2021 NCAA Tournament

[ramster]

Houston beats Rutgers 63-60 as Houston outscores Rutgers 14-2 the last few minutes of the game.

Horrendous Head Coaching strategy by Rutgers as they went to slow down ball, trying to use up the clock with each possession resulting in a bunch of turnovers. While that strategy works sometimes, more times than not it doesn't and it didn't tonight.

Tremendous effort by Dejon Jarreau who hurt his hip but returned to the game giving it his all. He hit a huge 3 point shot in the run, finishing with 17 points.

"While that strategy works sometimes, more times than not it doesn't and it didn't tonight." They took the foot off the pedal a little early tonight, agreed. But do you have any data to back up your statement? Or is your "more times than not" just you throwing it out there?

Sounds like this guy might have a study

[ramster]

I’m sure Dan Gavitt can explain it......

Really good article no way at all Loyola deserves an 8 seed and Illinois sure paid the price

[ramster]

Houston beats Rutgers 63-60 as Houston outscores Rutgers 14-2 the last few minutes of the game.

Horrendous Head Coaching strategy by Rutgers as they went to slow down ball, trying to use up the clock with each possession resulting in a bunch of turnovers. While that strategy works sometimes, more times than not it doesn't and it didn't tonight.

Tremendous effort by Dejon Jarreau who hurt his hip but returned to the game giving it his all. He hit a huge 3 point shot in the run, finishing with 17 points.

"While that strategy works sometimes, more times than not it doesn't and it didn't tonight." They took the foot off the pedal a little early tonight, agreed. But do you have any data to back up your statement? Or is your "more times than not" just you throwing it out there?

From attached article below....

Rutgers blew it

The Scarlet Knights scored just 10 points in the final 10 minutes, missing 12 of its final 18 shots as Houston closed the game on a 14-2 run. Rutgers hit one bucket in the final four minutes of the game, attempting to kill clock when it had the ball instead of running its offense and looking to put the nail in Houston’s coffin. After controlling the glass for most of the contest, Rutgers conceded six offensive rebounds in the final seven minutes.
The Scarlet Knights came close to making an unforgettable run, but they could not hang on, suffering the kind of heartbreaking defeat that only March can bring.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nj.com ... utType=amp

[rhodylaw]

4 minutes is an eternity in a college basketball game, way to soon to run clock with a 10ish point lead. Start killing clock under 2:30 with a 10 point lead and you probably win. I wish more coaches would keep the foot on the gas, most players aren’t adept at holding a lead. It’s not in the way they play the other 36 mins of the game.

[wpbrown8267]

Just as with the other significant upsets to date the defense was immense and relentless.
12 steals for Loyola vs only 5 for Illinois

Krutwig 9-18 FG, 12 rebounds, 5 assists, 3 steals, 19 points. Nice box score line.

#1 Big10 seed goes down in round of 32.

I LOVE IT

Putting 9 B10 teams in the tournament was a total travesty, and the selection committee should be ashamed.

Another thing the committee should be ashamed of: Loyola was CRIMINALLY underseeded. They should have been in the 3-5 range.

Agreed...I was thinking at worse a 5-6 seed. In hindsight i guess you can say the commitee actually hurt Illinois in the process, by having them meet up in rd of 32

[Rhode_Island_Red]

In general, non-Cartel teams are underseeded year in and year out. Obvious nepotism hire Dan Gavitt wouldn't have it any other way.

[URIFIJI]

I LOVE IT

Putting 9 B10 teams in the tournament was a total travesty, and the selection committee should be ashamed.

Another thing the committee should be ashamed of: Loyola was CRIMINALLY underseeded. They should have been in the 3-5 range.

Agreed...I was thinking at worse a 5-6 seed. In hindsight i guess you can say the commitee actually hurt Illinois in the process, by having them meet up in rd of 32

In theory if they pushed Loyola to a better seed - it would seem the committee would then need to add more teams outside of the BIG 5 Conferences - like Belmont. We have seen this far too much. I was watching this with my son and told him it was exactly like our 8 seed when we took down Kansas. We were a great team in 1997-98. Clearly we see way too much of this.

[rhodylaw]

Read a thought by one of the national basketball writers that maybe the 20 game P5 schedule hurts because the teams do not get exposed to different styles, coaching, etc. Makes sense, if you prepare for the same 12 teams every year and don't expose yourself to different schemes or play against seasoned college basketball players you will get punched in your mouth by a group of 4 year players at a smaller school. My general opinion when a conference gets a large amount of bids (over 6) is to bet against that conference. None of those teams are as good as they made themselves out to be. There is probably only 2 or 3 who have any real shot at making noise in the tournament.

[JimSidd]

I think it would be smart for P5 conferences to set up a challenge series in February against another P5 conference, instead of doing this in December. It would give them a better idea of where they stand against the good competition closer to tournament time, which I think would lead to more success in the tournament. It will never happen, though.

[ramster]

Another thing the committee should be ashamed of: Loyola was CRIMINALLY underseeded. They should have been in the 3-5 range.

Agreed...I was thinking at worse a 5-6 seed. In hindsight i guess you can say the commitee actually hurt Illinois in the process, by having them meet up in rd of 32

In theory if they pushed Loyola to a better seed - it would seem the committee would then need to add more teams outside of the BIG 5 Conferences - like Belmont. We have seen this far too much. I was watching this with my son and told him it was exactly like our 8 seed when we took down Kansas. We were a great team in 1997-98. Clearly we see way too much of this.

It's interesting to hear writers talk of how Illinois got screwed by Loyola being an 8-seed. The really challenge about being 8-9 seed is that the winner has to play a 1. Teams prefer to be a 4,5, or 7 so as to avoid that distinction.

Now media is feeling bad for Illinois in that they had to play Loyola who should NOT have been a 8 seed. Well, how about Loyola having to play a 1-seed? It works both ways.

1-seeds get a huge break intuit they get to play a warm up game against a 16-seed. They they play the 8-9 winner.

The big question is why does Dan Gavitt's seeding team not use the NET data effectively? If they did then Loyola would have been a 2,3 or at worst 4th round seed. To be an 8th is absurd - either that or that NET is not very reliable or useful

[Rhode_Island_Red]

The big question is why does Dan Gavitt's seeding team not use the NET data effectively? If they did then Loyola would have been a 2,3 or at worst 4th round seed. To be an 8th is absurd - either that or that NET is not very reliable or useful

Loyola got pushed down to an 8 to make room for more Cartel teams on the top seven lines. Obvious nepotism hire Dan Gavitt has one job — keep the Cartel happy. The more Cartel teams on the top seven lines, the more games they win and the more money the Cartel makes.

[SGreenwell]

I think it would be smart for P5 conferences to set up a challenge series in February against another P5 conference, instead of doing this in December. It would give them a better idea of where they stand against the good competition closer to tournament time, which I think would lead to more success in the tournament. It will never happen, though.

Yeah - they would be too fearful of losing bids.

Again though, I think the biggest thing that's made college basketball more competitive is because player movement is so much easier, in all directions. Players can go up and down conferences to find their "level," and also, the top end talent quickly exits the college game. (Someone pointed out in another thread that Fatts and Jayson Tatum are the same age, which is somewhat mind-bending.) In addition to that, with the Internet and how easy it is to get tape on players now, mid-majors aren't at such a severe scouting disadvantage as they were in the past. It's a dogfight at all levels, and even the advantages of being in the cartel don't matter as much once the teams are in the tournament.

[rhodyruckus]

The big question is why does Dan Gavitt's seeding team not use the NET data effectively? If they did then Loyola would have been a 2,3 or at worst 4th round seed. To be an 8th is absurd - either that or that NET is not very reliable or useful

Loyola got pushed down to an 8 to make room for more Cartel teams on the top seven lines. Obvious nepotism hire Dan Gavitt has one job — keep the Cartel happy. The more Cartel teams on the top seven lines, the more games they win and the more money the Cartel makes.

Talk about shooting themselves in the foot, then. If I'm an Illinois fan I'd be like "as a 1 seed we shouldn't be seeing this team until the Sweet 16 round at the earliest." Instead of putting Loyola on the 3 or 4 seed line and having them knock out some lower level conference team first then defeat a P5 team, now they send 2 cartel teams home in the first weekend.

[Rhody15]

The big question is why does Dan Gavitt's seeding team not use the NET data effectively? If they did then Loyola would have been a 2,3 or at worst 4th round seed. To be an 8th is absurd - either that or that NET is not very reliable or useful

Loyola got pushed down to an 8 to make room for more Cartel teams on the top seven lines. Obvious nepotism hire Dan Gavitt has one job — keep the Cartel happy. The more Cartel teams on the top seven lines, the more games they win and the more money the Cartel makes.

6 seeds SDSU and BYU are cartel teams? Must’ve missed that.

The cartel talk is nauseating to continue reading about.

[reef]

Big 10 looks overrated for sure right now possibly zero teams in the Sweet 16 as only Michigan is a small fav over LSU ?? Iowa trails by 14 to Oregon with 16 minutes left and Maryland will exit today

How bout the PAC 12 being undefeated I guess all those teams are pretty damn solid

[ramster]

I LOVE IT

Putting 9 B10 teams in the tournament was a total travesty, and the selection committee should be ashamed.

Another thing the committee should be ashamed of: Loyola was CRIMINALLY underseeded. They should have been in the 3-5 range.

Agreed...I was thinking at worse a 5-6 seed. In hindsight i guess you can say the commitee actually hurt Illinois in the process, by having them meet up in rd of 32

If Illinois had beat Loyola then you could say Loyola got screwed being an 8-seed and having to play a 1-seed so early.

Actually a 1-seed should be able to beat anybody in their bracket of 16 - that's why they are a 1, right?

[ramster]

Big 10 looks overrated for sure right now possibly zero teams in the Sweet 16 as only Michigan is a small fav over LSU ?? Iowa trails by 14 to Oregon with 16 minutes left and Maryland will exit today

How bout the PAC 12 being undefeated I guess all those teams are pretty damn solid

Reef,
In watching Iowa of late I thought they were over-rated. I'm not surprised Oregon is having their way with them today. I took the Ducks.

Yet another Big 10 Team going home earlier than expected.

Only Michigan and Maryland remain.

[ramster]

I think it would be smart for P5 conferences to set up a challenge series in February against another P5 conference, instead of doing this in December. It would give them a better idea of where they stand against the good competition closer to tournament time, which I think would lead to more success in the tournament. It will never happen, though.

Yeah - they would be too fearful of losing bids.

Again though, I think the biggest thing that's made college basketball more competitive is because player movement is so much easier, in all directions. Players can go up and down conferences to find their "level," and also, the top end talent quickly exits the college game. (Someone pointed out in another thread that Fatts and Jayson Tatum are the same age, which is somewhat mind-bending.) In addition to that, with the Internet and how easy it is to get tape on players now, mid-majors aren't at such a severe scouting disadvantage as they were in the past. It's a dogfight at all levels, and even the advantages of being in the cartel don't matter as much once the teams are in the tournament.

I think a big difference this year is the lack of attendance.

Normally you would have big crowds cheering on Ohio State, Michigan, Wisconsin, etc. Either the highest seeded teams would be playing close to home OR their fans travel very well OR both. This year we see arena's basically empty. Refs are not as tempted to be intimidated by the loud and boisterous crowds. Played for the High Seed teams are used to being cheered and motivated by the big crowds.

Oral Roberts, North Texas, Abilene Christian, Loyola Chicago, etc are not used to the huge crowds, they are used to motivating themselves, ether are hungry. The playing field is more even because of the crowd factor being much, much less.

[rhodylaw]

I love watching Oregon - such a fun team. Crisp passes, lots of ball movement, PG does not hold the ball at the top of the key forever. I honestly think this is close to the offense Cox wants to run but personnel does not match the plan. Need a bunch of guys who can play inside or out to spread out the defense and need to be a true threat from 3 as well. I think Tyrese would have been good at Oregon. Perfect player for their system.

[SGreenwell]

I think it would be smart for P5 conferences to set up a challenge series in February against another P5 conference, instead of doing this in December. It would give them a better idea of where they stand against the good competition closer to tournament time, which I think would lead to more success in the tournament. It will never happen, though.

Yeah - they would be too fearful of losing bids.

Again though, I think the biggest thing that's made college basketball more competitive is because player movement is so much easier, in all directions. Players can go up and down conferences to find their "level," and also, the top end talent quickly exits the college game. (Someone pointed out in another thread that Fatts and Jayson Tatum are the same age, which is somewhat mind-bending.) In addition to that, with the Internet and how easy it is to get tape on players now, mid-majors aren't at such a severe scouting disadvantage as they were in the past. It's a dogfight at all levels, and even the advantages of being in the cartel don't matter as much once the teams are in the tournament.

I think a big difference this year is the lack of attendance.

Normally you would have big crowds cheering on Ohio State, Michigan, Wisconsin, etc. Either the highest seeded teams would be playing close to home OR their fans travel very well OR both. This year we see arena's basically empty. Refs are not as tempted to be intimidated by the loud and boisterous crowds. Played for the High Seed teams are used to being cheered and motivated by the big crowds.

Oral Roberts, North Texas, Abilene Christian, Loyola Chicago, etc are not used to the huge crowds, they are used to motivating themselves, ether are hungry. The playing field is more even because of the crowd factor being much, much less.

I guess? I don't know - In 2012, two No. 15 seeds won their opening round games. Is that more or less chaotic than this year? I'd prefer to wait until the tournament is over before we decide that "no crowds" had a huge effect. The NBA playoffs, for example, had one significant upset (Clippers losing to Denver), and one quasi-upset (the Heat beat the Bucks somewhat handily, with Giannis hurt for the final two games), but the Lakers still won it.

So far this year, we've seen some power conference teams lose, but that happens every year. I like watching teams like Ohio State and Texas get undressed on national TV too, but the A-10 was a pretty dismal 0-2, and there are still plenty of bluebloods like Syracuse and Maryland in the tournament, making people looking like fools for shitting on them in the selection process. This year doesn't "feel" any more chaotic than other years to me.

[ramster]

Yeah - they would be too fearful of losing bids.

Again though, I think the biggest thing that's made college basketball more competitive is because player movement is so much easier, in all directions. Players can go up and down conferences to find their "level," and also, the top end talent quickly exits the college game. (Someone pointed out in another thread that Fatts and Jayson Tatum are the same age, which is somewhat mind-bending.) In addition to that, with the Internet and how easy it is to get tape on players now, mid-majors aren't at such a severe scouting disadvantage as they were in the past. It's a dogfight at all levels, and even the advantages of being in the cartel don't matter as much once the teams are in the tournament.

I think a big difference this year is the lack of attendance.

Normally you would have big crowds cheering on Ohio State, Michigan, Wisconsin, etc. Either the highest seeded teams would be playing close to home OR their fans travel very well OR both. This year we see arena's basically empty. Refs are not as tempted to be intimidated by the loud and boisterous crowds. Played for the High Seed teams are used to being cheered and motivated by the big crowds.

Oral Roberts, North Texas, Abilene Christian, Loyola Chicago, etc are not used to the huge crowds, they are used to motivating themselves, ether are hungry. The playing field is more even because of the crowd factor being much, much less.

I guess? I don't know - In 2012, two No. 15 seeds won their opening round games. Is that more or less chaotic than this year? I'd prefer to wait until the tournament is over before we decide that "no crowds" had a huge effect. The NBA playoffs, for example, had one significant upset (Clippers losing to Denver), and one quasi-upset (the Heat beat the Bucks somewhat handily, with Giannis hurt for the final two games), but the Lakers still won it.

So far this year, we've seen some power conference teams lose, but that happens every year. I like watching teams like Ohio State and Texas get undressed on national TV too, but the A-10 was a pretty dismal 0-2, and there are still plenty of bluebloods like Syracuse and Maryland in the tournament, making people looking like fools for shitting on them in the selection process. This year doesn't "feel" any more chaotic than other years to me.

The gap between the P5 Schools (include the BE if you like) and the Mid-Majors is not near as big as the P5 markets to make you think it is. The media also wants you to think it's a huge difference - that's how they sell tickets, advertising, land the big Television packages, get money for the Charter flights, get money for the $40 million and up Practice facilities. Marketing, marketing, marketing.

Look at the Vegas point differentials and you see the true story. The point spreads are relatively small. For one thing the big crowds are not present so the traditional 3 points for home court don't exist. Truly neutral courts with screaming people.

[reef]

Big 10 looks overrated for sure right now possibly zero teams in the Sweet 16 as only Michigan is a small fav over LSU ?? Iowa trails by 14 to Oregon with 16 minutes left and Maryland will exit today

How bout the PAC 12 being undefeated I guess all those teams are pretty damn solid

Reef,
In watching Iowa of late I thought they were over-rated. I'm not surprised Oregon is having their way with them today. I took the Ducks.

Yet another Big 10 Team going home earlier than expected.

Only Michigan and Maryland remain.

Iowa defense was horse poop all year and today especially

Enjoy life without Luka G

[4Diffs]

Oregon was ridiculously under seeded as a 7. As I mentioned, VCU would have had no chance against them. Just a much better team than VCU. And Rhodylaw to put Oregon and Rhode Island in the same sentence is a giant leap of faith, including style of play. This Oregon team is going to their fourth sweet sixteen in the last five years, including a final four. They will be playing to get to the final four, they will beat Kansas (or USC) but then run up against Gonzaga. Will be a great game to watch and I give them a chance to win that game, one in three.

And LSU being an 8 seed was also too low. So yes the A10 teams theoretically got good seeds but terrible matchups. But as stated, you got to be competitive, can't be getting blown out in a 8-9 game.

Big East has not been great either. It has been a down year for them. Creighton is very fortunate to advance, UConn got handled pretty easily and Georgetown got blown out. Creighton will lose to Ohio because they are just a better team, unless they shoot out of their a__ from three which is possible. But the one thing the Big East has going for it is Villanova. A perennial powerhouse which has won two national championships in the last five years. I expect Uconn to continue their ascent as well. That is what the A10 needs. The league used to have teams like that, UMass, Temple, St. Joes that one year, Xavier were solid. Was not long ago, maybe four or five years ago, that the A10 had a streak of like ten straight years of one A10 team making the sweet sixteen. Feels like a long time ago.

I have enjoyed this tournament. There is some really good basketball being played outside of the Power five. Oral Roberts is legit. They flat out beat Ohio State who played well, and a Florida team that also played well. No fluke there, they have two players that can play anywhere in the country. Ohio is solid as is Abilene Christian. And who does not love to watch Loyola of Chicago. I would love to root for a team like that, just so fundamentally sound, play great defense and so well coached. But if I am not mistaken, Porter Moser was fired by Illinois State.

But I have no idea how North Texas beat Purdue. Very strange and knew they had no chance against Villanova.

I long for the day that Rhode Island is back in these conversations.

[ramster]

and Oral Roberts came in 4th in the Summit Conference. They have now won 7 straight games.

[theblueram]

I have to root against Michigan and Maryland coming up. A conference touted as the best ever had received about 14% of all bids. Yet not 1 team has made it to the second weekend. The big 10 has had a #1 lose, 2 #2 lose, 1 #3 lose and a 4,9 and 10 lose. The talking heads are exploding. They don't know what to say. They have 2 teams left out of 9.

[reef]

Right image of all 9 fail to make the Sweet 16 be one of the craziest things ever since it’s the first time in history had 4 seeds on the 1 and 2 line !!

[theblueram]

You should check out the NCAA Rivals forum. The big 10 is getting bashed.

[ramster]

Deservedly so.

[UCH21377]

I’m sure Dan Gavitt can explain it......

Really good article no way at all Loyola deserves an 8 seed and Illinois sure paid the price

If you didn't know the teams you would have sworn Loyola was the higher seed. They were the better team.

Baylor looked really good yesterday.

[theblueram]

This Michigan/LSU game is great.

[ramster]

Maryland down 23 with 10 minutes to go as they are getting dominated by Alabama.

[The Dude]

Don't really care much for whether someone is a 5 seed, 9 seed, 15 seed...or whatever. If you want to win the NCAA Tournament, you have to beat each team that is in front of you. Loyola was the better team & showed it. Whether Illinois lost to them during that game or to them in a later round or even another better team...nothing really changes from that standpoint. Illinois in the end wasn't going to be good enough to be the last team standing and different seeding likely wouldn't have changed that in my opinion.
I don't know much about the whole money dynamic at play with regards to teams advancing in the tournament, but I like seeing a big conference team get beat by a smaller school. It's what makes the tournament great & sorts the contenders from the pretenders.

[reef]

4 Pac 12 teams in Seeet 16 and only Baylor and Michigan make it from the so called 2 best conferences 16 total bids

[ramster]

[PeterRamTime]

I implore you to check out this guy's channel!

Really interesting basketball analysis here

[reef]

Beavers 1st elite 8 since 1982 what a story had to win the Pac 12 tournament just to get a bid

Nova giving Baylor all they can handle

[ramster]

Too much dribbling and not enough passing by Villanova in the 2nd half, turned the ball over too many times in the last 10 minutes.

[Billyboy78]

I think Cole Swider should transfer to URI.

[reef]

Baylor is the real deal I expect to see them on Championship Monday

[Joe95]

I think Cole Swider should transfer to URI.

I agree Billyboy as a native of Portsmouth, I would love to see Cole come home. It wouldn’t shock me one bit to see his name in the portal in a week or two. Maybe Malik can recruit him to Rhody.

[NYGFan_Section208]

I have to root against Michigan and Maryland coming up. A conference touted as the best ever had received about 14% of all bids. Yet not 1 team has made it to the second weekend. The big 10 has had a #1 lose, 2 #2 lose, 1 #3 lose and a 4,9 and 10 lose. The talking heads are exploding. They don't know what to say. They have 2 teams left out of 9.

I like Michigan...always liked Juwaan...all the Fab 5
But, I do have 'noles - syracuse in the Final..

[ramster]

I have to root against Michigan and Maryland coming up. A conference touted as the best ever had received about 14% of all bids. Yet not 1 team has made it to the second weekend. The big 10 has had a #1 lose, 2 #2 lose, 1 #3 lose and a 4,9 and 10 lose. The talking heads are exploding. They don't know what to say. They have 2 teams left out of 9.

I like Michigan...always liked Juwaan...all the Fab 5
But, I do have 'noles - syracuse in the Final..

208,
Need to do something with Jarreau in the 2nd half. He is running the show with 8 rebounds and 6 assists - both game highs. Cuse only has 2 assists total.
Buddy needs to get hot.

[ramster]

Syracuse scored only 46 points.
Houston to play Oregon State in Elite 8

[PeterRamTime]

I really hate that OSU beat Loyola. Loyola missed sooooo many wide open shots! OSU got lucky.

[reef]

I think Houston beats Oregon St in a close game

Sunday I think winners are Gonzaga Florida St Alabama and USC

[Ramulous]

I can never root for Syracuse or current big east teams. Sorry people

[Rhody74]

I can never root for Syracuse or current big east teams. Sorry people

My daughter (and money) went there. I still can’t root for the basketball team.

[Rhode_Island_Red]

I can never root for Syracuse or current big east teams. Sorry people

Not to mention their whiny, unbearable coach.

[wpbrown8267]

I can never root for Syracuse or current big east teams. Sorry people

Not to mention their whiny, unbearable coach.

Boehiem is insufferable, so pompous...you see how that tool answered a reporter a few weeks ago about never playing a game. Such a tool, he’s always been a first rate asshole

[ramster]

I can never root for Syracuse or current big east teams. Sorry people

Not to mention their whiny, unbearable coach.

Boehiem is insufferable, so pompous...you see how that tool answered a reporter a few weeks ago about never playing a game. Such a tool, he’s always been a first rate asshole

Couldn't stand the guy going all the way back to the Louie and Bouie Show. He had Roosevelt Bouie and Louis Orr. He has always bugged me with his cocky behavior. Always root against him