The David Cox Era

NorthernRamFan · Unread post by **NorthernRamFan** » 6 years ago

ms1111 wrote:Rambone - is Macon officially not coming? Or is he still in play?

Last I heard SLU increased Macon’s salary by almost 100k and that put him out of reach for us... again I reiterate. They need to hire young and hungry!

RF1 · Unread post by **RF1** » 6 years ago

NorthernRamFan wrote:
Last I heard SLU increased Macon’s salary by almost 100k and that put him out of reach for us... again I reiterate. They need to hire young and hungry!

You might as well also add inexperienced and cheap.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 6 years ago

That is correct. We offered more than he was making at St. Louis, and then they countered with more than we offered.

Not sure of the exact numbers, but I think we offered more than 200K a year. There goes the 1st choice.

giovanni · Unread post by **giovanni** » 6 years ago

jcru · Unread post by **jcru** » 6 years ago

You can be both, but it's rarer than you would think. Rick Pitino is both.

Jim Harrick, to a lesser extent was both.

It's not a bad stigma to be a good recruiter, if you actually are one. Being a good recruiter, is kind of like being suave with the ladies.

You know the guy who can approach any girl at the club and get her number? A good recruiter is kind of like that.

Then, to be a good X's and O's coach too. That's big

Seawrightspostgame · Unread post by **Seawrightspostgame** » 6 years ago

Certainly not an encouraging article for basketball, but encouraging article for the team that hired David Cox as their coach.

Cameron_Dollar · Unread post by **Cameron_Dollar** » 6 years ago

Rhody74,
I'm curious who you consider to be also rans. If you share the names, we could track them during the David Cox era and could compare their performance to Coach Cox. Who the hell are you to call any D1 coach that applies for a better position an also ran. it takes a tremendous amount of hard work, sacrifice, low pay and plenty of rejection to make it to this level of coaching, unless you are Richard Pitino.

CT Rhody · Unread post by **CT Rhody** » 6 years ago

Just read a sporting news article that predicted the A-10 next year and had us 8th. It highlighted Adams recommitment so it’s pretty recent.

rhodylaw · Unread post by **rhodylaw** » 6 years ago

CT Rhody wrote:Just read a sporting news article that predicted the A-10 next year and had us 8th. It highlighted Adams recommitment so it’s pretty recent.

8th??? That is absurd. No worse than 6th. League is graduating a lot of guys, new coaches in place. I would be shocked if we ended the season worse than 4th, but I could see someone predicting 5th or 6th

Rhody74 · Unread post by **Rhody74** » 6 years ago

Cameron_Dollar wrote:Rhody74,
I'm curious who you consider to be also rans. If you share the names, we could track them during the David Cox era and could compare their performance to Coach Cox. Who the hell are you to call any D1 coach that applies for a better position an also ran. it takes a tremendous amount of hard work, sacrifice, low pay and plenty of rejection to make it to this level of coaching, unless you are Richard Pitino.

Lighten up Francis. By “also ran” I just meant the guys who weren’t hired.

Cameron_Dollar · Unread post by **Cameron_Dollar** » 6 years ago

Most of you on this board consider the URI job a top job. It is not. We are witnessing first hand with the limited funds available for a top assistant and the empty promise of a top rate practice facility. Most of you on this board were not interested in anyone but Cox. The reality is, there wasn't much interest in the job from anyone that would have blown us away except Pitino and we all know how that went. Dan did a great job, but everything broke right. St. Joe's had three big season-long injuries, we were an experienced, senior laden team and the rest of the conference was really down this year. it would be unrealistic to expect the same results next year. Without any basis of fact, I would expect St. Joes, VCU and Dayton to come roaring back and UMASS has had a two above average recruiting classes with an experienced D1 coach in his second year. I would rather see the conference on the upswing where we have to bring it every night that coast through the conference schedule when the perennial good programs are down.

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 6 years ago

This post was like talking to my toddler who starts a sentence talking about one thing and by the end of that same sentence has moved onto an entirely different thing.

But to your first point, I think people here have a pretty good understanding of where this job ranks in college basketball hierarchy. Our fans also want to see this program move out of that neighborhood and be a national program at or above the level that, say, Dayton has been for a decade-plus. I’m not sure what coaches you were looking for that would have blown you away, but obviously nobody is leaving an elite program where they’ve had the kind of success that would excite URI fans to come coach at URI. You’re picking from three lots: washed out or disgraced former elite coaches, up-and-coming coaches who are moving up from lower level programs, or future-star coaches currently working as assistants who you are trying to give their first job to before they are “discovered” by anyone else. None of those profiles is automatically better than the others, it’s about who/what is the best fit for the program at the time - URI has had some success with all three profiles, but all come with some degree of risk. When I looked around the landscape, I’m not sure who you’ve identified as someone that would have blown you away, but I didn’t see anyone. Some quality coaches, for sure, but nobody better suited to take over this particular program at this particular time than the guy they hired. Probably the only guy they could’ve hired that actually does excite me, to be honest. Some unknowns, but lots and lots of upside.

To your second point, anyone expecting next year to unfold exactly how last year did is delusional, but I also think to expect that URI is just going to fade back to the back half of the league and stay there is selling the talent in the program (and on the way) well short. I also think it’s a joke to downplay the quality of the 2017-18 team because the league was down. If the league was a little better, as it has been in other years, maybe this URI team doesn’t start out 16-0 in the conference, but they’d have definitely been good enough to win the league or be right there at the end with a chance to do so. At its peak, this team was one of the best 15 or so teams in the country; unfortunately it peaked too early (we can all speculate about why) and they got a terrible matchup in the second round of the tournament, but to diminish how good they were is odd and absurd.

Cameron_Dollar · Unread post by **Cameron_Dollar** » 6 years ago

True Point, typical response from you and the rest of those that wear Keaney Blue colored glasses. Agree with the majority on this board and life is great. Offer dissenting opinions and be subjected to anything from petty insults to profanity laced tirades. That I can handle. It is when an opinion is rendered and the same usual suspects attack it because it is contrary to their's is what I find irritating. I was taught that the definition of a forum is one expresses an idea or opinion; and offers his or her rational to support the argument. My offerings usually come about when posts that are born from emotion are pushed forward as fact.
Example:
Dan will never leave unless he is offered his dream job.
Dan is different than other coaches because he's not motivated by money.
Andrea and the kids won't let him leave because they love it here.
If we don't sign David Cox we will lose our recruiting class and set the program back 5 years.
Dan and his family would never move to Storrs.
GoLocal never had any information right
Dan never discussed any jobs with his agent during the season because he said so.
Whether these statements were true or false at the time, they were born out of hope and as previously stated emotion. They went on ad nauseam. What also gets misconstrued here is to be in the minority on certain takes is considered to be an enemy to the cause. That is so not true. Maybe it's because I have experienced many more disappointments than celebrations with this program. Or maybe it's that I grow older and more tired by the day. In any event, this has been a disappointing off season and my fear is when the assistant coach is named it will only get worse. And for what it's worth, not the first time my mind has been compared to that of a toddler.

RhodyKyle · Unread post by **RhodyKyle** » 6 years ago

Didn't Dayton just lose like 5 kids who were on the day 1 roster last season? Maybe we wait and see how they fill those scholarships before declaring them to be back to the Dayton of old?

Running Ram · Unread post by **Running Ram** » 6 years ago

Seriously c dollar, you're mashing up several subjects with a heavy dose of pessimism and acting like we're all fools for having high expectations. High expectations are the point!! Off-season is when we are supposed to see the possibilities as bright. You're also putting words into peoples mouths, who said we would have a repeat performance in the conference this season? Who was it that didn't realize the A10 was in a 'down' year and who is it that doesn't expect the competition in the A10 to increase this year as coaches get acclimated and players experience increase?

Most of us here have followed the program for a long time and for many of us that have, we realize there is plenty of reason for optimism. The future still looks bright and as long as Bjorn and Dooley are at the helm we will be a "basketball" school. Sure HOFer's weren't clamoring for a chance to get the HC spot, but we are in a great spot with better infrastructure than ever. I'm as excited as ever to see what the future holds for the program, DH saw a ceiling here, I think he's wrong and I think DC could take us to new heights, I'm not saying we're going to the final four next season, but that we continue to be top tier in the A10, keeping the interest in the program high and the facilities growing. I see us being the flag ship program of the A10 and that has always been a top 25 type of team, when it was Temple, St.Joes, Umass, Xavier, Dayton, VCU, all were legitimately among the best teams in the country. The A10 always has at least one program, sometimes 2 or 3 programs in and around the top 25. Stop focusing on past disappointments and look at the possibilities. I'd say you're allowed to be disappointed if we slide back to mid pack A10 where we peak every 4 years with an NIT invite, but at this point that shouldn't be the expectation.

Unread post by **ATPTourFan** » 6 years ago

Keep in mind that the slow state hiring process resulted in some of our previous assistants living secretly at Hampton Inn until they could be officially hired.

Cameron_Dollar · Unread post by **Cameron_Dollar** » 6 years ago

Running Ram,
Points well taken. However, keep in mind that although the emotional commitment may be there from Thorr and Dooley, the financial commitment is not. Businesses that are under capitalized often fail or at the very least work tirelessly to keep their heads above water. The same holds true for professional sports and college athletic programs. There may be an exception here or there, but historically those that spend the most win the most. Until there is a major commitment to be a top spending program year after year in the A10, we will never be a perennial contender for the regular season nor tourney championship, as well as annual appearances in the NCAA Tournament. Until the two aforementioned gentlemen can secure increased funding from the state (a longshot) or increase donor contributions (a bigger longshot), they must make do with what they have. This means
only select charter flights, no elite practice facility in the near future and limited funds for top assistants. I have yet to have one person on this board or anywhere for that matter tell me if an offer was really made to Hurley for what was reported, where were the funds to back it up. My contention all along has been that the biggest gift that both Dan and Thorr received was Pittsburgh's interest. It allowed Hurley's people to leverage Pitt against UCONN while Thorr throwing out numbers and promises of amenities that he knew could never supported. Everyone saved face. My other contention is that there was a deal in place even prior to Ollie being dismissed by UCONN and that everything was basically in place except crossing a few T's and dotting a few I's. Let the barrage begin.

Obadiah · Unread post by **Obadiah** » 6 years ago

Cameron_Dollar wrote: Until the two aforementioned gentlemen can secure increased funding from the state (a longshot) or increase donor contributions (a bigger longshot), they must make do with what they have. in.

I cannot disagree with much of your contention, but why do you believe that Thorr cannot increase donor contributions and calling the action a bigger long shot than getting money from the State????

Blue Man · Unread post by **Blue Man** » 6 years ago

Cameron_Dollar wrote:True Point, typical response from you and the rest of those that wear Keaney Blue colored glasses. Agree with the majority on this board and life is great. Offer dissenting opinions and be subjected to anything from petty insults to profanity laced tirades. That I can handle. It is when an opinion is rendered and the same usual suspects attack it because it is contrary to their's is what I find irritating. I was taught that the definition of a forum is one expresses an idea or opinion; and offers his or her rational to support the argument. My offerings usually come about when posts that are born from emotion are pushed forward as fact.
Example:
Dan will never leave unless he is offered his dream job.
Dan is different than other coaches because he's not motivated by money.
Andrea and the kids won't let him leave because they love it here.
If we don't sign David Cox we will lose our recruiting class and set the program back 5 years.
Dan and his family would never move to Storrs.
GoLocal never had any information right
Dan never discussed any jobs with his agent during the season because he said so.
Whether these statements were true or false at the time, they were born out of hope and as previously stated emotion. They went on ad nauseam. What also gets misconstrued here is to be in the minority on certain takes is considered to be an enemy to the cause. That is so not true. Maybe it's because I have experienced many more disappointments than celebrations with this program. Or maybe it's that I grow older and more tired by the day. In any event, this has been a disappointing off season and my fear is when the assistant coach is named it will only get worse. And for what it's worth, not the first time my mind has been compared to that of a toddler.

Just to respond to your examples:
Dan will never leave unless he is offered his dream job - Correct. He was offered his dream job which pretty much makes all other points moot.
Dan is different than other coaches because he's not motivated by money - See answer to point #1.
Andrea and the kids won't let him leave because they love it here. - See answer to point #1. They're only an hour away from here, and an hour closer to home, regardless.
If we don't sign David Cox we will lose our recruiting class and set the program back 5 years. - Yeah, that's pretty accurate. You think Tate, Harris, and Martin just happened to love winter time in Kingston regardless of the coach? Or that maybe they had an inkling that the coach who recruited them was going to be HC. No one commits to a school. They commit to coaches.
Dan and his family would never move to Storrs. - See answer to point #1
GoLocal never had any information right - Correct. So you're discounting everything Dan Hurley said because it doesn't fit your narrative, but Bob Terino is gospel now? Did Donors want Pitino? Absolutely. Did Donors reach out to Pitino's people and construct what they imagined would be an offer URI could make and then call the athletic department and tell them that's what would happen? More than likely. Did certain donors get pissed when Thorr's response reminded them that it's not the late 90's and Ron Petro/the good ol boys club weren't running things any more? Yup. Is it plausible to think that maybe Thorr said to the donors that Dooley wouldn't allow Pitino just to shut the donors up? Also more than likely.
Dan never discussed any jobs with his agent during the season because he said so. - I'll give you that point, and I think anyone who thinks about it should understand that's exactly the case. If you're not happy with the support you get at your job - do you just broadcast out there that you're looking for a new job? Or do you put out feelers in the back ground to keep your options open? Of course Dan discussed other jobs. Does that mean he wanted to win here any less? That he was just mailing it in down the stretch? You really don't know Dan Hurley at all then.

The one thing that those of us on the board who were confident in Dan staying had wrong was what he considered his dream job. Anyone's "dream" scenario renders every other point of logic irrelevant.

Just because we all discounted UConn as a premier program doesn't mean Dan did. It was widely known that Dan wasn't going to be here "forever" and that he had one job left in him. He called it a "big" job.

The same way that some fans consider URI or South County as the best thing ever. "Best" is subjective. From our perspective why would you ever leave here? We're biased. We didn't play basketball in the Big East in the 90's. We didn't grow up in a basketball family that revered and respected Jim Calhoun. It's a matter of perspective. I really don't get why some people don't understand this.

Cameron_Dollar · Unread post by **Cameron_Dollar** » 6 years ago

Obie,
From what i see and hear URI does not have a strong lobbying presence at the state house and the only potential donor increase will come from younger alumni, most of whom are not in a position to become major donors.

Blue Man, you speak of Hurley like you have Sunday dinner with him. Go back and check the posts. I stated from the get go that a)UCONN could be elite again b)Dan had a deal in place c)he was like a stock that had reached a high and was time to sell.
Also you did not attack my theory on the whole Thorr, Pitt and UCONN scenario. On that I heard crickets. I would love to get your take.

RhodyRams12 · Unread post by **RhodyRams12** » 6 years ago

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 6 years ago

If boosters were willing to help with any offer to Dan, then they could also help with the assistants pool.

Even with that, there should be enough money coming in so URI could at least increase that pool more than they did.

There already is evidence that we have offered candidates more, in order to get them to come here.

Good news on the Nevada game.

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 6 years ago

Answers below in bold.

Cameron_Dollar wrote:True Point, typical response from you and the rest of those that wear Keaney Blue colored glasses. Agree with the majority on this board and life is great. Offer dissenting opinions and be subjected to anything from petty insults to profanity laced tirades. That I can handle. It is when an opinion is rendered and the same usual suspects attack it because it is contrary to their's is what I find irritating. I was taught that the definition of a forum is one expresses an idea or opinion; and offers his or her rational to support the argument. My offerings usually come about when posts that are born from emotion are pushed forward as fact.

There is no requirement that you "agree with the majority." The pushback you're getting from me has nothing to do with the fact that you're offering a "dissenting opinion." Dissenting opinions are welcomed because they further the discussion and sharpen the arguments on both sides. The pushback you're getting from me is based on the fact that I don't think the opinions you're putting out are very good. You're saying that other people's arguments are based on emotion and not fact, which is a common theme from trolls here, but you are not supporting what you're saying with anything beyond conclusory statements that I think are very questionable based on the facts as I know and understand them

Example:
1. Dan will never leave unless he is offered his dream job.
2. Dan is different than other coaches because he's not motivated by money.
3. Andrea and the kids won't let him leave because they love it here.
4. If we don't sign David Cox we will lose our recruiting class and set the program back 5 years.
5. Dan and his family would never move to Storrs.
6. GoLocal never had any information right
7. Dan never discussed any jobs with his agent during the season because he said so.

You've got the wrong guy for most of these. I've numbered them to make responding easier. I never signed onto 2, 5 or 7. 1 and 3 are probably still defensible even in light of recent events, although I never claimed to have personal insight into this and believed it a little less than other people did. 4 is undoubtedly true, although that alone would not have convinced me to support Cox as a candidate for HC if I didn't think he was the best choice. 6 is a joke - to the extent golocal was presenting any of their Pitino bullshit as reporting on what the actual school and athletic department was doing, they never had anything right. I do not doubt that there were boosters confused about what decade it is trying to pull levers behind the scenes, but there was never any chance of Pitino being the coach at URI, so the reporting was either god awful or intentionally misleading. In either case, golocal is a laughingstock.

Whether these statements were true or false at the time, they were born out of hope and as previously stated emotion. They went on ad nauseam. What also gets misconstrued here is to be in the minority on certain takes is considered to be an enemy to the cause. That is so not true. Maybe it's because I have experienced many more disappointments than celebrations with this program. Or maybe it's that I grow older and more tired by the day. In any event, this has been a disappointing off season and my fear is when the assistant coach is named it will only get worse. And for what it's worth, not the first time my mind has been compared to that of a toddler.

This is the exact kind of thing that have taken exception to. You criticize others for making arguments on emotion but not facts. What are the facts supporting the assertions that this offseason has been a disappointment? If you're disappointed, that is your right and I'm not going to tell you how to feel, but my opinion is that the thoughts underlying that disappointment are off base. This program is, holistically, as healthy as it has ever been. While this offseason presented some inevitable change with seniors graduating and the head coach leaving, there was nothing that could have been done to prevent either of those outcomes. Hiring Cox gives the program its best chance to continue along the path it has been traveling. Any time you change coaches, there will be some unknowns, but you couldn't have given yourself a better shot at keeping things moving in the same direction.

Cameron_Dollar wrote:Running Ram,
Points well taken. However, keep in mind that although the emotional commitment may be there from Thorr and Dooley, the financial commitment is not. Businesses that are under capitalized often fail or at the very least work tirelessly to keep their heads above water. The same holds true for professional sports and college athletic programs. There may be an exception here or there, but historically those that spend the most win the most. Until there is a major commitment to be a top spending program year after year in the A10, we will never be a perennial contender for the regular season nor tourney championship, as well as annual appearances in the NCAA Tournament.

This is the kind of take that is driving me nuts right now. You are far from alone in making it, if that makes you feel any better. It seems like there is a segment of our fan base that is MAD that are not operating with a bigger budget. As in life, URI basketball can only spend the money that it has. If you want them to spend more money, nothing is stopping you from donating more.

That aside, yes there is generally a correlation between budget and success - if there were not any correlation, why would anyone spend any money, ever? But all fields are littered with examples of well run outfits overseen by smart people doing more with less. These are not examples of people getting lucky, they are examples of the value of good leadership and of thoughtful, intelligent and strategic approaches. The best URI can do is deploy the resources at their disposal in the most effective way they can. If they succeed, it will lead to more resources. This is a model that can be sustained and that will allow the program to experience continued growth. As always, there is a high degree of difficulty and success is not guaranteed, but I'm not hearing a lot of better solutions being offered by the perpetual complainers (beyond "spend more moneys!!1!1!")

Until the two aforementioned gentlemen can secure increased funding from the state (a longshot) or increase donor contributions (a bigger longshot), they must make do with what they have. This means only select charter flights, no elite practice facility in the near future and limited funds for top assistants. I have yet to have one person on this board or anywhere for that matter tell me if an offer was really made to Hurley for what was reported, where were the funds to back it up. My contention all along has been that the biggest gift that both Dan and Thorr received was Pittsburgh's interest. It allowed Hurley's people to leverage Pitt against UCONN while Thorr throwing out numbers and promises of amenities that he knew could never supported. Everyone saved face. My other contention is that there was a deal in place even prior to Ollie being dismissed by UCONN and that everything was basically in place except crossing a few T's and dotting a few I's. Let the barrage begin.

This, while typically disjointed (again a paragraph starts off being about one thing and ends up being about an entirely different thing), I actually agree with. I'm just not sure what point you're trying to make, or how you think it relates to or supports any of the other points you're trying to make. Look, to root for URI to do well in college basketball is to support a guerrilla operation. We are not blue bloods. We are insurgents. There are always going to be institutional challenges and financial obstacles, at least until we've sustained success without lapse for an extended period of time, and even then there will always be better funded programs with more resources and more historical success. If you can't embrace the beauty in that, just root for Kentucky.

Seawrightspostgame · Unread post by **Seawrightspostgame** » 6 years ago

IDK how you can bring up DH quotes now that he is gone. The "1 job left in him" talk and all the talk about his loyalty and what not was stuff to use when a troll said Hurley was leaving. All of it. Everything was used as rationalization of why he would or would not stay. Now that he is gone? None of it matters. It's all over. Doesn't matter if his family likes the beach. It doesn't preclude him from leaving URI and UConn doesn't preclude him from going to the beach.

It only ever mattered to say that he would only leave for a huge job was because people wanted him to stay at URI. Now that he is gone, it doesn't matter what job he left for. Doesn't matter what he said or how he said it. He had a good run and did some heavy lifting. Thanks. The guy is competing against URI right now. And has been for a little more than a month.

C dollar, you're late to the party. You're basically doing a meltdown a month too late after DH is gone. Youre posts would have been par for the course when Hurley left. Obviously URI is limited today. You can't get into following URI and then turn around and realize it's not Syracuse. It is what it is. The hope is that the program can continue the recent success and parlay that into an elevated position where the team is always competing for the fun stuff.

RF1 · Unread post by **RF1** » 6 years ago

TruePoint wrote:It seems like there is a segment of our fan base that is MAD that are not operating with a bigger budget. As in life, URI basketball can only spend the money that it has.

That segment of the fan base exists because URI DOES HAVE MORE MONEY from and for the program at this time.

The 2018 NCAA units this past year will bring in an additional 400K for the next six years. (This is on top of the nearly 400K it is currently getting for the next five seasons from the 2017 NCAA Tournament.)

The school saw a significant increase in ticket revenue last year with the highest ever average attendance in the Ryan Center (likely amounts to several 100K more revenue).

David Cox will net some 300-400k less than what Dan Hurley made this past season (and some 1.3M less than it supposedly offered Hurley to stay).

URI will receive 1M as a buyout with Hurley leaving.

These are all additional monies that URI did not have LY that are currently available. None of this can be disputed. How then can someone claim there is currently no money for upgrades to the program. Making a statement that the money is not presently there for upgrades seems very disingenuous given the facts.

Seawrightspostgame · Unread post by **Seawrightspostgame** » 6 years ago

But who is saying they aren't upgrading?

RF1 · Unread post by **RF1** » 6 years ago

Seawrightspostgame wrote:But who is saying they aren't upgrading?

It is implied by the lack of a significant public commitment to things such as staff salary and increased charter flights. While Thorr may not have 100% ruled these out, he has also not specifically endorsed or guaranteed them with his public comments and new contract with Cox. Given the history of how things work at URI, it has some fans troubled.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 6 years ago

RF1 +1000

We're only talking about an extra 100K or so for the asst pool, which could make a definite positive difference.

Thorr talking about "all the fun stuff" but he forgot that it takes a little more to get the right people in here to help make it happen.

SPG, maybe they are....but we don't know for sure...until we do, it's open for debate.

Seawrightspostgame · Unread post by **Seawrightspostgame** » 6 years ago

rambone 78 wrote:RF1 +1000

We're only talking about an extra 100K or so for the asst pool, which could make a definite positive difference.

Thorr talking about "all the fun stuff" but he forgot that it takes a little more to get the right people in here to help make it happen.

SPG, maybe they are....but we don't know for sure...until we do, it's open for debate.

You are right. I will keep the faith.

I also am under the impression the practice facility is coming. My source says that and he is ahead of most on things.

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 6 years ago

RF1 wrote:
Seawrightspostgame wrote:But who is saying they aren't upgrading?

It is implied by the lack of a significant public commitment to things such as staff salary and increased charter flights. While Thorr may not have 100% ruled these out, he has also not specifically endorsed or guaranteed them with his public comments and new contract with Cox. Given the history of how things work at URI, it has some fans troubled.

I think you are completely wrong and foolishly shortsighted about this. All of this is based on not wanting to give Van Macon 400k? I’d be more mad if we did that considering the other budgetary priorities facing this program.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 6 years ago

Well Thorr did say he would be open to making adjustments depending on what DC wants for the program.

We will see what those are as time goes on.

Yes TP if that is indeed what we needed to get Macon, then that's not realistic at this time.

If we offered him 300K then I would think that's enough to get a very solid AHC here....hopefully.

And obviously that means that the 425K total pool is already being adjusted upward.

Seawrightspostgame · Unread post by **Seawrightspostgame** » 6 years ago

I don't think Van Macon makes or breaks this program. We just lost Dan Hurley? Think that is more significant?

I think Cox and Boswell will prove to be better 10 years from now than they are considered today. AAU gives people a bad reputation. Think of how nice the kids out of Expressions Elite have been. Very good citizens and thoughtful young men.

Running Ram · Unread post by **Running Ram** » 6 years ago

I personally have no problems with your theories on how the coaching changes all went down and the timing etc..

Cameron_Dollar wrote:I have yet to have one person on this board or anywhere for that matter tell me if an offer was really made to Hurley for what was reported, where were the funds to back it up. My contention all along has been that the biggest gift that both Dan and Thorr received was Pittsburgh's interest. It allowed Hurley's people to leverage Pitt against UCONN while Thorr throwing out numbers and promises of amenities that he knew could never supported. Everyone saved face. My other contention is that there was a deal in place even prior to Ollie being dismissed by UCONN and that everything was basically in place except crossing a few T's and dotting a few I's. Let the barrage begin.

I believe it's all plausible.

I'm just over it now. I've convinced myself that I convinced myself that DH was becoming a great coach, now I have convinced myself that the strides he made towards becoming more flexible as a coach were due to the arrival and work of David Cox. You see how that works? I can tell myself all off-season that all this was really a stroke of good luck because Cox will probably be a better HC. Ahh off-season optimism, I love it! Furthermore, I've mentioned the ceiling that I think DH saw here, I think that ceiling is his, he seems to think only by recruiting 5* players will he ever be able to compete for a NC, I say a better coach can take 3 and 4* players and fully compete at the highest levels. I think Cox has a chance to shatter that ceiling. Again, I don't think it's any coincidence that things really turned around when Dan stopped rotating his assistants on game scouting and Cox began to be the primary scout for upcoming games. And there you have it, take a few positives, create your own narrative and vouala we're going to be National Champs!!

This is how off-season optimism works me up into a frenzy of high expectations by the time games come around, I imagine recruits being world beaters, coaches being innovative...

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 6 years ago

Calhoun made a habit out of making 3 star players national champs....Izzo has done it too......

UConn has never really had many 4 and 5 stars....if they do, they bolt ha ha.....lately anyway.

bigappleram · Unread post by **bigappleram** » 6 years ago

The other thing of note here, is by all accounts within last year's budget we had a very competent assistant coaching staff (Cox, Moore, Boswell, etc).
Why can't we have a similarly competent staff with the same or even slightly larger budget. It's like the sky is falling bc we "may" be operating under the same budget parameters as our last fiscal year. Unless I am missing something we had 1 of the better AHCs in the region on staff (Cox), a former HC at a low major (Moore) and a New England AAU guru (Boswell) on staff. Can't we replicate that formula with the same or slightly larger budget?

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 6 years ago

bigappleram wrote:The other thing of note here, is by all accounts within last year's budget we had a very competent assistant coaching staff (Cox, Moore, Boswell, etc).
Why can't we have a similarly competent staff with the same or even slightly larger budget. It's like the sky is falling bc we "may" be operating under the same budget parameters as our last fiscal year. Unless I am missing something we had 1 of the better AHCs in the region on staff (Cox), a former HC at a low major (Moore) and a New England AAU guru (Boswell) on staff. Can't we replicate that formula with the same or slightly larger budget?

I would say no.....why here goes...

Cox was hired several years ago, when rates for AC's were a little less than they are now...

Moore took the job because he was still being paid by Quinnipiac and with the URI pay was still making 500K a year....

And it was Boswell's first assistant gig, and it was a major raise over what he was getting before.

If DC is indeed looking for assts with strong experience, then what we are offering simply doesn't cut it at this level.

The only people who will take what we are offering are most likely coachs from lower level conferences, and who likely have less experience imo.

Blue Man · Unread post by **Blue Man** » 6 years ago

Cameron_Dollar wrote:Obie,
From what i see and hear URI does not have a strong lobbying presence at the state house and the only potential donor increase will come from younger alumni, most of whom are not in a position to become major donors.

Blue Man, you speak of Hurley like you have Sunday dinner with him. Go back and check the posts. I stated from the get go that a)UCONN could be elite again b)Dan had a deal in place c)he was like a stock that had reached a high and was time to sell.
Also you did not attack my theory on the whole Thorr, Pitt and UCONN scenario. On that I heard crickets. I would love to get your take.

You're absolutely correct that URI doesn't have a strong lobbying presence at the state house. So none of the money to make anything that Dan was promised happen would come from there. It would come from the donors. The increase would still come from those big donors, it's just a matter of "wait and see" with Cox. They were obviously willing to throw that money if it meant Dan staying, or if it meant bringing in Pitino.

They don't feel the same about an "unproven" coach in their minds. It's their money and their right. That doesn't mean that if Cox leads the Rams to another conference title and NCAA run the money won't re-appear.

We will be as "big time" as the big time donors are willing to make us. Unfortunately they aren't always on the same page as athletics.

To say that you think this is some fake conspiracy and that we didn't actually offer Dan a real contract and that we're just saving face is a legitimate tin-foil hat crazy person theory.

I don't even know what to do with that, because if you truly believe that URI didn't offer Dan what was reported and it's all a media coverup, there's no logic or facts I can present you with that will change your mind. Must be a tough way to live when everything is a conspiracy.

To 78's point, he's right on the money. The assistant coaches pool was a priority of Dan's. It was a priority of Dan's because he didn't want to lose Dave Cox. Dan had earned the clout to call his shots and what was important.

Dave is obviously the best guy for the job, and now they have started over at "what do you need to be successful, Dave?" There isn't a blind allegiance to what Dan wanted or valued, because Dan isn't here any more. It's just faulty logic to say "well now that Dan is gone we aren't supporting the program anymore." Dave may not even know what he thinks is most important yet. There's a finite budget that we can spend, so taking the time to figure out what matters most to the guy in charge of your program is probably more important than spending money on things the previous guy thought were important.

section(105) · Unread post by **section(105)** » 6 years ago

.......I think the strength of the lobby efforts and relationship between the GA and Dr Dooley are underestimated....

hrstrat57 · Unread post by **hrstrat57** » 6 years ago

rambone 78 wrote:Calhoun made a habit out of making 3 star players national champs....Izzo has done it too......

UConn has never really had many 4 and 5 stars....if they do, they bolt ha ha.....lately anyway.

Truth.

Further true is that we could likely go toe to toe with uConn for recruits same as we do with Providence.

We have to win our fair share of those battles on the recruiting trail starting tomorrow with Omar.

josephski · Unread post by **josephski** » 6 years ago

Blue Man wrote:
Cameron_Dollar wrote:Obie,
From what i see and hear URI does not have a strong lobbying presence at the state house and the only potential donor increase will come from younger alumni, most of whom are not in a position to become major donors.

Blue Man, you speak of Hurley like you have Sunday dinner with him. Go back and check the posts. I stated from the get go that a)UCONN could be elite again b)Dan had a deal in place c)he was like a stock that had reached a high and was time to sell.
Also you did not attack my theory on the whole Thorr, Pitt and UCONN scenario. On that I heard crickets. I would love to get your take.
Dave is obviously the best guy for the job, and now they have started over at "what do you need to be successful, Dave?" There isn't a blind allegiance to what Dan wanted or valued, because Dan isn't here any more. It's just faulty logic to say "well now that Dan is gone we aren't supporting the program anymore." Dave may not even know what he thinks is most important yet. There's a finite budget that we can spend, so taking the time to figure out what matters most to the guy in charge of your program is probably more important than spending money on things the previous guy thought were important.

The idea that we need to increase the pool for the coaching staff is more a fact than just what Dan felt is important. Cox should be allowed to make his own decisions in terms of what he thinks is important but you can't ignore what Dan valued just because he's no longer here. What Dan valued obviously helped rebuild the program and I think it'd be stupid to start from scratch rather than building off what Dan thought is important.

Ultimately Thorr is the one in charge of the basketball program. If we're going to continue to be a stepping stone for coaches and go the same route as Xavier with hiring our assistants then Thorr needs to find a way to add more money for our assistants. Personally, I have a hard time believing $425,000 is the absolute best we could do which doesn't mean we're not supporting the program but is still disappointing nonetheless.

Rhody83 · Unread post by **Rhody83** » 6 years ago

bigappleram wrote:The other thing of note here, is by all accounts within last year's budget we had a very competent assistant coaching staff (Cox, Moore, Boswell, etc).
Why can't we have a similarly competent staff with the same or even slightly larger budget. It's like the sky is falling bc we "may" be operating under the same budget parameters as our last fiscal year. Unless I am missing something we had 1 of the better AHCs in the region on staff (Cox), a former HC at a low major (Moore) and a New England AAU guru (Boswell) on staff. Can't we replicate that formula with the same or slightly larger budget?

78’s responses to this were correct. To add more to the point that our Ast Coaches’ pool is not enough - we lost the following top assistants during a 4 year span - Preston Murphy, Luke Murray & ARD. They all left for higher paying assistants jobs. We can’t count on paying less and holding on to a fired HC still being paid by previous school (Moore), a coach that is willing to take less because of the opportunity to become the HC (Cox) and a coach just getting to the assistant level after being at the AAU level.

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 6 years ago

Rhody83 wrote:
bigappleram wrote:The other thing of note here, is by all accounts within last year's budget we had a very competent assistant coaching staff (Cox, Moore, Boswell, etc).
Why can't we have a similarly competent staff with the same or even slightly larger budget. It's like the sky is falling bc we "may" be operating under the same budget parameters as our last fiscal year. Unless I am missing something we had 1 of the better AHCs in the region on staff (Cox), a former HC at a low major (Moore) and a New England AAU guru (Boswell) on staff. Can't we replicate that formula with the same or slightly larger budget?
To add more to the point that our Ast Coaches’ pool is not enough - we lost the following top assistants during a 4 year span - Preston Murphy, Luke Murray & ARD. They all left for higher paying assistants jobs.

And yet...we somehow kept winning. And in the cases of Preston and Murray, won even more than we did when they were here.

I am not arguing that assistant coaches are not important. If the assistant coaches pool was 600K instead of 425K, I'd be fine with that. Especially considering what we will be saving on salary at the HC level. The reality is that I don't have insight into how the budget is being allocated among priorities, but I do trust the people in charge to identify the right priorities and take the necessary steps required to address them. That might mean taking a little out of pile B to make sure there is enough in pile A. I also don't know what the staff is going to end up looking like. If it turns out that we end up with a grossly underqualified staff, then I will be aggravated and critical, as well. But at this point I don't think there is much to go on beyond knowing that we did not break the bank for an assistant coach that nobody here had heard of two weeks ago.

RamIt! · Unread post by **RamIt!** » 6 years ago

URI job posting site has the assistant coach job being first posted on 4/12, open until filled. I'm guessing from the posting that we might not hear about a hiring until 4/27.

Kingston · Unread post by **Kingston** » 6 years ago

A new assistant will be named in the next 24 hours

CT Rhody · Unread post by **CT Rhody** » 6 years ago

Kingston wrote:A new assistant will be named in the next 24 hours

Feel free to put a name to this announcement!

Section104 · Unread post by **Section104** » 6 years ago

I wonder if Jarvis joins the staff in some sort of smaller grad assistant role

Iggy1979 · Unread post by **Iggy1979** » 6 years ago

Kingston wrote:A new assistant will be named in the next 24 hours

Hurley leaked info to Zags, Goodman and Rothstein. Who will Cox trust?

DC_Rams · Unread post by **DC_Rams** » 6 years ago

Iggy1979 wrote:
Kingston wrote:A new assistant will be named in the next 24 hours
Hurley leaked info to Zags, Goodman and Rothstein. Who will Cox trust?

Probably the exact same people.

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 6 years ago

Same group had the Cox hire (much to the annoyance of the local guys), so it apparently wasn’t just Dan.

Billyboy78 · Unread post by **Billyboy78** » 6 years ago

Disano is the guy I would trust.

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