A10 vs ACC / Barclay's

bigappleram · Unread post by **bigappleram** » 10 years ago

A Hurley vs Duke seems like a compelling TV matchup to me....assuming we are relevant again. That is the key, if we are then given we have a brand name coach I assume we get a game.

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 10 years ago

Nah. Wrong Hurley.

rjsuperfly66 · Unread post by **rjsuperfly66** » 10 years ago

ESPN wrote:The Barclays Center will host the nonconference doubleheaders between ACC and A-10 teams, likely in December. The doubleheaders would start in the 2015-16 season. There will be one a year, the source said.

I hope the A-10 got some assurance on the type of teams the A-10 would play. It wouldn't surprise me to see the ACC send at best their middle of the road teams to an event like this. You know there is no way they are forcing Coach K, Boeheim, Williams, or Pitino to play in games they don't want to unless they some handshakes before hand to allow them to pull the trigger and get that presence in NY. If the A-10 gets the likes of BC, Wake, Georgia Tech, Clemson, etc., IMHO would be a complete screwjob. The only win would be the A10 getting to set the terms of the games (although I think their should be some restriction like an ACC team can only be expected to play in one of these games).

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 10 years ago

One doubleheader a year isn't much. Three would have been nice.

It will take 7 years for all 14 A10 teams to play in one.

Not holding my breath on this one.

At least we get the Barclay's back for 2019-21. That's OK in my book.

steviep123 · Unread post by **steviep123** » 10 years ago

Would the Barclays want a BC-Duquesne type match up? I'm sure they'd prefer a Syracuse playing one of the A10s top teams.

rjsuperfly66 · Unread post by **rjsuperfly66** » 10 years ago

I would think they try to headline one game with decent team, and have a "throwaway" game with a lower-ranked team in that conference. The problem is that if URI's one game against the ACC is against Wake or Clemson, does it feel to your fan base like you got fair compensation for losing the Barclays?

As for Barclays, they have held low-rated double headers in the past. This year, they held a double header, Virginia St. vs. Virginia Union and Delaware St. vs. Howard. If the Barclays sees a benefit in getting the ACC Tournament there, they probably can eat one night of decent crowds. However, I would bet schools like Syracuse, Notre Dame, BC, they would like to be involved with games there due to NYC.

RF1 · Unread post by **RF1** » 10 years ago

rambone 78 wrote:One doubleheader a year isn't much. Three would have been nice.

It will take 7 years for all 14 A10 teams to play in one.

Not holding my breath on this one.

At least we get the Barclay's back for 2019-21. That's OK in my book.

Per the ESPN article:

The Barclays Center will host the nonconference doubleheaders between ACC and A-10 teams, likely in December. The doubleheaders would start in the 2015-16 season. There will be one a year, the source said.

My guess is that this deal does not last seven years and several A-10 programs will not participate. I think this will end up being another gift to members such as VCU and Dayton. Would not surprise me if URI never participates. The league will contine to with its haves and have nots. People will continue to complai about the bottom tier of the conference but no actions will be taken to help change this. The league's actions will just reinforce the status quo.

bigappleram · Unread post by **bigappleram** » 10 years ago

RF1, I dont agree....its on us to get out of the bottom and become relevant again. The conference isnt there to prop us up. We were relevant in the late 90s because we won games. If we win the rest takes care of itself. Put it this way, if we are around a 20 win team next year and EC and Hassan look like bona fide stars then we will attract attention. If we are a bottom feeder then we deserve what we get.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 10 years ago

URI will be good in 2 years. Top of the conference, if we get the recruits to complement what we have.

I think we'll play a decent ACC team there, but it might take 2-3 years into the agreement.

Of course, who wants to play who, could be interesting. At least it's a neutral court.

BAR, agree with that assessment.

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 10 years ago

Agree with BAR. The conference should only put it's premier teams in a game that should be a showcase event for the league. It's up to URI to become one of those teams. And as far as gifts go, I have no problem with throwing a bone to some of our more attractive members. I definitely think the conference has an interest in keeping it's best programs happy.

twisted3829 · Unread post by **twisted3829** » 10 years ago

http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports. ... urnaments/

RF1 · Unread post by **RF1** » 10 years ago

If it ever took place there, the A-10 would have to mandate to the DDC that all banners for its other tenants be removed. I can also think of some court space that would be an excellent and fitting choice to have the A-10 logos.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 10 years ago

That would be great. A de facto home court, and when we have become an A10 power.

I can see the Dunk getting one of those two years.

Probably would have a better shot than Mohegan. However, the fans that would come to a tourney there would have a lot more fun than in Providence.

I might guess that PC would not like the tourney in Providence, oh well too bad.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 10 years ago

I think it's going to come down to 3 venues for those 2 years.

The Verizon Center in DC, the Palestra in Philly, and the DDC in Providence.

ace · Unread post by **ace** » 10 years ago

I selfishly want Philly. The Palestra is one of my favorite places to watch a basketball game, but it's certainly not as shiny and new, or as big, as the alternatives.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 10 years ago

Well, Philly is centrally located, which is good.

The DDC would be great for the northern part of the conference, the Verizon would be great for the southern schools.

Can make a good case for all 3.

All will eventually get to host a tourney I would think, including back to AC again at some point.

In my selfish case I would love to see the Dunk get the first shot, as 2017 would be EC's and Hassan's senior year [if they haven't NBA'd by then].

I think we'll be pretty good then.

peeps4life · Unread post by **peeps4life** » 10 years ago

any of you get to catch the NCAAs at DDC? it was an awesome time.

Unread post by **ATPTourFan** » 10 years ago

peeps4life wrote:any of you get to catch the NCAAs at DDC? it was an awesome time.

Yes, sure did. Dunk looked good that weekend, even if some of the top seeds playing there did not.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 10 years ago

I know this might not mean anything, but the "northern 4" [meaning URI, Fordham, St.Bonnie, and UMass] isn't exactly the strongest part of the A10 right now.

If there's a "favored" group likely to get the conference tourney near them, it's got to be the southern schools, especially if Dayton is included in that.

Of course things can, and likely will change by the time the sites are decided on.

Who knows what UMass will end up doing. Also, will Dayton and St. Louis still be a part of the A10 in a couple of years?

RF1 · Unread post by **RF1** » 10 years ago

rambone 78 wrote:I know this might not mean anything, but the "northern 4" [meaning URI, Fordham, St.Bonnie, and UMass] isn't exactly the strongest part of the A10 right now.

If there's a "favored" group likely to get the conference tourney near them, it's got to be the southern schools, especially if Dayton is included in that.

Of course things can, and likely will change by the time the sites are decided on.

Who knows what UMass will end up doing. Also, will Dayton and St. Louis still be a part of the A10 in a couple of years?

The majority and power of the league is now pretty much in the Philly-DC-Richmond corridor with six teams located there. I would think if things could be worked out (building availability, cost effective, etc...), they would want it in their region.

The final decision will likely involve league politics and which venue can offer the best deal.

Rhody74 · Unread post by **Rhody74** » 10 years ago

While I'd love to have it at the Dunk, objectively speaking, it probably belongs in D.C.

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 10 years ago

Rambone, Ohio borders on Canada. I don't think you can consider Dayton to be in the south.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 10 years ago

Actually, Dayton and St. Louis are outliers in terms of the A10's geographical footprint. And they have 2 of the best arenas in the conference, but they won't ever get the tourneys there.

Maybe if the A10 were to expand west, along with keeping those 2 in the conference, it would happen, but I doubt it. As in adding Wichita State and Bradley, or Murray State.

I would say that the DC area, along with Philly, would be the most likely choices for the tourney in 2017-18.

RF1 · Unread post by **RF1** » 10 years ago

The Dunkin Donuts Center is the perfect size for this event. Barclays is too big and so too would be the Verizon Center in DC and Wells Fargo Center in Philly. Its location however is not ideal as it is the most northeastern point in the league's footprint. I would think the only chance it could have to get the event is if things can't be worked out elsewhere. The arena size and cost to stage the event in either DC or Philly might not make sense. The DDC would have to really offer an attractive package and possibly make some guarantees.

If the DDC wants to bid for this event, all financial libility should be on them. There should be no monetary risk for URI. URI can assist the DDC by putting an option for the tourney in its season ticket applications (don't give the DDC the RC mailing list) and can collect funds and ticket requests and later distribute them. Perhaps get UMass involved in a similar fashion. Both schools could continue to cross promote the event throughout their seasons.

If URI were to have no monetary risk, the only downside I could see would be PR. If the event was not well attended, some of the local media would see it as a failure of URI and would surely pounce on it. URI and UMass would have to support this tournament to make it a success. Both teams would have to being doing well for that to happen.

I think Providence as a city would be a good host as everything that is required (hotels, restaurants, bars, shopping, etc...) is within a few blocks walking distance of the arena. The city is small enough that this event would take over the town.

Getting this event could be an economic boost to Providence. Since all that state money was spent on the purchase and renovation of the DDC, it doesn't seem to me like the arena has got many of the events that were promised. The best it did was to get the NCAA Basketball Tournament a few years ago but there isn't another on the horizon. It doesn't seem like the renovation has helped in getting the NCAA Frozen-4 back. I think the venue is just too small now. It did host an early round of the NCAA Hockey Tournament and I think it may be slated to do again in future years. Other than that, what big events have really come there since it was redone? If the DDC did get the A-10 Tourney, at least URI supporters would finally get some benefit for all their tax money that went into it.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 10 years ago

If URI and UMass were good, I would see no problem with the event being well attended.

But how do you time something like that?

We can assume URI will be good in 2017-18, but you really never know.

This program needs to get their APR situation under control, and know just who is going to play year in and year out. If that's even possible.

P.S. The APR deal shouldn't be a problem for the next couple of years, as long as the team scores well this year and next, because the 2 year rolling average is the criteria being used.

After that, however, the NCAA will revert to the 4 year average, which puts the 2011-12 scores into play. As we know, the last year of Baron's tenure was a train wreck.

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 10 years ago

Bottom line is, we don't draw well. It's not as if we had a fanatical fanbase that
would grab all the available seats.
None of the A-10 school, except Dayton and VCU travel well.
Remember, the tournament was held in Dayton years ago. That place was filled.
Put this in an 18,000 seat arena, and the 8,000 or so will make it look empty.
Maybe the Palestra or Atlantic City is best for that reason.
A smaller venue is likely to look better on TV.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 10 years ago

Well, if we were good, we would draw a few thousand to the Dunk.

We used to, anyway, when it was our home court in the PC rivalry.

I think that would happen again. As for any other venue except Mohegan, we would be likely to have a few hundred at most show up.

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 10 years ago

Back in the hayday of Rhode Island college basketball in the Jack Kraft era,
URI averages over 9,000 at the PCC one year.
That was with a super player, our best team, and intense interest
in college basketball.
I remember even when Penders was coach, sitting in the courtside seats, because
only a few people were there.
We didn't draw that well when Harrick was coach at the PCC, either.
I honestly don't see that 9,000 plus happening again. I hope I'm wrong.
We drew flies to Mohegan last year. A bit better when we played OSU years
ago.
Would the NCAA consent to a post season tournament on a gambling casino owned venue?

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 10 years ago

I would think so, Rod.

The AAC women's post season tourney was just played there.

The CIAC high school tourney also.

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 10 years ago

Well, in a metro area, Philly, DC, Providence, AC, there are a large quantity of hotels
for the out of town fans.
How would that work at Mohegan?
People would have to make the ride from Providence, Hartford or wherever hotels.
Not exactly convenient.
AAC could put its woman's tournament there, because UConn fans flock to fill
the arena. It's not a typical scenario with A-10 men's basketball.
Mohegan is a bad idea all around.

wakefield · Unread post by **wakefield** » 10 years ago

How about playing at the Izod center in Jersey if following happens.

ACC plays in Brooklyn
Big 10 in Newark - Their commissioner is from Jersey.
NBE NYC

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 10 years ago

Izod Center is a big dump. Another huge arena, where
8,000 people will make the place look empty.

Unread post by **ATPTourFan** » 10 years ago

I think it's virtually guaranteed that this two year window between Barclays will have a site in the mid-atlantic area so that the bulk of the fanbases are within reasonable distance which would max out attendance.

If Barclays/NYC wasn't such a coup for the conference, the A10 tournament would already be located centrally amongst their members.

RF1 · Unread post by **RF1** » 10 years ago

ATPTourFan wrote:I think it's virtually guaranteed that this two year window between Barclays will have a site in the mid-atlantic area so that the bulk of the fanbases are within reasonable distance which would max out attendance.

If Barclays/NYC wasn't such a coup for the conference, the A10 tournament would already be located centrally amongst their members.

I agree that the DC or Philly make the most sense. What venue options are there however that fit the league's needs? The Verizon Center in DC and the Wells Fargo Center in Philadelpha are large near 20k seat arenas that have NBA and NHL tenants. The buildings are bigger than what is needed for the A-10 Tournament and scheduling may be an issue the venues might not want to work around. Philly does have the Palestra or Temple's arena as other options. The Palestra is less than 9k seating with mostly benches and no modern amenities. The 10k seat Temple arena is in a bad part of town. While these cities make the most geographic sense, that doesn't mean that they will be able to work everything out.

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 10 years ago

What about The Baltimore Arena? It's about as big as
The Dunk.
It's got some history to it. The Bullets used to play there with
Earl The Pearl, Gus Johnson and Wes Unseld.
Baltimore is easy to get to, and would be good for VA, Philly teams.

Unread post by **ATPTourFan** » 10 years ago

Yeah, all serious talk of going back to Palestra has to stop. I love the Palestra for a single game, but I can assure you that would never meet the initial requirements for consideration.

RF1 · Unread post by **RF1** » 10 years ago

rodfromcranston wrote:What about The Baltimore Arena? It's about as big as
The Dunk.
It's got some history to it. The Bullets used to play there with
Earl The Pearl, Gus Johnson and Wes Unseld.
Baltimore is easy to get to, and would be good for VA, Philly teams.

The CAA now hods its tourney at the Baltimore Arena is available. I believe that their tourney ends right before the A-10 so the dates may be available. I however don't think it is a really nice arena as it is dated. The area where it is located also did not seem that nice to me. I was actually suprised how much (for the worse) Baltimore changes just a few blocks from the inner harbor. Everything from the stadiums to Fells Point along the waterfront is very nice. A few blocks away however is not.

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 10 years ago

They have plenty of events at Baltimore arena. It can't be that bad,
because the CAA is there, as well as other events.
They've had more big acts than the Dunk.
Springsteen, Rolling Stones,Taylor Swift, Carrie Underwood, and Miss USA pagent.
Dear Leader had a rally there.
It's near the inner harbor, where Camden Yards is.

RF1 · Unread post by **RF1** » 10 years ago

rodfromcranston wrote:It's near the inner harbor, where Camden Yards is.

I know where it is as I have walked by it. It is just a few blocks from the inner harbor in the old downtown. That area is no where as nice as by the harbor. I was surprised how quickly the area deteriorated in just a few blocks. I don't think most visitors ever go there.

The arena will remind many of AC or Keaney as it is horseshoe shaped with a stage at one end.

There has been talk for decades about building a new first class arena to match the baseball and football stadiums, convention center, and inner harbor area. The arena was built in 1962 and has had some renovations but it really doesn't match the other public spaces in town.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baltimore_Arena

Seawrightspostgame · Unread post by **Seawrightspostgame** » 10 years ago

7 teams are within an easy drive to DC. Could be exciting.

I always like visiting DC.

The street outside that venue is lively too. It is where the wizards play that would be used right?

I also feel like our backyard could have adverse effects. Or at least prompt local media to aggravate this board.

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 10 years ago

DC traffic is horrid. The Verizon Center is where the Wizards,
Caps and GTown play. It's in Chinatown, DC.
It's fairly new and seats 18,000

bigappleram · Unread post by **bigappleram** » 10 years ago

the area around the Verizon Center has been greatly gentrified and built up in the last 15 or so years. a lot going on and a nice neighborhood, it wasnt when i was in DC in the mid 90s. Baltimore definitely has some sketchy areas, it has a very rough element and is the kind of city where you make a wrong turn and are in a very scary place. plus that arena is supposedly awful, very old and outdated.

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 10 years ago

Ha! Atlantic City was the place where, one block from
the casinos made Roxbury look nice.
All urban areas have places you wouldn't want to get stuck in or
walk around.

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 10 years ago

DC definitely has some sketchy neighborhoods but it is in my top 5 American cities to visit. I would definitely use the basketball tournament as an excuse to take a trip down there.

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 10 years ago

DC is a very different place now than it was before 9-11.
You used to be able to go pretty much anywhere.
Now, understandably, it's more like a huge military base, as far as
public buildings go.
I used to kill time sitting in the Senate and House galleries, I doubt
it's that easy these days.
Still, a great place to visit or if you live in Alexandria or nearby, a nice part of
the world.

ace · Unread post by **ace** » 10 years ago

RF1 wrote:I agree that the DC or Philly make the most sense. What venue options are there however that fit the league's needs? The Verizon Center in DC and the Wells Fargo Center in Philadelpha are large near 20k seat arenas that have NBA and NHL tenants. The buildings are bigger than what is needed for the A-10 Tournament and scheduling may be an issue the venues might not want to work around. Philly does have the Palestra or Temple's arena as other options. The Palestra is less than 9k seating with mostly benches and no modern amenities. The 10k seat Temple arena is in a bad part of town. While these cities make the most geographic sense, that doesn't mean that they will be able to work everything out.

I don't think the Liacouras Center is a good choice, but I have to stick up for that part of North Philly a little, it's fine. The problem is that, even though it's a direct subway ride to Center City or a quick drive to Northern Liberties, there's not much in the way of restaurants/bars in the immediate vicinity. Penn has added to the Palestra, giving it some more space- not seating but media rooms and things like that. The American Conference considered it, at least briefly, for this year. Still, I think the tournament ends up in DC for at least one of the non-Barclays years.

rhodyrudder · Unread post by **rhodyrudder** » 10 years ago

It's not gonna be at temple.
They'd have it at the sports complex in south philly.
It should go back to ac.
Would they even cover up the giant 'Providence' logo if it was
on the dave gavitt court?

twisted3829 · Unread post by **twisted3829** » 10 years ago

I think it's going to go to DC and I think that's probably the best option

RF1 · Unread post by **RF1** » 10 years ago

rhodyrudder wrote:It's not gonna be at temple.
They'd have it at the sports complex in south philly.
It should go back to ac.
Would they even cover up the giant 'Providence' logo if it was
on the dave gavitt court?

All the banners would need to be removed. I would then put a big A-10 Tournament decal over the Friar logo at center court and A-10 Conference logos over Gavitt's name. The covering up of Gavitt's name would be poetic justice for the A-10 since he continually raided it in his lustful and greedy campaign to build his league with no regard for anyone else.

Captainron@ · Unread post by **Captainron@** » 10 years ago

RF1 wrote:
rhodyrudder wrote: The covering up of Gavitt's name would be poetic justice for the A-10 since he continually raided it in his lustful and greedy campaign to build his league with no regard for anyone else.

Huh? History isn't your strong suit I guess.

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