3/4 | Dayton | 9:00PM (CBSSN)

[Rhody22]

Totally agree. I posted in another thread JD’s A/TO ratio from his first 3 years. How can you have a top 5 nationally A/TO PG with 2 years experience and 4 NCAA Tournament games under his belt and take the ball out of his hands? Even someone who knows nothing of basketball would look at those numbers and realize he is your floor general. Not sure if it had anything to do with keeping Fatts or keeping him happy but that is Cox’s biggest mistake: reinventing the wheel.
This collapse may be worse because of the timing of it. It also may be an understandable collapse in that we have dealt with the 8 man rotation we were dealt.

Cox went from great coach to nothing in just a few weeks.

I think you have to base our current situation on the roster management. Cox almost coached the team out of it, but only have the particular 8 guys we have, led by Fatts who is somehow capable of playing like an All-American and then playing like I dont even know.

I mean besides us relying on Fatts entirely, we have seen us execute plays offensively with a crispness that some here havent seen here in a while. We were pick and rolling like crazy and Fatts was lighting people up.

Our defense was up in peoples grill. Teams could never get going. Remember how we shut down Duquesne? They are a talented offensive team right there and we made them look like current us.

I mean, I think Cox has shown he can create good results. Last year we peaked at this time. Earlier in the year we peaked.

I think the goal HAS to be to not have to rely on Fatts. Then we neeeeeed a big. I would wager Harris and Walker will be better, but they wont be good enough and for heavens sake you need more than 2 freaking big men. We dont have JG JT EC Stan Dowtin and Fatts next year. Just hot cold Fatts. Cant have a year with just two guards and then follow it with just two bigs. I wouldn't even mind getting two more big guys!
We just need enough guys to pick up the slack if Fatts doesnt have it. Rese can do it. Love Dowtin, but he obviously struggles being an offensive weapon. Can Rese, Sheppard, Leggett, Wood, Toppin and everyone else be good enough to make shots and score some points? Good teams can afford multiple guys having off nights.


Ugh I'm just blabbering. This makes me sad.

I was so excited to pound my chest when we made the tournament. Give my profile picture the Rhody March Madness frame. Get to see all the hype leading up. And it's gone in two weeks.

Feel bad for the guys though. Must really suck for them

Ignoring all of the roster issues, my biggest issues with the coaching are taking the ball out of Dowtin's hands and the treatment of Fatts. Letting Fatts play hero ball is great if he's playing like Obi Toppin...but I've watched Obi Toppin and Dayton play, and they don't even let their consensus lottery pick play hero ball. EVERY DAYTON PLAYER TOUCHES THE BALL IN THE HALF COURT.

Seriously, when's the last time you even saw a single possession that had all 5 rams touch the ball?

This team was on a winning streak when Fatts was scoring. This team gets on a losing streak when Fatts isn't scoring. It's exactly like last year. Hero ball doesn't work. ESPECIALLY when the "hero" is a wildly inconsistent shooter. That's not good coaching. It's literally the same crap we bag on Ed Cooley about.

Speaking of Cooley - compare Fatts to Pipkins. Same exact thing - except Pipkins decided to shoot his team out of games in the beginning of the year, and shoot them into them at the end. Fatts went the opposite way which is way worse.

When it comes to the treatment of our "star" - Fatts' technical and subsequent lack of punishment told me everything I needed to know. Under Hurley, it wouldn't have mattered who was available on the bench. We'd have gone with 4 forwards or Eric Dadika would've come into the game to make a point that that behavior was unacceptable. Fatts gets the superstar treatment - which causes me issues because once you tell him he's a superstar he stops producing like one. His season turned the second he made that watch list. Dude is a Philly grinder which is awesome. He loves being the underdog. The second he's out front he loses his edge.

On top of that, I feel bad for Jeff. After his sophomore year I think a lot of people saw him as having a legitimate chance at making a run at the NBA. Then we took the ball out of his hands the last 2 years instead of letting him run the show. That's the biggest problem with this whole experiment.

There's no floor general. No leadership. That's why we take so many bad shots early in the clock. It doesn't excuse the lack of effort to get back on defense, but holy hell is it pathetic basketball to watch.

The lack of BBIQ from anyone but JD is really astounding. I think it's fair to put that on the coach - and I don't mean he's supposed to get everyone up to a Jeff Dowtin IQ level. I mean he's supposed to identify his smartest player and keep the ball in his hands. The games where that doesn't happen are the games we get embarrassed in.

There's just no excuse for us not to be a tournament team this year. Once again, we didn't have to beat Dayton. We didn't have to beat Maryland, LSU, or WVU either. That much was clear. Technically, we didn't even need to beat Brown or Richmond. We were CLEARLY in the NCAA field as of a week ago with all of those losses. We were a consensus 9 seed. All we had to do was beat a shitty Davidson team and St Louis at home. We couldn't do that. We don't deserve shit.

Hopefully Coach takes a lot of lessons from this season and makes the appropriate changes. I'd really prefer to not post on this message board in the "NIT or Bust" section.

I posted in another thread JD’s A/TO ratios from his first 3 years. How can you take the ball out of the hands of a top 5 nationally A/TO PG ? That is Cox’s biggest mistake. Was it fear of losing Fatts? I feel bad for Jeff because he got totally screwed with this.

[Blue Man]

To defend Fatts a little, he gets hit on almost every drive and no calls. Thought the T was completely unnecessary.

On another note, and please do not think I am blaming the refs for the loss, there is absolutely no way we win that game last night, the refs made the game unenjoyable. Let the kids play some without calling a foul every possession.

Further note, Obi is an awesome dunker. Spectacular stuff there.

OK but how many times do you need to do that before you realize you're not getting the calls? You have to adjust to the officials.

Not for nothing he hasn't been getting those calls for weeks now. To be fair he hasn't earned them because it's clear he's going in for contact, not going in for the basket. After the 2nd time that happened, Cox should've pulled Fatts aside and told him to stop. Dish the ball out when they collapse on you more. DO ANYTHING DIFFERENT.

Refs don't reward the guys that make it obvious. If we had anyone on the bench telling our players to just go AT THE F*&KING RIM and not at the body - we would get more calls.

Every single one of our players goes at the side of the backboard for a layup, expecting contact, not even trying to make the shot. That's not how you do it. That will get you a bail out call maybe 10% of the time. Just go at the rim for a dunk. Try to actually make the shot. You will probably get fouled. You might even make the basket.

Considering this is more widespread than just a Fatts issue, it's once again, on the coach.

[ramster]

To defend Fatts a little, he gets hit on almost every drive and no calls. Thought the T was completely unnecessary.

On another note, and please do not think I am blaming the refs for the loss, there is absolutely no way we win that game last night, the refs made the game unenjoyable. Let the kids play some without calling a foul every possession.

Further note, Obi is an awesome dunker. Spectacular stuff there.

I'm glad you brought up the Obi dunking cause that made me almost lose it. At least twice guys couldn't wait to get out of the way fast enough. GO UP AND CHALLENGE HIM!! Don't let him windmill dunk in our building without him ending the play on his ass, instead our guys wanted to watch the show without buying a ticket

The Technical was very unnecessary. Never, ever should have happened.
But Russell selfishly put himself above the team, his Coaches, his fellow students and the fans. The Ref was completely right in calling that Technical.
Especially when the player is not even involved in the play.

And this was not just this one incident. Russell was chirping a lot. Eventually you go over the line.

It’s Russell’s Fault and it’s the Coaching Staffs fault. It was not the Ref.

But I taped the game and I’ll watch it again to verify but I was in perfect view of the incident.

[TruePoint]

To defend Fatts a little, he gets hit on almost every drive and no calls. Thought the T was completely unnecessary.

On another note, and please do not think I am blaming the refs for the loss, there is absolutely no way we win that game last night, the refs made the game unenjoyable. Let the kids play some without calling a foul every possession.

Further note, Obi is an awesome dunker. Spectacular stuff there.

OK but how many times do you need to do that before you realize you're not getting the calls? You have to adjust to the officials.

Not for nothing he hasn't been getting those calls for weeks now. To be fair he hasn't earned them because it's clear he's going in for contact, not going in for the basket. After the 2nd time that happened, Cox should've pulled Fatts aside and told him to stop. Dish the ball out when they collapse on you more. DO ANYTHING DIFFERENT.

Refs don't reward the guys that make it obvious. If we had anyone on the bench telling our players to just go AT THE F*&KING RIM and not at the body - we would get more calls.

Every single one of our players goes at the side of the backboard for a layup, expecting contact, not even trying to make the shot. That's not how you do it. That will get you a bail out call maybe 10% of the time. Just go at the rim for a dunk. Try to actually make the shot. You will probably get fouled. You might even make the basket.

Considering this is more widespread than just a Fatts issue, it's once again, on the coach.

I think Fatts absorbs a lot of contact on plays where it isn’t obvious that drawing contact is his sole purpose. Last night he even made a basket on a play he was clearly fouled and got no call - not sure how you can argue he isn’t trying to score when the play results in a made basket. Also, just because he is trying to draw contact doesn’t excuse the ref not calling a foul - drawing contact is a legitimate basketball play. I do think there has been a concerted effort not to reward Fatts with free throws on every play, and that’s fine I guess but the game should be called straight up and if he gets hit it should be called a foul.

As far as the “if it’s not working, do something else” idea, a huge problem is that if you take Fatts’ penetration out of the equation this team just does not have enough ways to score. Some of that is coaching and some of it is personnel. We are reliant on his getting into the paint and scoring, dishing, and getting to the line.

I think this team’s biggest flaw is that it is completely purposeless in the half court offense - teams like Dayton and even Davidson, there is a lot of movement without the ball but it is all purposeful. It is designed to create specific looks off of specific actions that are coordinated utilizing all five guys on the floor. Our offense does have some motion to it, but it often appears to be movement for movement’s sake - at least it is not creating anything useful most of the time. That’s a design flaw, and that is coaching. The personnel is also limiting because you don’t have enough floor spacers that can’t be left on the perimeter, you don’t have enough guys that can create their own shots off the dribble, and you do not have interior players that you can isolate on the block. As a result, we don’t put the kind of pressure on teams where they have to make exceptions to their normal defensive rules to account for these things and they can play us straight up. That’s why when you watch URI play against quality teams it just looks like we are working so hard for every point we get on offense and the opponent seems to be getting good looks every time down the court. Theoretically you could win a game played like that, but it requires the other team to miss a lot of good looks and you to make a ton of suspect ones. Most of the time that’s not a winning formula, and we’ve seen that. When we can dictate tempo, turn teams over and get out into transition we can make runs in these games but when the game gets locked down into a my turn-your turn back and forth we get these 5 minute stretches where we don’t score and the game changes from a small lead to trailing, or from a close game to a blowout, or a big lead to a tight one. We’ve seen those stretches all year, I’ve expressed panic about it all year, and it turned out that it wasn’t even the actual problem but just a symptom of a larger one.

[steviep123]

On Fatt's technical, from watching on tv, it seems he was reacting to something Landers or Crutcher (I can't remember which) said. He was also walking away too. The announcers also weren't really sure why/what happened. It seems to me if the refs were trying to send a message, then why not a double tech? Or a warning. It seems that it was not all on Fatts there.

[Rhodymob05]

The timing of that tech was ridiculously similar to the first game. We had a little run going and then boom. Goodnight.

[mstyles22]

Agree with most of the takes here. JD should be the focal point of the offense. Either breaking down the defense and setting up his mid-range, or step-back 3's. We have a short rotation and have had trouble scoring since the first Dayton game. I'd be fine with Jeff attempting 10 3's per game. It's certainly better option than Harris or an ice-cold Fatts.

But I also think putting the ball in Jeff's hands would open things up for Fatts and get his game going at the rim.

And I'll say it one more time...LOB THE BALL TO TOPPIN AT THE RIM!!! Off of a backdoor cut or designed back screen, I don't give a shit. The kid has springs and is a gifted athlete. I trust our guards to put the ball in a good spot and for him to finish. Those are easy points just sitting there. Toppin (through no fault of his own) spends way too much time outside of the paint in this offense.

Other teams have adjusted to Rhody's style of play by overplaying Fatts, immediately doubling Cyril, making sure their guards block out Martin. Rhody hasn't dictated the pace in any game since the first Dayton game, including the Fordham game. This is 100% on the coaching staff.

I'm holding off on ranking this collapse until after UMass and Brooklyn...but the bones are there. This has been painful. To make it selfish and about us for a minute, it just sucks no longer being a part of the conversation. Going from visions of seeing "Rhode Island" on your bracket to "NIT #6 seed" in basically 10 days is quite the gut punch.

I mean technically we're not out of it yet but we all know better. This team is on fumes. It's going to take some kind of drastic change in philosophy over the next week for us to have any chance in Brooklyn. And this starts with the UMass game. The low-IQ optimist in me is like, "Hey, maybe we come out and play inspired ball against UMass. Get some nice momentum going into Brooklyn. Maybe Fatts and/or Jeff heats up..."

But like I said, we all know better. This sucks.

[Billyboy78]

BTW, I was so excited when I saw Antwan Walker play his first couple of games. I remember some nice work around the rim and some beautiful passes from high to low post or kicking out to the wing. Since then, what the hell happened?

[ramster]

Maybe it's the lack of sleep, but I can't even really put into words how pissed off I am at last night and this season.

Fatts was a complete and total liability last night. 2-13 from the field, 0-4 from three, doesn't get a call on offense so never bothers to get back on d, and the ultimate back breaking play of the game: Jeff hits a 3 with 4:14 to go in the half and we're down 8. We're called for a foul and Fatts gets T'd up complaining about it. Dayton hits their two technical free throws, Obi hits his two free throws because of the foul and we're instantly down 12 and we ever got the deficit in single digits the rest of the way. Did he face any apparent discipline for his poor shot selection, ball chucking, and poor attitude? Nope. Keep running him out there and let him keep chucking.

Speaking of guys not sitting, if you're down 20 throughout the last quarter of the game, you have two guys extremely banged up, and your only chance of making the tournament is winning the conference championship do you keep the banged up guys in or do you sit them? If you chose the right answer then you disagreed with Cox' strategy last night. What the fuck were Jeff and Cyril doing in the game with under a minute left? Seriously does anyone have a clue what Cox was doing there, because I certainly don't.

I think it's clear at this point that for Cox to be successful he needs conference player of the year Fatts and if he doesn't have that we're mediocre at best. He can win if he has superior talent but we won't win if it's a battle of coaching wits. He's a fantastic assistant but there is no evidence that he's a good head coach. If we don't win the conference championship this year and don't make the tournament next year then everything Hurley built here would have been pissed away. If that happens Cox shouldn't be the head coach here any longer. I don't want to hear another hint of him being extended until we make a tournament

RR2,

That was a huge moment. Dowtin had just hit the 3P. Energy was pouring out from the crowd and from the URI bench. Down to 8 points vs the #3 Team in the country!!

Jacob committed the foul. Jacob did not have a problem with the foul, nobody did, except Fatts. Rightfully so the Ref Teed up Russell. It was right in front of Cox, 15 feet away. I actually think Russell was still mad about previous calls or non calls or who knows what. Russell complains about officiating all the time. It’s tiring. But Cox allows it. Never tells Russell to get his head back in the game. Russell goes unmanaged complaining about Refs like the boy who cried wolf.

That was a crucial Technical. Totally unnecessary and unwarranted by Russell. Was Not even his play or foul. He was not involved!!

Fans around me said the same thing. It took the momentum we had from Jeff’s big 3-point shot away. It silenced the crowd and the URI Bench. But Cox left Russell in. No repercussions whatsoever.

Later in the game Russell waved off a call by the Ref, it was one of those waves that would only piss of a Ref and that was Russels intent. If the Ref had seen Russell do it he would have teed him up and thrown him out. I’m not 100% sure any of the 3 Refs didn't see Russell wave his hand, but if they did they gave him a break. I would have tossed him.

I’m so tired if Russell complaining about calls or more so non-calls.

He not only shot 2-13 but most all of his misses were way off, not even close. Dowtin goes 5-7 on 3-pointers but do we try to get him more shots from 3? No.

From my vantage point Fatts got the T for saying something to one of the Dayton guys- not the ref

Point is he deserved it. Nobody thought he didn’t. We were all cringing.
and again, it might not be just be one thing he said, he was griping a lot. He never drives the lane whereby he doesn’t say he was fouled.
Sometimes during his complaining his man is down court scoring. It happened last night.

He selfishly got the tech and took away the nice momentum we had going after Dowtin’s 3 pointer. Kaput. End of comeback.

[Rhodymob05]

BTW, I was so excited when I saw Antwan Walker play his first couple of games. I remember some nice work around the rim and some beautiful passes from high to low post or kicking out to the wing. Since then, what the hell happened?

Been wondering the same, he barely plays now.

[Billyboy78]

BTW, I was so excited when I saw Antwan Walker play his first couple of games. I remember some nice work around the rim and some beautiful passes from high to low post or kicking out to the wing. Since then, what the hell happened?

Been wondering the same, he barely plays now.

Least amount if minutes out of the 8 scholly players yesterday.

[ramster]

To defend Fatts a little, he gets hit on almost every drive and no calls. Thought the T was completely unnecessary.

On another note, and please do not think I am blaming the refs for the loss, there is absolutely no way we win that game last night, the refs made the game unenjoyable. Let the kids play some without calling a foul every possession.

Further note, Obi is an awesome dunker. Spectacular stuff there.

OK but how many times do you need to do that before you realize you're not getting the calls? You have to adjust to the officials.

Not for nothing he hasn't been getting those calls for weeks now. To be fair he hasn't earned them because it's clear he's going in for contact, not going in for the basket. After the 2nd time that happened, Cox should've pulled Fatts aside and told him to stop. Dish the ball out when they collapse on you more. DO ANYTHING DIFFERENT.

Refs don't reward the guys that make it obvious. If we had anyone on the bench telling our players to just go AT THE F*&KING RIM and not at the body - we would get more calls.

Every single one of our players goes at the side of the backboard for a layup, expecting contact, not even trying to make the shot. That's not how you do it. That will get you a bail out call maybe 10% of the time. Just go at the rim for a dunk. Try to actually make the shot. You will probably get fouled. You might even make the basket.

Considering this is more widespread than just a Fatts issue, it's once again, on the coach.

I think Fatts absorbs a lot of contact on plays where it isn’t obvious that drawing contact is his sole purpose. Last night he even made a basket on a play he was clearly fouled and got no call - not sure how you can argue he isn’t trying to score when the play results in a made basket.
ok, we will give you that one of his 2-13 attempts.


Also, just because he is trying to draw contact doesn’t excuse the ref not calling a foul - drawing contact is a legitimate basketball play. I do think there has been a concerted effort not to reward Fatts with free throws on every play, and that’s fine I guess but the game should be called straight up and if he gets hit it should be called a foul. What is this concerted effort by the Refs? Do they get together and say they are going to change how they call fouls in favor of Russell?

As far as the “if it’s not working, do something else” idea, a huge problem is that if you take Fatts’ penetration out of the equation this team just does not have enough ways to score. Some of that is coaching and some of it is personnel. We are reliant on his getting into the paint and scoring, dishing, and getting to the line. The players are often just watching Russell drive. His penetration is not working. Ball is getting ripped out of his hands, or he is just losing control of it, or his shot is getting swatted away. A-10, teams have learned to adjust to Russell’s greatest asset - his speed. Earlier in the year he could blow by people like an element of surprise. Opposing Teams and Coaches have adjusted. Russell keeps doing the same thing and getting abused. It’s not the Refs. And even if it is the Refs they are not going to change. So either keep putting the head down and throwing up prayers are get other players taking some shots. o

I think this team’s biggest flaw is that it is completely purposeless in the half court offense - teams like Dayton and even Davidson, there is a lot of movement without the ball but it is all purposeful. It is designed to create specific looks off of specific actions that are coordinated utilizing all five guys on the floor. Our offense does have some motion to it, but it often appears to be movement for movement’s sake - at least it is not creating anything useful most of the time. That’s a design flaw, and that is coaching. The personnel is also limiting because you don’t have enough floor spacers that can’t be left on the perimeter, you don’t have enough guys that can create their own shots off the dribble, and you do not have interior players that you can isolate on the block. As a result, we don’t put the kind of pressure on teams where they have to make exceptions to their normal defensive rules to account for these things and they can play us straight up. That’s why when you watch URI play against quality teams it just looks like we are working so hard for every point we get on offense and the opponent seems to be getting good looks every time down the court. Theoretically you could win a game played like that, but it requires the other team to miss a lot of good looks and you to make a ton of suspect ones. Most of the time that’s not a winning formula, and we’ve seen that. When we can dictate tempo, turn teams over and get out into transition we can make runs in these games but when the game gets locked down into a my turn-your turn back and forth we get these 5 minute stretches where we don’t score and the game changes from a small lead to trailing, or from a close game to a blowout, or a big lead to a tight one. We’ve seen those stretches all year, I’ve expressed panic about it all year, and it turned out that it wasn’t even the actual problem but just a symptom of a larger one.

[TruePoint]

I thought Fatts drew contact that should have been called and wasn’t 4-5 times last night. Could have made a similar observation about several recent games. I do think the book is out on him a little bit among officials - a similar thing happened with Jermaine last year. It seems by your question that you think officials don’t prep for games or share notes on teams, which would be an incorrect assumption. I’m not alleging a conspiracy; but I think there has been an over-correction to Fatts getting a lot of trips to the line earlier in the year.

I feel like blaming Fatts and his shot selection for the team’s recent slump is inverting the analysis. I think the tendency for Fatts to force offense over the last couple of weeks is a result of the team falling apart and the burden of trying to carry the offense falling on his shoulders. No doubt that is coinciding with teams paying increased attention to him and developing a better plan against him as they get more and more film of him. I also wouldn’t discount the physical toll his body has taken over the course of the year and the impact that is having. I’m just not sure where people want the points to come from if Fatts isn’t supposed to try to create some for himself. We don’t have the personnel or the offensive system to take much of the load off of his shoulders unfortunately.

[Billyboy78]

BTW, we missed 18 free throws last night.....18!!!!!...is that a school record?

[ramster]

4-5 times?

I saw none. But even if you give him those 4/5 fouls, his shooting when not among those 4-5 times the Refs decided not to call fouls just on Russell, his shooting was way off. Most shots were not even close.

And if he is so tired then why does Cox put him Back in the game with ( 5 minutes you go and down 23 points? The game was over. Rest him if fatigue is the reason for his diminished effectiveness.

Let him sit out the UMASS game and rest up for NY. I’d vote for that in a NY Minute.

[FDshoes]

BTW, I was so excited when I saw Antwan Walker play his first couple of games. I remember some nice work around the rim and some beautiful passes from high to low post or kicking out to the wing. Since then, what the hell happened?

Been wondering the same, he barely plays now.

Least amount if minutes out of the 8 scholly players yesterday.

He is horrible on defense.

[FDshoes]

4-5 times?

I saw none. But even if you give him those 4/5 fouls his shooting when not among those 4-5 times the Refs decided not to call fouls just on Russell, his shooting was way off. Most shots were not even close.

And if he is so tired then why does Cox put him Bach in the game with ( minutes you go and down 23? Rest him if fatigue is the reason for his diminished effectiveness.

Let him sit out the UMASS game and rest up for NY. I’d vote for that in a NY Minute.

Because its not fatigue young kids playing 35 minutes a game 30 times over the course of the season dors not wear you out.

[RF1]

BTW, we missed 18 free throws last night.....18!!!!!...is that a school record?

17-35 (.486) from the line for a game is just atrocious for a D1 college team. Cyril was 2-8, Martin 2-6, and Long 1-4. I understand that most big men struggle from the line but Cyril is even below average for that position. Martin is typically better but Long is really bad for a player that likes to heave up 3 pt attempts. Mekhi is just 23-42 (.540) for the season in free throws. That is downright ugly for a non big man.

[MARhody]

Long night for sure...agree with a lot of what has been said, but I'd also recognize that Dayton is a VERY good team. It seemed like they were looking to make sure there was distance between them and the 2nd/3rd best team in the conference and they accomplished that barely breaking a sweat. I have been coming to games for a long time, not as long as many on these board, but long enough to see some excellent teams (Cheney's Temple teams, St.Joe's and their near undefeated run, etc.) and this Dayton team might be the best? To go along with Obi, a complete team where so many can score, they are unselfish, they help each other on defense, the offense in half court has many options, they can fast break, are well coached, etc. etc. etc. Their only weakness might be Obi having to defend a true high post big? Langevine got around him a couple times early on with success, but then down by so many it seemed like the inside game was abandoned. Tough night at the FT line (17-35 vs Dayton 18-21), among other disappointing stats.

Got there early and enjoyed the Dayton "dunk" show in the pre-game. Quite impressive, and not just Obi. Self lobs, alley oops, good stuff, a team clearly having some fun and working well together as a single unit. The athleticism across the board was something to see. Early departure meant I missed Green and Dadika, feel like they should have been in earlier given that the game was decided with 8:00 left, if not prior to that. Hated the Fatts T, but he had already been put on notice by the officials for the situation a few plays before where he thought he was thrown to the ground (did not appear to be the case and the Dayton player immediately went to help him up but he refused the hand). That was a tough spot, but not too much later the favor was returned with a T on Dayton for something similar. With the game out of reach, the fouls came hot and heavy to make sure nothing got out of hand, which I was ok with, game control stuff.

And thanks for all the parking tips. I have made it a point to park towards the back end of the lot and take back roads out of there (Tootell Rd/Plains Rd) with success (always parking with front end out). Though last night was helped in that many had already left before I did. Thumbs down to the construction that had Route 4 North down to a single lane just before 95 so got home a shade before 1am. Ah well.

I'm not stepping off the bandwagon and will continue to cheer for the team from afar vs UMass and a-10 tourney, but with lower expectations. At this point I would be surprised with a deep run in the a-10, but anything is possible. I have the calendar clear in case they make the final on 3/15 to scoot on down to support them in person. Certainly some work to do for next season, but can cross that bridge when we get there.

Go Rhody!

[ramster]

4-5 times?

I saw none. But even if you give him those 4/5 fouls his shooting when not among those 4-5 times the Refs decided not to call fouls just on Russell, his shooting was way off. Most shots were not even close.

And if he is so tired then why does Cox put him Bach in the game with ( minutes you go and down 23? Rest him if fatigue is the reason for his diminished effectiveness.

Let him sit out the UMASS game and rest up for NY. I’d vote for that in a NY Minute.

Because its not fatigue young kids playing 35 minutes a game 30 times over the course of the season dors not wear you out.

I’m not saying it’s fatigue, others are.

NBA plays 82 regular season games.

Problem is some on this board look for excuses where there are none.

Sometimes players just play bad. It’s not just fatigue, injury, referees, not enough students in the stands, games scheduled to close together, games scheduled a week apart.......

Sometimes players get overrated. Sometimes players don’t get enough coaching or get the wrong coaching, sometimes players don’t mesh well on a team. Sometimes players go through times of greatness and sometimes they go through periods of poor play.

[NYGFan_Section208]

Just saw on espn.com, the section we're in, was clear in the background of one of the obi highlights.
Basically, a nice slice of our section got posterized on national tv ... by a lottery pick.
You don't get to just roll out of bed and have that happen every day...

[ramster]

Sad place 45 minutes after end if game
Sad last few weeks of season
Saturday and Next week to turn it around. Maybe best to get out of the hometown.

[theblueram]

Sad thing is we didn't even need to beat Dayton. Just had to beat Davidson and SLU. That's it. Just disgusted at where we are now compared to two weeks ago.

[TruePoint]

4-5 times?

I saw none. But even if you give him those 4/5 fouls, his shooting when not among those 4-5 times the Refs decided not to call fouls just on Russell, his shooting was way off. Most shots were not even close.

And if he is so tired then why does Cox put him Back in the game with ( 5 minutes you go and down 23 points? The game was over. Rest him if fatigue is the reason for his diminished effectiveness.

Let him sit out the UMASS game and rest up for NY. I’d vote for that in a NY Minute.

Yes, his shooting was off. Agree. I’m not sure what the point of that observation is, though. He obviously has to keep shooting - the team doesn’t have other ways to score. If he was getting the calls he was earlier in the year, he could make up some of the missing scoring from the line. It wouldn’t have mattered last night, though. The offense is way too anemic right now to beat a team like Dayton, and the issue with the offense is way bigger than Fatts’ shooting. My only point is that Fatts shooting is tough shots and the resulting poor percentage is largely a function of the offense being so bad, not the cause of it.

[ramster]

Sorry to disagree.
We are back to where we were before the 10 game winning streak. It’s not because the Referees are calling the game in Fatts differently? Please.

Russell is back to forcing shots, he is off balance, driving blindly down the middle. He is shooting the 3P, 2P and even FTs worse than during the win streak.
Russell is also getting beat by his nan more often. Not hustling and doing a lot of complaining about calls

Go back to your complaining after the Brown and Richmond games when you said the season was over. No need to play anymore.

It’s back. That simple. The passing and unselfish play and the ferocious/tenacious defense have all gone significantly missing as in prior to the Win Streak.

Just as benching Fatts after the Richmond game, similar measures are urgently needed. The players are drained emotionally and looking for a leader.

Without changing fast we will get clobbered by Richmond in NYC, if we even get that far.

[mstyles22]

Jeff needs to take over from now through the remainder of his career. Why not?

This team has won plenty of big games with him being THE guy. Time to win a few more.

[theblueram]

Sorry to disagree.
We are back to where we were before the 10 game winning streak. It’s not because the Referees are calling the game in Fatts differently? Please.

Russell is back to forcing shots, he is off balance, driving blindly down the middle. He is shooting the 3P, 2P and even FTs worse than during the win streak.
Russell is also getting beat by his nan more often. Not hustling and doing a lot of complaining about calls

Go back to your complaining after the Brown and Richmond games when you said the season was over. No need to play anymore.

It’s back. That simple. The passing and unselfish play and the ferocious/tenacious defense have all gone significantly missing as in prior to the Win Streak.

Just as benching Fatts after the Richmond game, similar measures are urgently needed. The players are drained emotionally and looking for a leader.

Without changing fast we will get clobbered by Richmond in NYC, if we even get that far.

Ramster can you explain to me why once again Cyril has been out at the 3pt line more than under the basket? This is what we were doing for the Brown/Richmond game. Who the hell is game planning these last two weeks? They should be fired. It's a horrible, horrible offensive set for sure.

[rambone 78]

The offensive sets are offensive.

It's amazing to me that the staff hasn't learned their lessons from those 2 games.

We've got problems....way too many to solve now.

[TruePoint]

Sorry to disagree.
We are back to where we were before the 10 game winning streak. It’s not because the Referees are calling the game in Fatts differently? Please.

Russell is back to forcing shots, he is off balance, driving blindly down the middle. He is shooting the 3P, 2P and even FTs worse than during the win streak.

You’re mischaracterizing what I said. I did not say or come close to implying that the thing that is hurting the team right now is that Fatts is getting less calls. My comments about that were in response to another poster saying that part of the problem is that he has resorted to trying to sell contact rather than trying to score, and I don’t think that’s an accurate read of what’s going on. I think he is playing the same way and the referees have started to officiate him differently. But this is a completely separate issue from what is going on with the team overall right now.

As for the rest of what you said, I agree that his percentages are down and that is largely due to him forcing some questionable shots, but I just think blaming the team’s struggles on that is missing what is really going on. The team has nothing on offense. Our offensive approach lacks any sort of consistent purpose or philosophy and appears to be designed just to get guys moving around. We are not identifying opponent weaknesses and designing actions to attack and exploit them, and as a result we do not create easy baskets and high percentage looks; we also do not have the personnel to overcome that with guys who can create their own shot consistently. This results in Fatts having to carry the scoring burden while facing defenses designed around the idea of not letting him beat them. It’s obvious that Fatts shooting 15 contested shots per game is not a recipe to win, but neither is taking the ball out of his hands and depending on the other players to create offense.

I’m not going to bother going around and around with you on this any more. I’ve made the same point three different times now, and none of your responses have even tried to address it - you’re just making silly arguments about the referees that are completely and totally besides the point of what I’m saying. I honestly don’t know if you’re really not understanding my point about Fatts and the offense or you’re deliberately misrepresenting it to make a straw man argument like this is a political debate, but either way I’m not going to keep trying to straighten it out. My point stands.

[rhodyfan3000]

Ignoring all of the roster issues, my biggest issues with the coaching are taking the ball out of Dowtin's hands and the treatment of Fatts. Letting Fatts play hero ball is great if he's playing like Obi Toppin...but I've watched Obi Toppin and Dayton play, and they don't even let their consensus lottery pick play hero ball. EVERY DAYTON PLAYER TOUCHES THE BALL IN THE HALF COURT.

Seriously, when's the last time you even saw a single possession that had all 5 rams touch the ball?

This team was on a winning streak when Fatts was scoring. This team gets on a losing streak when Fatts isn't scoring. It's exactly like last year. Hero ball doesn't work. ESPECIALLY when the "hero" is a wildly inconsistent shooter. That's not good coaching. It's literally the same crap we bag on Ed Cooley about.

Speaking of Cooley - compare Fatts to Pipkins. Same exact thing - except Pipkins decided to shoot his team out of games in the beginning of the year, and shoot them into them at the end. Fatts went the opposite way which is way worse.

When it comes to the treatment of our "star" - Fatts' technical and subsequent lack of punishment told me everything I needed to know. Under Hurley, it wouldn't have mattered who was available on the bench. We'd have gone with 4 forwards or Eric Dadika would've come into the game to make a point that that behavior was unacceptable. Fatts gets the superstar treatment - which causes me issues because once you tell him he's a superstar he stops producing like one. His season turned the second he made that watch list. Dude is a Philly grinder which is awesome. He loves being the underdog. The second he's out front he loses his edge.

On top of that, I feel bad for Jeff. After his sophomore year I think a lot of people saw him as having a legitimate chance at making a run at the NBA. Then we took the ball out of his hands the last 2 years instead of letting him run the show. That's the biggest problem with this whole experiment.

There's no floor general. No leadership. That's why we take so many bad shots early in the clock. It doesn't excuse the lack of effort to get back on defense, but holy hell is it pathetic basketball to watch.

The lack of BBIQ from anyone but JD is really astounding. I think it's fair to put that on the coach - and I don't mean he's supposed to get everyone up to a Jeff Dowtin IQ level. I mean he's supposed to identify his smartest player and keep the ball in his hands. The games where that doesn't happen are the games we get embarrassed in.

There's just no excuse for us not to be a tournament team this year. Once again, we didn't have to beat Dayton. We didn't have to beat Maryland, LSU, or WVU either. That much was clear. Technically, we didn't even need to beat Brown or Richmond. We were CLEARLY in the NCAA field as of a week ago with all of those losses. We were a consensus 9 seed. All we had to do was beat a shitty Davidson team and St Louis at home. We couldn't do that. We don't deserve shit.

Hopefully Coach takes a lot of lessons from this season and makes the appropriate changes. I'd really prefer to not post on this message board in the "NIT or Bust" section.

You summed this up so perfectly, so efficiently, I'm really not sure there is anything else to add.

[rhodyfan3000]

I guess I'll add my own 2 cents.

I'm really not 'surprised' by any of this, but still a bit disappointed. The team couldn't handle it's own success. Certainly this is not the first time in the decades upon decades of this program that this has happened.

I think we were all accurate with that "one game at a time" mentality. Each game was "must win". Don't look beyond the next game to what is after that. Keep your head screwed on.

And for a good long while that worked... until it didn't. Next thing you know they are mentioning Fatts in player of the year discussions, Cox in coach of the year discussions. And, well frankly, we lost containment on that whole "one game at a time" thing. Once that monster was out of it's cage, there was no putting it back in.

That's why I was a bit perturbed when, during the GW game, a giddy Steve McDonald starting announcing to the world "this team is going to the NCAA tournament!" He's been with this program for 30 years, he should know better than that.

Well, back to the drawing board. Should be another exciting year next year. Use whatever buzz there is to draw the best possible recruits. This team will still have the same issues, however, because this team for one more season will follow Fatts into battle, and he has those issues. So, for each 10 game win streak, you are going to have to accept the potential nose dive that could ensue. Please try not to act surprised when these scenarios play out.

[ramster]

Sorry to disagree.
We are back to where we were before the 10 game winning streak. It’s not because the Referees are calling the game in Fatts differently? Please.

Russell is back to forcing shots, he is off balance, driving blindly down the middle. He is shooting the 3P, 2P and even FTs worse than during the win streak.

You’re mischaracterizing what I said. I did not say or come close to implying that the thing that is hurting the team right now is that Fatts is getting less calls. My comments about that were in response to another poster saying that part of the problem is that he has resorted to trying to sell contact rather than trying to score, and I don’t think that’s an accurate read of what’s going on. I think he is playing the same way and the referees have started to officiate him differently. But this is a completely separate issue from what is going on with the team overall right now.

As for the rest of what you said, I agree that his percentages are down and that is largely due to him forcing some questionable shots, but I just think blaming the team’s struggles on that is missing what is really going on. The team has nothing on offense. Our offensive approach lacks any sort of consistent purpose or philosophy and appears to be designed just to get guys moving around. We are not identifying opponent weaknesses and designing actions to attack and exploit them, and as a result we do not create easy baskets and high percentage looks; we also do not have the personnel to overcome that with guys who can create their own shot consistently. This results in Fatts having to carry the scoring burden while facing defenses designed around the idea of not letting him beat them. It’s obvious that Fatts shooting 15 contested shots per game is not a recipe to win, but neither is taking the ball out of his hands and depending on the other players to create offense.

I’m not going to bother going around and around with you on this any more. I’ve made the same point three different times now, and none of your responses have even tried to address it - you’re just making silly arguments about the referees that are completely and totally besides the point of what I’m saying. I honestly don’t know if you’re really not understanding my point about Fatts and the offense or you’re deliberately misrepresenting it to make a straw man argument like this is a political debate, but either way I’m not going to keep trying to straighten it out. My point stands.

You are right
I’m not understanding

I just say Fatts shoots too much and in my opinion it has nothing to do with the ineptitude of others. He likes to shoot, he likes to have points in the scorebook. He is not a pass first point guard.

And no way do I think referees have adjusted to Fatts. Refs are refs.

A-10 teams and coaches have adjusted to the dribble drive the middle and force up shots but we still do it as much or more than ever.

Fatts should e stirring the Drink as a PG

I’ll look forward to Sheppard as PG next year.

[theblueram]

Sorry to disagree.
We are back to where we were before the 10 game winning streak. It’s not because the Referees are calling the game in Fatts differently? Please.

Russell is back to forcing shots, he is off balance, driving blindly down the middle. He is shooting the 3P, 2P and even FTs worse than during the win streak.

You’re mischaracterizing what I said. I did not say or come close to implying that the thing that is hurting the team right now is that Fatts is getting less calls. My comments about that were in response to another poster saying that part of the problem is that he has resorted to trying to sell contact rather than trying to score, and I don’t think that’s an accurate read of what’s going on. I think he is playing the same way and the referees have started to officiate him differently. But this is a completely separate issue from what is going on with the team overall right now.

As for the rest of what you said, I agree that his percentages are down and that is largely due to him forcing some questionable shots, but I just think blaming the team’s struggles on that is missing what is really going on. The team has nothing on offense. Our offensive approach lacks any sort of consistent purpose or philosophy and appears to be designed just to get guys moving around. We are not identifying opponent weaknesses and designing actions to attack and exploit them, and as a result we do not create easy baskets and high percentage looks; we also do not have the personnel to overcome that with guys who can create their own shot consistently. This results in Fatts having to carry the scoring burden while facing defenses designed around the idea of not letting him beat them. It’s obvious that Fatts shooting 15 contested shots per game is not a recipe to win, but neither is taking the ball out of his hands and depending on the other players to create offense.

I’m not going to bother going around and around with you on this any more. I’ve made the same point three different times now, and none of your responses have even tried to address it - you’re just making silly arguments about the referees that are completely and totally besides the point of what I’m saying. I honestly don’t know if you’re really not understanding my point about Fatts and the offense or you’re deliberately misrepresenting it to make a straw man argument like this is a political debate, but either way I’m not going to keep trying to straighten it out. My point stands.

You are right
I’m not understanding

I just say Fatts shoots too much and in my opinion it has nothing to do with the ineptitude of others. He likes to shoot, he likes to have points in the scorebook. He is not a pass first point guard.

And no way do I think referees have adjusted to Fatts. Refs are refs.

A-10 teams and coaches have adjusted to the dribble drive the middle and force up shots but we still do it as much or more than ever.

Fatts should e stirring the Drink as a PG

I’ll look forward to Sheppard as PG next year.

Sheppard? I'll look forward to Harris, Long, Toppin, Walker and Martin improving. Freshmen and transfers are a crapshoot. Meaning we shall see.

[steveystuds06]

I’d love to hear from the Cox can do no wrong posters. We are 100% out of the tournament. We were completely embarrassed in a sold out Ryan Center. Are we supposed to be ok with this total collapse or can we start questioning our coaching?

[theblueram]

I’d love to hear from the Cox can do no wrong posters. We are 100% out of the tournament. We were completely embarrassed in a sold out Ryan Center. Are we supposed to be ok with this total collapse or can we start questioning our coaching?

Have at it Stevey. The defense and offense has been offensive the last two weeks. We are 2-4 in our last 6 games. We have played our way out from should be in, to last four in, to first four out, to OUT.

[FDshoes]

I’d love to hear from the Cox can do no wrong posters. We are 100% out of the tournament. We were completely embarrassed in a sold out Ryan Center. Are we supposed to be ok with this total collapse or can we start questioning our coaching?

I was a big defender of his especially on the "roster management" aspect. But after these past 6 games i question his and his staffs ability to game plan for individual games. Without a player taking over, typically Fatts, we are toast. There seems to be zero game plan that can be sustainable for 40 minutes.

And the lack of scholarships filled going into next year is a HUGE red flag.

Not suprised we haven't seen DCrams post yet. Not calling him out i like his insight to certain thought processes. I would also stay off the board to let emotions settle down before posting again if in his shoes.

[ramster]

You’re mischaracterizing what I said. I did not say or come close to implying that the thing that is hurting the team right now is that Fatts is getting less calls. My comments about that were in response to another poster saying that part of the problem is that he has resorted to trying to sell contact rather than trying to score, and I don’t think that’s an accurate read of what’s going on. I think he is playing the same way and the referees have started to officiate him differently. But this is a completely separate issue from what is going on with the team overall right now.

As for the rest of what you said, I agree that his percentages are down and that is largely due to him forcing some questionable shots, but I just think blaming the team’s struggles on that is missing what is really going on. The team has nothing on offense. Our offensive approach lacks any sort of consistent purpose or philosophy and appears to be designed just to get guys moving around. We are not identifying opponent weaknesses and designing actions to attack and exploit them, and as a result we do not create easy baskets and high percentage looks; we also do not have the personnel to overcome that with guys who can create their own shot consistently. This results in Fatts having to carry the scoring burden while facing defenses designed around the idea of not letting him beat them. It’s obvious that Fatts shooting 15 contested shots per game is not a recipe to win, but neither is taking the ball out of his hands and depending on the other players to create offense.

I’m not going to bother going around and around with you on this any more. I’ve made the same point three different times now, and none of your responses have even tried to address it - you’re just making silly arguments about the referees that are completely and totally besides the point of what I’m saying. I honestly don’t know if you’re really not understanding my point about Fatts and the offense or you’re deliberately misrepresenting it to make a straw man argument like this is a political debate, but either way I’m not going to keep trying to straighten it out. My point stands.

You are right
I’m not understanding

I just say Fatts shoots too much and in my opinion it has nothing to do with the ineptitude of others. He likes to shoot, he likes to have points in the scorebook. He is not a pass first point guard.

And no way do I think referees have adjusted to Fatts. Refs are refs.

A-10 teams and coaches have adjusted to the dribble drive the middle and force up shots but we still do it as much or more than ever.

Fatts should e stirring the Drink as a PG

I’ll look forward to Sheppard as PG next year.

Sheppard? I'll look forward to Harris, Long, Toppin, Walker and Martin improving. Freshmen and transfers are a crapshoot. Meaning we shall see.

Yep. I heard very good things about him this past year.
I’ve also seen our PG play this past 3 weeks

We have big opportunities to improve our passing and selfish play.

[rhodyfan3000]

I saw some game films from when he was all rookie at ECU. He looked really good, so unless he regressed significantly, I think you can use those films as a gauge.

[ramster]

I’d love to hear from the Cox can do no wrong posters. We are 100% out of the tournament. We were completely embarrassed in a sold out Ryan Center. Are we supposed to be ok with this total collapse or can we start questioning our coaching?

Have at it Stevey. The defense and offense has been offensive the last two weeks. We are 2-4 in our last 6 games. We have played our way out from should be in, to last four in, to first four out, to OUT.

And thanks to Jacob Toppins great rebound, court awareness to put a shot back up then hitting 2 huge FTs vs Fordham we would be 1-5

On the bright side at least the following topics have dissipated:

Richmond plays soft and they stink
Fordham stinks and shouldn’t be in the league
Fatts would be POY if not for Toppin
Cox possibly to Boston College
Letters to The AD to get Cox more money and to keep him
NET rankings
Top 25 AP Rankings
Fatts could possibly play in the NBA

[FDshoes]

Fatts should have been the 2 all year. Jeff never did anything wrong, actually nothing but good running the point for 2 NCAA tournament teams. Then Fatts is given the rungs of the offense and Jeff's production has taken a huge hit.

I am actually intrigued about Wood next year. A pass first PG, if he is solid on defense and limits TOs give him a chance.

[theblueram]

Fatts should have been the 2 all year. Jeff never did anything wrong, actually nothing but good running the point for 2 NCAA tournament teams. Then Fatts is given the rungs of the offense and Jeff's production has taken a huge hit.

I am actually intrigued about Wood next year. A pass first PG, if he is solid on defense and limits TOs give him a chance.

Fatts is playing pg and Cox's career seems bent on it. If I was a Vegas man, I would run.

[FDshoes]

Levying your career on Fatts doesnt seem like a wise business decision.

[Rhody72]

Just some comments:
1. The team ran out of gas physically AFTER bye week. Go figure!
2. Fatts and no-calls: Who initiated contact?
3. JD as off-guard: Where are those that had no problem with it last Nov?
4. Cox: No depth means no options.
5. Walker, Long, Toppin, Martin: Will Cox be able to develop this talented group?
6. Harris: Didn't deserve the honor of starting.

[FDshoes]

Just some comments:
1. The team ran out of gas physically AFTER bye week. Go figure!
2. Fatts and no-calls: Who initiated contact?
3. JD as off-guard: Where are those that had no problem with it last Nov?
4. Cox: No depth means no options.
5. Walker, Long, Toppin, Martin: Will Cox be able to develop this talented group?
6. Harris: Didn't deserve the honor of starting.

1. Running out of gas after 30 games for a bunch of 19-22 year olds is BS
2. No argument there
3. Plenty questioned why Jeff was no longer running the point.
4. Majority of teams run an 8 man rotation, only Tate hurt the "depth" issue
5. Agree there
6. Who else should have? Walker isnt anything special and Toppin doesnt have the strength yet to play down low.

[theblueram]

Just some comments:
1. The team ran out of gas physically AFTER bye week. Go figure!
2. Fatts and no-calls: Who initiated contact?
3. JD as off-guard: Where are those that had no problem with it last Nov?
4. Cox: No depth means no options.
5. Walker, Long, Toppin, Martin: Will Cox be able to develop this talented group?
6. Harris: Didn't deserve the honor of starting.

1. Running out of gas after 30 games for a bunch of 19-22 year olds is BS
2. No argument there
3. Plenty questioned why Jeff was no longer running the point.
4. Majority of teams run an 8 man rotation, only Tate hurt the "depth" issue
5. Agree there
6. Who else should have? Walker isnt anything special and Toppin doesnt have the strength yet to play down low.

#3. The biggest failure I have seen of not playing a player to his full potential. Jeff was an awesome PG and Cox stifled that. Unbelievable.

[FDshoes]

Yup Jarvis goes down jeff steps up as a freshman and leads an upperclass dominant team to the dance. I agree with this 100%

[BlackDogRants]

Really should have a Cox specific thread. I have plenty to say about him and it seems so do a lot of people in this thread. Majority of the posts here mention something negative about how he’s been running things.

[Rhody72]

Just some comments:
1. The team ran out of gas physically AFTER bye week. Go figure!
2. Fatts and no-calls: Who initiated contact?
3. JD as off-guard: Where are those that had no problem with it last Nov?
4. Cox: No depth means no options.
5. Walker, Long, Toppin, Martin: Will Cox be able to develop this talented group?
6. Harris: Didn't deserve the honor of starting.

1. Running out of gas after 30 games for a bunch of 19-22 year olds is BS
2. No argument there
3. Plenty questioned why Jeff was no longer running the point.
4. Majority of teams run an 8 man rotation, only Tate hurt the "depth" issue
5. Agree there
6. Who else should have? Walker isnt anything special and Toppin doesnt have the strength yet to play down low.

1. Players are tired. Their legs are gone.
3. Some did; many didn't.
4. Toppin, Long and Walker not physically able to compete this year.
6. Rotate starters based on performance. Create competition for the honor of being a starter.

[FDshoes]

Just some comments:
1. The team ran out of gas physically AFTER bye week. Go figure!
2. Fatts and no-calls: Who initiated contact?
3. JD as off-guard: Where are those that had no problem with it last Nov?
4. Cox: No depth means no options.
5. Walker, Long, Toppin, Martin: Will Cox be able to develop this talented group?
6. Harris: Didn't deserve the honor of starting.

1. Running out of gas after 30 games for a bunch of 19-22 year olds is BS
2. No argument there
3. Plenty questioned why Jeff was no longer running the point.
4. Majority of teams run an 8 man rotation, only Tate hurt the "depth" issue
5. Agree there
6. Who else should have? Walker isnt anything special and Toppin doesnt have the strength yet to play down low.

1. Players are tired. Their legs are gone.
3. Some did; many didn't.
4. Toppin, Long and Walker not physically able to compete this year.
6. Rotate starters based on performance. Create competition for the honor of being a starter.

Still say #1 is a cop out excuse and not reality at all, if what you say in #4 is true then who the hell is left to start aver Harris in #6?

[FDshoes]

"Players are tired" is a load of . Go thru the majority of rosters of top D1 programs guards play a boat load of minutes. These are kids playing roughly 30 games over 3-4 months 35 minutes a game is NOT going to wear them out!