GAME 11: Iona (Sat, Dec. 19, 7 P.M.)

steveystuds06 · Unread post by **steveystuds06** » 8 years ago

ram1980 wrote:Uri inbounding.. Trying to get it to Mcglynn.. Mcglynn trying to get free to get pass and get fouled. Instead he was called for a push off to get free.. Only after defender wacked him a couple of times.... Lousy call...

Can anyone tell me why after Akele missed first free throw with 1.8 seconds left, we still did not put any players in the lane to get a rebound and possibly win in regulation?? Be smart enough not to go over the back and hope for a fortuitous bounce and a put back.. Thought that was a terrible decision..

Well I think he thought Akele would have at least hit one but I think with all the guys they had fouling out Hurley felt good with us going to OT and not risking us getting foul off of a rebound.

section(105) · Unread post by **section(105)** » 8 years ago

.......I would say the tide had turned against us, and with our collapse in regular time....I would not have felt good going into OT.....put kids on the lane......cause ya Neva know.....of course this is all Monday morning stuff....I am comforted to know my paycheck is not based on these outcomes, both long and short...

NYGFan_Section208 · Unread post by **NYGFan_Section208** » 8 years ago

section(105) wrote:
NYGFan_Section208 wrote:
section(105) wrote:Ram1980, cause....we practice free throws in all kinds of situations......and we make them in practice....

LOL...good one.
....just tying to keep the lights burning here....how 'bout them Gi-ants.....once again close but no cigar....

Yep...but...at least when you watch them there's none of that, boring, annoying 'defense' stuff

Seawrightspostgame · Unread post by **Seawrightspostgame** » 8 years ago

Really like what Dan Hurley had to say about Jared Terrell. I feel and have felt for a long time that he gets caught watching. Everything is going on and he watches everyone else play offense. There is usually a ton of space between him and anyone else if JG goes to the basket or anyone. He floats on that 3 point line. He doesn't really make that shot and its not like he's spacing a thing because people don't even look at him after those passes he does back and forth.

He does training type stuff well. Straight line, tell him what to do. Just incredible defender. He does not take the initiative on offense to just make something happen. I was wondering last game why he never after a pass looks to cut off the pass and get it going toward the basket. Why he basically just camps on the line. There is something just off about him going to the rim.

Teams pick up on that. Basketball players evaluate and accumulate a bank of knowledge in the game and anticipate what a guy will do. By the end of the game they hardly give two thoughts to guarding him. ALTHOUGH, for some reason he shoots it better down the stretch. I wonder if its a combo of him being a little more worked out from the whole game and then the focus that comes with adrenaline from the possibility of losing.

He has to adjust to be aggressive. Be a complete player. You're talking about playing Iona. A team that doesn't play defense. He couldn't take advantage of that. He has to evaluate his approach and get a sense of urgency to put the ball in the hoop. The game is decided by who scores the most.

ramster · Unread post by **ramster** » 8 years ago

Obadiah wrote:With 21 seconds left in regulation, URI has the ball and McGlynn fouls Iona which leads to a Gaels three to tie game. For those at the game, what was that all about???

Obadiah,

With 22 Seconds to Iona hit both FTs to make a 5 point lead only a 3 pt URI lead.
On the URI inbound pass, Four got called for a push off trying to get open to get the pass. I was down the other end so I didn't see it clearly but it was a critical foul call. Instead of being a foul on Iona who would want to foul, we get called for a foul!!

I then thought to myself (as I always do in this situation) do not let Iona shoot a 3 under any circumstances. I personally would foul inside of 15 seconds left but I know we don't do that as a policy - neither Baron, nor Hurley have done that in the past that I can ever recall. Some Coaches do it but not the majority.

But even more so, I was thinking do NOT let MUCH SHOOT THE 3!! Much was on fire. Everything he was putting up seemed to be going in. So what happens? Much gets the ball and ties the game with yet another 3 ball with 10 seconds to go. AAARRRGGGGHHHHH!!!!! In looking around the arena at all the fans they were just dumbfounded. It was like everyone was in shock since everyone thougth this game was pretty much over.

We got the ball downcourt quite fast and I think it was Garrett who got in the lane and dished a nice pass to Akele who was moving well without the ball at the baseline and was fouled shooting so two shots awarded. Can someone confirm that it was a Garrett pass?

1.8 seconds to go. Akele was long on the FT. Good form, just long probably due to the pressure and adrenilyn of the situation. Second FT was long too.

After the 2nd Akele miss Iona grabbed the rebound and threw the length of the floor and the ball hit the backboard and grazed the rim. The shot would have counted.
Can you imagine the KeaneyBlue Board meltdown if that shot had gone in? We would have had to shut down the Board for a period of time just like the NYSE has to shut down when there is a big event - a circuit breaker type action

Seriously though, URI should have had guys at the FT Lane to get a possible tip in off a rebound or at least tipped the ball to prevent Iona from getting a shot of any kind off.

I thought we were in big trouble in OT having blown a 5 point lead in 22 seconds, and then when Much hit yet another 3 for the first points by either team in the OT I actually was thinking about how the KeaneyBlue Board was going to melt down if we lost this one

But we played well in the OT and took control of the game back with good defense, FG and FT shooting.

ramster · Unread post by **ramster** » 8 years ago

section(105) wrote:.......I would say the tide had turned against us, and with our collapse in regular time....I would not have felt good going into OT.....put kids on the lane......cause ya Neva know.....of course this is all Monday morning stuff....I am comforted to know my paycheck is not based on these outcomes, both long and short...

Agree, guys on lane to keep the ball alive, maybe a tip in? But Iona also got a full length shot off that would have counted had it gone it. Ball hit the Backboard and part of the rim I think. Would have been a disaster had it gone in.

steveystuds06 · Unread post by **steveystuds06** » 8 years ago

Let's say we do attempt to get a rebound off the missed free-throw. Iona grabs it we get called for a push in the back or something similar they go to the line with no time left to win the game. I see both sides of the story, but I'm fine with Hurley stepping back and letting them play D and not risking a foul at that critical moment. Iona already was playing without some of their best players and then had a couple guys foul out. Besides Much continuing to hit everything he's throwing up our chances were still high that we would come out with a win in OT and we did.

ramster · Unread post by **ramster** » 8 years ago

steveystuds06 wrote:Let's say we do attempt to get a rebound off the missed free-throw. Iona grabs it we get called for a push in the back or something similar they go to the line with no time left to win the game. I see both sides of the story, but I'm fine with Hurley stepping back and letting them play D and not risking a foul at that critical moment. Iona already was playing without some of their best players and then had a couple guys foul out. Besides Much continuing to hit everything he's throwing up our chances were still high that we would come out with a win in OT and we did.

It's the old John Chaney think of pulling all guys off the line but that strategy was based more on being ready on the other end defensively. In this case the only shot Iona had was to get the rebound (which we let them have) and then thrown the length of the court, which we let them do as all our guys were nowhere near the thrower.

Glad you thought we would win in OT. The momentum was not with us at all. We did not score a point in the OT until 1:34 had elapsed. I thought we were doomed in OT and so did the vast majority in the Ryan Center judging by the deer in the headlights look they all had.

We were very fortunate to come out of that with a win. Board would have melted. Board melted anyway even with the OT win, imagine with a loss?

steveystuds06 · Unread post by **steveystuds06** » 8 years ago

I think it was good for the guys mentally to pull out a victory after blowing another lead once again... If I'm Hurley I'm thinking there is no way Much can keep hitting every single shot he takes. They really didn't seem to have anyone left besides him that could beat us.

Sure the place was dead and I saw plenty of people leave before OT started so I get that we had no momentum. If you don't have confidence in your team in OT at home against a depleted Iona team then I think people have lost all hope for this team. I get that so I'm not saying that's a bad thing.. I'm extremely close to being the guy that leaves early but I'm not there yet. We go up 20 Tuesday and somehow find a way to lose I'll be that guy.

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 8 years ago

Never got people leaving early.
In my life, I have never left any game early,
regardless of the sport.
So leaving a minute early is going to beat the traffic?
I remember two years ago, people leaving the PC game,
that came down to the last shot.
Why?
Some fans are just strange to me.

ramster · Unread post by **ramster** » 8 years ago

Thoughts on the game:
The good:
- Good crowd, better than I expected. My guess would have been under 2500 with students gone. Pleasantly surprised.
- Hassan Martin monster game. Martin put the URI Rams on his back. Great to see from 1 of the 3 remaining of the Core 4
* Career high 27 points
* 10-15 FG shooting
* 7-9 FTs including some clutch FTs late in game and in OT. His release was smooth and confident
* Don't recall any dunks - his shooting was solid from all distances, displayed a nice soft touch and release, Played in control all night
* 4 Blocks, 3 Assists - some very nice passes
* 9 rebounds with 6 offensive rebounds
* Only 3 fouls in an OT game playing 38 minutes
* ZERO Turnovers, first game with zero TOs since the first game of the season
* Truly a 1st team All Conference performance - great to see
- Garrett with 9 assists, some nice passes in the lane
- Iverson with 11 rebounds plus he kept the ball alive many times with the ball going to someone else
- Thompson continuing to prove that he can play at this level. Had the only steal of the game for URI. 4 rebounds, not afraid to drive the lane and battle inside for rebounds and position
- Ramettes, Cheerleaders and Band on hand with school out - great to see
- Roady Jay's signs
- A WIN!!

The not soo good:
- Only 1 steal in an extended OT game. That by the Freshman Thompson off the bench.
- Starting Guards shooting woes continue with 9-32: Garrett 3-11, Terrell 4-13, McGlynn 2-8

The Optimistic Side:
- Win against ODU and Brown to enter Conference at 9-4
- I see first 5 games as winable going into the GW January 22 on the road.
- If Terrell and Garrett can get on track much like Martin did then this team can grab a Top 3 finish. Plus Thompson in the starting line up:
Sat 2-Jan St Louis Home
Tues 5-Jan Richmond Home
Sun 10-Jan St Joes Away
Wed 13-Jan St Bonaventure Away
Sat 16-Jan LaSalle Home
Fri 22-Jan GW Away
Wed 27-Jan Fordham Home
Sat 30-Jan St Joe's Home
Tues 2-Feb UMASS Away
Sat 6-Feb LaSalle Away
Tues 9-Feb George Mason Home
Fri 12-Feb Dayton Home
Tues 16-Feb VCU Away
Sat 20-Feb Duquesne Home
Tues 23-Feb Davidson Away
Sat 27-Feb Dayton Away
Thu 3-Mar UMASS Home
Sat 5-Mar Fordham Away

steveystuds06 · Unread post by **steveystuds06** » 8 years ago

rodfromcranston wrote:Never got people leaving early.
In my life, I have never left any game early,
regardless of the sport.
So leaving a minute early is going to beat the traffic?
I remember two years ago, people leaving the PC game,
that came down to the last shot.
Why?
Some fans are just strange to me.

A couple behind me leaves no matter what the score is with 2 mins left every single game. It's crazy!

bigappleram · Unread post by **bigappleram** » 8 years ago

Agree with Rod the "leaving early" thing is baffling. I remember the Valpo game, down 3 in a timeout before our last possession and people are leaving. I'm like WHAT, I think I even heckled a few on the way out. Why bother even coming if u leave a 1 possession game for the last minute. I can't say I have witnessed that in many places. Down 20 with 5 minutes to go I get it but cmon

Surfri72 · Unread post by **Surfri72** » 8 years ago

People aren't actually leaving the game. I go near one of the entrances and watch the end then beat all the traffic out of there.

Rhody Guy · Unread post by **Rhody Guy** » 8 years ago

So this is my take on not fouling in that situation. URI up 3, we foul, Iona makes both URI up 1, inbound the ball and Iona fouls, URI misses FT(s), Game tied/Iona up 1, Much hits a 3 URI loses.

Obadiah · Unread post by **Obadiah** » 8 years ago

Thanks, ramster, for the great summary.

sf2010 · Unread post by **sf2010** » 8 years ago

Was at the game, a few observations:

1) URI was fortunate to win - Iona is not very good but we brought our C- game (being generous) and let them hang around. That said, the team was able to "win without their best stuff" which is a helluva lot better than the alternative. Actually got some home cooking in this game as several questionable calls went in Rhody's favor, except the foul called on Four at the end of regulation. He did push off, but only after he was being held the entire way across the court trying to come open for the pass.

2) Hassan had his best game of the year for sure, and possibly his career. Tremendous effort and undoubtedly biggest reason for the victory.

3) Despite the low fg%, I was not displeased with the process on offense, though certainly the results (note the difference) left much to be desired. Most notably Kuran but also Jared got numerous good looks in the lane that rimmed out and they were unable to convert. If Kuran gets 13 shots of a similar quality as he did against Iona I guarantee he makes more than 3 of them next time.

4) Some people like to cherry-pick which stats to use, so let me do it too! Removing Akele and Watson, we shot 74% on fts!! Hurley must have finally decided to practice them!

5) Garrett was excellent. 3-4 on 3s (again with the cherry-picking, lets ignore the 0-7 on 2 pt fgs), 9 assists, did a great job getting into the lane and finding the open man. Terrell very good 2nd half/OT.

6) I thought we recruited that kid Much! Man he was in some kind of zone. The 3 he made to tie and the one in OT were wide open looks off of pump fakes that our guys were too aggressive on, but before that he hit two tough, contested looks from well beyond the arc that couldn't have been defended better.

7) Agree with the move to not put anybody in the lane on Akele's FTs. Much higher percentage of us committing a foul going for a tip than there are odds of success. And with 1.8 left I'm fine with conceding an 85 foot heave that has about a 1 in 10,000 chance of being successful. Of course it would have been better had Akele just made one of them, but tough situation for him. Big opportunity wasted, hopefully he learns from it. I remember Marquis Jones either during his JR or SR year missed a couple FTs like that right at the end of the game and we ended up losing - he responded by being nails from the FT line under pressure for the rest of the year. Hopefully it has the same affect on Akele, who besides those misses played one of his best games.

8) Four didn't play great again. Tough slump for him. Hit one big 3, made 7-8 FTs, but is overall struggling. That said, Christion is still in the role that he is best suited for. He did not contribute any more than Four did on offense, though his defense in short spurts has been solid. 18 minutes off the bench sounds about right barring drastic improvement. Earl had a poor showing, 2 real quick fouls in the first half, didn't contribute much when he did play in the 2nd.

9) We won the game while playing poorly. Can't afford to do that against ODU. Hopefully Hassan can carry over this momentum.

SmartyBarrett · Unread post by **SmartyBarrett** » 8 years ago

sf2010 wrote:6) I thought we recruited that kid Much!

We did. Bobby recruited him when he was here, then Much ended up committing to him at Buffalo. He (Much) played one year for the Bulls before transferring to Iona.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 8 years ago

A shooter.

What a revelation.

Would be nice if we had a couple.

sf2010 · Unread post by **sf2010** » 8 years ago

rambone 78 wrote:A shooter.

What a revelation.

Would be nice if we had a couple.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 8 years ago

You bet your ass.

sf2010 · Unread post by **sf2010** » 8 years ago

rambone 78 wrote:You bet your ass.

Haha at least you can admit it! I prefer to think of myself more as the character seen below... even if this season so far has been enough to turn most people into Eeyores.

Running Ram · Unread post by **Running Ram** » 8 years ago

I've never left an URI game early, I don't believe I ever will, but just last night I listened to a long time friend/season ticket holder tell me he and his wife left this game early, at the end of regulation, win or lose he said he's tired of the product. According to my friend, they've never left early before, which I believe, these games probably make up 75% of their social activities, win or lose they always make a night/day of it. What he said next touches a hot button, they started getting season tix again when DH came on, they plan to enjoy the rest of the season with a new outlook, but he tells me four seasons of tix, four seasons of the same product issues, without prompting he told me it "feels like the last rebuild," his words, so they walked out on the product, they don't care about beating traffic. He gave the last guy more credit than most are willing to, he believes both guys (current coach and former coach) get players with plenty of talent. I'm sorry, it's not my imagination, people are getting tired of the off season highs getting dashed by uneven play. His opinion, again unprompted, he expects players to be streaky, but when a talented team plays streaky and uneven, it's the job of the coach to correct and improve. I can't blame them for leaving early this once.

section(105) · Unread post by **section(105)** » 8 years ago

We are not quiet there yet......but I can relate......we have had our tickets much longer.....but I get it......don't leave early thou, Neva....I have to add that I thought we would be now closer to having tickets for something special in Kingston.....

ace · Unread post by **ace** » 8 years ago

Running Ram wrote:I've never left an URI game early, I don't believe I ever will, but just last night I listened to a long time friend/season ticket holder tell me he and his wife left this game early, at the end of regulation, win or lose he said he's tired of the product. According to my friend, they've never left early before, which I believe, these games probably make up 75% of their social activities, win or lose they always make a night/day of it. What he said next touches a hot button, they started getting season tix again when DH came on, they plan to enjoy the rest of the season with a new outlook, but he tells me four seasons of tix, four seasons of the same product issues, without prompting he told me it "feels like the last rebuild," his words, so they walked out on the product, they don't care about beating traffic. He gave the last guy more credit than most are willing to, he believes both guys (current coach and former coach) get players with plenty of talent. I'm sorry, it's not my imagination, people are getting tired of the off season highs getting dashed by uneven play. His opinion, again unprompted, he expects players to be streaky, but when a talented team plays streaky and uneven, it's the job of the coach to correct and improve. I can't blame them for leaving early this once.

I don't agree that this program the last three years has consistently underperformed. That's just not the case last year. They were picked as low as 6th in the conference and finished tied for second. For what they had, and despite the losses to the other top teams in the conference, they slightly over-achieved. I think that was the consensus at the end of last season and then EC got hurt, the team struggled, and people forgot. But let me say, I think anyone who buys a ticket can do whatever he wants with it- use it, burn it, give it to a PC fan, whatever. This year has kind of sucked. I think the last two games have blocked out some things that were ok about it so far, though.

NYGFan_Section208 · Unread post by **NYGFan_Section208** » 8 years ago

section(105) wrote:We are not quiet there yet......but I can relate......we have had our tickets much longer.....but I get it......don't leave early thou, Neva....I have to add that I thought we would be now closer to having tickets for something special in Kingston.....

These are our first season tix, so I've got nowhere near the history, but I can appreciate what you went thru in yrs 1 and 2 of the Hurley era. While it's certainly not 'obvious' yet anyway that we have tickets for something special in Kingston, I think there's still a good chance and we're excited about it.

Hurley has done better every year since yr 1. Despite some "Rhode Island pothole"-sized bumps in the road (it seems like this state 'farms' them as part of some 'competition' or something?)...I expect no different this year. If they were to somehow run the table to GW and then pull that one off...we'll be looking around the Ry saying, 'remember when all those people dressed up like blue seats used to come to these?'

PS: If you want to leave in the final minutes of a blowout to hear the post game radio analysis, that's fine here.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 8 years ago

You're right about that Ace.

What happens tonight and the few games after that, will tell us if the wheels have completely fallen off, or will they rally and play like they did against PC?

This team is way better than they showed against Iona. I know that.

But will they show it starting tonight? A couple more losses and this board will go down in flames.

This team has to stick together to succeed. Or it's wait until next year already.

ramster · Unread post by **ramster** » 8 years ago

NYGFan_Section208 wrote:
section(105) wrote:We are not quiet there yet......but I can relate......we have had our tickets much longer.....but I get it......don't leave early thou, Neva....I have to add that I thought we would be now closer to having tickets for something special in Kingston.....
These are our first season tix, so I've got nowhere near the history, but I can appreciate what you went thru in yrs 1 and 2 of the Hurley era. While it's certainly not 'obvious' yet anyway that we have tickets for something special in Kingston, I think there's still a good chance and we're excited about it.

Hurley has done better every year since yr 1. Despite some "Rhode Island pothole"-sized bumps in the road (it seems like this state 'farms' them as part of some 'competition' or something?)...I expect no different this year. If they were to somehow run the table to GW and then pull that one off...we'll be looking around the Ry saying, 'remember when all those people dressed up like blue seats used to come to these?'

PS: If you want to leave in the final minutes of a blowout to hear the post game radio analysis, that's fine here.

NYG,
I think you said earlier that you came here 3-4 years ago for URI.....just curious, what is it that drove you to get season tickets for this year and not the last couple and also what triggered you to join the board this past November and not the past couple of years?
Enjoy your refreshing points of view

Running Ram · Unread post by **Running Ram** » 8 years ago

To be clear, he had season tix for many of the last guys years, stopped buying them until DH got here, and his point, however you want to classify last season is the product on the floor isn't evolving, the same issues that plagued this team yr 1 are still holding us back yr 4. The talent is there, and I don't want to hear about the type of kid recruited, my guys, the last guys guy, this injury or that, suck it up and win! get the best out of the players you have, if that means you have to ratchet up your patience because a guy like Watson isn't on the defensive curve you want him to be, then do that, because there are a number of ways you can get the benefits of his skills while mitigating the liabilities, he's not Bentil, but he's pretty skilled in the post, he's not going to light it up every game, but cut him some slack, it took DH two years before he started to hold Gil accountable for similar lapses, Watson on the other hand gets yanked per mistake.

It's not rocket friggin surgery, we don't have the luxury of getting all well rounded 5 star recruits, you can't go pushing square pegs into round holes and expect results, ADAPT!!!

sf2010 · Unread post by **sf2010** » 8 years ago

"suck it up and win!"

Oh, just like that? Somebody better get DH on the phone, I guess he doesn't realize how easy it is...and if it isn't rocket friggin surgery, how come we're not all coaching basketball and making 7 figures to do it?

Unread post by **SGreenwell** » 8 years ago

sf2010 wrote:"suck it up and win!"

Oh, just like that? Somebody better get DH on the phone, I guess he doesn't realize how easy it is...and if it isn't rocket friggin surgery, how come we're not all coaching basketball and making 7 figures to do it?

https://screen.yahoo.com/bob-saget-impo ... 00154.html

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 8 years ago

RR, I agree about the team not evolving and the same issues being there, but at some point we have to question just how talented we really are.

Of course we have talent, so I don't want to hear people say I think we don't. Let's start there.

But there are too many holes still. We have guys who can't shoot. Looking at the video of the Iona game, that's enough bricks to build a subdivision. It's not an occasional thing either, it's most of the time.

We have guys, who since they can't make open jump shots, can't make free 15 footers either. Free throws are not free when we shoot them. There's pain involved.

It's also not just one or two guys, it's most of the team. They take turns missing from game to game actually.

We still turn the ball over way too much even when there isn't pressure. Errors of omission and commission.

It's not all Dan screwing up, although there is plenty of blame to go around on both sides.

There is, by now, a mounting pile of evidence to support the feeling that this group, probably even with EC, just isn't good enough.

When will they be? That's to be determined. It would be nice if we could finally find a player who could put the team on his back and will the team to wins in close games. You know, clutch in crunch time.

All good teams have at least one of those. We do not.

Running Ram · Unread post by **Running Ram** » 8 years ago

bone, a great coach takes good talent and gets great results.

Shooting can improve. Hit the Gym can't be the answer to every bump. Everybody and their mothers know that offense is secondary to DH, I don't care what he says to the media, I don't care what anyone has seen in open practices. Look at the product.

No reason to get back into any of it at this point. Again results speak for themselves. Not throwing in the towel, just want some adaptability.

hey there smart guy, yeah you sf, no, not anybody can do it, nice to put words in people's mouths because you refuse to talk about the subject matter. The fact is DH is a good coach, we've had good coaches in the past, now we want a coach that gets results. you dig?

And yeah just like that "suck it up and win." Move on from wallowing in injury misery, from bad calls, from rigid ideals, get the most out of your talent even if it means you have to learn or implement other offenses and defenses or whatever it takes really. Results!

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 8 years ago

Agreed, RR.

If Dan has to bring in someone to help on half court offense, or FT's, or playing some zone, then teach his players how to play it.

His inflexibility is holding this team back. They are way too predictable.

sf2010 · Unread post by **sf2010** » 8 years ago

Running Ram wrote:hey there smart guy, yeah you sf, no, not anybody can do it, nice to put words in people's mouths because you refuse to talk about the subject matter. The fact is DH is a good coach, we've had good coaches in the past, now we want a coach that gets results. you dig?

And yeah just like that "suck it up and win." Move on from wallowing in injury misery, from bad calls, from rigid ideals, get the most out of your talent even if it means you have to learn or implement other offenses and defenses or whatever it takes really. Results!

Smart guy here - you're the one who wants to ignore the context surrounding the team and just say "results!" Damn the injuries! At least you allowed that Hassan's injury may have had something to do with our most recent loss.

I've talked about "the subject matter" extensively over the past couple weeks and it's getting absurdly frustrating. People are free to criticize the coaching staff all they want (my big criticism would be that Jared/Jarvis have not improved this year as I had hoped they would. Some of that is on them of course but the blame can be shared with the staff as well). I just happen to be unconvinced by many of the criticisms that people are lobbing at the coaching staff. Some of them being:
"Play Earl More!" - You still think Earl is skilled in the post? He is athletic, for sure, and gets a lot of his points that way. No doubt he is a valuable piece, but I would not describe him as "skilled" or "polished" in the post, worthy of being a focal point of our offense.
"Why don't we play other defensive styles?" - I don't think Dan's defensive philosophy needs to be changed at all. Top 10 defense last year, though we have struggled at times this year that doesn't mean it needs to be scrapped. You saw what happened with a zone briefly last night. The pressing/trapping was good (maybe because they DO work on other things in practice! Shocker!), but with our depth there is no way we can get away with playing that style for more than 5 mins/gm except in desperation situations like last night. People mention other coaches who mix up their defenses all the time. I can give you a name who never did - Bobby Knight. Anybody can find an expert for anything to support their position, doesn't make it right.

Long story short - I'm as pissed off as anybody about how disappointing this season has been, but laying it all at the feet of the coaching staff and willfully ignoring context in demanding results is foolish. Thinking that we know the strengths and weaknesses of the team better than the coaches is short-sighted. I want results too, but I'm not saying that the coaching staff needs to be blown up. You say "Adapt!" I say, "Adapt how?" And I have yet to hear an answer that I can get on board with, and I highly doubt that anyone here suggests anything that the coaching staff has not already thought of. If they believed it could help, they would do it, I guarantee you.

Again, I'm not saying don't criticize, I'm not saying don't want more results. We all want more results. I'm just saying actually give some critical thought to the criticisms.

adam914 · Unread post by **adam914** » 8 years ago

sf2010 wrote: Smart guy here - you're the one who wants to ignore the context surrounding the team and just say "results!" Damn the injuries! At least you allowed that Hassan's injury may have had something to do with our most recent loss.

I've talked about "the subject matter" extensively over the past couple weeks and it's getting absurdly frustrating. People are free to criticize the coaching staff all they want (my big criticism would be that Jared/Jarvis have not improved this year as I had hoped they would. Some of that is on them of course but the blame can be shared with the staff as well). I just happen to be unconvinced by many of the criticisms that people are lobbing at the coaching staff. Some of them being:
"Play Earl More!" - You still think Earl is skilled in the post? He is athletic, for sure, and gets a lot of his points that way. No doubt he is a valuable piece, but I would not describe him as "skilled" or "polished" in the post, worthy of being a focal point of our offense.
"Why don't we play other defensive styles?" - I don't think Dan's defensive philosophy needs to be changed at all. Top 10 defense last year, though we have struggled at times this year that doesn't mean it needs to be scrapped. You saw what happened with a zone briefly last night. The pressing/trapping was good (maybe because they DO work on other things in practice! Shocker!), but with our depth there is no way we can get away with playing that style for more than 5 mins/gm except in desperation situations like last night. People mention other coaches who mix up their defenses all the time. I can give you a name who never did - Bobby Knight. Anybody can find an expert for anything to support their position, doesn't make it right.

Long story short - I'm as pissed off as anybody about how disappointing this season has been, but laying it all at the feet of the coaching staff and willfully ignoring context in demanding results is foolish. Thinking that we know the strengths and weaknesses of the team better than the coaches is short-sighted. I want results too, but I'm not saying that the coaching staff needs to be blown up. You say "Adapt!" I say, "Adapt how?" And I have yet to hear an answer that I can get on board with, and I highly doubt that anyone here suggests anything that the coaching staff has not already thought of. If they believed it could help, they would do it, I guarantee you.

Again, I'm not saying don't criticize, I'm not saying don't want more results. We all want more results. I'm just saying actually give some critical thought to the criticisms.

Spot on, I am with you here.

DeanDome88 · Unread post by **DeanDome88** » 8 years ago

sf2010 wrote:
Running Ram wrote:hey there smart guy, yeah you sf, no, not anybody can do it, nice to put words in people's mouths because you refuse to talk about the subject matter. The fact is DH is a good coach, we've had good coaches in the past, now we want a coach that gets results. you dig?

And yeah just like that "suck it up and win." Move on from wallowing in injury misery, from bad calls, from rigid ideals, get the most out of your talent even if it means you have to learn or implement other offenses and defenses or whatever it takes really. Results!
Smart guy here - you're the one who wants to ignore the context surrounding the team and just say "results!" Damn the injuries! At least you allowed that Hassan's injury may have had something to do with our most recent loss.

I've talked about "the subject matter" extensively over the past couple weeks and it's getting absurdly frustrating. People are free to criticize the coaching staff all they want (my big criticism would be that Jared/Jarvis have not improved this year as I had hoped they would. Some of that is on them of course but the blame can be shared with the staff as well). I just happen to be unconvinced by many of the criticisms that people are lobbing at the coaching staff. Some of them being:
"Play Earl More!" - You still think Earl is skilled in the post? He is athletic, for sure, and gets a lot of his points that way. No doubt he is a valuable piece, but I would not describe him as "skilled" or "polished" in the post, worthy of being a focal point of our offense.
"Why don't we play other defensive styles?" - I don't think Dan's defensive philosophy needs to be changed at all. Top 10 defense last year, though we have struggled at times this year that doesn't mean it needs to be scrapped. You saw what happened with a zone briefly last night. The pressing/trapping was good (maybe because they DO work on other things in practice! Shocker!), but with our depth there is no way we can get away with playing that style for more than 5 mins/gm except in desperation situations like last night. People mention other coaches who mix up their defenses all the time. I can give you a name who never did - Bobby Knight. Anybody can find an expert for anything to support their position, doesn't make it right.

Long story short - I'm as pissed off as anybody about how disappointing this season has been, but laying it all at the feet of the coaching staff and willfully ignoring context in demanding results is foolish. Thinking that we know the strengths and weaknesses of the team better than the coaches is short-sighted. I want results too, but I'm not saying that the coaching staff needs to be blown up. You say "Adapt!" I say, "Adapt how?" And I have yet to hear an answer that I can get on board with, and I highly doubt that anyone here suggests anything that the coaching staff has not already thought of. If they believed it could help, they would do it, I guarantee you.

Again, I'm not saying don't criticize, I'm not saying don't want more results. We all want more results. I'm just saying actually give some critical thought to the criticisms.

sf it is pretty obvious you do not like criticism of the coaching staff, but seriously, "the better players need to play better" is just a weak statement coming out of the head coaches mouth. I believe that Dan is a good coach. I do not believe that he is yet to become a great coach or leader. Dan should adjust the things he has control over such as playing time and on the court tactics. It was refreshing to see the team employ the press against ODU it plays to the teams athleticism and has not been used nearly enough. Some of us fans have been calling for it since last season. I'm sure the coaching staff has many thoughts but if they do not implement them it is not going to change a thing. I am sure that Dan would do anything that he thought would help the team win more games nobody is arguing against the obvious. My earlier comment in another thread about unconscious bias went right over your head based on your response.

I was not surprised that Dan started calling out the players in public but personally find it disgusting. He has them a certain number of hours each week but then complains about them not being in the gym more on their own time. They are student athletes not professionals. Dan is the one making the big bucks and he is just not willing to accept much responsibility for not meeting whatever expectations he thinks that people may have for the program. I'd rather the staff helping the players work on their shot in practice rather then a player working endless hours alone in the gym if their form needs to be corrected. Dan is damn near expert at framing the conversation and assigning blame to others. For over two years it was "the mess the program was in when he took over" and then towards the end of last year it was the "young core 4" talk when he chose not to play his upperclassmen major minutes. It is like the subtext of the conversation is that he is a basketball genius with all the answers and there has to be reasons that the team isn't firmly in the top 20. Dan is a good coach but needs to consistently evaluate the things he has control over rather than churn out blame and excuses that before long will be falling on deaf ears.

I am not trying to change your mind. Feel free to think that Dan is great and nearly infallible. I will feel free to make my own observations.

sf2010 · Unread post by **sf2010** » 8 years ago

DeanDome88 wrote: sf it is pretty obvious you do not like criticism of the coaching staff, [You're right, I do not like a lot of the criticism that has come down on the coaches recently because as I stated, I don't believe they are issues for which the coaches should be assigned blame. Criticize all you want, but when I think it is unwarranted and can be explained with just a little bit of critical thinking, I will disagree with it.] but seriously, "the better players need to play better" is just a weak statement coming out of the head coaches mouth. [He's not wrong, but you could be right, perhaps those are things that should be kept behind closed doors. I find it likely that he has tried to keep it behind closed doors for much of the year but hasn't seen the improvement he wants so is trying to push the players' buttons in another way] I believe that Dan is a good coach. I do not believe that he is yet to become a great coach or leader. [That's fair. I wouldn't call him a great coach yet either. He was a great hire by URI, not yet a great coach] Dan should adjust the things he has control over such as playing time and on the court tactics. It was refreshing to see the team employ the press against ODU it plays to the teams athleticism and has not been used nearly enough. Some of us fans have been calling for it since last season. [This is one of the things that I don't think is a legitimate criticism. Do you seriously think that with our depth issues we could sustain playing more than 5ish minutes per game of a pressing style defense? I sure don't, especially when we've already been concerned about players becoming fatigued this year. The defensive philosophy should not change.] I'm sure the coaching staff has many thoughts but if they do not implement them it is not going to change a thing. I am sure that Dan would do anything that he thought would help the team win more games nobody is arguing against the obvious. My earlier comment in another thread about unconscious bias went right over your head based on your response. [The comment did not go over my head. If he had an unconscious bias it would still manifest outwardly in a similar fashion as a conscious bias for observers to see. I have been to over 80% of home games since DH took over - I have not witnessed a bias in how he handles his front court players as opposed to his guards. There have been more guards, for sure, and the guards have been relatively better than the front court players, you will get no argument. But to think that for some reason he doesn't treat front court players fairly because he himself was a guard is just absurd in my mind.]

I was not surprised that Dan started calling out the players in public but personally find it disgusting. He has them a certain number of hours each week but then complains about them not being in the gym more on their own time. They are student athletes not professionals. Dan is the one making the big bucks and he is just not willing to accept much responsibility for not meeting whatever expectations he thinks that people may have for the program. I'd rather the staff helping the players work on their shot in practice rather then a player working endless hours alone in the gym if their form needs to be corrected. [To me this seems to be a double-standard - not saying it was you specifically, but how many of us lauded Four earlier this year when he was shooting for hours after games? How many of us rave about the practice habits of Jimmy Baron? There are certain players who work extremely hard to be great, and the fans love to see those guys succeed. Perhaps Hurley's expectations are similar to that of a professor in college, where for each hour of class time it is assumed that the student will do at least one hour of work preparing for the class? Maybe that's an unfair expectation given all the demands that these kids have on their time.] Dan is damn near expert at framing the conversation and assigning blame to others. For over two years it was "the mess the program was in when he took over" and then towards the end of last year it was the "young core 4" talk when he chose not to play his upperclassmen major minutes. Which upperclassmen didn't he play? TJ and Gilvydas were major parts of what we accomplished last season - who should have gotten more playing time instead of EC/Hass/JG/JT?] It is like the subtext of the conversation is that he is a basketball genius with all the answers and there has to be reasons that the team isn't firmly in the top 20. Dan is a good coach but needs to consistently evaluate the things he has control over rather than churn out blame and excuses that before long will be falling on deaf ears.

I am not trying to change your mind. Feel free to think that Dan is great and nearly infallible. [I think he's a great hire, not yet a great coach. Surely not infallible, but the criticisms that many here make assume knowledge of things going on behind the scenes that none of us know. The team could be better on offense. That's fair. Some of the players have not developed as we would have hoped. That's fair, but it also should be kept in mind that not all players pan out.] I will feel free to make my own observations. [Please do, and I will feel free to disagree with them when I do - that's kind of the point of this place.]

DeanDome88 · Unread post by **DeanDome88** » 8 years ago

sf2010 wrote:
DeanDome88 wrote: sf it is pretty obvious you do not like criticism of the coaching staff, [You're right, I do not like a lot of the criticism that has come down on the coaches recently because as I stated, I don't believe they are issues for which the coaches should be assigned blame. Criticize all you want, but when I think it is unwarranted and can be explained with just a little bit of critical thinking, I will disagree with it.] but seriously, "the better players need to play better" is just a weak statement coming out of the head coaches mouth. [He's not wrong, but you could be right, perhaps those are things that should be kept behind closed doors. I find it likely that he has tried to keep it behind closed doors for much of the year but hasn't seen the improvement he wants so is trying to push the players' buttons in another way] I believe that Dan is a good coach. I do not believe that he is yet to become a great coach or leader. [That's fair. I wouldn't call him a great coach yet either. He was a great hire by URI, not yet a great coach] Dan should adjust the things he has control over such as playing time and on the court tactics. It was refreshing to see the team employ the press against ODU it plays to the teams athleticism and has not been used nearly enough. Some of us fans have been calling for it since last season. [This is one of the things that I don't think is a legitimate criticism. Do you seriously think that with our depth issues we could sustain playing more than 5ish minutes per game of a pressing style defense? I sure don't, especially when we've already been concerned about players becoming fatigued this year. The defensive philosophy should not change.] I'm sure the coaching staff has many thoughts but if they do not implement them it is not going to change a thing. I am sure that Dan would do anything that he thought would help the team win more games nobody is arguing against the obvious. My earlier comment in another thread about unconscious bias went right over your head based on your response. [The comment did not go over my head. If he had an unconscious bias it would still manifest outwardly in a similar fashion as a conscious bias for observers to see. I have been to over 80% of home games since DH took over - I have not witnessed a bias in how he handles his front court players as opposed to his guards. There have been more guards, for sure, and the guards have been relatively better than the front court players, you will get no argument. But to think that for some reason he doesn't treat front court players fairly because he himself was a guard is just absurd in my mind.]

I was not surprised that Dan started calling out the players in public but personally find it disgusting. He has them a certain number of hours each week but then complains about them not being in the gym more on their own time. They are student athletes not professionals. Dan is the one making the big bucks and he is just not willing to accept much responsibility for not meeting whatever expectations he thinks that people may have for the program. I'd rather the staff helping the players work on their shot in practice rather then a player working endless hours alone in the gym if their form needs to be corrected. [To me this seems to be a double-standard - not saying it was you specifically, but how many of us lauded Four earlier this year when he was shooting for hours after games? How many of us rave about the practice habits of Jimmy Baron? There are certain players who work extremely hard to be great, and the fans love to see those guys succeed. Perhaps Hurley's expectations are similar to that of a professor in college, where for each hour of class time it is assumed that the student will do at least one hour of work preparing for the class? Maybe that's an unfair expectation given all the demands that these kids have on their time.] Dan is damn near expert at framing the conversation and assigning blame to others. For over two years it was "the mess the program was in when he took over" and then towards the end of last year it was the "young core 4" talk when he chose not to play his upperclassmen major minutes. Which upperclassmen didn't he play? TJ and Gilvydas were major parts of what we accomplished last season - who should have gotten more playing time instead of EC/Hass/JG/JT?] It is like the subtext of the conversation is that he is a basketball genius with all the answers and there has to be reasons that the team isn't firmly in the top 20. Dan is a good coach but needs to consistently evaluate the things he has control over rather than churn out blame and excuses that before long will be falling on deaf ears.

I am not trying to change your mind. Feel free to think that Dan is great and nearly infallible. [I think he's a great hire, not yet a great coach. Surely not infallible, but the criticisms that many here make assume knowledge of things going on behind the scenes that none of us know. The team could be better on offense. That's fair. Some of the players have not developed as we would have hoped. That's fair, but it also should be kept in mind that not all players pan out.] I will feel free to make my own observations. [Please do, and I will feel free to disagree with them when I do - that's kind of the point of this place.]

The 1988 Running Rams calling card was the press and fast break basketball and they had six players who were decent up to outstanding players with just one Kenny Green coming off the bench, the drop off in talent to the first back up guard Jim Christian was steep. You do not have to press all the time to use it some of the time, it is just another tactic to disrupt the other team and gain an advantage. It is not to help the defense as much as it is to improve the offense by creating easy baskets. Our players seem more athletic rather than highly skilled and I believe the press in stretches is an excellent tool for the players on our roster.

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