A10 Outlook for 2023-24

[Jersey77]

What happened at UMass? I’m pretty sure I understand the reasons why we are picked so low, but did something crazy happen at UMass? Similar to us, they made a splash hire before last season and it didn’t immediately translate - I think some A10 observers are underestimating our potential based on that, but curious if it’s the same phenomenon at UMass or if something else happened. It seemed like Martin was bringing in a lot of players people liked when he arrived.

I have been wondering about him and UMass as well, TP.

He came in with a splash but - from my seat - he has been quiet lately. I wonder if the honeymoon is quickly wearing off for him and he won’t be there beyond this season.

I understand he has had health issues. Hopefully, it isn’t something health related.

Other than that, like us, there are unknowns for their team from the perspective of outsiders, perhaps? And that skews expectations?

They were overhyped last season.
They lost quite a few players in the portal this off-season.
Fernandes (Rutgers), Luis (St.Johns), Gapare (Georgia Tech), Leveque (Texas A&M). Weeks (Rider), Dominguez (Ark. State)

They have a decent starting 5: (PG)Thompson, (G)Diggins, (F)Cross, (PF)Hankins-Sanford, (C)Cohen.
But no experienced depth, brought in 7 freshmen recruits.
Hopefully we should finish ahead of them this season.

[PeterRamTime]

Frank Martin has a pretty unusual resume.

At Kansas State his team's were great every year, only one season where they missed the tournament, but they were still 9-7 in the Big 12 and in the NIT.

Other than one NIT and the out of nowhere Final Four run he was mediocre to terrible. It is extremely bizarre that he couldn't parlay that Final Four run into ANY success. How do you build a Final Four caliber team, make it there and then just not be able to even get back to the NIT in five seasons?

I'm sure he can get some talent to UMass, but making the dance at UMass in the A-10 is just about as hard as doing it USCjr. I have doubts that he's got the x's and o's to get it done at UMass.

[TruePoint]

Honestly it’s not shocking to me that his act would wear thin with players - I said as much when they hired him and I’ve never been a fan of his or his style. Still, one year is extraordinarily fast for anyone’s act to wear thin to the point that a “splash hire” who is getting paid quite handsomely is going to finish dead last in a mediocre 15 team conference in which some of the schools have basketball budgets that would be modest for women’s volleyball at big schools. If we finish 10th this year I will be extremely disappointed, for people to be picking UMass 15th things must be going absolutely sideways out there. Their fans must be beside themselves.

[SGreenwell]

I think Martin was going for a quick retool via the portal, and got nothing to show for it. Unlike Miller though, he hadn't been sitting out for a year, so I find his first year more worrisome. UMass had some OK talent on the roster, more than Rhody, but were ultimately more disappointing as a result. You can also see tactical errors in his playing time decisions (playing his son so much, less minutes for Dominiguez, etc.), which isn't great.

[ramster]

What happened at UMass? I’m pretty sure I understand the reasons why we are picked so low, but did something crazy happen at UMass? Similar to us, they made a splash hire before last season and it didn’t immediately translate - I think some A10 observers are underestimating our potential based on that, but curious if it’s the same phenomenon at UMass or if something else happened. It seemed like Martin was bringing in a lot of players people liked when he arrived.

I have been wondering about him and UMass as well, TP.

He came in with a splash but - from my seat - he has been quiet lately. I wonder if the honeymoon is quickly wearing off for him and he won’t be there beyond this season.

I understand he has had health issues. Hopefully, it isn’t something health related.

Other than that, like us, there are unknowns for their team from the perspective of outsiders, perhaps? And that skews expectations?

They were overhyped last season.
They lost quite a few players in the portal this off-season.
Fernandes (Rutgers), Luis (St.Johns), Gapare (Georgia Tech), Leveque (Texas A&M). Weeks (Rider), Dominguez (Ark. State)

They have a decent starting 5: (PG)Thompson, (G)Diggins, (F)Cross, (PF)Hankins-Sanford, (C)Cohen.
But no experienced depth, brought in 7 freshmen recruits.
Hopefully we should finish ahead of them this season.

Overhyped seems a bit of a stretch.
UMASS lost preseason 2nd Team PG Noah Fernandes early in the season playing only 11 games. He had a baby while he was out too. They pretty much knew he was going portal early on. Portal to P5 Rutgers

URI lost preseason 3rd team Freeman

UMASS was picked by A10 Coaches 8th, finished 13th
URI was picked 9th, finished 14th

UMASS finished 15-16, 6-12 conference
URI finished 9-22, 5-13 conference

UMASS beat URI both games out scoring Rhody by 34 points
UMASS won 75-65 at UMASS
UMASS won 69-45 at URI. It was as ugly as the score sounds

In the A10 Tournament both lost their 1st round games getting badly beaten:

UMASS lost 71-38 to Richmond
URI lost 73-56 to LaSalle

Martin and Miller in 1st year in A10 both make about $1.8 million per year

Both veteran HC's with big 2nd years upcoming

UMASS lost All Rookie star RJ Luis to the Portal. He 1st entered the Portal and was thought to be leaving for Miami then returned to UMASS for a reported $100,000, only to reneg and again go portal and went to Pitino at St Johns.

[Jersey77]

I have been wondering about him and UMass as well, TP.

He came in with a splash but - from my seat - he has been quiet lately. I wonder if the honeymoon is quickly wearing off for him and he won’t be there beyond this season.

I understand he has had health issues. Hopefully, it isn’t something health related.

Other than that, like us, there are unknowns for their team from the perspective of outsiders, perhaps? And that skews expectations?

They were overhyped last season.
They lost quite a few players in the portal this off-season.
Fernandes (Rutgers), Luis (St.Johns), Gapare (Georgia Tech), Leveque (Texas A&M). Weeks (Rider), Dominguez (Ark. State)

They have a decent starting 5: (PG)Thompson, (G)Diggins, (F)Cross, (PF)Hankins-Sanford, (C)Cohen.
But no experienced depth, brought in 7 freshmen recruits.
Hopefully we should finish ahead of them this season.

Overhyped seems a bit of a stretch.
UMASS lost preseason 2nd Team PG Noah Fernandes early in the season playing only 11 games. He had a baby while he was out too. They pretty much knew he was going portal early on. Portal to P5 Rutgers

URI lost preseason 3rd team Freeman

UMASS was picked by A10 Coaches 8th, finished 13th
URI was picked 9th, finished 14th

UMASS finished 15-16, 6-12 conference
URI finished 9-22, 5-13 conference

UMASS beat URI both games out scoring Rhody by 34 points
UMASS won 75-65 at UMASS
UMASS won 69-45 at URI. It was as ugly as the score sounds

In the A10 Tournament both lost their 1st round games getting badly beaten:

UMASS lost 71-38 to Richmond
URI lost 73-56 to LaSalle

Martin and Miller in 1st year in A10 both make about $1.8 million per year

Both veteran HC's with big 2nd years upcoming

UMASS lost All Rookie star RJ Luis to the Portal. He 1st entered the Portal and was thought to be leaving for Miami then returned to UMASS for a reported $100,000, only to reneg and again go portal and went to Pitino at St Johns.

Yeah, maybe a little.
I think Busting Brackets had them picked to finish 6th.
Also, I think that early 6-game win streak, including winning the 3-game Myrtle Beach Invitational Championship, some thought they would be much better than they were.

Biggest disappointment was losing to them at the RC by 24 pts and they were without Fernandes and Cross.

Curious to see the A10 coaches predictions for 23-24.

[ramster]

They were overhyped last season.
They lost quite a few players in the portal this off-season.
Fernandes (Rutgers), Luis (St.Johns), Gapare (Georgia Tech), Leveque (Texas A&M). Weeks (Rider), Dominguez (Ark. State)

They have a decent starting 5: (PG)Thompson, (G)Diggins, (F)Cross, (PF)Hankins-Sanford, (C)Cohen.
But no experienced depth, brought in 7 freshmen recruits.
Hopefully we should finish ahead of them this season.

Overhyped seems a bit of a stretch.
UMASS lost preseason 2nd Team PG Noah Fernandes early in the season playing only 11 games. He had a baby while he was out too. They pretty much knew he was going portal early on. Portal to P5 Rutgers

URI lost preseason 3rd team Freeman

UMASS was picked by A10 Coaches 8th, finished 13th
URI was picked 9th, finished 14th

UMASS finished 15-16, 6-12 conference
URI finished 9-22, 5-13 conference

UMASS beat URI both games out scoring Rhody by 34 points
UMASS won 75-65 at UMASS
UMASS won 69-45 at URI. It was as ugly as the score sounds

In the A10 Tournament both lost their 1st round games getting badly beaten:

UMASS lost 71-38 to Richmond
URI lost 73-56 to LaSalle

Martin and Miller in 1st year in A10 both make about $1.8 million per year

Both veteran HC's with big 2nd years upcoming

UMASS lost All Rookie star RJ Luis to the Portal. He 1st entered the Portal and was thought to be leaving for Miami then returned to UMASS for a reported $100,000, only to reneg and again go portal and went to Pitino at St Johns.

Yeah, maybe a little.
I think Busting Brackets had them picked to finish 6th.
Also, I think that early 6-game win streak, including winning the 3-game Myrtle Beach Invitational Championship, some thought they would be much better than they were.

Biggest disappointment was losing to them at the RC by 24 pts and they were without Fernandes and Cross.

Curious to see the A10 coaches predictions for 23-24.

Winning that Myrtle Beach Invitational was big for UMASS and the A10 and Noah Fernandes was the MVP of that 8 Team Tournament
Fernandes only played 11 games and went out for the rest of the year with a calf injury.
Fernandes was UMASS high scorer and was hitting 45% 3 pointers and led the team with 4+ assists per game.
Biggest reason they underachieved preseason #8 A10 HC's Predictions. Team was never the same.

[PeterRamTime]

Overhyped seems a bit of a stretch.
UMASS lost preseason 2nd Team PG Noah Fernandes early in the season playing only 11 games. He had a baby while he was out too. They pretty much knew he was going portal early on. Portal to P5 Rutgers

URI lost preseason 3rd team Freeman

UMASS was picked by A10 Coaches 8th, finished 13th
URI was picked 9th, finished 14th

UMASS finished 15-16, 6-12 conference
URI finished 9-22, 5-13 conference

UMASS beat URI both games out scoring Rhody by 34 points
UMASS won 75-65 at UMASS
UMASS won 69-45 at URI. It was as ugly as the score sounds

In the A10 Tournament both lost their 1st round games getting badly beaten:

UMASS lost 71-38 to Richmond
URI lost 73-56 to LaSalle

Martin and Miller in 1st year in A10 both make about $1.8 million per year

Both veteran HC's with big 2nd years upcoming

UMASS lost All Rookie star RJ Luis to the Portal. He 1st entered the Portal and was thought to be leaving for Miami then returned to UMASS for a reported $100,000, only to reneg and again go portal and went to Pitino at St Johns.

Yeah, maybe a little.
I think Busting Brackets had them picked to finish 6th.
Also, I think that early 6-game win streak, including winning the 3-game Myrtle Beach Invitational Championship, some thought they would be much better than they were.

Biggest disappointment was losing to them at the RC by 24 pts and they were without Fernandes and Cross.

Curious to see the A10 coaches predictions for 23-24.

Winning that Myrtle Beach Invitational was big for UMASS and the A10 and Noah Fernandes was the MVP of that 8 Team Tournament
Fernandes only played 11 games and went out for the rest of the year with a calf injury.
Fernandes was UMASS high scorer and was hitting 45% 3 pointers and led the team with 4+ assists per game.
Biggest reason they underachieved preseason #8 A10 HC's Predictions. Team was never the same.

UMass most certainly has a much different season if Fernandes doesn't get hurt.

[ramster]

Yeah, maybe a little.
I think Busting Brackets had them picked to finish 6th.
Also, I think that early 6-game win streak, including winning the 3-game Myrtle Beach Invitational Championship, some thought they would be much better than they were.

Biggest disappointment was losing to them at the RC by 24 pts and they were without Fernandes and Cross.

Curious to see the A10 coaches predictions for 23-24.

Winning that Myrtle Beach Invitational was big for UMASS and the A10 and Noah Fernandes was the MVP of that 8 Team Tournament
Fernandes only played 11 games and went out for the rest of the year with a calf injury.
Fernandes was UMASS high scorer and was hitting 45% 3 pointers and led the team with 4+ assists per game.
Biggest reason they underachieved preseason #8 A10 HC's Predictions. Team was never the same.

UMass most certainly has a much different season if Fernandes doesn't get hurt.

Yep
And Fernandes goes to Rutgers where he will be the PG
Rutgers #41 in 144 Madness and #43 in Rothstein Top 45

43. Rutgers
Projected Starting 5:
G Derek Simpson
G Noah Fernandes
F Mawot Mag
F Aundre Hyatt
C Cliff Omoruyi
Projected Bench: Antwone Woolfolk, Antonio Chol, Gavin Griffiths, Jamichael Davis, Emmanuel Ogbole
Key Newcomers: Gavin Griffiths, Jamichael Davis, Noah Fernandes (UMass), Emmanuel Ogbole (JUCO)
Key Losses: Caleb McConnell, Cam Spencer, Paul Mulcahy

Rutgers HC has his program on the move.......
Class of '23 Gaven Griffith ranked #50 committed

Class of '24 already got commitments from #3 and #87 espn.

[steveystuds06]

UMass had a much better roster than we did. Obviously, that's on Archie, but they had plenty of talent and completely underachieved, even without Fernandez. According to many of the annoying UMass fans on Twitter and even some of the UMass fans on this message board, RJ Luis was a stud. Gapare was supposed to be the next big thing. Matt Cross was a huge get. Then you had strong role players like Weeks, Dominguez, Diggins, Kante. That team is better than 13th in a very weak A10.

They sucked, which makes me very happy. Yes, I know we did as well

[Obadiah]

Thanks, ramster for the info. Interesting times for Rutgers. Also, the Fernandes move from UMass just points out that the number of players defecting from the A-10 to higher programs was significantly higher than other conference.

[Obadiah]

An assessment of URI prospects from the a10Talk forum.

https://www.a10talk.com/2023-24-atlanti ... de-island/

[Rhodymob05]

That review has Rhody aiming for another tough season. I think there’s a chance we surprise them.

[luke]

It amazes me how all these prognosticators think they know so much about this team and its prospects . Imo nobody really has any idea what this
team will look like this season , and have no idea about the talent level or intangibles of many of the new players . I consider myself in that boat as well .
there just isn't enough history on most of the players nor any information about the team chemistry that may already exist or not exist . I wouldn't bet
that URI won't finish last or that URI won't finish top four because in my mind there isn't enough information publicly available upon which to make
a truly educated guess . So I will sit here completely in the dark until I've seen the team compete in some real action . Until that time I will view all
of the predictions with a heavy dose of skepticism , and with optimism.

[SGreenwell]

That review has Rhody aiming for another tough season. I think there’s a chance we surprise them.

It's not especially well-written and seems like a very surface-level analysis to me. I don't follow the league well enough as a whole to really guess where we'll finish, but I think we'll be more toward the middle just from the process of churning the roster in the way we did.

[section(105)]

Are we having the Annual Prediction Contest? I recall Obie stepping away after many years of great work?

[reef]

Are we having the Annual Prediction Contest? I recall Obie stepping away after many years of great work?

I’m hoping so , my absolute favorite internet contest !!

[bigappleram]

Not A10 related but I’m curious what the story will be here.

[bigappleram]

The A10 talk writers are almost all kids and anything they say should be taken with huge grain of salt.

[steveystuds06]

Are we having the Annual Prediction Contest? I recall Obie stepping away after many years of great work?

I’m hoping so , my absolute favorite internet contest !!

I thought he said he wasn't doing it this year a few times. But I could be wrong.

[SGreenwell]

There will be a prediction game, yes. I believe Obie said that last year would be the last time for him, so we'll (referring to myself, ATP and Truepoint) handle the posting and tabulation and what not.

[Obadiah]

Sadly I will no longer be running the prediction contest, but it looks like it will be in good hands going forward. Best to all on this forum.

[section(105)]

Sadly I will no longer be running the prediction contest, but it looks like it will be in good hands going forward. Best to all on this forum.

Thank you for the past contests. You certainly set a very high bar! Thank you.

[Rambler_63]

Hey Everyone, this is my first post on Keaney Blue. I run the Loyola fan message board, and I wish I had as many posts about Loyola Basketball this summer as you've had on this thread...

Look, I understand Loyola was an embarrassment in men's basketball last year. It was really bad. We're concerned and embarrassed by our showing last season. I would be alarmed, too, if I were a long-time A-10 fan, except for these facts:

1. It was obvious that Loyola was tooled for another type of basketball. The MVC plays more deliberately, and doesn't have the height, length, or athleticism of the A-10. We had a rough adjustment to the MVC also, but we won the CBI and 24 games (despite an injury to our best player for half of conference play) in our 2nd year.
2. The bottom four teams in last year's A-10 were coached by veteran coaches with winning NCAA Tournament experience, who all happened to be coaching new teams their first year in the A-10: LaSalle, UMass, URI and Loyola finished last in the league. Feels weird for you guys to be ragging on Loyola when we're the ONLY team that had ZERO players AND ZERO coaches with A-10 experience, and you were below us in KenPom with a highly-experienced A10 coach and many experienced A-10 players.
3. Despite the men's and women's basketball face-plants, most of our other teams did well, and we won the volleyball, men's & women's cross country titles, and went to the conference tournament final in men's soccer.
4. Beyond just being a Midwest stop for St. Louis and Dayton to feel less isolated, we are part of the third largest media market in the country, and it's easy to travel in and out of Chicago. That fact proved to be a highly valuable asset for the MVC, and it's certainly a plus for the A10.
5. It's not like we're a flash in the pan: We have a National Championship from the 1960s, an NIT runner-up finish in the 1930s and 1940s, an undefeated season in the 1920s, and a Hall of Fame Coach who died in 1942. We were the first major college team to put five African-American players on the court at the same time. And we've had one Final Four and four Sweet 16s since the National Championship that forever changed how African-American players were recruited.

So that's just my take. A lot of pot-shots were kinda fair, the ones listed above bothered me a little. Maybe we're the ones who should be concerned about the league we joined if all these doomsayers are right.

[Obadiah]

Hey Everyone, this is my first post on Keaney Blue. I run the Loyola fan message board, and I wish I had as many posts about Loyola Basketball this summer as you've had on this thread...

Look, I understand Loyola was an embarrassment in men's basketball last year. It was really bad. We're concerned and embarrassed by our showing last season. I would be alarmed, too, if I were a long-time A-10 fan, except for these facts:

1. It was obvious that Loyola was tooled for another type of basketball. The MVC plays more deliberately, and doesn't have the height, length, or athleticism of the A-10. We had a rough adjustment to the MVC also, but we won the CBI and 24 games (despite an injury to our best player for half of conference play) in our 2nd year.
2. The bottom four teams in last year's A-10 were coached by veteran coaches with winning NCAA Tournament experience, who all happened to be coaching new teams their first year in the A-10: LaSalle, UMass, URI and Loyola finished last in the league. Feels weird for you guys to be ragging on Loyola when we're the ONLY team that had ZERO players AND ZERO coaches with A-10 experience, and you were below us in KenPom with a highly-experienced A10 coach and many experienced A-10 players.
3. Despite the men's and women's basketball face-plants, most of our other teams did well, and we won the volleyball, men's & women's cross country titles, and went to the conference tournament final in men's soccer.
4. Beyond just being a Midwest stop for St. Louis and Dayton to feel less isolated, we are part of the third largest media market in the country, and it's easy to travel in and out of Chicago. That fact proved to be a highly valuable asset for the MVC, and it's certainly a plus for the A10.
5. It's not like we're a flash in the pan: We have a National Championship from the 1960s, an NIT runner-up finish in the 1930s and 1940s, an undefeated season in the 1920s, and a Hall of Fame Coach who died in 1942. We were the first major college team to put five African-American players on the court at the same time. And we've had one Final Four and four Sweet 16s since the National Championship that forever changed how African-American players were recruited.

So that's just my take. A lot of pot-shots were kinda fair, the ones listed above bothered me a little. Maybe we're the ones who should be concerned about the league we joined if all these doomsayers are right.

Rambler, thanks for your input. Since I lived in Chicago for many years as a grad student at UC and also later in my working life, I can attest to much of what you stated. URI fans are zealous, but maybe not so knowledgeable about Chicagoland and Midwest sports in general which may be equivalent to Loyola fans about East coast basketball. No question A-10 BB is an upgrade for Loyola and one year's performance is indicative of nothing. What is important is the longer term build of your program and that is more complicated than merely dumping on Loyola's first year BB performance.

So welcome to the A-10. Loyola with its beautiful campus and facilities is a worthy addition to the A-10. I, as well as other URI fans, look forward to the Ramblers first visit to the Ryan Center on February 18.

[Rhody74]

Hey Everyone, this is my first post on Keaney Blue. I run the Loyola fan message board, and I wish I had as many posts about Loyola Basketball this summer as you've had on this thread...

Look, I understand Loyola was an embarrassment in men's basketball last year. It was really bad. We're concerned and embarrassed by our showing last season. I would be alarmed, too, if I were a long-time A-10 fan, except for these facts:

1. It was obvious that Loyola was tooled for another type of basketball. The MVC plays more deliberately, and doesn't have the height, length, or athleticism of the A-10. We had a rough adjustment to the MVC also, but we won the CBI and 24 games (despite an injury to our best player for half of conference play) in our 2nd year.
2. The bottom four teams in last year's A-10 were coached by veteran coaches with winning NCAA Tournament experience, who all happened to be coaching new teams their first year in the A-10: LaSalle, UMass, URI and Loyola finished last in the league. Feels weird for you guys to be ragging on Loyola when we're the ONLY team that had ZERO players AND ZERO coaches with A-10 experience, and you were below us in KenPom with a highly-experienced A10 coach and many experienced A-10 players.
3. Despite the men's and women's basketball face-plants, most of our other teams did well, and we won the volleyball, men's & women's cross country titles, and went to the conference tournament final in men's soccer.
4. Beyond just being a Midwest stop for St. Louis and Dayton to feel less isolated, we are part of the third largest media market in the country, and it's easy to travel in and out of Chicago. That fact proved to be a highly valuable asset for the MVC, and it's certainly a plus for the A10.
5. It's not like we're a flash in the pan: We have a National Championship from the 1960s, an NIT runner-up finish in the 1930s and 1940s, an undefeated season in the 1920s, and a Hall of Fame Coach who died in 1942. We were the first major college team to put five African-American players on the court at the same time. And we've had one Final Four and four Sweet 16s since the National Championship that forever changed how African-American players were recruited.

So that's just my take. A lot of pot-shots were kinda fair, the ones listed above bothered me a little. Maybe we're the ones who should be concerned about the league we joined if all these doomsayers are right.

Welcome! I’m a longtime URI fan, but I have to say there’s a place in my heart for Sister Jean.

[reef]

Hey Everyone, this is my first post on Keaney Blue. I run the Loyola fan message board, and I wish I had as many posts about Loyola Basketball this summer as you've had on this thread...

Look, I understand Loyola was an embarrassment in men's basketball last year. It was really bad. We're concerned and embarrassed by our showing last season. I would be alarmed, too, if I were a long-time A-10 fan, except for these facts:

1. It was obvious that Loyola was tooled for another type of basketball. The MVC plays more deliberately, and doesn't have the height, length, or athleticism of the A-10. We had a rough adjustment to the MVC also, but we won the CBI and 24 games (despite an injury to our best player for half of conference play) in our 2nd year.
2. The bottom four teams in last year's A-10 were coached by veteran coaches with winning NCAA Tournament experience, who all happened to be coaching new teams their first year in the A-10: LaSalle, UMass, URI and Loyola finished last in the league. Feels weird for you guys to be ragging on Loyola when we're the ONLY team that had ZERO players AND ZERO coaches with A-10 experience, and you were below us in KenPom with a highly-experienced A10 coach and many experienced A-10 players.
3. Despite the men's and women's basketball face-plants, most of our other teams did well, and we won the volleyball, men's & women's cross country titles, and went to the conference tournament final in men's soccer.
4. Beyond just being a Midwest stop for St. Louis and Dayton to feel less isolated, we are part of the third largest media market in the country, and it's easy to travel in and out of Chicago. That fact proved to be a highly valuable asset for the MVC, and it's certainly a plus for the A10.
5. It's not like we're a flash in the pan: We have a National Championship from the 1960s, an NIT runner-up finish in the 1930s and 1940s, an undefeated season in the 1920s, and a Hall of Fame Coach who died in 1942. We were the first major college team to put five African-American players on the court at the same time. And we've had one Final Four and four Sweet 16s since the National Championship that forever changed how African-American players were recruited.

So that's just my take. A lot of pot-shots were kinda fair, the ones listed above bothered me a little. Maybe we're the ones who should be concerned about the league we joined if all these doomsayers are right.

Welcome 63 ! I was for the Loyola addition so good luck to you guys this season

[Jersey77]

Hey Everyone, this is my first post on Keaney Blue. I run the Loyola fan message board, and I wish I had as many posts about Loyola Basketball this summer as you've had on this thread...

Look, I understand Loyola was an embarrassment in men's basketball last year. It was really bad. We're concerned and embarrassed by our showing last season. I would be alarmed, too, if I were a long-time A-10 fan, except for these facts:

1. It was obvious that Loyola was tooled for another type of basketball. The MVC plays more deliberately, and doesn't have the height, length, or athleticism of the A-10. We had a rough adjustment to the MVC also, but we won the CBI and 24 games (despite an injury to our best player for half of conference play) in our 2nd year.
2. The bottom four teams in last year's A-10 were coached by veteran coaches with winning NCAA Tournament experience, who all happened to be coaching new teams their first year in the A-10: LaSalle, UMass, URI and Loyola finished last in the league. Feels weird for you guys to be ragging on Loyola when we're the ONLY team that had ZERO players AND ZERO coaches with A-10 experience, and you were below us in KenPom with a highly-experienced A10 coach and many experienced A-10 players.
3. Despite the men's and women's basketball face-plants, most of our other teams did well, and we won the volleyball, men's & women's cross country titles, and went to the conference tournament final in men's soccer.
4. Beyond just being a Midwest stop for St. Louis and Dayton to feel less isolated, we are part of the third largest media market in the country, and it's easy to travel in and out of Chicago. That fact proved to be a highly valuable asset for the MVC, and it's certainly a plus for the A10.
5. It's not like we're a flash in the pan: We have a National Championship from the 1960s, an NIT runner-up finish in the 1930s and 1940s, an undefeated season in the 1920s, and a Hall of Fame Coach who died in 1942. We were the first major college team to put five African-American players on the court at the same time. And we've had one Final Four and four Sweet 16s since the National Championship that forever changed how African-American players were recruited.

So that's just my take. A lot of pot-shots were kinda fair, the ones listed above bothered me a little. Maybe we're the ones who should be concerned about the league we joined if all these doomsayers are right.

Rambler, thanks for your input. Since I lived in Chicago for many years as a grad student at UC and also later in my working life, I can attest to much of what you stated. URI fans are zealous, but maybe not so knowledgeable about Chicagoland and Midwest sports in general which may be equivalent to Loyola fans about East coast basketball. No question A-10 BB is an upgrade for Loyola and one year's performance is indicative of nothing. What is important is the longer term build of your program and that is more complicated than merely dumping on Loyola's first year BB performance.

So welcome to the A-10. Loyola with its beautiful campus and facilities is a worthy addition to the A-10. I, as well as other URI fans, look forward to the Ramblers first visit to the Ryan Center on February 18.

Well said Obadiah, pretty much agree.

[section(105)]

Maybe Sr. Jean will make the trip east to the RC? Would love to see that.

[Jdrums#3]

Hey Everyone, this is my first post on Keaney Blue. I run the Loyola fan message board, and I wish I had as many posts about Loyola Basketball this summer as you've had on this thread...

Look, I understand Loyola was an embarrassment in men's basketball last year. It was really bad. We're concerned and embarrassed by our showing last season. I would be alarmed, too, if I were a long-time A-10 fan, except for these facts:

1. It was obvious that Loyola was tooled for another type of basketball. The MVC plays more deliberately, and doesn't have the height, length, or athleticism of the A-10. We had a rough adjustment to the MVC also, but we won the CBI and 24 games (despite an injury to our best player for half of conference play) in our 2nd year.
2. The bottom four teams in last year's A-10 were coached by veteran coaches with winning NCAA Tournament experience, who all happened to be coaching new teams their first year in the A-10: LaSalle, UMass, URI and Loyola finished last in the league. Feels weird for you guys to be ragging on Loyola when we're the ONLY team that had ZERO players AND ZERO coaches with A-10 experience, and you were below us in KenPom with a highly-experienced A10 coach and many experienced A-10 players.
3. Despite the men's and women's basketball face-plants, most of our other teams did well, and we won the volleyball, men's & women's cross country titles, and went to the conference tournament final in men's soccer.
4. Beyond just being a Midwest stop for St. Louis and Dayton to feel less isolated, we are part of the third largest media market in the country, and it's easy to travel in and out of Chicago. That fact proved to be a highly valuable asset for the MVC, and it's certainly a plus for the A10.
5. It's not like we're a flash in the pan: We have a National Championship from the 1960s, an NIT runner-up finish in the 1930s and 1940s, an undefeated season in the 1920s, and a Hall of Fame Coach who died in 1942. We were the first major college team to put five African-American players on the court at the same time. And we've had one Final Four and four Sweet 16s since the National Championship that forever changed how African-American players were recruited.

So that's just my take. A lot of pot-shots were kinda fair, the ones listed above bothered me a little. Maybe we're the ones who should be concerned about the league we joined if all these doomsayers are right.

Welcome aboard, 63. Don’t be a stranger.

[reef]

Maybe Sr. Jean will make the trip east to the RC? Would love to see that.

I’m hoping so too !! I doubt they want her to travel @ her age ??

[rhodylaw]

Would love nothing more than Loyola to prove to be more like VCU then George Mason. George Mason’s final four run was very coach dependent, they finally had some success in the league after a good hire in English (now gone). I am also very concerned that Davidson is Coach dependent and may not be close to the same without McKillop.

Rhody is what it is in the A10. We have cycles of good and bad for the past 30 years. I would say that we are also Coach dependent, but our program has repeatedly attracted good coaches to bring the program back to life over decades. I don’t think it is luck. I suspect that Loyola, being in Chicago could have similar results due to a desire for a coach to be there, but then you would think Fordham would have success and they just don’t.

[jcru]

Law, I'm guessing Jim Baron's 17 year basketball purgatory had something to do with all of that. Nothing like compounding the mistake of a bad hire by making it a permanent hire for nearly two decades. Only Rhode Island could have cooked up that one. The other A-10 teams must have secretly been beside themselves with delight.

At least Cox was only a 4 year mistake, but it just goes to show you that it doesn't take more than a couple of years in the current environment to dig yourself a big ole hole to climb out of.

[RhowdyRam02]

They were overhyped last season.
They lost quite a few players in the portal this off-season.
Fernandes (Rutgers), Luis (St.Johns), Gapare (Georgia Tech), Leveque (Texas A&M). Weeks (Rider), Dominguez (Ark. State)

They have a decent starting 5: (PG)Thompson, (G)Diggins, (F)Cross, (PF)Hankins-Sanford, (C)Cohen.
But no experienced depth, brought in 7 freshmen recruits.
Hopefully we should finish ahead of them this season.

Overhyped seems a bit of a stretch.
UMASS lost preseason 2nd Team PG Noah Fernandes early in the season playing only 11 games. He had a baby while he was out too. They pretty much knew he was going portal early on. Portal to P5 Rutgers

URI lost preseason 3rd team Freeman

UMASS was picked by A10 Coaches 8th, finished 13th
URI was picked 9th, finished 14th

UMASS finished 15-16, 6-12 conference
URI finished 9-22, 5-13 conference

UMASS beat URI both games out scoring Rhody by 34 points
UMASS won 75-65 at UMASS
UMASS won 69-45 at URI. It was as ugly as the score sounds

In the A10 Tournament both lost their 1st round games getting badly beaten:

UMASS lost 71-38 to Richmond
URI lost 73-56 to LaSalle

Martin and Miller in 1st year in A10 both make about $1.8 million per year

Both veteran HC's with big 2nd years upcoming

UMASS lost All Rookie star RJ Luis to the Portal. He 1st entered the Portal and was thought to be leaving for Miami then returned to UMASS for a reported $100,000, only to reneg and again go portal and went to Pitino at St Johns.

Yeah, maybe a little.
I think Busting Brackets had them picked to finish 6th.
Also, I think that early 6-game win streak, including winning the 3-game Myrtle Beach Invitational Championship, some thought they would be much better than they were.

Biggest disappointment was losing to them at the RC by 24 pts and they were without Fernandes and Cross.

Curious to see the A10 coaches predictions for 23-24.

The UMass home game last year might be the worst single game of the last five years. To lay that big of an egg at home, against a bad team, on a weekend we honored the 88 Sweet Sixteen and 98 Elite Eight teams? I'm pissed off all over again!

[RhowdyRam02]

That review has Rhody aiming for another tough season. I think there’s a chance we surprise them.

It's not especially well-written and seems like a very surface-level analysis to me. I don't follow the league well enough as a whole to really guess where we'll finish, but I think we'll be more toward the middle just from the process of churning the roster in the way we did.

It's written by someone that just recently graduated Fordham, so they probably have no clue what they're talking about

[rhodylaw]

Law, I'm guessing Jim Baron's 17 year basketball purgatory had something to do with all of that. Nothing like compounding the mistake of a bad hire by making it a permanent hire for nearly two decades. Only Rhode Island could have cooked up that one. The other A-10 teams must have secretly been beside themselves with delight.

At least Cox was only a 4 year mistake, but it just goes to show you that it doesn't take more than a couple of years in the current environment to dig yourself a big ole hole to climb out of.

Jim Baron years were disappointing in the end but we also were not terrible until the last one. In the end, we were not ok with just being ok. Also, never in our history have we been complacent with being bad. That is the worry of teams that have not had a long history of trying.

[ramster]

Sean Miller's Xavier comes in at #30 in 144 Madness and #5 Big East
He has 12 new players on this year's roster including 6 Freshmen and 6 Transfers. Only 4 players remain from last year's team.

https://www.collegesportsmadness.com/article/22149

2022-23 Record: 27-10, 15-5
2022-23 Postseason: NCAA
Coach: Sean Miller
Coach Record: 147-57 at Xavier, 449-166 overall

Key Departed Players:
Souley Boum, Guard, 16.4 ppg, 4.3 rpg, 4.3 apg
Colby Jones, Guard, 15.0 ppg, 5.7 rpg, 4.4 apg
Jack Nunge, Center, 14.2 ppg, 7.8 rpg, 2.1 apg
Adam Kunkel, Guard, 10.9 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 3.0 apg
KyKy Tandy, Guard, 2.2 ppg, 0.8 rpg, 0.9 apg

Key Returning Players:
Zach Freemantle, Senior, Forward, 15.2 ppg, 8.1 rpg, 2.9 apg
Jerome Hunter, Senior, Forward, 7.8 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 1.3 apg
Desmond Claude, Sophomore, Guard, 4.7 ppg, 2.5 rpg, 1.8 apg
Kam Craft, Sophomore, Guard, 2.6 ppg, 1.5 rpg, 0.3 apg

Key New Players:
Sasa Ciani, Freshman, Forward
Brad Colbert, Senior, Guard, Transfer from Louisville
Lazar Djokovic, Freshman, Forward
Reid Ducharme, Freshman, Forward
Logan Duncomb, Junior, Center, Transfer from Indiana
Trey Green, Freshman, Guard
Dayvion McKnight, Senior, Guard, Transfer from Western Kentucky
Gytis Nemeiksa, Senior, Forward, Transfer from International
Kachi Nzeh, Freshman, Center
Quincy Olivari, Senior, Guard, Transfer from Rice
Abou Ousmane, Senior, Forward, Transfer from North Texas
Dailyn Swain, Freshman, Forward

Projected Postseason Tournament: NCAA

[Jersey77]

Sean Miller's Xavier comes in at #30 in 144 Madness and #5 Big East
He has 12 new players on this year's roster including 6 Freshmen and 6 Transfers. Only 4 players remain from last year's team.

https://www.collegesportsmadness.com/article/22149

2022-23 Record: 27-10, 15-5
2022-23 Postseason: NCAA
Coach: Sean Miller
Coach Record: 147-57 at Xavier, 449-166 overall

Key Departed Players:
Souley Boum, Guard, 16.4 ppg, 4.3 rpg, 4.3 apg
Colby Jones, Guard, 15.0 ppg, 5.7 rpg, 4.4 apg
Jack Nunge, Center, 14.2 ppg, 7.8 rpg, 2.1 apg
Adam Kunkel, Guard, 10.9 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 3.0 apg
KyKy Tandy, Guard, 2.2 ppg, 0.8 rpg, 0.9 apg

Key Returning Players:
Zach Freemantle, Senior, Forward, 15.2 ppg, 8.1 rpg, 2.9 apg
Jerome Hunter, Senior, Forward, 7.8 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 1.3 apg
Desmond Claude, Sophomore, Guard, 4.7 ppg, 2.5 rpg, 1.8 apg
Kam Craft, Sophomore, Guard, 2.6 ppg, 1.5 rpg, 0.3 apg

Key New Players:
Sasa Ciani, Freshman, Forward
Brad Colbert, Senior, Guard, Transfer from Louisville
Lazar Djokovic, Freshman, Forward
Reid Ducharme, Freshman, Forward
Logan Duncomb, Junior, Center, Transfer from Indiana
Trey Green, Freshman, Guard
Dayvion McKnight, Senior, Guard, Transfer from Western Kentucky
Gytis Nemeiksa, Senior, Forward, Transfer from International
Kachi Nzeh, Freshman, Center
Quincy Olivari, Senior, Guard, Transfer from Rice
Abou Ousmane, Senior, Forward, Transfer from North Texas
Dailyn Swain, Freshman, Forward

Projected Postseason Tournament: NCAA

Currently too high of a ranking for Xavier.
I would have previously put them in the top 5 of the BE, but not now.
Both Freemantle and Hunter, their top frontcourt players, are out indefinitely and probably for the season.
Freemantle with another foot surgery, and Hunter with an undisclosed medical condition, I think heart related.

Looking at a top BE 5 of Marquette, Creighton, UConn, Villanova, and St. John's.
Also wouldn't sleep on PC and SH.

[ramster]

Sean Miller's Xavier comes in at #30 in 144 Madness and #5 Big East
He has 12 new players on this year's roster including 6 Freshmen and 6 Transfers. Only 4 players remain from last year's team.

https://www.collegesportsmadness.com/article/22149

2022-23 Record: 27-10, 15-5
2022-23 Postseason: NCAA
Coach: Sean Miller
Coach Record: 147-57 at Xavier, 449-166 overall

Key Departed Players:
Souley Boum, Guard, 16.4 ppg, 4.3 rpg, 4.3 apg
Colby Jones, Guard, 15.0 ppg, 5.7 rpg, 4.4 apg
Jack Nunge, Center, 14.2 ppg, 7.8 rpg, 2.1 apg
Adam Kunkel, Guard, 10.9 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 3.0 apg
KyKy Tandy, Guard, 2.2 ppg, 0.8 rpg, 0.9 apg

Key Returning Players:
Zach Freemantle, Senior, Forward, 15.2 ppg, 8.1 rpg, 2.9 apg
Jerome Hunter, Senior, Forward, 7.8 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 1.3 apg
Desmond Claude, Sophomore, Guard, 4.7 ppg, 2.5 rpg, 1.8 apg
Kam Craft, Sophomore, Guard, 2.6 ppg, 1.5 rpg, 0.3 apg

Key New Players:
Sasa Ciani, Freshman, Forward
Brad Colbert, Senior, Guard, Transfer from Louisville
Lazar Djokovic, Freshman, Forward
Reid Ducharme, Freshman, Forward
Logan Duncomb, Junior, Center, Transfer from Indiana
Trey Green, Freshman, Guard
Dayvion McKnight, Senior, Guard, Transfer from Western Kentucky
Gytis Nemeiksa, Senior, Forward, Transfer from International
Kachi Nzeh, Freshman, Center
Quincy Olivari, Senior, Guard, Transfer from Rice
Abou Ousmane, Senior, Forward, Transfer from North Texas
Dailyn Swain, Freshman, Forward

Projected Postseason Tournament: NCAA

Currently too high of a ranking for Xavier.
I would have previously put them in the top 5 of the BE, but not now.
Both Freemantle and Hunter, their top frontcourt players, are out indefinitely and probably for the season.
Freemantle with another foot surgery, and Hunter with an undisclosed medical condition, I think heart related.

Looking at a top BE 5 of Marquette, Creighton, UConn, Villanova, and St. John's.
Also wouldn't sleep on PC and SH.

Jon Rothstein just listed his #28 Team today on his daily countdown

[Jersey77]

Sean Miller's Xavier comes in at #30 in 144 Madness and #5 Big East
He has 12 new players on this year's roster including 6 Freshmen and 6 Transfers. Only 4 players remain from last year's team.

https://www.collegesportsmadness.com/article/22149

2022-23 Record: 27-10, 15-5
2022-23 Postseason: NCAA
Coach: Sean Miller
Coach Record: 147-57 at Xavier, 449-166 overall

Key Departed Players:
Souley Boum, Guard, 16.4 ppg, 4.3 rpg, 4.3 apg
Colby Jones, Guard, 15.0 ppg, 5.7 rpg, 4.4 apg
Jack Nunge, Center, 14.2 ppg, 7.8 rpg, 2.1 apg
Adam Kunkel, Guard, 10.9 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 3.0 apg
KyKy Tandy, Guard, 2.2 ppg, 0.8 rpg, 0.9 apg

Key Returning Players:
Zach Freemantle, Senior, Forward, 15.2 ppg, 8.1 rpg, 2.9 apg
Jerome Hunter, Senior, Forward, 7.8 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 1.3 apg
Desmond Claude, Sophomore, Guard, 4.7 ppg, 2.5 rpg, 1.8 apg
Kam Craft, Sophomore, Guard, 2.6 ppg, 1.5 rpg, 0.3 apg

Key New Players:
Sasa Ciani, Freshman, Forward
Brad Colbert, Senior, Guard, Transfer from Louisville
Lazar Djokovic, Freshman, Forward
Reid Ducharme, Freshman, Forward
Logan Duncomb, Junior, Center, Transfer from Indiana
Trey Green, Freshman, Guard
Dayvion McKnight, Senior, Guard, Transfer from Western Kentucky
Gytis Nemeiksa, Senior, Forward, Transfer from International
Kachi Nzeh, Freshman, Center
Quincy Olivari, Senior, Guard, Transfer from Rice
Abou Ousmane, Senior, Forward, Transfer from North Texas
Dailyn Swain, Freshman, Forward

Projected Postseason Tournament: NCAA

Currently too high of a ranking for Xavier.
I would have previously put them in the top 5 of the BE, but not now.
Both Freemantle and Hunter, their top frontcourt players, are out indefinitely and probably for the season.
Freemantle with another foot surgery, and Hunter with an undisclosed medical condition, I think heart related.

Looking at a top BE 5 of Marquette, Creighton, UConn, Villanova, and St. John's.
Also wouldn't sleep on PC and SH.

Jon Rothstein just listed his #28 Team today on his daily countdown

Maybe if Freemantle, their best player, and Hunter return for conference play.
But most feel that will be a longshot and what impact they will have if they do come back.

Agree that Mcknight and Olivari were huge additions at guards.
Ousmane also not bad in the middle, but the BE is loaded with excellent bigs.

[ramster]

I thought Pitino was high with 12 new players, keeping only Soriano. Only 2 freshmen and 10 Transfers

Then Sean Miller also brings in 12 new players with 6 freshmen and 6 transfers

Crazy world of roster turnover and predicting who finishes where is a crapshoot




St. John’s Red Storm
2023-2024 Overall Rank: #37
Conference Rank: #7 Big East

St. John’s Team Page
2022-23 Record: 18-15, 7-13
2022-23 Postseason: None
Coach: Rick Pitino
Coach Record: 0-0 at St. John’s, 711-290 overall

Key Departed Players:
David Jones, Forward, 13.2 ppg, 6.8 rpg, 1.6 apg
Posh Alexander, Guard, 10.2 ppg, 3.9 rpg, 4.2 apg
Andre Curbelo, Guard, 9.6 ppg, 2.8 rpg, 4.3 apg
Montez Mathis, Guard, 9.6 ppg, 1.9 rpg, 0.7 apg
Dylan Addae-Wusu, Guard, 9.3 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 2.4 apg
AJ Storr, Guard, 8.8 ppg, 1.9 rpg, 1.1 apg
Rafael Pinzon, Guard, 6.1 ppg, 1.9 rpg, 1.1 apg
O’Mar Stanley, Forawrd, 4.7 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 0.4 apg

Key Returning Players:
Joel Soriano, Senior, Center, 15.2 ppg, 11.9 rpg, 1.3 apg

Key New Players:
Nahiem Alleyne, Senior, Guard, Transfer from Connecticut
Sean Conway, Senior, Guard, Transfer from VMI
Cruz Davis, Sophomore, Guard, Transfer from Iona
Jordan Dingle, Senior, Guard, Transfer from Penn
Brady Dunlap, Freshman, Forward
Zuby Ejiofor, Sophomore, Forward, Transfer from Kansas
Sadiku Ibine Ayo, Sophomore, Forward, Transfer from Iona
Daniss Jenkins, Senior, Guard, Transfer from Iona
Chris Ledlum, Senior, Guard, Transfer from Harvard
RJ Luis, Sophomore, Guard, Transfer from Massachusetts
Glenn Taylor Jr., Junior, Forward, Transfer from Oregon State
Simeon Wilcher, Freshman, Guard

Projected Postseason Tournament: NCAA

[ramster]

Rothstein Prediction on the 14-Team AAC

[ramster]

Pitino's starting 5 are all from Northeast Mid Major Teams:

Jenkins -Iona
Luis - UMASS
Ledlum - Harvard
Dingle - Princeton
Soriano - Fordham


Pitino hitting the ground running looking to enable playing Duke in Arthur Ashe Stadium and Alabama in MSG next year

[Jersey77]

Pitino's starting 5 are all from Northeast Mid Major Teams:

Jenkins -Iona
Luis - UMASS
Ledlum - Harvard
Dingle - Princeton
Soriano - Fordham


Pitino hitting the ground running looking to enable playing Duke in Arthur Ashe Stadium and Alabama in MSG next year

IMG_0232.png

Look for (F)Glenn Taylor to maybe start (11.6 pts, Oregon State) in place of Luis.

[NYGFan_Section208]

Coach: Rick Pitino
Coach Record: 711-290 overall

Just let that marinate a little....

[reef]

Seems like Freemantle been @ Xavier forever !!

[Ramfan22]

Less than a month before we see Always Wright and David Fuchs in action

[Jersey77]

Less than a month before we see Always Wright and David Fuchs in action

Well at least the men's basketball team will be first in the A10 at something this upcoming season.

[ramster]

Pitino's starting 5 are all from Northeast Mid Major Teams:

Jenkins -Iona
Luis - UMASS
Ledlum - Harvard
Dingle - Princeton
Soriano - Fordham


Pitino hitting the ground running looking to enable playing Duke in Arthur Ashe Stadium and Alabama in MSG next year

IMG_0232.png

Look for (F)Glenn Taylor to maybe start (11.6 pts, Oregon State) in place of Luis.

I've heard that Pitino is high on Luis and he really wanted him recruiting him through the Portal. Luis is projected to go in the 2nd round of the 2024 NBA Draft as the #53 Draft Pick To Philadelphia by NBADRAFT.NET

https://www.nbadraft.net/nba-mock-draft ... -mock=2024

Injury update on Luis from SJU thread.....

https://red.fans/quad/threads/rj-luis-injury.323401/

[RhowdyRam02]

When did Xavier rejoin the A10? When did St. John's join?