Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby steveystuds06 » 1 year ago

Any team that makes it to the knockout round with Portugal and Germany in the group is a good team.
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby NYGFan_Section208 » 1 year ago

TruePoint wrote:
NYGFan_Section208 wrote:I think the US will be 'good at soccer', right after we adopt the metric system....


This is a dinosaur way of thinking. It's also obviously wrong, since the U.S. is already good at soccer, it just isn't one of the very elite soccer nations yet. As I mentioned before, the "ignorance is cool" soccer-hating thing that was popular among dumb sports fans of a certain age in the late 90s has lost the culture war on soccer. The metrics are not debatable - the demand for the sport at its highest level has led to all of the major European soccer leagues to be broadcast live in the U.S., the attendance and overall health of MLS is on a steady incline, and anecdotally this generation of sports fan cares more and knows more about the game of soccer globally than they do about American sports like hockey.


Ignorance is not cool and people that hate soccer probably aren't any dumber than people that hate baseball.
But, it does seem that there are many more that like baseball and don't like soccer - the 'dumb majority', maybe? :lol:
And if someone could post funnies on a baseball thread about why it sucks, I'd probably laugh, too.
Has to be a reason why the soccer stuff is so much funnier though...

The metric system analogy is spot on...the fact is...it just has not caught on in America...doesn't matter if it's 'better' or not. It has not caught on.
It has not and probably will not, in our lifetime, ever surpass any of the big 4 in America (of which hockey is #4 and therefore maybe a decent target).
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby steveystuds06 » 1 year ago

12-to-26 year-olds soccer is the second-most-popular professional sport, behind only football and above basketball, baseball and hockey.
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby ramfan85 » 1 year ago

Curling must be number 5.
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby josephski » 1 year ago

NYGFan_Section208 wrote:
TruePoint wrote:
NYGFan_Section208 wrote:I think the US will be 'good at soccer', right after we adopt the metric system....


This is a dinosaur way of thinking. It's also obviously wrong, since the U.S. is already good at soccer, it just isn't one of the very elite soccer nations yet. As I mentioned before, the "ignorance is cool" soccer-hating thing that was popular among dumb sports fans of a certain age in the late 90s has lost the culture war on soccer. The metrics are not debatable - the demand for the sport at its highest level has led to all of the major European soccer leagues to be broadcast live in the U.S., the attendance and overall health of MLS is on a steady incline, and anecdotally this generation of sports fan cares more and knows more about the game of soccer globally than they do about American sports like hockey.


Ignorance is not cool and people that hate soccer probably aren't any dumber than people that hate baseball.
But, it does seem that there are many more that like baseball and don't like soccer - the 'dumb majority', maybe? :lol:
And if someone could post funnies on a baseball thread about why it sucks, I'd probably laugh, too.
Has to be a reason why the soccer stuff is so much funnier though...

The metric system analogy is spot on...the fact is...it just has not caught on in America...doesn't matter if it's 'better' or not. It has not caught on.
It has not and probably will not, in our lifetime, ever surpass any of the big 4 in America (of which hockey is #4 and therefore maybe a decent target).


The metric system analogy is awful and sums up your ignorance of soccer. As TP said the fact that the major European soccer leagues now broadcast live in the US is just one example of how soccer is growing. If you don't like soccer that's fine, nobody cares, but maybe try and realize soccer is growing whether you want it to or not.
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby NYGFan_Section208 » 1 year ago

The metric system compare is perfect...it's de rigeur in Europe, it might even be considered better by a lot of people, but it hasn't caught on in the US...except maybe in pockets. I don't care if it grows or not, as long as it's not on "instead" of regular sports. Let's see how long it takes to get on major network tv in prime time on a regular basis....

What today's 12-26 year olds want to see...might drive that to happen....when that group is 25-34...?
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby UCH21377 » 1 year ago

208 most sports are now not on the networks during prime time. The final 4 was on TBS wasn't it?
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby TruePoint » 1 year ago

First of all, the metric system is a terrible analogy. That would be asking people to abandon their whole frame of reference for measurements they've had their whole life, while soccer is asking people to like a new thing without replacing any other thing. It's like if you have two $20s in your pocket and I'm like "would you like to have this $10 bill also?" There is no down side to it, you don't have to give me one of your $20s. It's just a new extra thing.

Second of all, the premier league is on network NBC somewhat regularly. Maybe you should wake up earlier.
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby NYGFan_Section208 » 1 year ago

TruePoint wrote:First of all, the metric system is a terrible analogy. That would be asking people to abandon their whole frame of reference for measurements they've had their whole life, while soccer is asking people to like a new thing without replacing any other thing. It's like if you have two $20s in your pocket and I'm like "would you like to have this $10 bill also?" There is no down side to it, you don't have to give me one of your $20s. It's just a new extra thing.

Second of all, the premier league is on network NBC somewhat regularly. Maybe you should wake up earlier.


I disagree...most have limited time, so you do have to give up something Most people that have jobs and families...only have so much time for sports. So, if I'm going to watch three hours of soccer, I gotta give up three hours of real sports - and people are not doing that in mass quantities...yet. Not saying never...but not now.

And, as far as network tv goes...last I checked I was pretty good at being able to wake up in time for prime time TV.
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby TruePoint » 1 year ago

So soccer is not popular because the premier league doesn't play their games at 3am local time so you can watch it in primetime?
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby NYGFan_Section208 » 1 year ago

No...I think it's the other way around. ;)
If it were popular enough for the US, the $ would be there so that they would schedule their games for 3AM, so we could watch it in primetime. But it isn't there, because...well...not enough people interested.
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby TruePoint » 1 year ago

You know that the UK has money, too, right? Does the NBA play games at 3am so China can watch it in primetime?
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby bressler3south » 1 year ago

Congratulations, 208!!!!!!! You are now the winner of "THE BRESSLER3SOUTH LOGICALLY ILLOGICAL AWARD," it's yours, and I'm surprised TP didn't bestow this upon you earlier with some quip or the like.....
You, pal, are a complete dip. Okay, so you don't like soccer, great, got it.
Now, do us a favor, and get off of it.
You've made your point.
Wow-weeeeeeeeeeeeeee, wee-heeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby NYGFan_Section208 » 1 year ago

TruePoint wrote:You know that the UK has money, too, right? Does the NBA play games at 3am so China can watch it in primetime?


Still proving my point, NBA doesn't have to...the Chinese (and the UK) get up at 3AM to watch...because it's the NBA...

And bressler...name-calling, that's nice. If you don't like what I have to say, ignore it or block me.
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby TruePoint » 1 year ago

How can that be your point? That's my whole point. Guys my age were flooding bars on Saturday and Sunday mornings to watch the premier league and bundisliga and la liga and serie a, and so the sports networks bought the rights to all those leagues and now people can watch all of them from the comfort of their own homes. Because people here like soccer. So if that is your point, you need a new point.
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby bressler3south » 1 year ago

On point, TruePoint.
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby steveystuds06 » 1 year ago

TruePoint speaks the truth!!
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby TruePoint » 1 year ago

Not sure how many of you guys are paying attention, but Leicester City won again today and is going to win the premier league. That is kind of like URI winning the NCAA tournament, only in a way even more impressive because it is 40 games instead of 6. One of the coolest stories in sports right now.
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby josephski » 1 year ago

TruePoint wrote:Not sure how many of you guys are paying attention, but Leicester City won again today and is going to win the premier league. That is kind of like URI winning the NCAA tournament, only in a way even more impressive because it is 40 games instead of 6. One of the coolest stories in sports right now.

5000-1 odds at the beginning of the season. URI might even have better odds than that next year to win the tourney. It amazing too because without any playoffs they're required to be the best team for the entire season and not just a portion of it.
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby UCH21377 » 1 year ago

So how is it happening? Did they have players come out of nowhere and become great, a la Brady? Did they just come up from the lower division? Why were the odds so long? Just curious; don't know much about soccer but did notice the press about Leicester. I'm assuming they don't have the money of the big shots, who are Man U and a few others right? And since we are talking about Cameron, where does Stoke fit in historically? Looks like the middle of the pack.
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby Shaolin Swat » 1 year ago

josephski wrote:
TruePoint wrote:Not sure how many of you guys are paying attention, but Leicester City won again today and is going to win the premier league. That is kind of like URI winning the NCAA tournament, only in a way even more impressive because it is 40 games instead of 6. One of the coolest stories in sports right now.

5000-1 odds at the beginning of the season. URI might even have better odds than that next year to win the tourney. It amazing too because without any playoffs they're required to be the best team for the entire season and not just a portion of it.



I don't really follow soccer, but for a team to win a league when they had 5000-1 odds at the beginning of the season is incredible. To put it all in perspective, right now the odds on URI winning it all next year are 300-1.
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby steveystuds06 » 1 year ago

UCH21377 wrote:So how is it happening? Did they have players come out of nowhere and become great, a la Brady? Did they just come up from the lower division? Why were the odds so long? Just curious; don't know much about soccer but did notice the press about Leicester. I'm assuming they don't have the money of the big shots, who are Man U and a few others right? And since we are talking about Cameron, where does Stoke fit in historically? Looks like the middle of the pack.


Leicester doesn't have any superstars they just play extremely well as a team. It's a simple 4-4-2 approach but it works for them. They don't compare to the likes of Chelsea and Man U when it comes to money so they got some under the radar guys that have worked out perfectly like Vardys and Mahrez. Playing great defense and counter attacking is what they do better than anyone. Their opponent will possess the ball for a while but then boom they see an opening and score on a counter attack.

Stoke is always in the 7-12 range a tough team to beat but never competes for a title. For Geoff to be a starter in one of the best leagues in the world is a huge achievement.
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby TruePoint » 1 year ago

UCH21377 wrote:So how is it happening? Did they have players come out of nowhere and become great, a la Brady? Did they just come up from the lower division? Why were the odds so long? Just curious; don't know much about soccer but did notice the press about Leicester. I'm assuming they don't have the money of the big shots, who are Man U and a few others right? And since we are talking about Cameron, where does Stoke fit in historically? Looks like the middle of the pack.


I do NOT (updated from earlier typo where I forgot the "not" and accidentally claimed knowledge I definitely don't have) know enough about soccer from a technical standpoint, nor have I watched enough of Leicester City this season, to know exactly how they are doing this. Just from doing a little reading on the internet, I can tell you that Leicester has never won the highest division of English soccer and, other than a runner-up finish in 1929, has never really threatened to in its 125+ year history. They have mostly bounced back and forth between the two highest divisions (the Premier League and the Championship) throughout their history, but as recently as 2009 were actually relegated all the way down to Division One, which is the third tier league.

Leicester's two best players are Riyad Mahrez, a Frenchman who is an Algerian international and who was voted the player of the year by the players this year, and Jamie Vardy, an Englishman who is leading the team in scoring. Both of these guys are having legitimately great seasons and both seem to have come out of nowhere almost as much as Leicester itself. It will be interesting to see whether Leicester tries to keep this team together to defend their Premier League title next year or if they will look to transfer those guys to a major club in order to finance their operations for the next decade (which may be the better bet for longterm success, but it seems unlikely they'll ever compete for league title again starting from scratch, so maybe its worth going for it again next year).
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby UCH21377 » 1 year ago

OK, so they can basically sell their guys off? There's no rules like in our preofessional leagues? Salary caps or any of that? Interesting. Probably would mean a small group of teams stays near the top? In any event it sounds like a remarkable achievement.
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Re: Arsenal 3-1 Stoke City: Cameron Scores First BPL Goal

Unread postby steveystuds06 » 1 year ago

This is a great weekly update on how our men's national players are doing at their clubs. Comes out every Monday.
http://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2016/04 ... pouring-in
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby ramster » 1 year ago

Touching tribute from fans.
They will be making a movie about this incredible season

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/201 ... redible-s/
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby josephski » 1 year ago

Leicester plays Manchester United tomorrow at 9:05 am. A win will give Leicester the premier league title and complete one of the greatest stories in sports history while Manchester United currently sits in 5th and is still fighting to get in the top 4 so they have a spot in the champions league next season. Should be a great match!
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby NYGFan_Section208 » 1 year ago

josephski wrote:Leicester plays Manchester United tomorrow at 9:05 am. A win will give Leicester the premier league title and complete one of the greatest stories in sports history while Manchester United currently sits in 5th and is still fighting to get in the top 4 so they have a spot in the champions league next season. Should be a great match!


What channel?
nm, found it
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby steveystuds06 » 1 year ago

Ref was awful... Both teams should of had PKs.
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby NYGFan_Section208 » 1 year ago

I tried....tuned in around 930...was 1-1. Watched until halftime, when I felt myself slipping into a soccer-induced coma. Went out for a 1 hour walk, came back, game over, final score 1-1. Maybe a great David v Goliath story...but still boring as all get out....B O R I N G................. Well, of course, 'cept for that time when, the guy kicked the ball...and it went off his teammate...then the other team kicked it...and then the other team took it back and (yup) kicked it again. That part was cool.....

Will be curious to see how that game's US ratings compare to Sox (coming off two straight last place finishes) vs Yankees (just not a very good team right now) ratings on espn tonight.
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby ATPTourFan » 1 year ago

Ridiculous comparison. You want to compare a live sporting event at 9am ET to one in prime time?
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby RhowdyRam02 » 1 year ago

The April 24th Leicester City match against Swansea City had 569,000 viewers. That same night the Sox played the Astros on Sunday night baseball and had 1.2 million viewers. So prime time baseball with two television markets in this country drew about double what morning soccer with no tv markets in the country drew.
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby NYGFan_Section208 » 1 year ago

Yup, it's a ridiculous comparison alright...but that's because one sport lags so freekn far behind in popularity in this country...

People want to yell and scream about how popular soccer is...but if someone wants to compare it to a real sport...then their comparison is considered ridiculous.
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby TruePoint » 1 year ago

I love baseball and you won't see me knocking it. But please consider that (1) baseball has had a 100 year head start in the U.S., (2) baseball teams have home markets in the U.S. to anchor their ratings, where European soccer does not, (3) European soccer broadcast live in the U.S. is typically on in the mornings, whereas baseball is played in primetime and (4) Sunday Night Baseball is not only on in primetime, but is on ESPN which is available in more households than NBCSN which is the primary carrier of the Premier League in the U.S.

It is dumb to pit baseball against soccer anyways. I am a much bigger MLB fan than I am an EPL fan, but most people capable of holding more than one thought in their head at the same time are also capable of liking multiple sports not the exclusion of one another.
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby TruePoint » 1 year ago

And it's official: Leicester City wins the Barclay's Premier League. Maybe the most incredible season in the history of sports.
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby NYGFan_Section208 » 1 year ago

TruePoint wrote:I love baseball and you won't see me knocking it. But please consider that (1) baseball has had a 100 year head start in the U.S., (2) baseball teams have home markets in the U.S. to anchor their ratings, where European soccer does not, (3) European soccer broadcast live in the U.S. is typically on in the mornings, whereas baseball is played in primetime and (4) Sunday Night Baseball is not only on in primetime, but is on ESPN which is available in more households than NBCSN which is the primary carrier of the Premier League in the U.S.

It is dumb to pit baseball against soccer anyways. I am a much bigger MLB fan than I am an EPL fan, but most people capable of holding more than one thought in their head at the same time are also capable of liking multiple sports not the exclusion of one another.


Never questioned how much of a fan you are...but if people want to talk about how 'popular' it is here (which, it's really not), then it seems comparison to real sports is a good place to start. What would you suggest comparing it to? House Hunters, Charlie Moor Outdoors? It's just that soccer has not caught on here in the US like any of the real sports. It's not that it's less popular because it's on a less extensive network and in the morning, it's on in the morning on a less extensive network because it's not that popular. Am guessing a Red Sox game in the middle of the week on NESN draws as many viewers as Saturday's match?

If people want to make fun of baseball...go for it...I just don't think it's as ripe for that kind of thing...
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby RhowdyRam02 » 1 year ago

By the odds it's certainly up there, and I'm sure their fans don't really care how it happened, but it felt odd and anticlimactic to me that they weren't on the field of play when the championship was won. Felt like some of the worst years in FBS when you didn't get an outright champion.
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby TruePoint » 1 year ago

NYGFan_Section208 wrote:
TruePoint wrote:I love baseball and you won't see me knocking it. But please consider that (1) baseball has had a 100 year head start in the U.S., (2) baseball teams have home markets in the U.S. to anchor their ratings, where European soccer does not, (3) European soccer broadcast live in the U.S. is typically on in the mornings, whereas baseball is played in primetime and (4) Sunday Night Baseball is not only on in primetime, but is on ESPN which is available in more households than NBCSN which is the primary carrier of the Premier League in the U.S.

It is dumb to pit baseball against soccer anyways. I am a much bigger MLB fan than I am an EPL fan, but most people capable of holding more than one thought in their head at the same time are also capable of liking multiple sports not the exclusion of one another.


Never questioned how much of a fan you are...but if people want to talk about how 'popular' it is here (which, it's really not), then it seems comparison to real sports is a good place to start. What would you suggest comparing it to? House Hunters, Charlie Moor Outdoors? It's just that soccer has not caught on here in the US like any of the real sports. It's not that it's less popular because it's on a less extensive network and in the morning, it's on in the morning on a less extensive network because it's not that popular. Am guessing a Red Sox game in the middle of the week on NESN draws as many viewers as Saturday's match?

If people want to make fun of baseball...go for it...I just don't think it's as ripe for that kind of thing...


Your argument is tied up in so much wrongheaded nonsense. If you want a comparison for soccer's TV ratings, I think a good place to start would be soccer's ratings 10 years ago, and 20 years ago. As has been explained already, the games are on when they are on because they are played in Europe and they are shown live. Nobody is arguing that soccer is more popular in the U.S. than the major American sports, but it has a not insignificant following and, more importantly, the popularity and the quality of soccer played here are both on a positive trajectory. You don't have to like soccer, but to make the argument that soccer is objectively bad just makes you look dumb. Every single tangible and intangible way of measuring it shows that the sport's popularity is unmatched globally and on the come in the U.S., and that is bolstered by the demographics of who is watching it and following it. When you don't know what you're talking about, sometimes it is better to not say anything rather than draw attention to your own ignorance.
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby TruePoint » 1 year ago

RhowdyRam02 wrote:By the odds it's certainly up there, and I'm sure their fans don't really care how it happened, but it felt odd and anticlimactic to me that they weren't on the field of play when the championship was won. Felt like some of the worst years in FBS when you didn't get an outright champion.


I guess. That's just the way the scheduling worked, but there is an outright champion.
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby NYGFan_Section208 » 1 year ago

TruePoint wrote:
NYGFan_Section208 wrote:
TruePoint wrote:I love baseball and you won't see me knocking it. But please consider that (1) baseball has had a 100 year head start in the U.S., (2) baseball teams have home markets in the U.S. to anchor their ratings, where European soccer does not, (3) European soccer broadcast live in the U.S. is typically on in the mornings, whereas baseball is played in primetime and (4) Sunday Night Baseball is not only on in primetime, but is on ESPN which is available in more households than NBCSN which is the primary carrier of the Premier League in the U.S.

It is dumb to pit baseball against soccer anyways. I am a much bigger MLB fan than I am an EPL fan, but most people capable of holding more than one thought in their head at the same time are also capable of liking multiple sports not the exclusion of one another.


Never questioned how much of a fan you are...but if people want to talk about how 'popular' it is here (which, it's really not), then it seems comparison to real sports is a good place to start. What would you suggest comparing it to? House Hunters, Charlie Moor Outdoors? It's just that soccer has not caught on here in the US like any of the real sports. It's not that it's less popular because it's on a less extensive network and in the morning, it's on in the morning on a less extensive network because it's not that popular. Am guessing a Red Sox game in the middle of the week on NESN draws as many viewers as Saturday's match?

If people want to make fun of baseball...go for it...I just don't think it's as ripe for that kind of thing...


Your argument is tied up in so much wrongheaded nonsense. If you want a comparison for soccer's TV ratings, I think a good place to start would be soccer's ratings 10 years ago, and 20 years ago. As has been explained already, the games are on when they are on because they are played in Europe and they are shown live. Nobody is arguing that soccer is more popular in the U.S. than the major American sports, but it has a not insignificant following and, more importantly, the popularity and the quality of soccer played here are both on a positive trajectory. You don't have to like soccer, but to make the argument that soccer is objectively bad just makes you look dumb. Every single tangible and intangible way of measuring it shows that the sport's popularity is unmatched globally and on the come in the U.S., and that is bolstered by the demographics of who is watching it and following it. When you don't know what you're talking about, sometimes it is better to not say anything rather than draw attention to your own ignorance.


I'm not saying it's objectively bad, I just find it definitely boring, subjectively bad and objectively less popular than any major sport in America. Last I knew, how much someone (subjectively) liked soccer was not a reflection of ignorance?

On ratings...look at viewership...Apply the same logic to the real sports number of viewers in the US 10-20 years ago. Use number of viewers, not "times" (because it doesn't take much to get multiples of soccer viewers)...Even US marquee events like the NBA Finals or the Super Bowl abroad - has soccer viewership in the US increased anything like basketball and football abroad in the last 10-20 years? I'm guessing not...please cure my ignorance there if that's a bad guess. The soccer numbers in the US are minimal...and it doesn't matter whether "I" like the sport or not, it's just not popular here in comparison to anything else on the US sports scene. Saying it's not popular in the US in comparison to real sports and that someone doesn't like the sport, I don't think is a reflection of ignorance...but labeling people that way, is always a more fun argument than facts, I guess.
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby TruePoint » 1 year ago

It isn't your not liking soccer that makes you ignorant, it is the arguments that you are using to argue...whatever it is that you're arguing. It is you continuing to use the phrase "real sports" when what you really mean is "American sports."

I don't think that the foreign NBA Finals or World Series numbers are any better than, say, a World Cup final is in the U.S. And I don't know the answer to this question, but I'd be willing to bet you a lunch that the Premier League ratings here are much better than the NBA or MLB ratings in England. My guess is that they are somewhat comparable to the NFL ratings across the pond. Would be interesting to find out, but I think the anecdotal evidence (the money that the networks in the U.S. are paying for the rights to those games) suggests I am right.

By the way, the ratings for all sports except football and soccer are way, way down decade over decade. That is your first argument, and it is not a helpful one.
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby TruePoint » 1 year ago

Just some cursory research shows that the Premier League had 7 matches with over 1.25M U.S. viewers this season. By way of comparison, MLB's national games on FOX have averaged between 1.9M and 2.7M over the last seven seasons, and the national MLB games on ESPN have averaged between 1.7M and 2.4M during that same time - those numbers show what anyone would expect, that baseball is more popular in America than soccer (duh), but they are not of a totally different scale. I don't think the numbers in any way support the argument that you are trying to make that soccer "is not popular." You can also look at the domestic league, MLS, which is doing terrific with attendance and cannot add teams fast enough (the markets that have fans sufficient to support a franchise far outnumber the number of teams for which there are good players available).
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby NYGFan_Section208 » 1 year ago

TruePoint wrote:Just some cursory research shows that the Premier League had 7 matches with over 1.25M U.S. viewers this season. By way of comparison, MLB's national games on FOX have averaged between 1.9M and 2.7M over the last seven seasons, and the national MLB games on ESPN have averaged between 1.7M and 2.4M during that same time - those numbers show what anyone would expect, that baseball is more popular in America than soccer (duh), but they are not of a totally different scale. I don't think the numbers in any way support the argument that you are trying to make that soccer "is not popular." You can also look at the domestic league, MLS, which is doing terrific with attendance and cannot add teams fast enough (the markets that have fans sufficient to support a franchise far outnumber the number of teams for which there are good players available).


Instead of comparing one sport's 7 best games (in its 'most popular year ever') against the 7 YEAR AVERAGE of another (declining, as you said) sport... what's the average of ALL PL matches this season compared to all MLB national games (this year, last year, any year)? I'm guessing they are of a totally different scale... They aren't in the same universe...people are passionate about it, but it's still a niche sport in the US...
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby NYGFan_Section208 » 1 year ago

Someone..anyone...please find me a rant about a sport that is half as funny as this one, even a sport that I like...I don't care...maybe it's a topic for a new thread, I don't know...but since this is the soccer thread...:

http://www.dailynorseman.com/2014/6/13/ ... ate-soccer
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Re: Rhody's Geoff Cameron, US Soccer & the Premier League

Unread postby TruePoint » 1 year ago

NYGFan_Section208 wrote:
TruePoint wrote:Just some cursory research shows that the Premier League had 7 matches with over 1.25M U.S. viewers this season. By way of comparison, MLB's national games on FOX have averaged between 1.9M and 2.7M over the last seven seasons, and the national MLB games on ESPN have averaged between 1.7M and 2.4M during that same time - those numbers show what anyone would expect, that baseball is more popular in America than soccer (duh), but they are not of a totally different scale. I don't think the numbers in any way support the argument that you are trying to make that soccer "is not popular." You can also look at the domestic league, MLS, which is doing terrific with attendance and cannot add teams fast enough (the markets that have fans sufficient to support a franchise far outnumber the number of teams for which there are good players available).


Instead of comparing one sport's 7 best games (in its 'most popular year ever') against the 7 YEAR AVERAGE of another (declining, as you said) sport... what's the average of ALL PL matches this season compared to all MLB national games (this year, last year, any year)? I'm guessing they are of a totally different scale... They aren't in the same universe...people are passionate about it, but it's still a niche sport in the US...


The point is the reach. In any given week, it is feasible that soccer could get as many viewers as a national baseball broadcast. That is startling. You're talking about the numbers as if they demonstrate people aren't interested in the sport, but the sport is in its relative infancy here. It isn't a mature market at this point.

I have no interest in comparing soccer to baseball. I am a much bigger baseball fan than I am a soccer fan, and I have never posited that soccer was more popular than baseball in America. I'm just showing you that the numbers are not as dramatic as you seem to think they are. It isn't Australian rugby or Indian cricket versus the NFL. By viewership, it is either the fourth or fifth biggest sport in the country even though the domestic league doesn't have the best players, the leagues with the best players play at bad TV times and America's fascination with it is relatively new. Nobody but you is trying to argue soccer versus the NFL, NBA or MLB, and that isn't the point.
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