UConn Women

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TruePoint
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by TruePoint »

I still don't get people being impressed with UConn. Give me the first 10 picks in my fantasy draft next year and I bet I'll do pretty well. Winning isn't much of an accomplishment when you have all the best players every year. That is like the opposite of the point of sports.
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rodfromcranston
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by rodfromcranston »

What an ignorant thing to say.
Do YOU know anything about Geno Auriemma? Did you ever bother
to hear how hard he works his players and his demand for perfection?
There's a reason why they are the best players.
We are in the presence of greatness.
You are such a chauvinist that it blinds you.
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sf2010
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by sf2010 »

TruePoint wrote:I still don't get people being impressed with UConn. Give me the first 10 picks in my fantasy draft next year and I bet I'll do pretty well. Winning isn't much of an accomplishment when you have all the best players every year. That is like the opposite of the point of sports.
Over the past 4 years, UConn has recruited 4 total players who were ranked in the top 10 of their class. Tennessee has 5, Notre Dame also has 4, Rutgers and Maryland have 3.

It doesn't really work they way you say it does.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by rodfromcranston »

If it was so easy, why didn't Pat Summit do it, when she
ruled WBB?
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by TruePoint »

LOLWUT? How am I a chauvanist? What does that have to do with the same team winning all the time making the sport uninteresting? I would have watched the last two minutes last night if ND was ahead. I was checking the score.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by SGreenwell »

I'm somewhere between TP and others on this. I think it's impressive that Geno has kept the basketball factory going there; he's obviously a good coach and a good recruiter. However, women's college basketball as a whole is still somewhat akin to, I don't know, pre-1960s men's basketball in terms of overall quality and parity. Dating back to 1990, only two #3 seeds have made the national title game. (Both won.) Two #1 seeds have met for the title nine times in the past 25 years, and that seems to be getting "worse," with it happening in 2010, 2012, 2014 and 2015.

For Geno's nitpicking about the men's game, there is a counter-argument to be made about the women's that unless you're a fan of a Top Four program, you have almost no shot of winning a championship. There isn't enough individual incentive for the student-athletes to spread the talent out amongst teams, which is why you get super teams like UConn. That's a result of there not being enough of an economic market and interest in general for women's basketball.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by rjsuperfly66 »

The thing about the women's game is most definitely the parity. UCONN routinely winning by 40 points isn't exciting. Someone from Deadspin Regression wrote an article talking about how dominate UCONN was in comparison to Kentucky in the men's game. That is the exact reason no one cares about the women's game besides those with a rooting interest. It's not exciting, and frankly I think gets to the point where it's not nearly as impressive. I think people have 10000000000x more respect for Coach K at 5 titles, than Geno at 10.

There are other issues that also exist. Women having to be four years removed from HS to go pro has hurt the game. Dominant figures like Griner or Charles or Moore or Stewart (just spitballing) are All-Americans 3 or 4 years. Granted, would they go pro due to professional income? Maybe not, but I do believe those top women are still bringing in high 6 figures (mostly foreign). Just imagine an Okafor or Anthony Davis having to play 4 seasons? Quality of play in college ball would increase, but while quality of recruit would likely increase at lower levels, I think a big seperation would be created at the top (exactly what has happened in the women's game). Kentucky would still load up with tons of top talent, and have guys who were the equivalent of NBA All-Stars dominating inferior foes.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by ATPTourFan »

Two great takes in a row! Thanks Steve and Superfly!
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by rodfromcranston »

There isn't much parity, for sure. However, those schools
like Tennessee, ND etc, have gotten good results, because they treat
WBB as a major sport.
Too often, it's a Title 9 afterthought.
Hell, I remember our WBB team beating UConn, back in the stone age,
when everyone was in the Yankee Conference.
I hope URI makes a commitment to WBB, beyond the hire of a great coach.

RJ, you asking for one and dones in WBB is hypocritical and exactly the opposite
reason why MBB sucks, today.
Teams used to stay together for 4 years and that's why it was a better game, by
almost everyone's estimation.
Besides, who gives a fat rat's ass about the WNBA?
You've got Diana Taurasi leaving her team to go make more money
in Russia. What does that say about professional WBB?
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rjsuperfly66
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by rjsuperfly66 »

rodfromcranston wrote:
RJ, you asking for one and dones in WBB is hypocritical and exactly the opposite
reason why MBB sucks, today.
Teams used to stay together for 4 years and that's why it was a better game, by
almost everyone's estimation.
Besides, who gives a fat rat's ass about the WNBA?
You've got Diana Taurasi leaving her team to go make more money
in Russia. What does that say about professional WBB?
It was a better game, but I think now there is a parity issue the men's game would also have to look at. Kentucky could build an NBA All-Star team if they had to keep players for 4 years. Teams like PC and URI might get slightly better recruits, but those top players would be so much better than they would never stand a chance.

I think what would be good is a baseball-esque model. Kids get drafted out of HS. If a team and player both want to make it work and have the kid play in the NBA Year 1, the kid goes pro. If a team drafts a player but the player doesn't want to play for that team or for that money, he goes to college but has to stay a mandatory 3 years (and gives up guaranteed NBA money). If a team drafts a player but wants that player to play in college, he has to stay there for at least 2 years before they can call him up (player receives guaranteed money for all years he plays in college under team control). All undrafted players have to stay mandatory 3 years.

I understand the odds of a system like that happening are slim, but I think getting rid of the "elite" talent make sure a LeBron isn't playing 3 years of college basketball at NBA All-Star caliber level, while guaranteeing 2 or 3 years of "next-tier" who should be very good but not nearly as dominant.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by bressler3south »

I admire what UConn has accomplished. THAT TEAM WORKS. If anyone watched the first game of the season against Stanford, it was like night and day watching the Lady Huskies last night. The growth of a team.
There's nothing to be ashamed of, but to be celebrated, because I enjoyed watching the ball move, Stewart, the best player scoring just eight points, BUT REBOUNDING, PASSING, BLOCKING SHOTS.
The team genuinely exhibited respect and caring for one another, just as URI's men's team showed us this season.
As a basketball purist, I enjoyed watching last night's game….
Also, "I'm going to the next level," etc., blah, blah, blah -- yeah, you are -- without any skills, applicable knowledge of how the game should be played, and an unearned sense of accomplishment.
That is why men's basketball is on the decline, and watching the NBA is unbearable to a growing number of people.
People in R.I. make fun of remedial work at CCRI -- guess what -- that's what the NBA has become for "The Next Levellers."
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by TruePoint »

bressler3south wrote:That is why men's basketball is on the decline, and watching the NBA is unbearable to a growing number of people.
By all accounts, the NBA game has gone in the opposite direction as college basketball, with the game being more watchable and better played than it has been in decades.

The two biggest problems facing women's basketball is that it is played by inferior athletes (which is not arguable, or they wouldn't have "men's" and "women's"), and that the games aren't competitive. Those are two big problems when spectator sports is based on the best athletes competing against one another.

What is the purpose of having hundreds of teams playing 30 games or whatever when you have one team win 90% of them by 30+ points, year after year? In other sports, if you have a team "dominate" by winning percentage or consecutive championships, they are at least challenged on a game-by-game basis. But just steamrolling teams over and over again is not remotely interesting to watch, and I don't understand how a guy like Aureimma, if he is a competitor, couldn't be bored out of his mind, too. He should go coach Central Connecticut and see if he can win there. Not sure how a person can go through life without any challenges and stay sharp.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by rodfromcranston »

More incredible pap.
The challenge is to keep winning.
Did you bother to read sf2010's post about other teams with more or equal top
players to UConn or does you hatred of women's sports and women in sports,
blind you to everything?
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TruePoint
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by TruePoint »

You keep saying things like I don't like women and I'm a chauvinist, but you couldn't be more wrong. That isn't an ok thing to accuse people of based on their not liking a particular sport, so chill out with that. There are plenty of women's sports I enjoy watching a great deal, basketball just isn't one of them.

As far as UConn and Auriemma, I don't care what is behind it, pummeling everyone you play for decades is not interesting at all. If a men's basketball or football team were similarly dominant, I would be similarly disinterested in those sports.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by rodfromcranston »

Good. I want to see you step into the Octagon
against Rhonda Rousey, and tell her that all women are inferior
athletes.
Let me know how that goes.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by TruePoint »

What? What could that possibly have to do with what I just said? We aren't talking about mma, and the point isn't that women basketball players are inferior athletes to all men, it's that they are inferior athletes to male basketball players at the same level. Nobody is saying a good women's player couldn't beat an average guy off the street, or that I want to fight Ronda Rousseau.

I'm not going to have this argument with you again. You seem to care about this a lot and I don't care about it at all, I'm just giving you the perspective of 99% of sports fans who do not find the women's game entertaining for a variety of reasons. You can disagree with my opinion or throw a fit or whatever you want to do. I don't care. I don't like women's basketball, and I explained why. I don't have anything more to add on the subject.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by bressler3south »

By all accounts, the NBA HAS DONE A BETTER JOB OF MARKETING ITSELF AS THE PRODUCT TO WATCH, FOLLOW, ETC.,
By my account, it is uninteresting, boring -- WHICH IS SHAMEFUL, CONSIDERING HOW ATHLETICALLY TALENTED THESE GUYS ARE.
Anyway, lengthen and widen the court 16 feet, raise the basket to 11 feet, then talk to me about real basketball skills…...
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by rodfromcranston »

High School Rob Lowe is all defensive.
Awwww.....

Bressler, the NBA is a snoozefest. Just watch the last two minutes of the game. It's all
that matters
The only time it's remotely interesting is during the later playoffs, which come in July
or so it seems.
It does supply ESPN with lots of dunks for their top 10, in addition to soccer from Bangaledesh,
and Abu Dabi, and cricket from Sri Lanka.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by TruePoint »

Do you guys just go to bed too early to see all the great basketball being played on the west coast? You're entitled to your opinions and I would have agreed with you five years ago, but by every measure and in most observers' opinions, the NBA has fixed a lot of what was wrong with its game and the product is much improved.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by bressler3south »

TruePoint wrote:Do you guys just go to bed too early to see all the great basketball being played on the west coast? You're entitled to your opinions and I would have agreed with you five years ago, but by every measure and in most observers' opinions, the NBA has fixed a lot of what was wrong with its game and the product is much improved.
Yeah, Rod and I hit the sack at 8:15 p.m. He sleeps on the left, I sleep on the right.
Thanks for entitling us to our OPINIONS. Very sporting of you, TP.
Ironically, if you watch the college game and the pro game, which came first? Crapolla I or Crapolla II ??????
I'm not most observers and what, TP, "…got fixed"?????
Oh, yeah: Less drug use.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by TruePoint »

A combination of rule changes, an influx of really talented players and an increasing awareness about efficiency from coaches and front offices have combined to make the game better on the offensive end of the floor. I don't have time to put together a detailed report citing mountains of empirical data right now, but those are widely held opinions in basketball circles and the league just cashed in on that sentiment with a record TV deal. It seems like your criticisms of the league are a little dated. Most people agreed with you a few years ago, but the pace of the game has increased over the last few years and scoring continues to trend up, and the game as a whole is more watchable now.

I can't make you like something, and really I have no desire to. I don't even understand what the argument you are trying to have with me is about (which is not a huge shock since nothing Bress posts makes sense and Rod just argues with me out of habit, usually about nothing). But if you're going to get all riled up and come at me over the idea that women's basketball is great and the NBA sucks, just understand that you guys are on an island with maybe six or seven other people on the planet. It seems like a strange hill to die on, but you do you.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by rjsuperfly66 »

I like college ball better then pros. The quality of player has diminished, which is the issue. I'm sure the NBA has gotten more exciting to NBA fans, but it doesn't appeal to me to see a league driven by the superstars. As a basketball purist, there are many little things to appreciate in an extremely competitive women's game. They have better fundamentals, run more plays, do the little things. I can appreciate the fact it doesn't operate at a rapid speed like the men's game, because you can follow things and appreciate them as a basketball fan.

The issue is that as a casual observer, I'm not going to appreciates UCONN's offense when they are winning by 35 points every night. I'm going to say "Good players doing good things, big whoop." It's when you get into a competitive environment that you can say "Wow, look how crisp that is, awesome." There is no such thing as a must-see game in women's college. After UCONN defeated South Carolina this year, their record in 1 vs 2 games over the past 10 years was 9-1. The average margin in those games was 16.5 points in UCONN's favor. Those should be your big sells, but turn into "Why bothers?"

The key for the women's game has to be to try to find competitive balance. Obviously UCONN will always be among the best, but it needs to be made so that other teams have a chance outside of maybe 2 per season. If that were to happen, can't promise I'd watch frequently, but I'd be more inclined to try to catch a big game. What can be done to fix it?
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by RhowdyRam02 »

Dominance is a funny thing. Sometimes it grows a sport to greater heights and sometimes it stifles that growth. Tiger Woods' dominance let to more people playing golf, more people watching golf, and more money in the golf industry. And even though Tiger's not on top anymore golf at its' highest levels is still doing well. UConn and before them Tennessee have been dominant and they might have more girls playing basketball, but I think their dominance has hurt the game of college basketball as a whole. Perhaps if the gap was smaller and their games more competitive it would draw more eyes to the product for elite games, which could cause more viewers for the rest of the product. Also, their dominance hasn't helped grow the professional game to a sufficient level.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by TruePoint »

I enjoy college basketball more and follow it more closely, too. But that doesn't mean that the NBA product hasn't improved, which was my only point. And if it's midnight and I want something on in the background while I'm finishing up a work thing, to me putting on a Golden State/Houston game or something is much more appealing that it was a few years ago.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by UCH21377 »

I rarely watch the NBA but you have to respect the way San Antonio plays the game. And hasn't Atlanta put in one of the assistants, and employed that style of play? I'll tune in for the playoffs, which is good basketball.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by bressler3south »

bressler3south wrote:I admire what UConn has accomplished. THAT TEAM WORKS. If anyone watched the first game of the season against Stanford, it was like night and day watching the Lady Huskies last night. The growth of a team.
There's nothing to be ashamed of, but to be celebrated, because I enjoyed watching the ball move, Stewart, the best player scoring just eight points, BUT REBOUNDING, PASSING, BLOCKING SHOTS.
The team genuinely exhibited respect and caring for one another, just as URI's men's team showed us this season.
As a basketball purist, I enjoyed watching last night's game….
Also, "I'm going to the next level," etc., blah, blah, blah -- yeah, you are -- without any skills, applicable knowledge of how the game should be played, and an unearned sense of accomplishment.
That is why men's basketball is on the decline, and watching the NBA is unbearable to a growing number of people.
People in R.I. make fun of remedial work at CCRI -- guess what -- that's what the NBA has become for "The Next Levellers."
TruePoint wrote:A combination of rule changes, an influx of really talented players and an increasing awareness about efficiency from coaches and front offices have combined to make the game better on the offensive end of the floor.
It seems like your criticisms of the league are a little dated.

I can't make you like something, and really I have no desire to. I don't even understand what the argument you are trying to have with me is about (which is not a huge shock since nothing Bress posts makes sense and Rod just argues with me out of habit, usually about nothing). But if you're going to get all riled up and come at me over the idea that women's basketball is great and the NBA sucks, just understand that you guys are on an island with maybe six or seven other people on the planet. It seems like a strange hill to die on, but you do you.
"By all accounts, the NBA HAS DONE A BETTER JOB OF MARKETING ITSELF AS THE PRODUCT TO WATCH, FOLLOW, ETC.,
By my account, it is uninteresting, boring -- WHICH IS SHAMEFUL, CONSIDERING HOW ATHLETICALLY TALENTED THESE GUYS ARE.
Anyway, lengthen and widen the court 16 feet, raise the basket to 11 feet, then talk to me about real basketball skills……"

You are unbelievable!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Read the posts rather than blanketly stating NOTHING makes any sense to you, Your Snideness!
My original post was about what I saw a few nights ago, that's it. I then chimed in with an OPNION about the state of the NBA and college ball. I stated that the skills at each level are still -- to me -- lacking, and watching the games unbearable.
By all accounts, you would have made one helluva efficiency expert at Orwell's Ministry of Truth.
You know, TP, you're a "Next Leveler," too. Let's see how efficient you are during your journey. Once you get to the top, I hope you realize that it's nothing but a shit-pile. What sense you make of it, ultimately means nothing to me, but I would like to see the look on your face when it happens.

P.S. By the way, as I know nothing and nothing I post makes sense, I do believe that I posted this before the season began in the prediction contest: bressler3south 21-8 13-5
Now, that's the truth.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by TruePoint »

Oh boy. It isn't that I don't understand the words that you're saying, it's that I don't understand why you're saying them. Responding to someone giving an opinion that is counter to yours with an unhinged rant about Orwellian efficiency experts is a great example. Just take it down a notch. I have no idea why you are so upset, but whatever it is, it will be OK.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by bressler3south »

TruePoint wrote:Oh boy. It isn't that I don't understand the words that you're saying, it's that I don't understand why you're saying them. Responding to someone giving an opinion that is counter to yours with an unhinged rant about Orwellian efficiency experts is a great example. Just take it down a notch. I have no idea why you are so upset, but whatever it is, it will be OK.
"But if you're going to get all riled up and come at me over the idea that women's basketball is great and the NBA sucks, just understand that you guys are on an island with maybe six or seven other people on the planet. It seems like a strange hill to die on, but you do you."

It's BULLSHIT like this that pisses me off.
I never wrote anything but that I enjoyed watching the UConn game the other night, and that I find the NBA unbearable to watch.
Soon, I will feel the same about men's basketball.
Your cutesy way of redirecting and twisting people's statements is typical of a little boy who always has to be right about everything.
You want to understand me or the other people with whom you do the same, get off of your high horse.
As to the being a "Next-Leveller Rant," you've just shown me very simply that you are what you are and "you do you."
It seems you'd be most satisfied "You doing You" anyway.
And to make it even more personal, TP, which will hopefully get me banned:
TP, go piss on a rock with the wind blowing in your face.
Maybe the sweet smell of success will have an awakening effect.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by rodfromcranston »

Oooh, TP makes another friend!
Nice job!
I don't think Bressler should be banned, either.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by RhowdyRam02 »

Bressler, are you Gandy under a different name?
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by bressler3south »

RhowdyRam02 wrote:Bressler, are you Gandy under a different name?
Well, where the eff' has he been?!?!?!?!?!?!? First off, I wouldn't dishonor Gandy by putting my mug on his coffee cup. Second, the bigger question is this: TP, are you Linc Chafee using a different name?
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by rodfromcranston »

I can safely say that Bressler is not Gandy and
TP is not Linc Chafee.
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Re: UConn Women

Unread post by TruePoint »

Bressler not going to be banned. He is entertaining as hell.
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