2016 NBA Draft Thursday June 23rd - Latest NBADraft.net Mock

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2016 NBA Draft Thursday June 23rd - Latest NBADraft.net Mock

Unread postby ramster » 1 year ago

Latest version
Interesting that Ben Bentil has now been listed in the 2016 Mock Draft going #46 to Orlando
With NBA scouts in droves watching Dunn has Bentil opened eyes?
Bentil easily leads the BE in scoring and is in the running for POY in the BE. He has had a monster year

http://www.nbadraft.net/2016mock_draft
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Re: 2016 NBA Draft Thursday June 23rd - Latest NBADraft.net

Unread postby SGreenwell » 1 year ago

I don't put much stock in the second round projections, since those are almost like undrafted free agents, because the contracts aren't guaranteed. Bentil has had a hell of a year, but unless he's getting first round buzz (and the guaranteed money that comes with it), it doesn't make sense for him to leave college. Dunn is projected at #5 by that site, which is a slight improvement to his draft stock, since I think he was projected more at the tail end of the lottery last year.
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Unread postby rjsuperfly66 » 1 year ago

So far, Dunn's decision has been the right one. While his play has slipped some of late, I think people can see it's the way he's being played, versus skill set. In the NBA, his ceiling is probably a Rajon Rondo type ... Explosive and long, can make plays in the pick and roll and get to the rim, but will likely struggle in any situation requiring a jumpshot. He'll probably never have to worry about being defended by 3 guys, he'd probably at best be a 3rd option, probably more like a 4th or 5th.
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Unread postby TruePoint » 1 year ago

While Dunn is not a great shooter, my assessment is that he is a better shooter than Rondo by a comfortable margin. He also is not as big of a dope, which helps. On the other hand, I think Rondo is probably slightly more of a freak athlete - not that Dunn is not an exceptional athlete in his own right. Overall, I do think the Rondo comp is a pretty decent one, even if they aren't the exact same player. I think Dunn would be happy to have a Rondo-like career, although I think his ceiling is actually higher.
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Unread postby Seawrightspostgame » 1 year ago

Yea awkward thing about Rondo is that he shoots a basketball like hes throwing a paper airplane into a dart board and then on the other hand, he was the most dominant player at times at his best(the triple doubles).

I agree with SG saying 2nd round underclassmen should stay. Crazy thing is that guys always come out that have no business doing it.
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Unread postby SGreenwell » 1 year ago

Seawrightspostgame wrote:Yea awkward thing about Rondo is that he shoots a basketball like hes throwing a paper airplane into a dart board and then on the other hand, he was the most dominant player at times at his best(the triple doubles).

I agree with SG saying 2nd round underclassmen should stay. Crazy thing is that guys always come out that have no business doing it.

Whenever someone projected as a second round pick decides to test the draft, I assume that something else is going on. Like, either they're going to flunk out, or someone at home needs money and they want to get started with their pro career. Even if you're not drafted, if you're talked about as a potential draftee, that normally means you're at the level that you can make good money in Europe or Asia.
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Re: 2016 NBA Draft Thursday June 23rd - Latest NBADraft.net

Unread postby ramster » 1 year ago

SGreenwell wrote:I don't put much stock in the second round projections, since those are almost like undrafted free agents, because the contracts aren't guaranteed. Bentil has had a hell of a year, but unless he's getting first round buzz (and the guaranteed money that comes with it), it doesn't make sense for him to leave college. Dunn is projected at #5 by that site, which is a slight improvement to his draft stock, since I think he was projected more at the tail end of the lottery last year.


On PC - Creighton game announcers just said Bentil is likely playing his last game at home for Providence. Bentil just recently showed up in this mock draft at #46 right in the middle of the second round. He is much more talented than many guys ahead of him. Likely will be BE POY and leads the BE in scoring by a wide margin. He is a phenomenal talent. All the scouts watching Dunn have also by their presence have seen the superb play of Bentil. If he goes this year he should go first round. Definitely Bentil is better than Ellenson.
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Re: 2016 NBA Draft Thursday June 23rd - Latest NBADraft.net

Unread postby rambone 78 » 1 year ago

With no Bentil and Dunn next year [if that does happen] there will be NO excuse not to beat PC next season.

I think BB needs a big finish to move up in those mock drafts.

If he's projected into the 1st round, I think he goes.
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Unread postby STC » 1 year ago

Bentil will be back.
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Unread postby rjsuperfly66 » 1 year ago

The only way I can see Bentil leaving is if he destroys a legit big in the tournament in a game Round of 32, Sweet 16 game. It would give him a ton of exposure.

Reality is, he's probably more of a 3/4 in the NBA whereas he plays the 4/5 in college. He probably needs another season to develop more off-the-dribble, whether going to the basket or creating his shot.
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Unread postby TruePoint » 1 year ago

Last year I thought Dunn was crazy for staying (and I may turn out to be wrong about that, but it isn't as much of a slam dunk as it looked like a month or two ago). This year I think the idea that Bentil would leave is crazy. He has had a great college basketball season, but to me he has more work to do at this level to project him at the next level. I'm sure he would get picked at some point because he is an obvious talent, but he could really improve his stock with another year in college, whereas I didn't think Dunn could improve his stock as much as he apparently has.
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Unread postby ATPTourFan » 1 year ago

What if PC helps Bentil by setting up an insurance program like they did for Dunn this year? That would help Bentil in the event he got hurt or whatever next year.

To me, that looks like the school is paying the player to stay and play for them. I know it's legal, but that's a gray area to me.

Kevin McNamara wrote:New NCAA rules have created an “exceptional student-athlete disability insurance program,” that Dunn has secured. The program provides him the opportunity to protect against future loss of earnings as a professional athlete, due to a disabling injury or sickness that may occur during his collegiate career.


http://www.providencejournal.com/articl ... /150429559
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Unread postby twisted3829 » 1 year ago

i think it just allows a school to buy/pay for an insurance policy so that if he returns and gets injured he wouldn't miss the money he sould have made if he left
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Unread postby ramster » 1 year ago

Latest listing of players staying in draft and those returning to school.
Jordan Hare stayed in the draft.

http://www.nbadraft.net/early-entry-withdrawal-list
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Unread postby SGreenwell » 1 year ago

ramster wrote:Latest listing of players staying in draft and those returning to school.
Jordan Hare stayed in the draft.

http://www.nbadraft.net/early-entry-withdrawal-list

He's 6'10" and has a pulse, so I'm guessing he could get invited to some workouts or combines and what not. But geez, there's pretty much nothing in his playing career or inability to play college basketball to suggest that an NBA team would use a draft pick on him. Again, with the size, he could probably get a look from a professional team of some sort.
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Unread postby STC » 1 year ago

Jarelle Reischel works out for Knicks...

http://hoopshype.com/tag/jarrelle-reischel/
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Unread postby ramster » 1 year ago

Do the Celtics really take Bender at pick #3?

http://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/celti ... eadArticle
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Unread postby SmartyBarrett » 1 year ago

At this point almost nothing would surprise me. I've seen mocks saying they'll take Bender, Dunn, Hield, Murray, Chriss, and Jaylen Brown.
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Unread postby STC » 1 year ago

I am firmly in the Jamal Murray camp for the Celtics pick at 3. (Assuming no trade)

Who do my fellow C's fans want to see at 3 if no trade?
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Unread postby ramster » 1 year ago

I can't see how Bender is possible #3 pick, or lottery or even first round pick.
He plays form macabi tel eve and does not even start
In 28 games
59% FG
37% 3PG
73% FT
3 rpg
5.5 ppg
Americans on the team include Trevor mbakwe (Minnesota) with 12.6ppg and 7.2 rpg and Jordan farmar at 9.7 ppg

I'd take any of the others being mentioned but just don't see it in Bender.
I would take Jaylen Brown if it were up to me.
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Unread postby SmartyBarrett » 1 year ago

The thing about those six guys I listed is that it's easy to make a strong case for any of them, and easy to make a strong case against any of them. Such is the 2016 NBA Draft. As a Celtics fan, I like Murray and I like Hield, and I could be talked into liking Bender. If they take Dunn I don't see how they keep him. They already have a handful of strong defensive guards that can't shoot.
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Unread postby SGreenwell » 1 year ago

ramster wrote:I can't see how Bender is possible #3 pick, or lottery or even first round pick.
He plays form macabi tel eve and does not even start
In 28 games
59% FG
37% 3PG
73% FT
3 rpg
5.5 ppg
Americans on the team include Trevor mbakwe (Minnesota) with 12.6ppg and 7.2 rpg and Jordan farmar at 9.7 ppg

I'd take any of the others being mentioned but just don't see it in Bender.
I would take Jaylen Brown if it were up to me.

Most young Euro prospects don't start on their teams, since IIRC, they're playing on teams with grown men. There is also a disincentive for many of those teams to play them major minutes once they know the player is an NBA prospect. I don't think Kristaps Porziņģis started for his team either, and he pretty solidly seems to be the #2 player from the 2015 draft.
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Unread postby Rhodymob05 » 1 year ago

STC wrote:I am firmly in the Jamal Murray camp for the Celtics pick at 3. (Assuming no trade)

Who do my fellow C's fans want to see at 3 if no trade?


Kris Dunn...wait for it....to be traded away to Philly for Okafor or Noel. Which is being rumored.
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Unread postby ramster » 1 year ago

SGreenwell wrote:
ramster wrote:I can't see how Bender is possible #3 pick, or lottery or even first round pick.
He plays form macabi tel eve and does not even start
In 28 games
59% FG
37% 3PG
73% FT
3 rpg
5.5 ppg
Americans on the team include Trevor mbakwe (Minnesota) with 12.6ppg and 7.2 rpg and Jordan farmar at 9.7 ppg

I'd take any of the others being mentioned but just don't see it in Bender.
I would take Jaylen Brown if it were up to me.

Most young Euro prospects don't start on their teams, since IIRC, they're playing on teams with grown men. There is also a disincentive for many of those teams to play them major minutes once they know the player is an NBA prospect. I don't think Kristaps Porziņģis started for his team either, and he pretty solidly seems to be the #2 player from the 2015 draft.


Ok, makes me feel a little better
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Unread postby STC » 1 year ago

As a Celtics fan I really hope these rumors about the 3rd pick for either Middleton or Noel are false. In either case I would rather keep the 3rd pick and have a guy like Jamal Murray under contract for the next 4 years.

The Middleton rumor really baffles me. I don't get why the Celtics would want to take on a huge contract before free agency begins when Ainge has worked so hard to sign short term guys (Jerebko, Johnson) and accumulate team friendly deals (Thomas, Bradley, Crowder) in order to save the cap space for a real big fish. Not Khris bleeping Middleton.

Now, for Milwaukee that deal would be a home run. Put the 3rd pick next to Giannis and Jabari and you have a nice little core to build with, plus the cap relief from ditching Middleton.
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Unread postby SmartyBarrett » 1 year ago

STC wrote:As a Celtics fan I really hope these rumors about the 3rd pick for either Middleton or Noel are false. In either case I would rather keep the 3rd pick and have a guy like Jamal Murray under contract for the next 4 years.

The Middleton rumor really baffles me. I don't get why the Celtics would want to take on a huge contract before free agency begins when Ainge has worked so hard to sign short term guys (Jerebko, Johnson) and accumulate team friendly deals (Thomas, Bradley, Crowder) in order to save the cap space for a real big fish. Not Khris bleeping Middleton.

Now, for Milwaukee that deal would be a home run. Put the 3rd pick next to Giannis and Jabari and you have a nice little core to build with, plus the cap relief from ditching Middleton.


100 percent agree. I've also heard Gordon Hayward's name tossed around. Hard pass.
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Unread postby ramster » 1 year ago

Interesting approach that I just read about Ainge......
If the Celtics are to make a trade with the #3 pick it will be after the first 2 picks are made.
This is because there is always the possibility that one of the first two teams pulls a surprise and either Simmons or Ingram are not taken at #1 and #2. So it is possible that the Celtics could land one of those two players - small chance, but nonetheless why not wait it out.

Then they could always have trades already lined up and in waiting when the #3 pick time comes.

At any rate, it promises to be a very interesting draft this year.

After first two picks three is far from consensus as to how the rest of the Top 10 go.
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Unread postby rjsuperfly66 » 1 year ago

I'm all for that plan ... But it appears that the C's have swung and missed at all the big targets and now appear destined to deal with Philly. Have to hope in the mean time that Philly doesn't swing a deal for 4 or 5 and dare the C's to draft Dunn or accept a lesser piece in a trade. If the C's do keep the pick, it would be hard for them to draft another PG even if they could deal off a piece later. Philly could sit at 4 and 5 and still have a chance at him. They would just have to hope no one offers the C's what they are looking for but IMHO, the C's have significantly overvalued the pick which went from a potentially great asset with the chance at Simmons or Ingram to a decent not great asset. Basically 3-8 is a bunch of guys who have the potential to be fringe-AS type players but far from a certainty. 2 will probably be hits, 1 will probably be ok, and 2 will probably underwhelm.

I think the C's thought the pick + 2 decent players (Bradley/Crowder) and maybe a role player or 2 got the deal done for a near perennial AS. That's not even close to the case, especially with the cast of characters they are even looking at. Went from hopes of Butler, George, Cousins during the season to Middleton, Hayward, and Okafor now.
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Unread postby SGreenwell » 1 year ago

rjsuperfly66 wrote:I'm all for that plan ... But it appears that the C's have swung and missed at all the big targets and now appear destined to deal with Philly. Have to hope in the mean time that Philly doesn't swing a deal for 4 or 5 and dare the C's to draft Dunn or accept a lesser piece in a trade. If the C's do keep the pick, it would be hard for them to draft another PG even if they could deal off a piece later. Philly could sit at 4 and 5 and still have a chance at him. They would just have to hope no one offers the C's what they are looking for but IMHO, the C's have significantly overvalued the pick which went from a potentially great asset with the chance at Simmons or Ingram to a decent not great asset. Basically 3-8 is a bunch of guys who have the potential to be fringe-AS type players but far from a certainty. 2 will probably be hits, 1 will probably be ok, and 2 will probably underwhelm.

I think the C's thought the pick + 2 decent players (Bradley/Crowder) and maybe a role player or 2 got the deal done for a near perennial AS. That's not even close to the case, especially with the cast of characters they are even looking at. Went from hopes of Butler, George, Cousins during the season to Middleton, Hayward, and Okafor now.

To be fair to the Celtics, while the George, Butler, Cousins trades were floated out there, I don't think they ever progressed to serious levels. All three of those teams would be nuts to deal those players - It seemed mostly like wishcasting on the behalf of sports writers or fans in those markets. (Similarly, that's what the Bucks' "deal" of Middleton for the #3 feels like - The sort of trade George Costanza would make while he was with the Yankees. "I just figured out a way to deal for Ken Griffey Jr.!")

There is an adage when it comes to NBA free agency that also applies to trades - It only takes one asshole. Meaning, it only takes one asshole to give Joe Johnson or Rashard Lewis an insane contract, or for the Nets to trade their draft for three years for Paul Pierce and Kevin Garnett, and it screws things up for everyone else. I think (or at least, I hope) the Celtics are willing to do that sort of deal, but less interested in the "fair" deals.

I think the #3 for Okafor or Noel is probably a fairly even deal in terms of value, but I don't think it helps the Celtics all that much specifically. Meaning, I think the Celtics already have a roster full of average to above-average players, and they need more of a bonafide all-star or guy with that potential. Like, as weird as it might seem, I'd rather they acquire Kevin Love than Noel or Okafor, since I think it's more likely that he returns to an AS level of production than the other two develop that way.
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Unread postby rjsuperfly66 » 1 year ago

On the adage -- I agree completely. But has Danny Ainge exhausted his ability to make someone like like the ahole? He obviously fleeced Minnesota for Garnett. Then he fleeced Brooklyn for basically 4 first round draft picks. To a lesser extent, he crushed the Suns on the Thomas deal, although that was more based on potential and scouting than a bad deal. I just wonder if other GM's know he doesn't like to pull the trigger on a deal unless he thinks he's at a clear advantage, and therefore are less relectuant to make tough deals for fear of losing the trade. Outside of the Perkins for Green swap, it's hard to find a tough basketball trade that doesn't look like the C's clearly won in the last decade.
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Unread postby ramster » 1 year ago

Interesting take on the top 5 players for the Celtics to take at #3

http://nesn.com/2016/06/celtics-draft-p ... no-3-pick/
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Unread postby ramster » 1 year ago

Chances of getting Jimmy Butler from Chicago just disappeared.
http://www.sbnation.com/2016/6/22/12006 ... ork-knicks
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Unread postby ace » 1 year ago

I want to know which team really wants Thon Maker to drop to them and got the age talk circling.
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Unread postby STC » 1 year ago

Wow I hate the Celtics draft so far, especially Guerschon at 16. Brutal!

A few other thoughts:

-Orlando is an absolute embarrassment. They have turned Tobias Harris, Victor Oladipo and the 11th pick into Ibaka, Jennings and what?

-Ainge should have been in on the 8th pick given what it went for. Celtics could have put together a very competitive package compared to what Sacto got.

-Minnesota was the ideal landing spot for Kris Dunn in my opinion. Paired alongside Wiggins and Towns the future is bright in Minnesota. Now they just have to not fuck it up.

-Wasn't Giorgios Papagiannis the 'invisible greek'? Well the Kings scooped him at 13.

-Jamal Murray will average 16+ ppg as a rookie. Denver has a solid little backcourt in Mudiay/Murray.

-Dragan Bender and Marquese Chriss will never live up to the hype in Phoenix.
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Unread postby TruePoint » 1 year ago

I love Celtics draft. Yabo is the man.
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Unread postby NYGFan_Section208 » 1 year ago

Interesting thoughts on Labissiere..."sometimes you have to declare, because you may not get as much PT next year with the incoming class that's coming"
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Re: 2016 NBA Draft Thursday June 23rd - Latest NBADraft.net

Unread postby TruePoint » 1 year ago

Hard to think of a better scenario for me than Bentil leaving a year early and falling to #51 for the Celts - Rhody doesn't have to deal with him and I think C's might have stolen him. Could be poor man's Draymond.
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Unread postby STC » 1 year ago

I'm happy the Celtics got Bentil but damn that kid got some bad advice. When Bentil announced he was staying in the draft I assumed he must have a first round promise.
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Unread postby Running Ram » 1 year ago

TruePoint wrote:Hard to think of a better scenario for me than Bentil leaving a year early and falling to #51 for the Celts - Rhody doesn't have to deal with him and I think C's might have stolen him. Could be poor man's Draymond.


TP, the next time we spar about some other non-sense, lets remember we do have, at least some, opinions in common, and I couldn't agree with you more on this one! Bentil gone; PC hurting, Bentil falls to the Celts at 51; theft of the draft!
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Unread postby SmartyBarrett » 1 year ago

I could also easily see Bentil never playing a game in the NBA. Late second rounders (picks 50+) making it are extremely rare - I think he got horrible advice and could be destined for the D-League and/or a career overseas. But if he does pop, I'm glad the C's have him.

My favorite part of last night was Celtics fans deciding that a player they had literally never heard of 30 seconds ago was a terrible pick.
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Unread postby RhowdyRam02 » 1 year ago

Did the Bentil decision backfire? Certainly looks that way. But returning to PC without Dunn alongside him for next year certainly had its own risks, to say nothing of the possibility of injury.
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Re: 2016 NBA Draft Thursday June 23rd - Latest NBADraft.net

Unread postby ace » 1 year ago

My team drafted a guy who won his league's dunk contest dressed as Darth Vader, so I think we know who the real winner in this year's draft is. I think Simmons will be great, and I'm feeling like this might finally be the year we see Embiid.


No one was drafted from the national champion, and object lesson with Skal vs Thon- possibly questionable highly ranked prospects would do better to hide at prep school for a year instead of playing in college, if the graduation/age thing works out right.
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Re: 2016 NBA Draft Thursday June 23rd - Latest NBADraft.net

Unread postby SGreenwell » 1 year ago

ace wrote:My team drafted a guy who won his league's dunk contest dressed as Darth Vader, so I think we know who the real winner in this year's draft is. I think Simmons will be great, and I'm feeling like this might finally be the year we see Embiid.

No one was drafted from the national champion, and object lesson with Skal vs Thon- possibly questionable highly ranked prospects would do better to hide at prep school for a year instead of playing in college, if the graduation/age thing works out right.

There isn't much evidence that going to college vs. going HS to NBA or from a Euro legaue effects the outcome that much. Plenty of anecdotal stuff on both sides - some kids need the stability of a college situation, some don't at all, and a bunch of players are probably somewhere in-between. I'm cynical about the NBA's age policy, and I've always thought it was more of an attempt by the league's ownership to minimize draft mistakes. They'd rather minimize their risk when it comes to drafting, at the cost of losing a year of a young player's development to college or another league.

re: The Celtics draft, meh. I actually like some of the Euro players they drafted, and Brown, but other teams (rightfully) seemed willing to wait the draft out and to see who fell to that 8 to 15 range before making deals. Without some trades, I think Bentil will be hard pressed to make the Celtics, but I'm not sure of what the rules are when it comes to stashing him in the D-League.

Also, at least the Celtics aren't the Magic. Holy hell, no clue what their thought process is in that trade for Ibaka. He plays the same position as their best young player (Gordon), and they essentially gave up Sabonis AND Oladipo for him. It's like Scott Skiles moved into the GM role for them, as opposed to being shitcanned.
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Re: 2016 NBA Draft Thursday June 23rd - Latest NBADraft.net

Unread postby Seawrightspostgame » 1 year ago

SGreenwell wrote: I'm cynical about the NBA's age policy, and I've always thought it was more of an attempt by the league's ownership to minimize draft mistakes. They'd rather minimize their risk when it comes to drafting, at the cost of losing a year of a young player's development to college or another league.



Also limits the player's earning ability. What if they raise it to 20?
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Re: 2016 NBA Draft Thursday June 23rd - Latest NBADraft.net

Unread postby ace » 1 year ago

SGreenwell wrote:
ace wrote:My team drafted a guy who won his league's dunk contest dressed as Darth Vader, so I think we know who the real winner in this year's draft is. I think Simmons will be great, and I'm feeling like this might finally be the year we see Embiid.

No one was drafted from the national champion, and object lesson with Skal vs Thon- possibly questionable highly ranked prospects would do better to hide at prep school for a year instead of playing in college, if the graduation/age thing works out right.


There isn't much evidence that going to college vs. going HS to NBA or from a Euro legaue effects the outcome that much. Plenty of anecdotal stuff on both sides - some kids need the stability of a college situation, some don't at all, and a bunch of players are probably somewhere in-between. I'm cynical about the NBA's age policy, and I've always thought it was more of an attempt by the league's ownership to minimize draft mistakes. They'd rather minimize their risk when it comes to drafting, at the cost of losing a year of a young player's development to college or another league.


I think players should be draft eligible as high school seniors, but I'm not sure that has all that much to do with Skal and Thon. Maker has been one of the most handled young players, maybe ever. They basically hid him his senior year, while Skal struggled to get meaningful minutes at a great college program. The Maker approach could be situationally effective for some guys.
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Re: 2016 NBA Draft Thursday June 23rd - Latest NBADraft.net

Unread postby Ramblinrose » 1 year ago

Ed Cooley told Dunn to declare a year ago. I doubt he told Bentil the same this year. You'll see a lot of Bentil with the Maine Claws.
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Re: 2016 NBA Draft Thursday June 23rd - Latest NBADraft.net

Unread postby TruePoint » 1 year ago

Running Ram wrote:
TruePoint wrote:Hard to think of a better scenario for me than Bentil leaving a year early and falling to #51 for the Celts - Rhody doesn't have to deal with him and I think C's might have stolen him. Could be poor man's Draymond.


TP, the next time we spar about some other non-sense, lets remember we do have, at least some, opinions in common, and I couldn't agree with you more on this one! Bentil gone; PC hurting, Bentil falls to the Celts at 51; theft of the draft!


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