Speaking of which, he is one of the quickest to 700 wins. Does he do everything in record time?

[rodfromcranston]

As a final item to Orlando, interesting
to note, Preston Murphy's mom, wearing a #32 URI jacket,
was there rooting for the Rams.
Ties run deep.

[RF1]

As a final item to Orlando, interesting
to note, Preston Murphy's mom, wearing a #32 URI jacket,
was there rooting for the Rams.
Ties run deep.

And Preston's son (Preston Jr) played in the Nebraska game half time exhibition for CLCF.

[Billyboy78]

As a final item to Orlando, interesting
to note, Preston Murphy's mom, wearing a #32 URI jacket,
was there rooting for the Rams.
Ties run deep.

And Preston's son (Prston Jr) played in the Nebraska game half time exhibition for CLCF.

And that kid is good. Get on him now!

[rodfromcranston]

Preston told me he was moving to Boston.
I wonder if that changed?
Bad time to be selling a house. Houses here are mostly selling
far below purchase price.

[Shinze88]

Georgia Tech just lost AT HOME to a team called South Carolina Upstate, who played nothing but zone defense against GT.
Michigan just lost to NJIT AT HOME
Yale goes on the road and beats UConn

Going to be a crazy season in college hoops as the talent disparity seems to be closing every year.

[TruePoint]

Preston told me he was moving to Boston.
I wonder if that changed?
Bad time to be selling a house. Houses here are mostly selling
far below purchase price.

I don't know about Rhode Island but in Boston the market is great for sellers. Almost no inventory and houses aren on the market for more than a day or two. We bought our house last summer - made an offer above asking while we were seeing it and we were the first ones to see it. Our realtor told us we could sell it today and clear 50k on it (a year later). The market may never get back to 2006 levels, so I guess it depends when you bought in, but the real estate market is generally pretty good right now.

[rodfromcranston]

Boston and NYC housing markets, in no way reflect the overall
housing market, which is far from robust.
In suburbia, houses sell after being on the market for months and only after price reductions.
The guy across the street has his house in for 120K less than he bought it for in
2007. It's still on the market.
There are endless numbers of homeowners with upside down equity. If they sell, they have to pay
the bank the difference.
Not quite so rosey a picture in real estate.