Big East - Basketball Only Schools Leaving

Rhody74 · Unread post by **Rhody74** » 11 years ago

Thorr is about to talk about conference realignment on http://www.iheart.com/live/3223/?autoplay=true

Brutus · Unread post by **Brutus** » 11 years ago

rodfromcranston wrote:VCU's arena is about the same size as The Ryan Center, and was built
in 1999.
Hinkle Fieldhouse at Butler, must've had the same guys renovate that place that did Keaney Gym.
Their capacity went from 15,000 to 10,000!
Fairfield? Why not Bryant? Ugh!

Brutus-"let's start with the fact that their new President was hired from his VP position at Villanova"
Gee, Dave Dooley was hired from Montana, maybe that means we're going to the Big Sky?
Eddy Eddy was from Penn State. Gee, we should have joined the Big 10. Oh wait, they raided the A-10 for PSU, while Eddy Eddy was here.
You're just here to go, "nya! nya! nya!" I hear that from my 4 year old and 2 year old granddaughters.

Rod in all seriousness some here don't see why Butler would join the BE7, I'm just giving you ONE reason why, along with the opportunity to make more money. Now if you don't want to believe me that's your perogative.

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 11 years ago

You may be right, but the reason you gave here is weak.

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 11 years ago

Brutus wrote:
TruePoint wrote:No Brutus, I didn't ban you. First of all. I sent you to timeout because you weren't participating in the discussion. I never said you were wrong, I said you presenting rumor as fact. As it happened, those rumors turned out to be on point. So kudos on that, but you didn't get sent to timeout for having a different opinion, you got sent to timeout for repeating yourself over and over again and not being responsive in the discussion.

You're welcome to participate here as someone with an outside perspective, but if you troll you go to timeout.
No you're wrong TP, YOU thought I was spewing rumors, when in reality, I was giving you facts from insiders. You have no idea who I am or who I know so how do you know if I was giving you rumors or facts?

BTW, I was told again last night that XU, Dayton, Butler and SLU are all on board if/when they are asked. Once again that's a fact that I know not rumor.

I have inside sources that tell me that the sun will come up tomorrow and that taxes are going to be due mid April. Maybe you do have sources, but you don't claim that. You pointed me towards articles I was aware of to evidence that a rumor was a fact. I think everyone here would have predicted that this would eventually happen. If you go read my posts, you will see that I certainly thought so. I was trying to point out that there was conflicting information out there.

Brutus · Unread post by **Brutus** » 11 years ago

TruePoint wrote:
Brutus wrote:
TruePoint wrote:No Brutus, I didn't ban you. First of all. I sent you to timeout because you weren't participating in the discussion. I never said you were wrong, I said you presenting rumor as fact. As it happened, those rumors turned out to be on point. So kudos on that, but you didn't get sent to timeout for having a different opinion, you got sent to timeout for repeating yourself over and over again and not being responsive in the discussion.

You're welcome to participate here as someone with an outside perspective, but if you troll you go to timeout.
No you're wrong TP, YOU thought I was spewing rumors, when in reality, I was giving you facts from insiders. You have no idea who I am or who I know so how do you know if I was giving you rumors or facts?

BTW, I was told again last night that XU, Dayton, Butler and SLU are all on board if/when they are asked. Once again that's a fact that I know not rumor.
I have inside sources that tell me that the sun will come up tomorrow and that taxes are going to be due mid April. Maybe you do have sources, but you don't claim that. You pointed me towards articles I was aware of to evidence that a rumor was a fact. I think everyone here would have predicted that this would eventually happen. If you go read my posts, you will see that I certainly thought so. I was trying to point out that there was conflicting information out there.

I'm sorry TP, but I've never seen a timeout or banning from any moderator on any forum unless it was for vulgar language, causing trouble, putting down other posters or institutions or showing x-rated content. I have done none of that. But it's your forum so although I may not agree with everything you do, I respect your decisions.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 11 years ago

The latest I've heard is X, Dayton, and StL would go. No mention of Butler.

That would put the A10 at 11 teams. Wouldn't be a whole lot of programs out there left to add, that would be anywhere near the quality of the 3 lost.

The 11 left wouldn't be much better than the current CAA. As long as Butler and VCU stay, I think the A10 will end up OK.

The question is: would they WANT to stay if this all happens?

Worst case: if Butler goes and Creighton is added, that's a heck of a 12 team conference.

Then we would be neck and neck with the CAA for the distant 2nd best mid major BB conference. Not good. 2 bid league. Much tougher to recruit. A couple years at the top of this conference, then does Hurley leave to go to the new conference?

section(105) · Unread post by **section(105)** » 11 years ago

we/ll see where this all shakes out. I, as I/ve stated on here before, the changing game board of these .edu/s will have already evaluated the options to be re-active/ pro-active in this conference dance in terms thier educational goals, missions, budget/funding bases etc. and other factors that fit with URI. As I have heard thru my own ears in a couple of recent settings, both the URI President and AD have talked about aspiring/being a national/championship level program for Rhody hoops. Whether or not this reflects back to having a desire and be a member of a larger hoops focused conference is an unknown. I would like to think the URI has already made its best evaluation of the quickly changing college football and basketball landscape and will act accordingly.

RF1 · Unread post by **RF1** » 11 years ago

If the A-10 only loses 1-2 teams, I think it can survive relatively intact with URI remaining. It could then maybe add 1-2 teams (such as GMU). If it however loses 4-5 teams, all bets are off. I don't like what would be left and don't think it would be good for URI to remain in the league with all the small Catholics given all the attractive high profile schools bolted. A big raid on the A-10 is the doomsday scenario for Rhody.

peeps4life · Unread post by **peeps4life** » 11 years ago

you can thank those scumbags from the acc for all of this.

section(105) · Unread post by **section(105)** » 11 years ago

I had offered on here, that the remaining BE hoops focused group could raid the the current A-10 and pluck the more attractive teams into a conference, and that conferecne make-up could not include URI hoops. If that comes to be, disapointed yes. Reality yes.

Kingston · Unread post by **Kingston** » 11 years ago

I'll try to take the glass is half full approach. The c7 takes x, Dayton and slu. I see the only big loss as Xavier. HEll Baron could beat Dayton, I know they have a great arena and fan base but Hardly a basketball power. They are going to leave the A10 to be a bottom feeder in a new conference. Good luck
SLU again Baron could beat them too. With Marjis gone they to will be a bottom feeder.
Lets add GMU and maybe a few stronger schools from the horizon league. I hopefully could see us becoming the new Xavier of this conference. The Hurleys have. Stated that this is their goal so maybe were just getting them out the way. If we keep VCU and Butler we are in the same shape. As we were two years ago the A10 is at best a four bid league And hopefully we are one of the. I think the Hurleys have what it takes to make us the new Xavier.

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 11 years ago

Rambone, the reason why you are hearing 10 rather than 12 is because it makes scheduling so much easier. If you want to have a balanced schedule - each team has a home-and-home - then the difference between 10 and 12 is the difference between 18 and 22 conference games. Eighteen gives you a good OOC slate; 22 is really restrictive. Maybe they will view the additional markets as more important than scheduling and go bigger, but that is why you're hearing 10 a lot.

As far as replacing teams that go, it shouldn't be looked at as a straight replacement. We would need to be proactive and make sure the conference is structured in an optimal way. Meaning: the deadwood at the bottom must be cut loose, and then we would need to go out and add the best programs we can to get to 10 (I think that is the best number for us, too - the shwag at the bottom his not helping anything and just drags down the other teams' RPIs).

So, hypothetically, we'd be out Charlotte, Temple, Xavier, Dayton and St. Louis to the New Medium East. Then you drop Fordham and you're at 10. I think you can get all the other members behind dumping them. The tougher question becomes do you go for the total makeover and try to bump out teams with resource issues (LaSalle, Duquesne and Bonnies come to mind) and replace them with some combination of Mason, Cleveland State, Wright State, Wichita State and Bradley to get back to ten? Do you stick with the 10 you have (which would really isolate Butler geographically if they don't go to the Medium East)? Do you keep everyone and still try to add those other five to stay at 16 (probably the thing the TV people would want the most)? And what is going to happen with UMass and the football thing?

I think Kingston has the right attitude. I tend to side with him.

section(105) · Unread post by **section(105)** » 11 years ago

Think Big We do.............In this case I, unfortunately, do not think the current existing URI administration with needed support of the purse strings to the disfunctional legislature is capable of being pro-active and position URI hoops in the national picture that we all want. No??

RF1 · Unread post by **RF1** » 11 years ago

peeps4life wrote:you can thank those scumbags from the acc for all of this.

Actually we have Dave Gavitt to thank for this mess in college athletics. He was way ahead of the Pac-12, BIG Ten, ACC in collecting teams in order to maximize tv revenues. Old associations and rivalries didn't matter. It was all about chasing the almighty dollar. The irony is that his legacy has now destroyed his baby (the Big East).

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 11 years ago

I don't think the administration will have any control over what happens with realignment.

Unfortunately, the BE7 will.

If they don't take us, which looks very likely, we're not going anywhere.

If by some very small chance they offer us a place in that conference, we HAVE to take it.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 11 years ago

RF1, sadly it looks like it's deja vu all over again, though.

A new BE will form, and we'll be left out. Again.

What happens to what's left, will determine our long term fate.

We might not be in a position in the future, to compete for any championships.

I do know this: we cannot have a league with too many bad programs. It's looking like the A10 is going to end up like the CAA. Screwed.

Seawrightspostgame · Unread post by **Seawrightspostgame** » 11 years ago

Hopefully things workout for us....

In other news.... I am glad Brutus was put in TO

At least URI people can control that!

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 11 years ago

rambone 78 wrote:
A new BE will form, and we'll be left out. Again.

I think, for the sake of accuracy, we need to refer to this new league as the "Medium East" and not the "New Big East." It will be the best non-BCS league when its formed, but it will be a meager shadow of its former self.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 11 years ago

True, the overall quality of play won't be much better than the top half of the A10, but the new ME will have major advantages over the A10, including more and better TV coverage, and of course money.

RIFan · Unread post by **RIFan** » 11 years ago

what did Thorr say on the radio?

hrstrat57 · Unread post by **hrstrat57** » 11 years ago

A10 should tell the 7 to pound it and invite Cinci, Uconn and USF.

Should do it now.

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 11 years ago

hrstrat57 wrote:A10 should tell the 7 to pound it and invite Cinci, Uconn and USF.

Should do it now.

You cannot count on football-playing schools in this climate. If UConn needs a place to play, I'd welcome them, but you cannot plan your future around them because they could leave at any second.

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 11 years ago

Most positive thing I've read this week,

"Xavier athletic director Mike Bobinski told ESPN.com that he's not sure how this will all play out but "we're supportive of efforts to strengthen the (Atlantic 10) membership," when asked what the Musketeers would do if the seven departing Catholic schools sought Xavier's membership. "

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 11 years ago

I agree its encouraging, Rod. He certainly could have said worse. On the other hand, if he's going to negotiate he has to protect his leverage. I'm still not buying anything anyone says until this whole situation is settled. I think BAR had the best point about this earlier: the A10 has some leverage through Xavier. If Xavier thinks it would be best served by merging the C7 into its conference rather than the other way around, that could change the course of how this plays out. If they think they can get the same TV money by bringing the C7 into the A10 as they could get by leaving the A10 to join the C7, then why wouldn't they want to be the elder statesman in the new conference rather than the new kid?

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 11 years ago

Also, they are the top program in the A-10. and have been for a long time.
They know the league, and they know they can make money going to the NCAAs almost every year.
They have no trouble selling out Cintas.
Plus, the great unknown is, what kind of TV money is a depleated Big East (or whatever the name is)
going to realize? No Syracuse, no Pitt, no Louisville, no UConn. Do they think some network is going to pay big money for Depaul, Seton Hall and PC, to be on TV? Don't they realize it was the glamor teams that brought in the contracts, along with footbal?
If it comes down to money, who's to say this new league is such a cash cow?
Better the devil you know.....

peeps4life · Unread post by **peeps4life** » 11 years ago

wow you guys are bitter with reality

reef · Unread post by **reef** » 11 years ago

cant wait til all this is over

Rhody72 · Unread post by **Rhody72** » 11 years ago

Understand that URI is a weak A10 program without strong leadership and will not benefit from realignment. Look at the State of our two major sports. Our athletic leadership has cultivated few allies to watch our back. No better conference will want us.

It would be too easy to blame JB, the crisis with ALL URI sports team is caused by lack of institutional support. Don't blame the State for this, URI's budget has been growing in leaps and bounds annually with no athletic mandate for improvement other than running clean programs. This fish has rotted from the head and is part of the Bob Carothers legacy.

I have confidence in Dooley, but it takes time to turn an aircraft carrier 180 degrees and then actually get momentum in a positive direction. It's like our economy - a new President can't take an economy that is bleeding 800K jobs per month to actually adding net job without going through a lengthy period of losing fewer net jobs per month. URI basketball is suffering such a fate this season even with very good new coaches. The flip-flop in football conferences set a dismal program back 4 years. I'm sure you have heard the ads for UMass On-line - how long will it take to scale this program to provide a superior undergraduate education at a lower cost than URI? Dooley sees this coming and is trying to make research URI's cash cow as tuition dollars decrease. Is Thor waiting for the phone to ring or is he making the calls and contacts needed to build a better future for URI athletics?

RF1 · Unread post by **RF1** » 11 years ago

peeps4life wrote:wow you guys are bitter with reality

This from the person calling others SCUMBAGS (see below).

peeps4life wrote:you can thank those scumbags from the acc for all of this.

Brutus · Unread post by **Brutus** » 11 years ago

Just remember Rod, money talks. Let's see what X does when they find out that by joining the BE7 they can receive at least $1.5 mil per year compared to $350,000 in the A10 from TV money.

BFC · Unread post by **BFC** » 11 years ago

Brutus wrote:Just remember Rod, money talks. Let's see what X does when they find out that by joining the BE7 they can receive at least $1.5 mil per year compared to $350,000 in the A10 from TV money.

No matter what number "journalists" with agendas pull out of the air, noone knows at this point how much they can really get in a TV contract. Xavier is eventually going, the question is whether they go on their terms or the Big East 7's terms.

Ramulous · Unread post by **Ramulous** » 11 years ago

If I am football BE I am on the phone with the C7 and offering them a bigger slice of the football television and bowl revenue in an effort to keep the conference intact.....jump from 1.5 million to 4 million.....the football schools have no basketball cache without the C7 and would further diminish the tv revenues currently estimated to come to them.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 11 years ago

Reading between the lines, I think what Bobinski said was that the A10 has to continue to be proactive in looking for new members that strengthen the league. Even if that means dumping the bottom programs.

If the A10 can get stronger and better, than maybe X wouldn't leave after all.

Unread post by **SGreenwell** » 11 years ago

Brutus wrote:Just remember Rod, money talks. Let's see what X does when they find out that by joining the BE7 they can receive at least $1.5 mil per year compared to $350,000 in the A10 from TV money.

I think that $1.5M number is questionable at best right now though, and I think the leverage of the Catholic 7 also lessens as time goes on, unless they can get some firm commitments from other programs to join up. Also, who knows what kind of mess will unfold in the courts - who gets possession of the name, what do they do about the existing TV contracts, etc.

Brutus · Unread post by **Brutus** » 11 years ago

SGreenwell wrote:
Brutus wrote:Just remember Rod, money talks. Let's see what X does when they find out that by joining the BE7 they can receive at least $1.5 mil per year compared to $350,000 in the A10 from TV money.
I think that $1.5M number is questionable at best right now though, and I think the leverage of the Catholic 7 also lessens as time goes on, unless they can get some firm commitments from other programs to join up. Also, who knows what kind of mess will unfold in the courts - who gets possession of the name, what do they do about the existing TV contracts, etc.

I'm hearing the money could end up to be more than $1.5 mil per year.

Unread post by **SGreenwell** » 11 years ago

Brutus wrote:
SGreenwell wrote:
Brutus wrote:Just remember Rod, money talks. Let's see what X does when they find out that by joining the BE7 they can receive at least $1.5 mil per year compared to $350,000 in the A10 from TV money.
I think that $1.5M number is questionable at best right now though, and I think the leverage of the Catholic 7 also lessens as time goes on, unless they can get some firm commitments from other programs to join up. Also, who knows what kind of mess will unfold in the courts - who gets possession of the name, what do they do about the existing TV contracts, etc.

I'm hearing the money could end up to be more than $1.5 mil per year.

I'm hearing birds. They live outside of my house. Apparently, you have more interesting neighbors than I do.

Billyboy78 · Unread post by **Billyboy78** » 11 years ago

Best scenario would be take all of the 7 into the A10 except PC...screw them.

Brutus · Unread post by **Brutus** » 11 years ago

Mr. Greenwell you don't know who I am or how close to the situation my sources are. All I will say is that everything I said the other day is starting to come to fruition, so therefore, I seem like I know what I'm talking about.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 11 years ago

The money could be more, could be less......who knows. Anybody who thinks they know this stuff now is making it all up.

Anyway, it looks like the BE7 is going to have to wait 27 months to form their own league. A lot can change in that time. From what we've seen from the A10, they aren't going to just sit back and get picked apart when the time comes.

Adding and subtracting programs, TV money, it's all on the table. I know the A10 just signed a new TV deal, but nowadays what does that mean? It can be changed if necessary, and it may need to be changed.

section(105) · Unread post by **section(105)** » 11 years ago

Why would the assumed C7 want URI? What exactly are the things URI would bring to their table?

Rhode_Island_Red · Unread post by **Rhode_Island_Red** » 11 years ago

Even if -- and "if" is the biggest two-letter word in the dictionary -- the Sacred Seven get $1.5 million a year in television, that will only last as long as it takes for the BCS cartel to regain control of all the television time.

Let's assume the scenario where four mega-conferences are left standing. Sixty-four schools would play a minimum of 32 games a week, or almost five games a day. (That's assuming they only play against each other. Non-conference games will add dramatically to their inventory, especially since nobody plays double-round-robin anymore.) The networks also have contracts to televise pro sports, and don't forget that the college football regular season now overlaps college basketball season by almost a full month. How many networks are there? How splintered can the television audience get before a game can't attract enough eyeballs to attract advertisers?

seanmc94 · Unread post by **seanmc94** » 11 years ago

BB,

The Catholic schools are raiding your conference; not the other way around.

BFC · Unread post by **BFC** » 11 years ago

The $1.5 million source could be the pope, who cares? It's still an estimate, the league isn't formed, negotiations haven't happened, ESPN hasn't had its say.

urirx · Unread post by **urirx** » 11 years ago

Georgetown and xavier hold all the cards in this poker game.

gorhody89 · Unread post by **gorhody89** » 11 years ago

Cincinnati enquire reporting that Xavier and butler have agreed to join big east schools

Billyboy78 · Unread post by **Billyboy78** » 11 years ago

http://www.wjla.com/articles/2012/12/bi ... 83116.html

Billyboy78 · Unread post by **Billyboy78** » 11 years ago

I'm getting sick to my stomach. The A10 and URI were supposed to be on the rise with a great future. I knew it was too good to be true.

RIFan · Unread post by **RIFan** » 11 years ago

I guess this is the Big Finish...(rim shot please)

section(105) · Unread post by **section(105)** » 11 years ago

so then we/ll end up in a A-10ish kinda conference, with the trickle down effect being that the A-10 loss of teams to the new BE/C7 will result an effort to replace them with............

RIFan · Unread post by **RIFan** » 11 years ago

The (historical) bottom 2-4 teams in the A-10 has always been a problem from a basketball strength perspective...I assume they have been kept on (Fordham) soley for TV markets and TV deals. This may now be the reason we are not able to merge and or keep our best teams. The C7 do not have that dead weight (well, not as dead as ours) and they have the TV markets where our dead weight reside.