The Offense

RoadyJay · Unread post by **RoadyJay** » 7 years ago

There have been a significant number of comments about our offense throughout various threads on this board. Comments related to our slow pace, some believing our coach has a general lack of offensive knowledge, a lack of creativity and innovation, comments about the amount of one-on-one basketball, and our inability to execute late in games, etc. etc.

I think it warrants a separate thread. So here it is.

It’s well documented that prior to the start of the season Dan stated that with our depth this season we would finally play the style he had always wanted to play. We would not only be an elite defensive team this season but also have a top 50 type offense. We would speed up the game and not get into the rock fights of past seasons. Rock fights that typically kept games close but were difficult to win a high percentage of the time. We would play 9-10 guys and avoid the lack of production late in games due to tired starters.

We are nearly 1/3 of the way into the season and the statistics don’t lie. We rank:
- 181st in Points Per Game (74.0)
- 291st in Adjusted Tempo (67.3)
- 162nd in Average Possession Length (16.9)
- 282nd in Assists per Field Goals Made (46.5)
- 226th in 2nd Half Points (36.4)

The numbers show what everyone already knows. We don’t play fast and we are not a top 50 offense at this point.

These numbers don’t mean we are a BAD offense. In fact, there are positives about our offense. We are a very efficient offensive team and rank in the top 50 in Adjusted Efficiency (109.6). For us that means that even though we have a relatively low number of possessions per game we are scoring a high number of points per each of those possession. We also take very good care of the basketball and rank in the top 50 in Turnover % (16.0).

Dan is playing the 9-10 guys as expected. We have 9 guys averaging 10 or more minutes per game. Berry is also averaging over 10 minutes per game but only in 3 games. No one is averaging more than 31 minutes per game.

Just because you play fast doesn’t mean you win, that’s not the point of this post.

What I want to know is why have we reverted back to the slow paced style of previous seasons?

I have a few weak theories:
- Teams are successfully dictating the pace against us and intentionally slowing down the tempo as they think doing this gives them the best opportunity to beat us
- Early game statistics indicated that a slower pace gave us a better chance to win flying in the face of their preseason plans
- In order to maximize ECs time on the court we need to play at a slower pace until he is back to full strength

I’d like to hear others’ theories.

theblueram · Unread post by **theblueram** » 7 years ago

I have no theories or answers. The offense has been offensive. Plain and simple. It needs to change.

Rhodymob05 · Unread post by **Rhodymob05** » 7 years ago

Great analysis, my observations are we don't use the screens correctly and it's a big factor to why we lack offense. If you watch Hurleys offense, it's a lot of screens and running the wheel at the top of the key. The screens are soft and the player off the screen is not using it well enough so the defender slides right around. These screens also produce stupid fouls if you move. Hassan and Iverson get in trouble with moving picks and it hurts us the rest of game. Screen correctly and efficiently and well get more open shots less fouls and higher point totals. That's my number one observation.

RoadyJay · Unread post by **RoadyJay** » 7 years ago

I loved how EC attacked the basket in the first half agains ODU. Reminded me of the EC of old. Then it didn't continue in the second half. I also have the impression that Jarvis penetrated defenses with regularity last season. I don't see that happening very much this season but could just be my perception.

NYGFan_Section208 · Unread post by **NYGFan_Section208** » 7 years ago

I think it shows that, it's not easy to coach/teach/train a 'great offense.' The teams that have the best offenses...you usually can name the coaches (and the players) pretty quickly. I don't know if it's the coaching or not, but I can't say it's not the coaching either. Good offensive players make good coaches...good coaches make good offenses...Chicken? Horse? Cart? Egg? I don't know.... Fun to watch it all play out though...

Billyboy78 · Unread post by **Billyboy78** » 7 years ago

Take out the stats of the first two games against the cupcakes in which we averaged over 90 a game and the offensive stats even look a lot worse.

PeterRamTime · Unread post by **PeterRamTime** » 7 years ago

It also seems like EC and Kuran becoming complete non-factors has had a huge impact on how bad our offense is.
Through the first four games our offense was playing way better than ever, (except for the first half against Cincinnati) we had tons of confidence and were attacking.
But those guys becoming liabilities has really weighed on us in a number of ways I think.
It's like everybody else is doing their thing and then they were just ruining the flow for everybody.

I also see us bring the ball up really slowly and then sluggishly run a set and we won't get a good shot out of it.
Like we don't get rebounds and attack enough.
Jarvis will jog up the court when I feel he should be pushing it and making guys move their asses and make some crisp decisive passes.
Instead they go slow and seem to think too much.
We really should be RIPPING people apart with our guard play.

We just really seem to lack the necessary aggression.

adam914 · Unread post by **adam914** » 7 years ago

Rhodymob05 wrote:Great analysis, my observations are we don't use the screens correctly and it's a big factor to why we lack offense. If you watch Hurleys offense, it's a lot of screens and running the wheel at the top of the key. The screens are soft and the player off the screen is not using it well enough so the defender slides right around. These screens also produce stupid fouls if you move. Hassan and Iverson get in trouble with moving picks and it hurts us the rest of game. Screen correctly and efficiently and well get more open shots less fouls and higher point totals. That's my number one observation.

To add to your point about the screens as well, it seems like while they are setting a lot of screens each possession, it doesn't always seem like there is much of a purpose to them. Like the screen is set and the player with the ball will use it but then just continue to pass the ball around the outside for the next guy to do the same thing. If the screener does roll to the basket nobody ever seems to make that pass. It's like they are setting screens just to kill some time before someone inevitably takes it one on one near the end of the shot clock.

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 7 years ago

I've made a similar point in other threads, but I'll (over)simplify it here: our inability to create 4-5 easy baskets per game through scheme is a weight on our overall offensive production. You toss that into what we are already doing and your efficiency and raw scoring go up (and you probably add two more wins). We basically never do that. Every once in a while we will catch a defense napping and backdoor someone for a layup, but it at least looks to me that we stumble into that due to an inevitable defensive lapse - we don't CREATE it. We do run an offense and we do score out of it, but the offense is predicated on players making plays, not forcing the defense into mistakes or creating obvious mismatches.

The other thing I would say is that Jarvis is either being told to or is being allowed to just walk the ball up 9 times out of 10, even where there is a quick change of possession or there is a long rebound that would lend itself to running. He is great playing downhill and attacking and he's great in the open floor, so I don't get why he's doing that. It feels like it's just habit. But nobody on our sideline is yelling at him and demanding he push the ball. If we really wanted to force tempo Dan would be riding Jarvis like a jockey going around the final turn at Churchill Downs.

josephski · Unread post by **josephski** » 7 years ago

I don't think it's so much that we reverted back because we never really moved forward with the offense. There's not enough movement off the ball. Guys hold onto the ball too long which runs down the shot clock. Then one guy has to try and make a play himself.

What I've been thinking lately is that maybe we really just don't have that great of offensive players. I know this has been talked about to some extent before but it seems like due to how much Dan values defense he recruits guys based more on their defensive ability than offensive ability. EC's probably the one guy who came here and was better on offense than defense. Maybe Kuran as well. The inconsistency on this team is what really hurts.

Against Cincy we had four of our starters in double figures. Since then we've had 2 starters in double figures against Duke, 3 against Belmont, 3 against Valpo, 2 against Providence, and 1 against Old Dominion. Bottom line is our guys have to play better as a team and individually. I don't even care about the pace of the game. Our guys just need to start hitting more shots, obviously it's easier said than done but I'm not expecting Hurley to suddenly reinvent the offense during the season.

Edit: To add a little, we could've really used someone like Four this year. A guy who can come off the bench and give us an offensive spark, maybe Thompson, Stan or Dowtin will grow into that role but I'm not holding my breath.

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 7 years ago

I would say that he seems to value the athleticism required to play his defensive system over the skill that is required to play good offense when he is recruiting (and also when he is giving out minutes - look at Andre Berry as a prime example). I've said that since almost the very beginning. But I think he does have good enough offensive players now. I don't know if they are good enough to score 80 points against decent teams all through one on one and creating their own shots, but I believe they are skilled enough to execute good plays and convert them to baskets. One thing is for sure: we aren't a great passing team - we aren't reminding anyone of the '86 Celtics. That's less skill and more basketball IQ and seeing the floor like a chess board. I don't think that is a big point of emphasis for us.

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 7 years ago

Hate to say it, but we noticed two years ago that Terrell had
his best games when EC was out.
He and Garrett had outstanding seasons last year.
Terrell was rock solid all year until Tuesday.
When EC seems to be the focal point of the offense,
he dribbles a lot, everyone else stands around to a large degree.
Iverson is an enigma.
He's a difference maker at times.
He's also the best offensive rebounder on this team.
Akele isn't much on the boards.
Problem is, which Iverson is going to show up.
His game seems to have digressed this season. Why is that?
It's his last chance to draw interest for playing overseas or
in the D-League.
There's talent there, but so far this year,
it's been sporadic at best.
As for Garrett, the kid can move faster with the ball
than most humans can run.
Unlike Mike Powell, when he gets in the trees, he can score
and he can find the open man.
With Terrell being so good in the open court, and Garrett's
speed, why not cut 'em lose and run?
Of course, you need rebounds to run, so that could be a problem.

RoadyJay · Unread post by **RoadyJay** » 7 years ago

TP, what you are saying then means that we are intentionally playing this style. I agree. But it brings me back to the original question. Why? Why are we now adopting this style of play over what was the plan on November 10th.

By the way. I don't for a second believe Dan somehow lacks the knowledge to implement an offense. Let me give you some reasons why.

I remember a couple of years ago when Dan had a weekly television show. He had an Xs and Os segment and the way he broke down some of our offensive plays and the options the offensive player has depending on what the defender showed was impressive.

I attended a coaches clinic that Dan ran a few years ago. One segment was literally in a classroom where Dan broke down film and covered a bunch of different plays that the coaches could use. Every coach there frantically took notes and left very impressed. If you ever get a chance to hear Dan really talk Xs and Os you would also be very impressed. Even to a knowledgeable fan I bet much of it would be Greek to them.

I remember Shaka Smart commenting in an interview how difficult URI was to prepare for because we had over 90 different plays that we ran.

I doubt many coaching staffs are more prepared than this one. I was surprised to learn that not all teams do the same amount of scouting other teams. Some do very little scouting of their opponents. Not many do as much as this coaching staff does. I doubt many teams out prepare our staff. I was very fortunate a few years ago to get to travel with the team to St Bonaventure. The pregame walk through/film session and how they broke down the opponent.. down to the minutia of talking about how they needed to watch out for a particular players ball fake and then showing five different clips of that players ball fake.

I get the impression that Dan doesn't do anything without purpose and intention. So, I don't think it's that he doesn't have the knowledge to implement an offense... any offense. He has lived, eaten, breathed basketball his whole life. I just think he believes that right now a slow pace gives us the best chance to win.

I just can't figure out why.

NYGFan_Section208 · Unread post by **NYGFan_Section208** » 7 years ago

Great defense is cool...and I understand that Hurls wants awesome D. Personally, offense is just so much more fun to watch...I'll take 100-96 or 86-75 over 60-52 any day of the week and twice on Sunday. Let's get some shooters in here, some "O", like ...Gervin...Fouts...Dirk...The Answer....doesn't look like it's going to happen here soon, but let's get some dudes known for putting points on the board... With 10 minutes to go the the other night, and only a 10 point lead, you knew it was over...neither team had the capability to shift the line by 10 in that amount of time (a quarter of the game!)...yaaawwwn..... Then again, that's why I'm just a fan, not a coach....

"Casual fan" does not want to see the local team score 50-60 points a game...no matter what the record...

josephski · Unread post by **josephski** » 7 years ago

Maybe the offense is too complicated for our guys? I don't understand how Dan can be that great of an offensive coach but we've never had an offense that looked good. If the offense isn't working, he has to adjust. Can't keep doing the same thing expecting different results.

I agree with your original post about opponents dictating the pace which is very possible. Rebounding could be another possible issue. A faster paced game might lead to us committing more fouls. He might have decided to go with the Virginia mentality of slowing the pace down and playing incredible defense. Dan doesn't think our depth is as good as expected so he doesn't want to wear out the starters by pushing the pace. Maybe he decided we're a better half court offense team.

Those are some ideas, like TP said it doesn't even seem like he's telling Jarvis to push the ball so there's obviously some sort of reason but ultimately it must be what Dan thinks will work best.

RoadyJay · Unread post by **RoadyJay** » 7 years ago

I think you're right. Seems like a combination of factors.

In the end I really don't care what offensive style we play. I just want to win.

I admittedly was very frustrated at the ODU game. I couldn't stand to watch another one of our offensive possessions in the 2nd half.

It was a great defensive effort but ODU was also one of the worst offensive teams I've ever seen.

Billyboy78 · Unread post by **Billyboy78** » 7 years ago

Regarding running, I've said this before. At the open practice, Dan stressed running after made baskets. As soon as the ball went through the hoop, Dan was yelling, RUN, RUN, RUN!!!, with the team quickly inbounding the ball and flying up the court. I haven't seen them do that once in a game.

runninrams5 · Unread post by **runninrams5** » 7 years ago

There has been to much dribbling on the perimeter without and penetration into the lane. We need the guards to start getting into the lane and also for them to get the ball down low and get the bigs some paint touches. Working the ball down low will open up spots for the guys for the perimeter for shots. Also being able to sit down low for the Old Dominion game, I noticed we don't really explode off screens with the exception of Jared. Need to come of the screens hard don't give the defense a moment to recover

section(105) · Unread post by **section(105)** » 7 years ago

......I know what I don't know.....that is exactly what DH teaches regarding the base offense is.....what we have heard from various sources is that DH wanted to play up tempo style where defense would create run style offense, and he wanted to run out of made baskets.....what I recall is that DH made some reference, in his early years, to '.....we are playing only 10% of the offense....' I took that to mean the strengths, talents, basketball IQ etc of those players dictated a reduced offense playbook.....my eyes tell me the other 90% is still under wraps.....my eyes tell me that DH often, apparently, implores the players to run/attack etc. via waving his arm in a windmill fashion which means??..... the results of those occurrences often result in a shot clock run down.....why?.....for me there is this thing called 'collective court speed of the players' where as a group on the floor does not find/create attack advantage of numbers and penetration/fill the passing lanes.....therefore pull the ball out, realign into the offense set(s) from the sideline directions of the coach that then results in what we see.....the high ball screens, the short flip passes where guards generally exchange the pill and spaces......etc. etc.......without the true center type, the post ups and entry passes to post are generally not part of the current tool box......but the role of the five type player in the A-10 and for this coach, and that style of offense remain a debate the has been kicked around before......adaptation to existing game conditions and opponents remains a mystery to me......you?

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 7 years ago

All great points guys....need to ask Dan why we don't push the ball more.....we just stink at slow-mo half court offense....I don't expect that to change.....have to try something different.....

and yes 105 your last point, Dan isn't very good at making in-game adjustments...the best coaches do it often and are very successful at it...

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 7 years ago

There's a difference from Xs and Os on a chalkboard than
putting it into action.
One factor is the opponent's defense.
I was with Dan and Bobby during a women's game.
They both had their laptops open, sitting at the empty press table.
Dan showed a poor inbounds play involving Shengalia,
during CFL's final year. They both kind of chuckled at it.
I think back on that, when I see us having problems
inbounding the ball, five years later.
I also have seen Dan's chalk talks.
There's an old thing called KISS.
Keep it simple, stupid.
It shouldn't be so complex that it's too
much so to execute.
The best offensive coaches we've had, Penders and Harrick's
practices, showed one thing.
What you saw in practices, you saw in the games.
Penders always said that turnovers were inevitable in an up tempo
game,
Both men didn't micro manage their offense during the game.
Their teams showed great confidence when on the attack.
Does anyone think our guys look really confident moving the ball?
I don't.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 7 years ago

Rod, I could imagine....80-90 plays? And none of them work most of the time?

Very few college teams are good at playing the slow style of offense.....I watch the UConn women play half court...they MOVE the ball around...short quick passes...get good shots most of the time.....nobody is standing around....Dan I'm told watches tape until the cows come home...does any of this sink in?

Our guys need to play on instinct....thinking too much just messes things up....

BTW Roady Jay, great thread......

RoadyJay · Unread post by **RoadyJay** » 7 years ago

rambone 78 wrote:All great points guys....need to ask Dan why we don't push the ball more.....we just stink at slow-mo half court offense....I don't expect that to change.....have to try something different.....

and yes 105 your last point, Dan isn't very good at making in-game adjustments...the best coaches do it often and are very successful at it...

That's the thing though... We actually ARE very good at the slow-mo half court offense. It may not look pretty to us fans but we have an Adjusted Offensive Efficiency rating of 110. This means that per 100 offensive possessions we score 110 points. That's 44th best in the country.

So what you say?

Well, let's look at the other teams that play our approximate tempo or slower and are as efficient or more efficient than us:

Villanova
Saint Mary's
Virginia
Wisconsin
Baylor
Butler
Arizona
Houston
Clemson
Michigan
Oregon
Texas Tech
Cincinnati
Kansas St.
Texas A&M

Pretty elite company. At our pace of play these are the only other teams that score it more efficiently.

Maybe this is what the coaching staff is seeing. Slow it down, score it efficiently, and play suffocating defense.

rambone 78 · Unread post by **rambone 78** » 7 years ago

When we turn teams over with our defense, we need to take advantage of that and run....before they can get back and negate our advantage...instead we pull the ball back out and everyone falls asleep again.....we need those easy baskets....could make a big difference....

so it's not a rebounding issue in this regard.....

RJ, we might be efficient but our assist ratio is putrid...too much one on one....we don't have those type of players for the most part....and we don't have great shooters either....

And this problem gets magnified late in close games.....we're certainly not very efficient then....

Ram1019 · Unread post by **Ram1019** » 7 years ago

I always think back to the game at home vs a ranked VCU team (two years ago?) when the game plan was an up-tempo offense. Even though we lost due to Traveon Graham's lights-out shooting towards the end for another classic Ryan Center heartbreaking loss, it was still a very effective game plan. We were scoring in transition and pushed the pace most of the game and players like Biggie Minnis were getting layups. Those were very important baskets that kept us in it. We also had less depth and talent at the time.

ramster · Unread post by **ramster** » 7 years ago

Rambone,
I assume you mean assist to turnover ratio. I was just looking at the A10 Conference stats this morning and we are 2nd at 1.2 tied with Richmond. Lasalle is 1st with 1.4. For whatever that's worth.

RoadyJay,
When I look at NCAA BB Team Offensive Efficiency Rankings through Dec 9th I see URI Ranked #63 at 1.070. this is at teamrankings.com. Which site are you using?
It is an interesting site that has 2016 to date, Last 3, Last 1, Home, Away and 2015 Final

Looking at Home for URI we are 1.117 while away we are 1.005. Tends to tell the story to date. Last year we were1.025 Final
Among A10 teams:
Dayton is #58 at 1.077
St Bonaventure #44 at 1.098
LaSalle #32 1.192 at 1.113

The kicker is that ranked #4 is Houston at with only #3 St Mary's, #2 UCLA and #1 Notre Dame ahead of them
FWIW PC is #96 at 1.044

But an interesting site. I think much of this can be related to your SOS to date as well, don't you think?

Other info from site is conference projections.
URI is projected 13.6 wins and 4.4 losses; 21.9 wins and 8.1 losses
Percent odds to win conference URI 31.8%, Dayton 24.5%, VCU 18.7%
Percent odds to win conference tournament URI 26.9%, Dayton 23.1%, VCU 19.7%

RoadyJay · Unread post by **RoadyJay** » 7 years ago

I've seen that site as well. I was using kenpom

ramster · Unread post by **ramster** » 7 years ago

Ok, very similar I suppose, I'll check that one too

ramster · Unread post by **ramster** » 7 years ago

RoadyJay,
Looking further at the teamrankings.com site they have Bracket predictions which are interesting. They have NCAA Advancement odds section with odds for Bid, Sweet 16, Final 4 and Win it all

URI is:
9th seed
33rd ranked (which makes them the 1st of the 9th seeds)
80% chance of NCAA bid
13% chance of Sweet 16
1% chance of Final 4
0% chance of Champion

Houston is:
10th seed
39th ranked
66% chance of NCAA bid
10% chance of Sweet 16
1% chance of Final 4
0% chance of Champion

So need I say that this game tomorrow is a big game for both teams???

RoadyJay · Unread post by **RoadyJay** » 7 years ago

I agree. It's huge for us in that it's another potential resume building win. Psychologically could be big for us as well... beating a good team on the road.

section(105) · Unread post by **section(105)** » 7 years ago

......do we see these things in the offense ????......the extra pass to the spot up three point shooter.......the entry pass to post player.....the pass to cutter out of the half court sets.....the quick outlet pass(off defensive rebound) AND the a second pass without a dribble up court.....an out of bounds play that gives a clear open(high percentage) shot......players moving w/o the ball AND away from the ball to help create for the player with the ball......just wondering.....

RoadyJay · Unread post by **RoadyJay** » 7 years ago

I do recall a couple of seasons ago being impressed with the number of times we came out of a time out and scored on something Dan drew up in the huddle. I haven't seen it much this season. The one where EC hit the 3 late in the game against Cincinnati was huge! Simple but effective.

The lob pass into the backcourt gives me indigestion. I still have nightmares of Dunn stealing that inbounds lob, dunking it, and then screaming in my face!

Billyboy78 · Unread post by **Billyboy78** » 7 years ago

No, it's not assist to turnover ratio. It's just lack of sssists. Poor shooting certainly doesn't help, but it's more than that. It's too much one on one, especially at the end of the shot clock in desperation. Not sharing the ball. No cutting . No back door. Just bad offense.

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 7 years ago

Billy - that touches on two things I've mentioned: first, the offense isn't designed to create easy baskets through mechanisms, it's designed to create certain one-on-one match ups and spacing for individual players to create their own offense; and second, the individual players are not great passers and none of them seem to have elite level floor vision. They aren't bad passers or terribly low IQ players, but we don't have a guy that sees things on the floor that 95% of the rest of the players don't see.

ramster · Unread post by **ramster** » 7 years ago

Did you call him Bully????

I thought you were the kinder, gentler TruePoint??

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 7 years ago

Good catch ramster - must have been autocorrected!

Billyboy78 · Unread post by **Billyboy78** » 7 years ago

I am a mean bully.

section(105) · Unread post by **section(105)** » 7 years ago

......why we reverted back to slow paced style??....coaches determined that the incoming players that were supposed to sustain the pressure defense that was expected to trigger fast place offense are not right off the shelf ready.....call our current offense Plan B?

Da_Process_Survivor · Unread post by **Da_Process_Survivor** » 7 years ago

the problem with the offense is the plan is to set up 1 on 1 situations for guys to try to create a shot instead of the plan being to create shots.

You can beat up bad to decent teams doing that, but it will have a low rate of success against good teams and against teams that can match/beat you in talent level or athleticism.

Its the definition of Baron Ball offense.

The team needs a true system with sets designed to get easy baskets, and save the 1 on 1 hero ball for late in the shot clock situations.

bigappleram · Unread post by **bigappleram** » 7 years ago

There is a tendency on this board to over inflate what people call "plays" and also a lot of criticism of the strategy without thinking about the execution. As Roady Jay alluded, much of our offense is based on "options" - read and react to the the defense and make the right decision.

Just out of curiosity, what "plays" did PC run that were so wizard like and completely had our Defense fooled? Our guys were going under the pick on Cartwright bc he hasn't shown to be a proficient shooter and he knocked down 4 three pointers, beyond that PC did little on offense...Valpo pounded a perceived mismatch with Peters on the block against KI. Luke Kennard, not some unbelievably designed offense, did us in vs Duke -- again exploiting a matchup vs KI. With the amount of tape and preparation that goes into games there isn't an offense out there that is going to result in easy baskets for long stretches, at some point guys have to make plays. 90% of end game situations are driven by a great player making a great play, not by running the picket fence and a guy getting a wide open shot.

Just like foul shots, its the easy road to blame the offensive play calling at times...especially without any visibility to the nuances or options within each set and whether it is our execution or strategy at fault. It's the catch all - just like foul shots were, until they weren't.

BPR2010 · Unread post by **BPR2010** » 7 years ago

I agree with a lot of what you said there BAR regarding half-court offense. Very little of the time, if ever, is a team completely fooled by the sets an opponent runs. Execution and preparation is what matters and wins games.

However, I can't help but think we'd be a better transition team with the experience and amount of minutes these guys have played together by now. We have a PG who has almost 2 full years running this offense. We have athletes on the wings and in our front-court. We have "depth" now, which was always the rub as to why Dan couldn't play the pace that he wanted to play at, which I understood.

I also know that playing fast doesn't win games. However, the past 3 games we have averaged 7 assists per game. As a team. Can't help but see that the ball has gotten too sticky around the perimeter in the half-court in that time. The reason we lost to PC was due to long stretches of stagnant offense.

You can get easy baskets in transition and make up for a stagnant half-court offense by "stealing" these points in 2 on 1 or 3 on 2 breaks the other way. I'm not saying we need to be the Hank Gathers/Bo Kimble LMU team, but what reason do we have now for still playing at the 291st ranked tempo in the nation? We have the guys, the talent, and the depth. When things get a little tough in the half-court, that is the easiest way to make up for it and turn momentum in a game.

ramster · Unread post by **ramster** » 7 years ago

bigappleram wrote:There is a tendency on this board to over inflate what people call "plays" and also a lot of criticism of the strategy without thinking about the execution. As Roady Jay alluded, much of our offense is based on "options" - read and react to the the defense and make the right decision.

Just out of curiosity, what "plays" did PC run that were so wizard like and completely had our Defense fooled? Our guys were going under the pick on Cartwright bc he hasn't shown to be a proficient shooter and he knocked down 4 three pointers, beyond that PC did little on offense...Valpo pounded a perceived mismatch with Peters on the block against KI. Luke Kennard, not some unbelievably designed offense, did us in vs Duke -- again exploiting a matchup vs KI. With the amount of tape and preparation that goes into games there isn't an offense out there that is going to result in easy baskets for long stretches, at some point guys have to make plays. 90% of end game situations are driven by a great player making a great play, not by running the picket fence and a guy getting a wide open shot.

Just like foul shots, its the easy road to blame the offensive play calling at times...especially without any visibility to the nuances or options within each set and whether it is our execution or strategy at fault. It's the catch all - just like foul shots were, until they weren't.

Agree with all BAR
And to your point about Cartwright he hit 4 threes in the 1st half alone and had only 4 threes in all of the previous games combined. He was red hot and the shots were contested as well. Not saying that cost us but then Fazekas hits one from the corner as soon as he enters the game with a hand right in his stinkin face and he buries it and he had not done much in previous games. We have had excellent 3 point defensive percentage stats all season, but sometimes it´s about who gets hot and when. 3 point shooting is becoming a bigger and bigger part of the game. I think we have room to improve our passing game to better set up 3 point shots, especially going down inside and back out.

bigappleram · Unread post by **bigappleram** » 7 years ago

I agree BPR. The tempo concern is valid and I am in the same camp as many here...we need to play faster, we need to create live ball TOs that translate into easy baskets. We aren't going to be Princeton in the half court set ever, so we need easy baskets in our arsenal.

As I have been saying, along with others, if I had to cull it down to 1 thing with this team it's that since the Brown/Cincy game they have played tight.
They need to play fast and loose, mistakes may happen but the net effect would be a style more suited to our athletes.

josephski · Unread post by **josephski** » 7 years ago

bigappleram wrote: Just out of curiosity, what "plays" did PC run that were so wizard like and completely had our Defense fooled? Our guys were going under the pick on Cartwright bc he hasn't shown to be a proficient shooter and he knocked down 4 three pointers, beyond that PC did little on offense...Valpo pounded a perceived mismatch with Peters on the block against KI. Luke Kennard, not some unbelievably designed offense, did us in vs Duke -- again exploiting a matchup vs KI. With the amount of tape and preparation that goes into games there isn't an offense out there that is going to result in easy baskets for long stretches, at some point guys have to make plays. 90% of end game situations are driven by a great player making a great play, not by running the picket fence and a guy getting a wide open shot.

Go back and watch the Valpo game. I believe Valpo's first possession they ran a play to hit Peters for an easy alley oop. They also had several other easy baskets from plays they ran. I'd have to go back and watch the PC game again but like TP has said, all we're asking for is 4-5 easy buckets a game from plays we run.

I agree with you that ultimately our guys need to play better individually. Even if we aren't able to get easy baskets through plays we run we should still have the individual talent where scoring shouldn't be an issue.

section(105) · Unread post by **section(105)** » 7 years ago

......we need the offensive guru......and starting guruing asap(Mike Lupica)

rodfromcranston · Unread post by **rodfromcranston** » 7 years ago

ARD played in the Jim Harrick offense.
I wonder how much input he has?
Harrick came here, decided Cat was his focal point,
made Tyson be the PG and not the main scorer.
He balanced the offense, so ARD, and Luther could get touches.
Made URI "hard to guard" as he loved to say.
The results are well known.

Unread post by **ATPTourFan** » 7 years ago

I think we still make poor passing decisions on the few breakouts we get each game. There was a 2nd half breakaway 3-1 or 3-2 and rather than pass Jarvis (I think) took it all the way and got stuffed or missed the layup. Anyone remember that?

He had an option to pass right to Terrell or EC or someone like that who could at least get all the way to the rim.

josephski · Unread post by **josephski** » 7 years ago

Here's my crazy idea for the offense that I know many will disagree with, start Stan and bring in EC off the bench. You can still give EC more minutes than Stan overall but it gives us the opportunity to bring in an offensive weapon from the bench.

Go back at look at the Syracuse 2011-2012 team. Scoop Jardine and Brandon Triche started every game at the guard positions. Dion Waiters came off the bench every game and averaged more minutes than Triche and close to as many as Scoop. Waiters was also the fourth overall pick in the draft that year even though he never started a game in his Syracuse career.

section(105) · Unread post by **section(105)** » 7 years ago

ATPTourFan wrote:I think we still make poor passing decisions on the few breakouts we get each game. There was a 2nd half breakaway 3-1 or 3-2 and rather than pass Jarvis (I think) took it all the way and got stuffed or missed the layup. Anyone remember that?

He had an option to pass right to Terrell or EC or someone like that who could at least get all the way to the rim.

I don't recall the specific situation, I know passing the ball to a player ahead is faster in advancing the pill into the easier shot area....than dribbling....the ball always moves faster when passed......

Unread post by **TruePoint** » 7 years ago

ATPTourFan wrote:I think we still make poor passing decisions on the few breakouts we get each game. There was a 2nd half breakaway 3-1 or 3-2 and rather than pass Jarvis (I think) took it all the way and got stuffed or missed the layup. Anyone remember that?

He had an option to pass right to Terrell or EC or someone like that who could at least get all the way to the rim.

We botch this with such consistency it's almost like we are coached to do it that way. At the very least, we aren't doing a lot of 3-2, 2-1 drills in practice. There is no ball movement on the break and no hint that we know what we are doing when we get on one.

I used to love running a break when I played. I wasn't anywhere near as good as the guys on our team, but I could run a break. Draw one defender, make the second guy commit, you have so many options to make an awesome play - tip pass, behind the back, lay a bounce pass into the lane of a breaking teammate, get into the air to draw a defender then dish behind his back for an easy two, look at one wing and draw the defender only to lay a pass down the other way. To me, as a basketball player, running the break as a point guard was like THE artistic moment in the game. I watch the videos of the '86 Celtics running a break and get excited as a man. I watch Rhody run a break and it's like I drank too much whiskey.

Login • Register