Jim Baron 2.0

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rodfromcranston
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by rodfromcranston »

I really like Thorr.
Still, I have to question the wisdom of throwing good money after bad
on the football program.
Sorry, but it's not competitive and it's not coming back to
The Ehrardt-Forster-DiMaggio days.
The stadium is a joke.
There are more important things to spend millions on than,
"BUT WHAT ABOUT HOMECOMING?"
Unless the basketball program makes the NCAAs, and attendance
increases significantly, it too will become a money drain.
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ramfan85
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by ramfan85 »

RhowdyRam02 wrote:
rambone 78 wrote:I give Dan this year and next to finally prove he has what it takes to get to the Dance......if not then Thorr and Dooley need to start looking for our next coach.....

That's the hard reality of the situation. Like it or not.
Assuming we don't get into the tournament, what has Thorr done to earn the opportunity to hire the next coach? If they don't make the tournament this year I think you need to take a hard look at the AD position because we might need to go in a new direction in our three biggest sports in the next couple seasons.

This is a very good point. Football and basketball are usually a university's major sports. Basketball is improving. But, football has been a joke for a long time.
Simply saying that we're going to keep football, without the necessary investment needed, seems pointless to me.
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RhowdyRam02
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by RhowdyRam02 »

theblueram wrote:Thorr hired the guy we all wanted. No blemish on him.
I don't understand that line of thinking at all, how is it not a blemish? It doesn't matter what the results are so long as it's what the people on a message board originally wanted? Why even have an AD, they can just put everything up to a vote on here.
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RhowdyRam02
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by RhowdyRam02 »

rodfromcranston wrote:I really like Thorr.
Still, I have to question the wisdom of throwing good money after bad
on the football program.
Sorry, but it's not competitive and it's not coming back to
The Ehrardt-Forster-DiMaggio days.
The stadium is a joke.
There are more important things to spend millions on than,
"BUT WHAT ABOUT HOMECOMING?"
Unless the basketball program makes the NCAAs, and attendance
increases significantly, it too will become a money drain.
I really like Thorr as well, so I offer this line of questioning up with no passion, and I still believe we can make the tournament this year, so it's just a theoretical exercise.

But if you're really committed to moving on from Dan if he doesn't make the tournament this year and next, don't you have to move on from Thorr after this season? What has Thorr done to keep his job that Dan hasn't? Aren't they both likeable guys who have improved the infrastructure since they've gotten here but ultimately haven't gotten results yet? What's Thorr's winning percentage for coaching hires in all sports? Is it good enough to give him another shot at men's basketball and quite likely football? Wouldn't you need someone else making that decision? Shouldn't they be here for about a year getting the lay of the land before they make that decision?

Again, I'm not saying Thorr should be gone if they don't make the tournament. But if you're saying Dan should be after next year if he still hasn't made it then this is what needs to happen going forward.
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theblueram
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by theblueram »

RhowdyRam02 wrote:
theblueram wrote:Thorr hired the guy we all wanted. No blemish on him.
someoe
I don't understand that line of thinking at all, how is it not a blemish? It doesn't matter what the results are so long as it's what the people on a message board originally wanted? Why even have an AD, they can just put everything up to a vote on here.
I don't understand your thought process at all. The hire was universally approved. If he hired someone this whole board hated and disapproved of, he would be in the fire line. He didn't. And everything is up for a fan vote. Always. Because if fans don't approve, no fannies in the seats.
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ramster
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by ramster »

Put my answers in red instead of the original black, maybe why you didn't think I answered your questions earlier.
ramster wrote:
rodfromcranston wrote:1. The title of this thread belittles the reputation of this Website. There is no way Jim Baron and Dan Hurley are equal. Does Not matter to me how many times it gets repeated. -Ramster

So, there's a reputation at stake here? nope
Are we viewed as the town tramp of basketball forums? no
Will we have to do the Queen Cersi walk of shame? no, also I don't know what that is
Will the Pope mention KB at Sunday Mass? no
Will Dr. Dooley put KB on double secret probation? no
Will tRUMP mention us in a Twitter attack? question belongs in the political thread
Who are we losing our "reputation" with? nobody
Supposedly nobody on staff or in the athletic department reads KB,
but are bothered at times by what's written here. Not a question, but I have no idea if the athletic department reads here, or if they are bothered
Those psychic readers, or ones like those who only read Playboy for the articles? no idea
I just want to know:
A. Who are the ubiquitous overseers judging KB. no idea
B. What are the consequences? no idea
Last edited by ramster 7 years ago, edited 1 time in total.
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hrstrat57
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by hrstrat57 »

Agree Thorr would be 100% off the hook re last HC search....
Last edited by hrstrat57 7 years ago, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by ramster »

josephski wrote:
TruePoint wrote: The reason why it is insulting on a personal level is because Jim Baron was a fraud, a huckster, an excuse-making, expectations-lowering phony whose sole professional focus was survival and not achievement, and who ran the program into the ground by failing to establish a culture that was representative of the university. Dan Hurley is none of those things. He is just about the exact opposite from Jim Baron in all of those ways. If you believe that doing things the right way will ultimately get you the results you want, even if unforeseen things go wrong along the way or you hit road blocks and obstacles, and you are capable of recognizing the difference between Hurley and Baron on a basic human level, then you should be willing to have some patience. Hurley is still a relatively young coach with big ambitions and a smart guy, whereas Baron was playing out the string and trying to protect his retirement job. I get that the 17 years is frustrating and it's hard to be patient 17 years into it, but those 17 years aren't Dan Hurley's fault.
Is that how you felt about Baron in his fifth year here or did that attitude come from the way his time ended here? I'll agree that Hurley has really changed the program around from where it was...I'm just not sure what will happen if we don't make the tournament this year. I think Hurley has done a great job establishing a positive culture for the program but missing the tournament this year could change things. Obviously it's too early to tell but I think Hurley's fifth year should be compared more to Baron's fifth year and not Baron's last.
It makes sense to compare Baron's 5th Year to Hurley's 5th year. That's fair. But it is most fair if we wait until Hurley's 5th year is completed - I know that's stating the obvious. This is a critical year for DH and the Team.

Baron had 12 years to get there too so obviously getting to the NCAA Tournament was not so important to the AD and the President.

I'm not sure it makes sense to fire Hurley if he does not make the NCAA Tournament this year, but it is likely a moot point anyway because URI will most likely make the NCAA. If we do not make the NCAA then it depends to some extent how badly did we miss. 1st 4 out? Did we finish 3rd in the A10? or did we finish 5th or worse in the A10? I don't think DH ever gets fired from URI, he will move on himself before it ever comes to that.

If URI does fire Hurley they I think RR2 has a good point. Thor sought out Hurley and his brother. Hurley was Thor's guy. If Hurley turns out to not be the guy to take us to the NCAA why would we think Thor's next choice would be any better? You would need to look at all the sports and access how successful they have been but not likely to find any home run stories. Men's B-Ball is hands down the primary program at URI. We need it to be successful.
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rodfromcranston
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by rodfromcranston »

Wow! I actually agree 100% with your first and last
paragraphs.
Total clarity, no emotion.
Love it!
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rambone 78
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by rambone 78 »

Weird shit going down tonight....but good shit.
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by Mongo »

Dumbest thread ever... Makes me sick.
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reef
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by reef »

I know it so sickening

I have a feeling we come on strong now get to the dance and can put this thread behind us for good
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by ATPTourFan »

Ok. Very complete road win in conference last night. Let's give this thread a rest until our postseason fate is reasonably clear.
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ramster
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by ramster »

rodfromcranston wrote:Wow! I actually agree 100% with your first and last
paragraphs.
Total clarity, no emotion.
Love it!
Thank you :D
Last edited by ramster 7 years ago, edited 1 time in total.
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rodfromcranston
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by rodfromcranston »

ATPTourFan wrote:Ok. Very complete road win in conference last night. Let's give this thread a rest until our postseason fate is reasonably clear.
Or until we lose the next close game that we should have won. :lol:
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Dre3000
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by Dre3000 »

I have an honest question: Of those that are upset with the team's performance to date, if this team ends up making it to the tourney and Dan leaves, would you be upset, indifferent, or glad? It almost seems as if no matter what happens this year some fans think it should be good riddance. Just curious
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by rodfromcranston »

We've lost Kraft to health, Penders, Skinner, and Harrick,
to bigger programs.
I think CFL was an anomaly, who only was approached once
to go elsewhere.
URI has extended Dan several times.
Resources are not unlimited as they are at P5 schools.
If he goes, he goes.
The trick is to be like Xavier and some other schools.
Hire the right successor.
URI has hired, Tom Carmody,Claude English, Brendan Malone,
Jerry D, and CFL.
The enemy has always been the man in the mirror.
Al Skinner turned out OK, but he was a work in progress when
he was hired after Penders left.
I hated it when Penders and Harrick left. They each brought us to new heights.
The only way Dan does that is to get us to a Final Four, although if he
won a game, everyone would be happy.
Just getting there, doesn't make the benchmark for mourning a coach leaving.
It would be more business as usual, in a mid-major program that made
a March splash.
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by reef »

I agree with Rod

Hire the right successor if DH leaves for greener pastures
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by Seawrightspostgame »

I agree with Rod. The Hurley years have been interesting. I don't mind him leaving as of right now.

lol, if he gets us deep in the tournament this year and wins the league or a10 tournament I will have more of an attachment. :lol: :lol:

IMHO the longer DH is here, the more likely Preston Murphy is our next coach. With previous lame duck hires over the years, I think it would be the respectable thing to do--so long as there is not a Jim Harrick type out there.

Regardless, I'm a huge URI basketball fan and to a much lesser degree I am interested in Dan Hurley.
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by NYGFan_Section208 »

Dre3000 wrote:I have an honest question: Of those that are upset with the team's performance to date, if this team ends up making it to the tourney and Dan leaves, would you be upset, indifferent, or glad? It almost seems as if no matter what happens this year some fans think it should be good riddance. Just curious
Honest answer is...if they make the tournament I will be one of the happiest guys on the planet...that will of course mean that Hurls gets offers. The better they do, the more likely he is to leave...Kind of goes with the territory, doesn't it? I'm separating the two...make the tourney and I'm psyched out of my mind...Hurls leaves...indifferent at this point (not glad or upset).
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rambone 78
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by rambone 78 »

Just make the tournament and win at least a game........I feel the same about Dan...if he leaves he leaves...we're in a good spot even if he does..just make a good hire.....that's huge.

I am intrigued by Russell though....hope he comes here even if DH were to leave.....

I tend to think Dan will be here another year though at least...one way or the other...
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by hrstrat57 »

We have one likely hire for HC whose appointment would likely result in zero transfers and would blow the recruiting pipeline wide open.

This off season would be our last chance in the short term to hire him....
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by bigappleram »

There are always transfers or player fall off after a new hire, it's just part of the deal.
You are crazy if you don't think there are kids on this team that are die hard loyal to Dan.
And this hire you speak of would still be a major high risk move, zero HC experience.
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Billyboy78
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by Billyboy78 »

Are we talking about Preston?
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by Seawrightspostgame »

I think over the next 10 years we are always talking about Preston.

Is it more risky to hire a guy that played on a tournament team? under good coaching?

Worked his way under Al Skinner with Big ED? Came back under Hurley and understands URI?

Is obviously an asset to Creighton because that program is doing things it didn't do before. Its one thing to capitalize on your son turning out to be the best scorer in the country and another to recruit the way that they have been recruiting.

He is a big fan of this area. I dont think its any more risky than hiring a guy that coached high school basketball for 10 years and headed up Wagner.
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by Rhody15 »

Give me Preston as Hurley's successor 10 times outta 10.
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by adam914 »

Are we already giving Preston full credit for Creighton's success in just his second year there? Of there 5 leading scorers, 3 were there before Preston and the 2 that are a sophomore and freshman are both from Omaha so it's not like he went out and stole some guys from another area. I love Preston, and seeing him back here one day might make sense, but let's not get carried away yet.
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Billyboy78
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by Billyboy78 »

Speaking of recruiting, Preston is recruiting Cole Swider for Creighton. Cole visited there last week.
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rambone 78
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by rambone 78 »

Would not be surprised if he goes there........I think Preston will be available when the time comes.......
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by RhowdyRam02 »

I know we all love Preston, but if we're going to go for a player from the glory days to be our next head coach, wouldn't Antonio Reynolds-Dean be a better choice at this point?
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Seawrightspostgame
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by Seawrightspostgame »

adam914 wrote:Are we already giving Preston full credit for Creighton's success in just his second year there? Of there 5 leading scorers, 3 were there before Preston and the 2 that are a sophomore and freshman are both from Omaha so it's not like he went out and stole some guys from another area. I love Preston, and seeing him back here one day might make sense, but let's not get carried away yet.
Is this like a Saturday Night Live skit? Carried away? just saying Creighton is doing well post McDermott.

Full Credit? to an assistant coach joining an already successful program? Just saying they have 2 4star guys signed. Neither NE guys.
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by adam914 »

Seawrightspostgame wrote:
adam914 wrote:Are we already giving Preston full credit for Creighton's success in just his second year there? Of there 5 leading scorers, 3 were there before Preston and the 2 that are a sophomore and freshman are both from Omaha so it's not like he went out and stole some guys from another area. I love Preston, and seeing him back here one day might make sense, but let's not get carried away yet.
Is this like a Saturday Night Live skit? Carried away? just saying Creighton is doing well post McDermott.

Full Credit? to an assistant coach joining an already successful program? Just saying they have 2 4star guys signed. Neither NE guys.
Maybe I misinterpreted what you said, but "Is obviously an asset to Creighton because that program is doing things it didn't do before. Its one thing to capitalize on your son turning out to be the best scorer in the country and another to recruit the way that they have been recruiting." sounded to me like they were doing things they hadn't done before because Preston was there. So I was merely pointing out that his impact on the current roster has been minimal.
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by reef »

I am sure Murph becomes a candidate when the job opens here. We will see if he is ready if it comes quickly
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by Gonebarongone »

Seawrightspostgame wrote:
adam914 wrote:Are we already giving Preston full credit for Creighton's success in just his second year there? Of there 5 leading scorers, 3 were there before Preston and the 2 that are a sophomore and freshman are both from Omaha so it's not like he went out and stole some guys from another area. I love Preston, and seeing him back here one day might make sense, but let's not get carried away yet.
Is this like a Saturday Night Live skit? Carried away? just saying Creighton is doing well post McDermott.

Full Credit? to an assistant coach joining an already successful program? Just saying they have 2 4star guys signed. Neither NE guys.
It's really two arguments. Is PM worth the risk if the job came open and what impact is he having on Creighton's success. All the 2015 guys were signed before he was hired and the one 2016 recruit doesn't really play. And I doubt he is having a huge impact on game planning but that's just a guess. As for URI, I don't think I would have a few years ago but I think he would be worth taking a shot on. In many ways, he is less of a risk than DH was. He's around 40 now so it's not like he is outrageously young for a new hire. And, he's has been on staffs with a lot of very smart coaches. He's probably more likely to be able to handle the X's and O's than DH and has clearly recruited at a very high level at some non traditional powers.
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rambone 78
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by rambone 78 »

As long as Preston can hire a strong staff.....that would help his learning curve big time.....I've heard that he would install Harrick's offense if he came here......that was a pretty solid offense if I remember...ya think?

Anyway, time will tell....
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by TruePoint »

Not only is this thread still alive but we have now moved on to discussing Hurley's replacement? Unreal.

Why don't we "stay in the now" or whatever meditation people say and worry about who should be the next coach should be when we need one.
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by Gonebarongone »

TruePoint wrote:Not only is this thread still alive but we have now moved on to discussing Hurley's replacement? Unreal.

Why don't we "stay in the now" or whatever meditation people say and worry about who should be the next coach should be when we need one.
Maybe don't click on a thread titled Jim Baron 2.0? Would probably save you some headache. The "everything is perfect" thread is buried a bit but you can find it.
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by bigappleram »

Unbelievable is right. Now we are talking about ARD - can anyone point to what ARD is bringing to this staff? How is a guy with zero HC experience less of a risk than DH was when he was hired...non traditional powers, BC and Creighton? While not blue bloods let's not make it like he was recruiting to Bryant. Loved PMurph as a player and do think he could make a good coach some day, but typical grass is greener talk here.
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by TruePoint »

Gonebarongone wrote:
TruePoint wrote:Not only is this thread still alive but we have now moved on to discussing Hurley's replacement? Unreal.

Why don't we "stay in the now" or whatever meditation people say and worry about who should be the next coach should be when we need one.
Maybe don't click on a thread titled Jim Baron 2.0? Would probably save you some headache. The "everything is perfect" thread is buried a bit but you can find it.
If I didn't click on it, how would I tell you that you are dumb for participating in it?

If there is an "everything is perfect" thread, could you point me to it so I can go there and call those people dumb, too?
Last edited by TruePoint 7 years ago, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by ramster »

bigappleram wrote:Unbelievable is right. Now we are talking about ARD - can anyone point to what ARD is bringing to this staff? How is a guy with zero HC experience less of a risk than DH was when he was hired...non traditional powers, BC and Creighton? While not blue bloods let's not make it like he was recruiting to Bryant. Loved PMurph as a player and do think he could make a good coach some day, but typical grass is greener talk here.

BAR,
IN some parts of this document there has been criticism that Hurley does not have enough HC experience, that he did not follow the more traditional path. Yet, we would consider PM and/or ARD with Zero HC experience to step right in here.
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by Gonebarongone »

bigappleram wrote:Unbelievable is right. Now we are talking about ARD - can anyone point to what ARD is bringing to this staff? How is a guy with zero HC experience less of a risk than DH was when he was hired...non traditional powers, BC and Creighton? While not blue bloods let's not make it like he was recruiting to Bryant. Loved PMurph as a player and do think he could make a good coach some day, but typical grass is greener talk here.
I get your point of view but it's not crazy when talking about the relative risk. PM has coached under very good coaches and has proven he can recruit to schools, while not Bryant, haven't had great recruiting histories. Being on the bench for NCAA tournament games and seeing how a program is built over many years just might be better than St. Benedict when you have an overwhelming talent advantage 90+% of the time and two years at Wagner. DH was the head of something for 10 years so that's a definite plus but if you are comparing PM's resume to DH on the day he was hired, I don't see a huge risk difference. Many wondered whether DH could build a staff, manage an end game, and construct an offense. That was the risk in hiring him and that really hasn't changed. PM's risk would be never being a head guy. That could blow up, for sure. It's not a grass is greener thing but the grass could be greener, for sure. Are you really pumped about the recruiting since PM left? What would you grade it?
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by bigappleram »

Yes PMurph has learned under Al and McDermott, two good coaches, for a few years. Dan learned under a HOF coach and father for 40+, are we not going to acknowledge that he likely has learned something from his father who happens to be in the HOF? Running St Ben's was akin to running a low major college program IMO, not a typical high school so he has that going for him as well as 2 years at Wagner and now 5 at URI. Right now in terms of experience DH is light years ahead...that doesn't mean PM would fail but the risk would be significant.

Hard to compare recruiting bc I am not sure who you will give credit to for guys like EC, Terrell, Hassan and Garrett - but none of them are likely here without Dan. Langevine and Dowtin look like legit A10 talent, and too early to tell on Tertsea, Layssard, Thompson (injuries hampering his progress this season). I'd say biggest whiffs on Dan's resume are Akele and Berry. But do you remember a guy named Daniel West?
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adam914
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by adam914 »

BAR you have to remember that no matter what everything good that has ever happened is because of Preston and Bobby and everything bad is because of Dan.
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Gonebarongone
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by Gonebarongone »

He left April of 2014 so I guess you draw the line at Terrell. Guys definitely commit because of the head coach but there is stark difference before and after, in my mind. Line up the offer lists (I think the best predictor) of those two groups. And, I am comparing DH the day he was hired to PM now. His five years at URI certainly lessen the risk a team would be taking on. You sort of know what you are getting right now. Not as much back then. You could be right....I just don't see a huge difference comparing the two hires.
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by Gonebarongone »

adam914 wrote:BAR you have to remember that no matter what everything good that has ever happened is because of Preston and Bobby and everything bad is because of Dan.
You think recruiting is equal to, better, or worse since those two left?
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by bigappleram »

I think it's not arguable that early classes were better talent by ratings, but too early to tell given last 2 classes post PM are too young to fully judge. However, what role PM played is up for debate with those early classes. DH had pre existing relationship with Hass. Terrell's AAU coach is now on our staff, so was Boswell's relationship with Dan or PM? EC is the guy I would give PM most credit for, but in most interviews he cited Dan and Bobby as being the reason he came (his desire to evolve into a PG). So was it lots of playing time and Dan/Bobby that delivered those early returns, or was it PM, or was it 50/50. Too many variables to make an apples to apples comparison as to recruiting post PM leaving.
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Billyboy78
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by Billyboy78 »

Wasn't it Carr who had the relationship with Hass?
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adam914
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by adam914 »

Exactly what BAR said, could not have said it much better. The early classes were clearly rated better, but it is way over simplifying things to just jump to the conclusion that it was all because of those guys.
Last edited by adam914 7 years ago, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by RhowdyRam02 »

Exactly. It's almost like abundant playing time may have allowed us to lure higher ranked players and now that we don't have that same amount of playing time to offer that we aren't getting the same types of players and that we don't know the talents of these newer players because they can't get on the court as much as our earlier recruits.
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Re: Jim Baron 2.0

Unread post by Billyboy78 »

If playing time is indeed the key factor, our '18 class should be loaded, as we lose EC, Jared, Jarvis, Stan and Andre.
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