ESPNU A-10 Update

[TruePoint]

It appears that the BE exit fees are not going to be an issue. If the BE7 all exit together, there is a clause that says that they don't have to pay the exit fees.

http://ajerseyguy.com/?p=4202

My understanding is that the bigger issue is not whether they can leave, but whether they can start their own conference and take the naming rights and the postseason credits with them. And without the remaining league members permitting the league to dissolve they won't be able to do that without an incredible amount of litigation and a really ugly fight that will cost a ton of time and money. That is where the A10 solution came from: if they leave together they have to go somewhere.

BFC, my point about UMass was a little sarcastic. UMass is not a factor in Boston, regardless of how they're classified. I think if this thing happens fast UMass will have to make a very hard decision about whether to pull the plug on their football investment after one year (a huge loss that will have to be completely written off) if they want to stay in the A10. I don't think the A10 could keep them knowing that they will be constantly looking to join a conference for all sports.

[Billyboy78]

Here's what KMAC writes today. We know where his interests lie......"Just what could a basketball-first Big East look like? One insider insists a 10 team league would land a TV deal worth at least $15 million per year, or $1.5 million per team. Xavier, Dayton and Butler would fit smoothly in an East/West lineup with an 18 game schedule featuring a home-and-home with every school."

[CT Rhody]

Interesting how the Projo is bashing the BE7 to the A-10 idea as a non-starter. One comment K-Mac made was Georgetown does not want to travel to St Bonnie or Fordham. Hate to break to it Kmac but PC is not Georgetown and Georgetown from all reports is working behind the scenes to leave the BE7 to go to a BCS conference. If that happens, the BE6 is not impressive in the least and would be lucky to be invited to the A-10.

If I was running the A-10, I would invite Creighton and George Mason into the league to solidify it even further. I would also work the back channels to see if getting rid of any mix of St Bonnie's, Fordham, and Lasalle would be a viable option or not. In this time of re-alignment madness, you have to be aggreesive and on the constant offense or else you'll be eliminated as a conference before you know it. Replacing Bonnies and Fordham with Creighton and Mason would totally change this conversation in my opinion.

[TruePoint]

CT, the thing you're missing is that the A10 would have to drop almost half of its teams to add the C7, so I'm not sure how adding more non-C7 would help.

The thing that hurts KMac's argument about GTown is that Bonnies and Fordham wouldn't be in an A10 that GTown was in.

[Sweep The Leg]

I think UMass may be looking into joining a BCS conference since they upgraded their football program to D1.

[rodfromcranston]

What BCS conference would want Georgetown?
They won a NCAA decades ago. They act as it fthey're a bigtime power.
Same with Marquette. Lots of chest pounding by their AD, but someone needs to tell him, Al McGuire
is long dead, and that championship was a long time before they joined
the Big East.
KMac is a Big East shill, and I told him that. His reply was "conferences are all that matter".
George Mason isn't anything great. Creighton only makes sense if there's a Western division, with St. louis in it.
If Fordham played it's conference games in MSG, like Manhattan used to do,
it becomes a moot point about their gym.
Besides, I can't see Bona, Fordham, GW, or Duquesne making the cut.

[twisted3829]

add Creighton and see if we can pick off a low lying fruit from the C7 like Seton Hall

[Brutus]

The latest batshit crazy idea, is Gonazaga in the Big East for basketball!
Yeah, let's fly out to Spokane for a game!
I'm sure Mark Few would love going to Providence on a weekday.
Just grasping at straws.

Rod, it's Gonzaga who is approaching the BE bballers inquiring about joining them in a new league. How's that grasping at straws?

[Brutus]

Wow.

http://zagsblog.com/temple/temple-can-s ... -big-east/

[RF1]

There are far too many variables out there for anyone to be able to say how this will all play out. The Marquette AD and the words of Kevin McNamara and other sports writers mean little. The schools themselves don't even have control over what will happen.

[ramfan85]

And I thought this would be a quiet week on the board. Silly me.
KMac is a BE tool. He only sees things from their perspective.
How about this?...Any new schools to our league have to be full universities, not colleges.

[theblueram]

There are far too many vairiables out there for anyone to be able to say how this will all play out. The Marquette AD and the words of Kevin McNamara and other sports writers mean little. The schools themselves don't even have control over what will happen.

Kudos to RF1 for his timely post on 12-12-12 at 12:12

[BFC]

BFC, my point about UMass was a little sarcastic. UMass is not a factor in Boston, regardless of how they're classified.

Rutgers is not a factor in NYC but yet they sure as hell didn't play their way into the Big 10. I agree with you about UMass, but I'm just saying these aren't sports decisions. Georgetown's brand name and big market means alot more than Butler's recent Final Four appearances. It's not enough to get Georgetown into the BCS but it probably gives them and St. John's and Xavier the choice to play with whoever they want. Hopefully Xavier sees the benefit of numbers and doesn't just jump at being the 8th member.

[TruePoint]

Haha Brutus. That says that a "source" says Temple can't block it "because of some bylaw or something," which doesn't sound like its coming from someone with great command of the facts. Most likely, there is some disagreement about Temple's position and voting rights. If Temple (and its football-playing allies) are determined to block the dissolution and there is any legit disagreement about the language in the bylaws, then this thing will end up in court. I doubt anyone wants it going to court, so most likely they will have to find an amicable solution.

Be ready to not believe a lot of what you hear/read about this in the press for the foreseeable future. There is going to be much more posturing than honest assessments from all of the parties involved.

[Brutus]

Haha Brutus. That says that a "source" says Temple can't block it "because of some bylaw or something," which doesn't sound like its coming from someone with great command of the facts. Most likely, there is some disagreement about Temple's position and voting rights. If Temple (and its football-playing allies) are determined to block the dissolution and there is any legit disagreement about the language in the bylaws, then this thing will end up in court. I doubt anyone wants it going to court, so most likely they will have to find an amicable solution.

Be ready to not believe a lot of what you hear/read about this in the press for the foreseeable future. There is going to be much more posturing than honest assessments from all of the parties involved.

Keep hoping it's wrong, but it's being verified that it's true.

[ATPTourFan]

There are far too many vairiables out there for anyone to be able to say how this will all play out. The Marquette AD and the words of Kevin McNamara and other sports writers mean little. The schools themselves don't even have control over what will happen.

Kudos to RF1 for his timely post on 12-12-12 at 12:12

RF1! Nice job!

[TruePoint]

Haha Brutus. That says that a "source" says Temple can't block it "because of some bylaw or something," which doesn't sound like its coming from someone with great command of the facts. Most likely, there is some disagreement about Temple's position and voting rights. If Temple (and its football-playing allies) are determined to block the dissolution and there is any legit disagreement about the language in the bylaws, then this thing will end up in court. I doubt anyone wants it going to court, so most likely they will have to find an amicable solution.

Be ready to not believe a lot of what you hear/read about this in the press for the foreseeable future. There is going to be much more posturing than honest assessments from all of the parties involved.

Keep hoping it's wrong, but it's being verified that it's true.

Verified by Temple, UConn or Cincinnati? Until then, assume you have a fight on your hands. The way these things are written, they're always subject to interpretation. I doubt there is anything in the bylaws specifically on point with the current situation.

Let me ask you: if there was no doubt that Temple didn't have a vote, what's the hold up?

[ATPTourFan]

ATP, the Palumbo Center in Duquesne was built in 1988 and had a massive renovation in 2011, which to me, makes it
a new building.
Lasalle's gym is new. Period.

Hi Rod, yes, Palumbo got a $8M renovation with video boards and new seats, but it's still in the lower 3rd for the A10 and seats just 4400.

Have you been to Tom Gola? It is a glorified high school gym. Yes, it was opened in 1998, and looks nice from the outside looking at the main facade and entrance, but it is worse than Palumbo, Reilly Center, and Hagan (despite it's very small size).

My breakdown of A10 arenas, each category ranked best to worst (red indicates not good enough for a new, better A10):

Modern
Chaifetz 10,600 (newest, awesome)
Cintas 10,250 (awesome)
Dayton Arena 13,435 (huge and great recent upgrades)
Liacouras 10,200 (very nice)
Ryan Center 7,657 (very nice, but could use some upgrades)
Halton Arena 9,105
Robins Center 9,071
Mullins 9,493 (nice, but better for hockey)

Older, respectable size:
Hinkle Fieldhouse 10,000 (old but historically awesome)
Siegel Center 7,500 (very nice, but not a modern facility)

High School:
Hagan 4,200 (Very Nice renovation, despite small size)
Palumbo Center 4,406 (recent upgrades)
Smith Center 5,000 (recent upgrades)
Reilly Center 5,480 (good capacity, but few amenities)
Rose Hill 3,470 (historic/ancient, but does have Dagger John's)
Tom Gola 4,000 (nothing special at all)

[spookydog]

Ryan Center 7,657 (very nice, but could use some upgrades)

The fact that they don't/can't show replays on the video boards is appalling.

[rodfromcranston]

The boxscore part of the board didn't work in the Vermont game.
Why don't we have an overhead scoreboard like 99% of arenas?
You have to constantly turn away from the floor, to look at the corner scoreboards,
and the North end one is pretty small.

[Rhody74]

The boxscore part of the board didn't work in the Vermont game.
Why don't we have an overhead scoreboard like 99% of arenas?
You have to constantly turn away from the floor, to look at the corner scoreboards,
and the North end one is pretty small.

That'd be on my wishlist, too, but I thought the roof was too low to accommodate an overhead scoreboard. Or am I misremembering it?

[Iggy1979]

I would be a lot more nervous, if JB was still the coach.

Of course, would we even care that much?

If they were to drop 3, no worries at all. Drop 5, and maybe a little, but I still think we would win out over GW and Duguesne. GW has a better recent history than we do, but overall they don't, and our facilities are considerably better.

Possibly there would be a compromise also. The A10 is calling the shots if the BE 7 want in, not the other way around.

I'm sure Thorr is watching this closely. There is going to be some serious hard feelings, if some schools are voted out, just so some others can get in. But in the end, the almighty dollar will rule the day.

No way the A10 is calling the shots. The BE7 have the muscle and the ESPN relationship. If anyone is calling the shots, it will ESPN or whatever network ponies up the most dough when this goes down. Most likely scenario is what has been discussed, I think. BE7 plus 9 A10 teams. Rhody is right on the cusp. Good facilities but closer to the bottom than top when it comes to marginal TV revenue. There is going to be market overlap with multiple schools in DC, Philly, NYC. I'm just not sure if having two Rhode Island teams is palatable for the eventual decision makers.

Please change your name to reflect that you're a PC fan. thanks.

[rodfromcranston]

Keaney had a low flat roof, and it had an overhead scoreboard.
Thank you, Iggy! I'm sure that request will be met with
indignant protests.

[Iggy1979]

One thing to keep in mind: the media is not unbiased in this matter. Projo needs PC to remain in what they consider a big-time conference. the same thing for the Courant and UConn. So you will probably see this bias creep into stories.

[Brutus]

Haha Brutus. That says that a "source" says Temple can't block it "because of some bylaw or something," which doesn't sound like its coming from someone with great command of the facts. Most likely, there is some disagreement about Temple's position and voting rights. If Temple (and its football-playing allies) are determined to block the dissolution and there is any legit disagreement about the language in the bylaws, then this thing will end up in court. I doubt anyone wants it going to court, so most likely they will have to find an amicable solution.

Be ready to not believe a lot of what you hear/read about this in the press for the foreseeable future. There is going to be much more posturing than honest assessments from all of the parties involved.

Keep hoping it's wrong, but it's being verified that it's true.

Verified by Temple, UConn or Cincinnati? Until then, assume you have a fight on your hands. The way these things are written, they're always subject to interpretation. I doubt there is anything in the bylaws specifically on point with the current situation.

Let me ask you: if there was no doubt that Temple didn't have a vote, what's the hold up?

Wrong again. BTW I give the A10 credit for contacting the BE bballers to try to get them to join the A10 knowing that they will lose some of their members to the new Big East.

[Brutus]

Wow the possibility of Notre Dame staying with the BE bballers instead of putting their basketball program in the ACC.

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/16971737 ... xodus.html

[TruePoint]

Verified by Temple, UConn or Cincinnati? Until then, assume you have a fight on your hands. The way these things are written, they're always subject to interpretation. I doubt there is anything in the bylaws specifically on point with the current situation.

Let me ask you: if there was no doubt that Temple didn't have a vote, what's the hold up?

Wrong again. BTW I give the A10 credit for contacting the BE bballers to try to get them to join the A10 knowing that they will lose some of their members to the new Big East.

Wrong about what? And based on what? If you want to call people out you need to support it with something. Arguing with people here using conclusory statements is going to lead to a short stay for you. You're entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts. If opposing fans are bringing information or unique perspective here, they will be welcome and appreciated contributors. If you're here to just disagree for the sake of it without anything substantive to add, I will do you the favor of not allowing to waste your time in that way any more.

[Brutus]

Verified by Temple, UConn or Cincinnati? Until then, assume you have a fight on your hands. The way these things are written, they're always subject to interpretation. I doubt there is anything in the bylaws specifically on point with the current situation.

Let me ask you: if there was no doubt that Temple didn't have a vote, what's the hold up?

Wrong again. BTW I give the A10 credit for contacting the BE bballers to try to get them to join the A10 knowing that they will lose some of their members to the new Big East.

Wrong about what? And based on what? If you want to call people out you need to support it with something. Arguing with people here using conclusory statements is going to lead to a short stay for you. You're entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts. If opposing fans are bringing information or unique perspective here, they will be welcome and appreciated contributors. If you're here to just disagree for the sake of it without anything substantive to add, I will do you the favor of not allowing to waste your time in that way any more.

Their are articles all over today proving most of your points are wrong why should I have to look them up for you, you're a big boy.

And remember when it all goes down and XU jumps the A10 ship remember who told you they would first.

[bigappleram]

why are you feeding the troll? brutus clearly sees things through 1 lens and for some reason wants to come here and try to pour salt on a wound that doesnt even exist yet. brutus, you know nothing as to how this will shake out, please dont pretend to be an insider or close to the inner dealings of either conference. you are a troll that is here only b/c PC beat us last week, if we had beaten you I am sure you would be nowhere to be found.

[Brutus]

BAR, I'm not here to rub any salt, only to be a realist at what really could happen. The BE bballers will NEVER join the A10 it's plain and simple. If they finally grow the gonads to split from the footballers they would rather start their own bball league with a few invites going to A10 schools and maybe a school like Creighton getting involved.

And I would still be here even if URI had won last week, because this conference realignment affects both our programs not just one.

[bigappleram]

do you really care how it affects URI, ummm no. So again, why are you here? If your team is never going to join the A10 then shouldn't you be on the VCU and X boards talking to their fan base. You are here for 1 reason only and its clear as day. And I know anyone with real intel as to how this will play out is not trolling the URI message board.

You are speculating, like everyone else, and then passing things off as definitive opinions or pretending like you have some sort of insider knowledge that no one else has. That's a joke. Many credible basketball sources, emphasis on credible, have raised the prospect of the BE basketball schools joining the A10 so sorry pal I am going to trust the opinion of Andy Katz over some dopey PC fan that calls himself Brutus and trolls the board of another school. Unless you are in the board room of either of our league offices then you have no clue.

Does the Big East brand name have more 'cache' than the A10, absolutely. But that cache was largely built on the backs of schools that are no longer part of the new Big East. A brand is only as strong as the product it puts out under its banner. In the end the only thing that will matter are the dollar signs. If an A10-BE merger makes the most money that will be what happens...if the BE staying intact and taking a select few schools from the A10 and other conferences means more dollars than that will be the driver of the decision. Brand cache and past glory from 20+ years ago will matter little in the decision.

[TruePoint]

BAR, I know I shouldn't, but I have to just once more.

Brutus, I'm asking you where I can find an article that disproves what I'm saying, because I've looked and I haven't found one. Humor me.

I don't think you're going to be able to, because my post was IN RESPONSE TO what you think proves me wrong. Since you appear to be struggling to understand what I'm saying, I'll put it in the simplest possible terms: I think the source for these stories is advancing an agenda and that what he is saying is not factually accurate (i.e., I'm calling bullshit). To support this proposition, I cite (1) the fact that those schools with an opposing viewpoint have not verified the assertion that Temple cannot vote to block the dissolution, and (2) that the C7 have not yet dissolved the conference, because I believe they would if they could. Furthermore, I am drawing upon (3) my personal experiences with contract disputes which tells me that the basis for the dispute is almost always two sides interpreting the same language differently - if the language was clear there would be no source for disagreement.

Now its your turn: address and rebut each of my points with some fact or opinion tailored specifically to that point, or point me towards a source that does so. I've even numbered the items I'd like you to address to make it easier for you.

[Brutus]

BAR, I know I shouldn't, but I have to just once more.

Brutus, I'm asking you where I can find an article that disproves what I'm saying, because I've looked and I haven't found one. Humor me.

I don't think you're going to be able to, because my post was IN RESPONSE TO what you think proves me wrong. Since you appear to be struggling to understand what I'm saying, I'll put it in the simplest possible terms: I think the source for these stories is advancing an agenda and that what he is saying is not factually accurate (i.e., I'm calling bullshit). To support this proposition, I cite (1) the fact that those schools with an opposing viewpoint have not verified the assertion that Temple cannot vote to block the dissolution, and (2) that the C7 have not yet dissolved the conference, because I believe they would if they could. Furthermore, I am drawing upon (3) my personal experiences with contract disputes which tells me that the basis for the dispute is almost always two sides interpreting the same language differently - if the language was clear there would be no source for disagreement.

Now its your turn: address and rebut each of my points with some fact or opinion tailored specifically to that point, or point me towards a source that does so. I've even numbered the items I'd like you to address to make it easier for you.

Philly Inquirer, Projo, Chicago Sun Times, Zags...it's out there...find it.

[Brutus]

do you really care how it affects URI, ummm no. So again, why are you here? If your team is never going to join the A10 then shouldn't you be on the VCU and X boards talking to their fan base. You are here for 1 reason only and its clear as day. And I know anyone with real intel as to how this will play out is not trolling the URI message board.

You are speculating, like everyone else, and then passing things off as definitive opinions or pretending like you have some sort of insider knowledge that no one else has. That's a joke. Many credible basketball sources, emphasis on credible, have raised the prospect of the BE basketball schools joining the A10 so sorry pal I am going to trust the opinion of Andy Katz over some dopey PC fan that calls himself Brutus and trolls the board of another school. Unless you are in the board room of either of our league offices then you have no clue.

Does the Big East brand name have more 'cache' than the A10, absolutely. But that cache was largely built on the backs of schools that are no longer part of the new Big East. A brand is only as strong as the product it puts out under its banner. In the end the only thing that will matter are the dollar signs. If an A10-BE merger makes the most money that will be what happens...if the BE staying intact and taking a select few schools from the A10 and other conferences means more dollars than that will be the driver of the decision. Brand cache and past glory from 20+ years ago will matter little in the decision.

The same Katz who said last night that his sources are telling him that the BE bballers are about to join the A10, but today has a story about Gonzaga approaching the BE bballers about joining them in a new bball conference?

[gorhody89]

BAR, I know I shouldn't, but I have to just once more.

Brutus, I'm asking you where I can find an article that disproves what I'm saying, because I've looked and I haven't found one. Humor me.

I don't think you're going to be able to, because my post was IN RESPONSE TO what you think proves me wrong. Since you appear to be struggling to understand what I'm saying, I'll put it in the simplest possible terms: I think the source for these stories is advancing an agenda and that what he is saying is not factually accurate (i.e., I'm calling bullshit). To support this proposition, I cite (1) the fact that those schools with an opposing viewpoint have not verified the assertion that Temple cannot vote to block the dissolution, and (2) that the C7 have not yet dissolved the conference, because I believe they would if they could. Furthermore, I am drawing upon (3) my personal experiences with contract disputes which tells me that the basis for the dispute is almost always two sides interpreting the same language differently - if the language was clear there would be no source for disagreement.

Now its your turn: address and rebut each of my points with some fact or opinion tailored specifically to that point, or point me towards a source that does so. I've even numbered the items I'd like you to address to make it easier for you.

Philly Inquirer, Projo, Chicago Sun Times, Zags...it's out there...find it.

He is right unfortunately...It looks like the much more likely case is the 7 big east schools leaving and joining a new conference with select A10 schools...Unfortunately it will prob be up to PC whether we are invited or not...I have a bad feeling

[rhodyram81]

I'm wondering if the fact that we are essentially a charter member of the A-10 helps us at all, coming from the Eastern-8, and gives us a leg up on some of the schools being discussed as the bottom 5 that could be lopped off.

[TruePoint]

BAR, I know I shouldn't, but I have to just once more.

Brutus, I'm asking you where I can find an article that disproves what I'm saying, because I've looked and I haven't found one. Humor me.

I don't think you're going to be able to, because my post was IN RESPONSE TO what you think proves me wrong. Since you appear to be struggling to understand what I'm saying, I'll put it in the simplest possible terms: I think the source for these stories is advancing an agenda and that what he is saying is not factually accurate (i.e., I'm calling bullshit). To support this proposition, I cite (1) the fact that those schools with an opposing viewpoint have not verified the assertion that Temple cannot vote to block the dissolution, and (2) that the C7 have not yet dissolved the conference, because I believe they would if they could. Furthermore, I am drawing upon (3) my personal experiences with contract disputes which tells me that the basis for the dispute is almost always two sides interpreting the same language differently - if the language was clear there would be no source for disagreement.

Now its your turn: address and rebut each of my points with some fact or opinion tailored specifically to that point, or point me towards a source that does so. I've even numbered the items I'd like you to address to make it easier for you.

Philly Inquirer, Projo, Chicago Sun Times, Zags...it's out there...find it.

Good. Now maybe I am missing something. Can you tell me which of those sources you cite quotes an official from Temple, UConn or Cincinnati conceding the point regarding Temple's voting ability? Next, could you please tell us which of those sources reported the news that the C7 schools have officially announced that they have dissolved the Big East conference?


Brutus, it is my strong suspicion that either you are the stupidest person on the Internet or you are one of its millions of trolls. If you cannot answer the questions that I'm asking you directly or concede that you don't know what you are talking about, you're going to timeout.

[Brutus]

BAR, I know I shouldn't, but I have to just once more.

Brutus, I'm asking you where I can find an article that disproves what I'm saying, because I've looked and I haven't found one. Humor me.

I don't think you're going to be able to, because my post was IN RESPONSE TO what you think proves me wrong. Since you appear to be struggling to understand what I'm saying, I'll put it in the simplest possible terms: I think the source for these stories is advancing an agenda and that what he is saying is not factually accurate (i.e., I'm calling bullshit). To support this proposition, I cite (1) the fact that those schools with an opposing viewpoint have not verified the assertion that Temple cannot vote to block the dissolution, and (2) that the C7 have not yet dissolved the conference, because I believe they would if they could. Furthermore, I am drawing upon (3) my personal experiences with contract disputes which tells me that the basis for the dispute is almost always two sides interpreting the same language differently - if the language was clear there would be no source for disagreement.

Now its your turn: address and rebut each of my points with some fact or opinion tailored specifically to that point, or point me towards a source that does so. I've even numbered the items I'd like you to address to make it easier for you.

Philly Inquirer, Projo, Chicago Sun Times, Zags...it's out there...find it.

Good. Now maybe I am missing something. Can you tell me which of those sources you cite quotes an official from Temple, UConn or Cincinnati conceding the point regarding Temple's voting ability? Next, could you please tell us which of those sources reported the news that the C7 schools have officially announced that they have dissolved the Big East conference?


Brutus, it is my strong suspicion that either you are the stupidest person on the Internet or you are one of its millions of trolls. If you cannot answer the questions that I'm asking you directly or concede that you don't know what you are talking about, you're going to timeout.

Who has come out and agreed with Temple that they now have voting rights?

I have stated the bballers needed to grow the gonads to finally decide to split from the footballers.

I know you can see the end of the A10 and it worries you, but when all is said and done we'll see who truly is the stupidest one between the 2 of us.

[TruePoint]

He is right unfortunately...It looks like the much more likely case is the 7 big east schools leaving and joining a new conference with select A10 schools...Unfortunately it will prob be up to PC whether we are invited or not...I have a bad feeling

Ugh....seriously I'm going to flip out. "It looks like" is all he has to say. I'm not arguing about what the eventual result of all this is going to be, nor am I trying to say he doesn't have the right to his opinion. Clearly you aren't following what I'm saying either, so maybe its my fault. My point is that of course there are anonymous sources out there selling the story that most benefits them to the press. Of course there are media outlets out there passing along that story as "news." My point (and really try to understand this) is that unless and until someone from the other side concedes on the record that Temple and the football schools cannot do anything to stop the dissolution of the conference, its just spin. And the only thing I've read from Temple is that they believe they have a vote, and the C7 schools disagree. Of course the C7 schools can leave on their own; that is why we are talking about where they'll go. But they can't dissolve the conference and start a new one with the name and the postseason credits unless they dissolve the conference, and they can't do that unless they get the football schools to agree or they win a lawsuit over Temple's voting rights.

It's like amateur hour on this board right now.

[Brutus]

He is right unfortunately...It looks like the much more likely case is the 7 big east schools leaving and joining a new conference with select A10 schools...Unfortunately it will prob be up to PC whether we are invited or not...I have a bad feeling

Ugh....seriously I'm going to flip out. "It looks like" is all he has to say. I'm not arguing about what the eventual result of all this is going to be, nor am I trying to say he doesn't have the right to his opinion. Clearly you aren't following what I'm saying either, so maybe its my fault. My point is that of course there are anonymous sources out there selling the story that most benefits them to the press. Of course there are media outlets out there passing along that story as "news." My point (and really try to understand this) is that unless and until someone from the other side concedes on the record that Temple and the football schools cannot do anything to stop the dissolution of the conference, its just spin. And the only thing I've read from Temple is that they believe they have a vote, and the C7 schools disagree. Of course the C7 schools can leave on their own; that is why we are talking about where they'll go. But they can't dissolve the conference and start a new one with the name and the postseason credits unless they dissolve the conference, and they can't do that unless they get the football schools to agree or they win a lawsuit over Temple's voting rights.

It's like amateur hour on this board right now.

Are you serious? Why hasn't any of the football schools come out to say that Temple does have a vote? Their silence is deafening.

Talk about amateur hour.

[TruePoint]

Why would they say something? How would it behoove them to acknowledge the dispute at all. They are for the status quo. They don't have to prove anything. That there hasn't been a vote to dissolve yet shows that it is a contended issue, which is one of the points I made before that you could not respond to.

Look, I am the first person to say that I have no idea what the agreement says, what the endgame actually is for each of the parties involved, or how everything is going to shake out. My point is neither does anyone else, including the media who just print whatever morsel they are given so they can keep their source. You have subscribed to a particular narrative here, and it very well could turn out that you're right. But the point remains that you really have no idea what's going on, you're basing your opinion on information that is being planted and used in a battle between two sides, and it is just as likely that you are wrong as you are right.

One thing is absolutely certain in my mind: the C7 schools will split from the football schools. But when or how, nobody knows. Even the people making the decisions don't know, or something would have already happened. Until there is an agreement among all the parties about whether the C7 can vote to dissolve the conference, there is an ongoing dispute. How can you argue that point?

[CT Rhody]

Interesting how playing in the BE with Syracuse, Uconn and the likes actually made PC, SH, etc think that they were actually a big time program. KMAC has turned into a PC super fan slash cheerleader these days. It's pathetic. I hope Georgetown gets that BCS invite they so desperately desire and these BE6 won't be much to talk about anymore. Their own league prob wouldn't be an option anymore if that were to happen.

I also thought it was funny the Marquette AD said the A-10 didn't have a Marquette, not even sure what that means to be honest. It's like some of these people live in another world. They were propped up by the BE after moving from Conference USA, there were def solid but never National Championship caliber so what am I missing here?

[Brutus]

Interesting how playing in the BE with Syracuse, Uconn and the likes actually made PC, SH, etc think that they were actually a big time program. KMAC has turned into a PC super fan slash cheerleader these days. It's pathetic. I hope Georgetown gets that BCS invite they so desperately desire and these BE6 won't be much to talk about anymore. Their own league prob wouldn't be an option anymore if that were to happen.

I also thought it was funny the Marquette AD said the A-10 didn't have a Marquette, not even sure what that means to be honest. It's like some of these people live in another world. They were propped up by the BE after moving from Conference USA, there were def solid but never National Championship caliber so what am I missing here?

Georgetown getting a BCS invite? That has to be the post of the year on this board.

[TruePoint]

Brutus is on a 24 hour vacation. A dozen posts in a row that were argumentative for the sake of being argumentative without adding a single idea of substance to the conversation. Continued to make mindless and argumentative posts and ignored warnings and directives to be responsive.

[Issac]

Couple of items. First, Butler will not join a league with all Catholic schools. Trust me on that.
Second, the demise of the BE will come at the initiative of the football schools or more departures from that group - primarily UConn or Cincy. Until that happens the BB schools can meet all they want, they will do nothing unless forced by football.

[PCFriarFan]

WThat there hasn't been a vote to dissolve yet shows that it is a contended issue, which is one of the points I made before that you could not respond to.

I come in peace Ram fans. Temple may or may not have full voting rights (typically a member only in for football does not)...Temple is unique in that it will become a full member. Back in 2005 (or so) there were concessions made on the basketball side (which is where this latest report is coming from...that the Catholics may be able to dissolve, seceded, whatever language you want to apply with or without 75% of the votes). The fact there has been no vote or action to dissolve means absolutely nothing at this point (in my opinion). Consider the following.

1. This notion has only recently picked up steam. With L-Ville leaving and addition of Tulane. I'm sure there have been many back channel conversations but three days ago was the first time Presidents and ADs of all the Catholic schools met together. The first time. It's obviously a very complicated situation and requires a commitment of all 7 schools.

2. Basketball schools technically don't have to do anything until July (assuming they do have the power) and they do not know what the actual TV $$ is...as the league is presently constituted (football hybrid). Why not find that out?

3. And there are literally hundreds of millions of other reasons. If they vote to dissolve the BE or use a clause to exit there are literally hundreds of millions of dollars up for grabs. The exit fees alone will be 65 - 80 million from schools that have recently left. Someone posted one year of NCAA money was 25 million to the Big East recently. And it rolls in over a six year period. So you are literally talking about a total on the board right now (before this years NCAAs) of a # maybe in excess of 200 million dollars. How is that money legally to be dived up presently and into the future? That doesn't even get into the rights to the Big East name, etc.

4. Law suits. If dissolution occurs even if it's done exactly to the letter of the bylaws, there is going to be legal action in some way. And there are just so many tangents right now the basketball schools have to consider. Boise St is signed on to be a football only member, and has stipulations in their contract about future membership. Cincinnati is a current member but publicly lobbying to get out, does that reduce the damages they can claim? What about Navy which is supposed to be a football only in 2015?

I could go on for pages (are other schools such as Xavier really committed to a new league, etc). It's just such an ugly mess with so many tentacles right now that a snap decision should not (could not?) be made. If the Presidents were to make a quick decision on this stuff it would be incredibly dumb and could up being a huge, huge blunder.

Anyway, here's hoping PC and URI both end up in good spot. I want both teams in the top 25. Anybody that doesn't see a top showcase, rivalry type game as being a benefit to both sides is incredibly short sighted.

[CT Rhody]

Good post PCFriarFan. Watching NBC Sports talk tonight, Vin Parise just said his sources have the BE7 stealing from the A-10 and not going to the A-10 but his source is more than likely Kmac so that doesn't mean much if anything.

Interesting how after all these rumors, the best play for URI might be these BE7 staying put in a water downed BE and the A-10 staying as is. Especially considering if all this dies down for a couple of years and Hurly is able to turn the program around, thur strenthening our position if this ever comes back up. If that happened, you would have to put the two conferences on level ground which would only help A-10 recruiting. I still think dropping 2-3 bottom programs who aren't serious about competing in basketball would be a successful path forward for the conference.

[Ramulous]

The sad part is that Brutus may be right in the end....but I don't think anyone has definitive knowledge about any school's intent.....the schools have been known to be lying two-facers throughout this conference jumping period....most especially the football schools......I don't think any basketball only schools have been caught in outright lies as of yet..

....for us the situation is not as dire as that for providence college....we are used to being in a second class mid-major conference so the fall-out is not as bad for us....even if the current cream of the A-10 leaves to join the C7...we will still be in a the second best mid-major conference....the friars will be in the best mid-major conference...and their income will be diminished from current levels..

....I favor the C7 joining with all members of the A-10 under whatever banner.....it would be the best mid-major conference and renew and maintain long standing rivalries....the attendance at games would be tremendous in my opinion....

And finally, Brutus seems to be living up to the translation of his Latin name.....but I oppose banning or suspending him.

[Rhody72]

Posters seem to think that the 5 teams that might get dropped from a merged league would be LaSalle, Fordham, SBU, Duquesne, and GW. Is URI the 6th? Would the 7 BE Catholics conspire against the 4 A10 Catholics in this list of five? I think URI could be in trouble unless some A10 teams bolt to a third conference. We overstate our stature in the A10 on this board.

[PCFriarFan]

Interesting how after all these rumors, the best play for URI might be these BE7 staying put in a water downed BE and the A-10 staying as is.

I think you are exactly right CT Rhody. I think the best bet for A-10 fans is to root for the Big East Basketball/Football hybrid to stay intact. The basketball schools get a decent TV deal and decide the risk of breaking up/leaving the Big East isn't worth it. However, if this happens and the dust settles there are 16 Basketball schools, I can still see the Big East trying to invite two more basketball only schools.